Question on path i shoulf take...first

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Hi, new here. I've been shooting for a while but just got into LRP.

My question is this, I have 2 ar15s, 1 with a 18" barrel that shoots amazing. The other a 16" with a red dot I just got on trade and a savage 111 in 3006.

Now should I swap the 16" barrel for a 6.5 grendel or 224 valkyrie or swap the 3006 to 260 or 6.5cm and build it up from there?

Only going to 600 yards on a regular basis. 1000+ once in a while and maybe get into pre. Thoughts?

 

[tna9001]

Lot's of hype with the Valkyrie, it's a cool name for a .223+P. The 6.5CM will give you significantly more capability and flexibility. What kind rifle and scope are you looking at? The entry point for a rifle cost wise is something like the Ruger Precision Rifle ($1k) and you'll spend about the same on a scope so your probably going to have to add $$ to the equation. Then you need a chronograph, bipod, rear bag and a ballistic solver which goes from free to hundreds of dollars if it's incorporated into hardware. My point is if you really want to get into this kind of shooting even at the entry point cost wise your going to spend $2,500 at the bare minimum otherwise you'll just have another rifle to store in your safe.

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

I was planning on using my savage and convert it into a 6.5cm and throw it in a chassis

 

[tna9001]

I was planning on using my savage and convert it into a 6.5cm and throw it in a chassis

Gotcha, your Savage is chambered in 30-06? If so, have you figured out how to make 6.5CM work in a long action?

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Apparently they work great. Mine has a detachable mag though. I dont know If that helps.

 

[tna9001]

Apparently they work great. Mine has a detachable mag though. I dont know If that helps.

Cool, that sound like a good plan then. What scope are you looking at?

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Swfa 3-15 if I get into prs. 16x or higher fixed if I stay on the bench

 

[tna9001]

Just be sure you know how much $$ it's going to cost to convert your Savage to a platform that is usable for your goals, PRS is very different than bench shooting. How much are you looking at for the chassis and barrel?

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Barrel is 300. Chassis of I go that route is 450+ grip and buttstock. I'm leaning towards bench and getting a Boyd's pro varmint and bedding it

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Now if I stay bench does the 6.5cm give me alot more advantage over the grendel ar 600?

 

[tna9001]

Now if I stay bench does the 6.5cm give me a lot more advantage over the grendel ar 600?

Yes. The 6.5CM vs 6.5 Grendle is an apples to oranges comparison. The 6.5CM has a significant advantage for long range shooting.

When you're considering your build, a rifle set up for PRS is easier to use on a bench than a rifle set up for the bench is to use in PRS.

Sounds like you are going to have close to $1k to convert your 30-06 plus the cost of your 30-06. You can pick up a new RPR for $1200 or so.

 

[XLR308]

Yes. The 6.5CM vs 6.5 Grendle is an apples to oranges comparison. The 6.5CM has a significant advantage for long range shooting.

When you're considering your build, a rifle set up for PRS is easier to use on a bench than a rifle set up for the bench is to use in PRS.

Sounds like you are going to have close to $1k to convert your 30-06 plus the cost of your 30-06. You can pick up a new RPR for $1200 or so.

One of the vendors on here has a thread going advertising the RPR as in stock and shipped for $1040 I believe was the price I saw.
It may be worth doing a quick search to see if any are left.

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

I actually traded for the 06 last year. But I actuall have it. Its easier on my budget to add to that then get another rifle with a factory barrel. But I'm open to building my grendel and saving for a better platform. I reload and I'm just getting going on 223.

 

[XLR308]

Depending on which Savage action you have it may be a better path than running with the 65Grendal.
Not that there is anything wrong with the Grendal but as it has allready been stated the 65 Creedmoor is in a different classification when it comes to performance.

Have you done your homework on the configuration of the Savage to determine what your options are with chassis and stocks ?

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

No where close to being ready. Just kicking it around

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Yea. I was looking at mdt.

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Just s standard savage long action. I might just save for a model 10 or 12 if sorts or ashbury precision

 

[...]

your current rifles are MORE than adequate to shoot out to 600 yds.

take all the money you are going to spend on parts and upgrades and buy ammo and youll be MUCH better off.

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

I reload and I got .73" at 100 with my first set of 69gr smk. The 1000 yard range nearest to me is 124 miles away and I'm not a member and another that is proposed to be built is 68 but not built yet. I might get better optics and practice. Is 3006 not a horrible round to load for long range?

 

[...]

I might get better optics and practice. Is 3006 not a horrible round to load for long range?

hardly a horrible round for LR.......it doesnt have a sexy name like "Valkyrie" or "Grendel"........but it is a proven cartridge.

especially loaded up with some of the High BC bullets........its more than capable of hammering at 600yds easily........and even out to 1000 itll not have a problem

 

[tna9001]

Getting good at long range starts with being good at 100 yard, if you or your rifle can’t shoot 1/2moa at 100 yards, you’re wasting time and ammo shooting further. I mention that to address your question about 30-06 for long range, can you comfortably shoot 100 rounds of 30-06 in a single range session without developing a nasty flench?

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

And with a better stock recoil should be lessened I'm assuming?

 

[XLR308]

I reload and I got .73" at 100 with my first set of 69gr smk. The 1000 yard range nearest to me is 124 miles away and I'm not a member and another that is proposed to be built is 68 but not built yet. I might get better optics and practice. Is 3006 not a horrible round to load for long range?

The 30-06 Is a more than capable 1000 yard rifle.
With a 1-10 twist barrel running a 178 or 195ELD bullet it would still have plenty at 1000 yards but I doubt it would be much fun shooting a sporter weight 06 on a bench with full power loads for long.

That's how I ended up building my first AR, was invited to shoot prairie dogs and all I had at the time was a sporter 30-06, it was a fun day but I was battered and bruised before the day was over.

 

[...]

And with a better stock recoil should be lessened I'm assuming?

1) recoil from a .3006 isnt that bad.....shoot it enough and you wont notice it
2) a well designed stock can help lessen felt recoil to some extent.......ive always found simply adding weight to the stock has more benefit.

as an example.....my .300 win mag in an XLR chassis was kind of a bear to shoot........i made up a solid steel buffer tube which added 2lbs to the rifle, i can now shoot that thing all day without issue.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

The Savage Long Action 111 will also fit into the Choate Tactical Stock for $229; just make sure your action uses the staggered feed. Weight-wise they run at just around 4lb. These stocks use a 'full length' aluminum bedding block, and can provide many of the advantages you might otherwise find in a chassis, but an AR style butt stock capability will not be among them. IMHO, they are probably just another thing that can break, and I don't use them aside from my actual AR's. If you disagree and go for a chassis, the Luth AR MBA series of adjustable butt stocks are a great choice.

The .30-'06 with the 1:10" twist and 178gr ELD-X will provide good to great performance to 1000yd and probably a good bit beyond.

The question will be about barrel profile. If your barrel is a sporter, you most likely will benefit from a longer and somewhat heavier profile, but if you are looking to compete in a discipline requiring moving around and shooting, the really heavy contours might not be ideal. With the '06 and the 178, recoil is going to be an issue for any sustained strings of fire, and a heavier weight barrel contour can help with absorbing some of that; along with the inevitable trade-off being that they are more weight to carry.

As for the AR, an LR capable Upper is called for. Mine are the Stag Model 6 Super Varminter, discontinued, but otherwise indistinguishable from the Stag 15 Varminter, $427.47 with BC and T-Handle. It uses a 24" long, 1:8" twist Stainless Bull Barrel. Mine has shot 600yd F T/R with ease, is both accurate and reliable, and has none of the potential issues that can crop up when one chooses to build their own. I live at 4200ft ASL, and on paper, the Hornady 75gr HPBT-Match is still supersonic at 1000yd, but this is not true when one is shooting at significantly lower altitudes. Heavier/longer bullets should also stabilize in this barrel, but beyond the size of the Sierra 77gr SMK, may have trouble fitting and feeding properly in the magazine. However, those longer OAL's shot have a good chance of working with a single feed magazine follower, or a SLED. The sled is marked 10rd or 20rd, but neither holds any rounds, the rounds reference is about the dimensional profile of the device itself.

You can go deep into the pocket for optics, but the Weaver Classic V-24 works very well on mine. My other Stag 6 Upper has the Mueller 8-32x44 Target Dot 30mm tube scope.

The only item linked in this post that I do not have 2 or 3 of is the Weaver V-24. They all work well and none have ever failed on me.

Greg

 

[Bender]

.30-06 is an EXCELLENT LR caliber. Think of it as a .308 magnum. It will shoot a 208g like a champion. I would buy a nicer scope and try and shoot the .30-06 for a while. If you are going to do this for real, buy a 6.5 CM and be done with it. You can buy a gen 2 RPR for $1000 or less now.

OR... get a hi end 6.5 Grendel upper for your AR. It will do 600-800yd like a beast!

 

[flyer]

First, practice, probably with the 18" AR. Cheap ammo, low recoil, it is good to learn on. If you have a standard crummy trigger, try a "15 minute trigger job". If it has conventional handguards, consider upgrading to a free float tube or rail, free float improves accuracy.

If you get competitive, your competition will kind of call the shots for you. If it's ELR, a .223 won't cut it. Then it's time for .224 Valkyrie or build up the Savage with something bigger.

If you just want to challenge yourself and shoot tight groups, you need to figure out what you like and go with it.

I like ARs so my first really accurate rifle was a LR308 in 6.5 Creedmoor. I like it a lot but I'm building up a 6.5 Creedmoor bolt action now. Better trigger, better scope, longer barrel for more velocity, it's just better and should give me an edge over my LR308.

I'm also building up an 18" AR15 upper in .223 for times when I don't want to pull out the big guns. I'm using a cheapo Remington R15 blemished barrel that I got for $75 but I'm expecting good things and I'll be shooting out to 600 yards if it shoots.

 

[FrozenMinnesotan]

Thanks for the replies. The 18" ar has a 15" freefloat hand gaurd. 1-7" 416r. Better than stock trigger. The group I was getting with my first handloads of 24.9gr of varget with a 69gr smk was .73" at 100 with mil spec trigger and Nikon 3-9x40 bdc.

The savage 3006 has the detachable mag which limits my stock options besides boyds or a chassis. Also has a 22" spotter. I've been looking at the 12fv from cabelas and dropping that in a choate. 26" bull barrel.

My plan first is better glass for my ar then decide what I want to do from there.

 

[steve123]

Hi, new here. I've been shooting for a while but just got into LRP.

My question is this, I have 2 ar15s, 1 with a 18" barrel that shoots amazing. The other a 16" with a red dot I just got on trade and a savage 111 in 3006.

Now should I swap the 16" barrel for a 6.5 grendel or 224 valkyrie or swap the 3006 to 260 or 6.5cm and build it up from there?

Only going to 600 yards on a regular basis. 1000+ once in a while and maybe get into pre. Thoughts?

IMO, don't put any more money into the savage. It seems like half of us have done that and after looking back regretted the decision, especially from the resale standpoint but also from the reliability side of it. If/when you decide to sell it the loss isn't much. Truck gun, back up gun, as a standard hunting rifle, that's how I view these. Because there are much better choices these days.

You can with the 223 too/ shoot 1000Y, but the round doesn't do as well in the wind and it's hard to spot hits or misses. However it's so much cheaper to shoot you can just fire away. For the most part I stopped shooting my 223 at those longer distances because if there is much wind it can get frustrating and becomes a waste of ammo. Hopefully you have a 7 twist enabling you to shoot the 70 + grain bullets. Depending on how far the lands are you can also single load 80 grainers to achieve more velocity with the heavies. At 600Y it doesn't do too bad and in light winds it can be a lot of fun.

The 224V is still new to the market. I was excited about it at first but it looks like my fears are probably true, that the currant brass isn't holding up to higher pressure well. If I did one in a AR to use for long range I'd go with as long a barrel as I could stand and load a mild load with 80's or 90's and for sure go with a top quality barrel. If I were to pick any 22 cal wildcat for the AR it'd be a 224 AR version based off 6.5G brass which is capable of pushing 90's at 2900 fps in a longer barrel and still fits in the mag. That's about the same ballistics as a 6.5 Creed.

After shooting friends 6.5G's in the wind at the longer distances I never bought one, instead I went to the improved versions like 6MMART40 and 6mmFatRat. Which do decent in the wind. A .5BC bullet going 2870 fps does acceptably at 1000Y in the wind. Next time I think I'll go 224 AR like I mentioned.

What most of us do is save and get a nicer bolt rifle. That's a relative term of course, the "nice" part, because some guys spend many thousands on top of the line stuff. The least expensive action I'd personally consider using for a build is the HOWA action, from there I'd jump to the Tikka, next would be a Bighorn Origin, or ARC Nucleus action, both those are very nice, well made and reasonably full featured custom actions that aren't super expensive.