Anyone know what actually went down in regards to the demise of J Allen?
- Thread starter Jimmy D in AK
- Start date
Incoming money was less than outgoing money if I had to take a wild guess at it........LOL
Maybe so, but I rarely see one at a match or event. Maybe 1 percent or less.
I have one. Never shot or even been to a match in my life.
I understand that. But the gear you see, when 100 plus shooters are in one spot is a good indication of what is being fielded. I love the J Allen chassis, but I rarely see one and we shoot all year, at different ranges in the Eastern US
one reason you havent seen many, their lead times used to be huge at times.
not weeks but months..many months, which makes sense because they were only a 5 man shop (FB post/letter)
when they first started out not many horses in the race
over the past 4-5 years, chassis are a dime a dozen
long lead times + big $ = none out in the wild
not weeks but months..many months, which makes sense because they were only a 5 man shop (FB post/letter)
when they first started out not many horses in the race
over the past 4-5 years, chassis are a dime a dozen
long lead times + big $ = none out in the wild
running a business can be tough. from what we can see, they didn't close on their own decisions overnight. from what I could put together from the other 789798 threads, it sounds like "Supply and Demand" played a factor. whatever it may be, I hope they overcome the challenges they have to face. hopefully nobody will kick them while they're down.
im guessing they have patents on their product, so if all goes well and they can get the finances squared away (if that was the problem) theyll be back
sorry but i have to do it..."JAE dont pull a prime ammo, give us the truth off the bat and we welcome you back with open arms"
? ? ?
sorry but i have to do it..."JAE dont pull a prime ammo, give us the truth off the bat and we welcome you back with open arms"
? ? ? I have a J Allen chassis that I use in matches and although heavy, I really like it. I recently got an Ingenuity rail system for it and it bolted in and fit like a glove. I went to their website to explore getting another one of their chassis and found their "Gumball" scheme to be rather childish. Their focus seemed to be mainly on all the colors available along in a minor fashion with some other options. I think my "build" on their website came to $2395. I didn't order one. I later saw they were advertising their chassis for $1200. I hate to see them go out of business, but just like S&B scopes waking up to the reality of the market, I suspect in J Allen's case, the "awakening" came too late. Just my two cents. I hope they can come back.
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Post #47 in this thread has a little more info.
They seem to be the most popular chassis for vudoo and insite
I shoot PRS and use JAE chassis, they are great. My .300NM sits in a JAE chassis as well
Best chassis out there.
Best chassis out there.
I recently competed in the Nightforce ELR Challenge; LOTS of J Allen Chassis were in use by the 250 or so shooters. I guess it depends on what type of comp you go to
My thoughts as well though i'm not sure that's why they went under. 2K is a lot for a chassis though. And to think when they started they were considerably cheaper (1200 IIRC), of course that was some time ago. Everyone likes what they like and i get that but there are so many other options that do the same job with the same ergos for substantially cheaper. They're a great chassis but i still think they priced themselves out of the running. Hell i can't even think of another chassis in that price range other than the KRG Habu or whatever.
Due to the seeming, abruptness of them going out of business, the new website, and TWO new chassis releases for Savage and Tikka, I’m gonna go out on a limb and say it had nothing to do with their prices.
I called J Allen about two years ago looking for them to mail me a demo so I could check it out. Nobody at my range has a J Allen. It is hard to buy a 2 k stock to see if I like it. . I told JA that I would pay shipping both ways and a handling fee. They told me that they do not send out demos. Manners mails out demos ( I think McMillan too). Both of those companies are back ordered. I do not know if this has anything to do with their demise, but I did not become a JA customer.
Bang
Bang
They mail you a chassis. You don’t like it. You send it back. You paid shipping both ways. Who cares right? But now they have a chassis they can’t sell as new anymore. Who makes up the difference?
Well if they have one or two and they're the only ones that get sent it doesnt matter. Worst case you sell them as demos nbd
I think his point is that Manners has loaners. They've been made specifically to send out for people to try. If the "renter" damages the stock beyond repair, I believe they're on the hook for some or all of the cost. Not that hard to do, really, but maybe they didn't want to deal with the hassle, who knows.
My company has a demo inventory.
Product coming back abused and broken is not rare.
Us-hey! We got it back broken.
Them-really? It must have been broken in transit.
Packaging and protective sleeve and tube are in perfect condition.
Hmmm????
If you knew what went into making manners vs making a JAE-700, you’d have a far better appreciation for why they declined.
Why would they cut into their own bottom line, and risk being left with something they can’t sell, when they could just sell it to someone who knows they want it?
Then you don't have a clue about what gets used and what is seen as a stupid waste of money.
If they would have sent me a demo I may have liked it and purchased one, or two. I am a middle aged guy with disposable income and I love guns. But I will not spend 2 thousand to see if a chassis is comfortable or fits me. This is the reason manufacturers put products on the prize table. People win items and if they like it they talk about it to their friends and the word gets around.
Bang
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They didn’t have a demo. Time to get over it now. I’m 99% certaint the fact they didn’t have a demo has less than 0% to do with them having to close up shop.
I know you feel wronged here, but you weren’t.
I know you feel wronged here, but you weren’t.
Enlighten us, please.
I think they didn't know how to run a mfg business.
Hand laying some carbon cloth into a mold and baking it, vs days of machining, injection mounding, bonding, and assembly. There’s a reason they’re more than double the price, and it isn’t arbitrary.
Not taking anything away from a manners either. I like mine a lot.
They did quite well for 16 years.
I know, and you know that I know, that you don't know the first fucking thing about that company's finances now, yesterday, or 16 years ago.
Yep, and most of that saw only a few key players in the precision rifle stock market, so long lead times had less of an impact. The market is getting pretty crowded these days, and technology has allowed newer and less expensive processes to be developed. Weaknesses of any kind will become evident when more options exist.
I’ve said it many times here on the Hide. I think JAE produced a technically marvelous and beautifully functional product, and I’ll absolutely have another at some point. But it’s hard to compete with the likes of Manners, McMillan, KRG, MDT, MPA, etc. that involve fewer machining operations and a greater variety of options at a lower price point.
Making money (profits) is absolutely not the same thing as being cash flow positive. You can be very profitable, and still end up running out of cash and bankrupt.
If you don't understand how that can be, go run a few mfg businesses successfully and come back here to explain it.
‘Twas likely simple economics.
When you produce basically only one product for 16 years that isn’t consumable (doesn’t need to be replaced), and costs quite a bit more than your competition, eventually most everyone who wants them, has them.
There’s also 16 years worth of them on the used market. And they hold up to wear and tear very well. So, after 16 years, you’re also competing with your own used product on the market.
They also spent a lot of time and resources on a tikka inlet. I’m sure some people welcomed this, but really, how many people out there but a tikka and drop it in an $1800 chassis?
Also didn’t evolve with the times. They admittingly created the grip at a time when more prone shooting was happening and an angled grip was preferable. Now with positional shooting being prevalent, a more vertical grip is preferred.
When asked about a different grip, their response was they were putting time and effort into the tikka.
This is pure speculation, but I’m guessing over saturation of cheaper and more adaptable chassis, along with the demand for their only real product dropping, likely put them out of business.
If you don’t diversify, you better be producing something that is consumable or is providing a service that will be needed constantly.
When you produce basically only one product for 16 years that isn’t consumable (doesn’t need to be replaced), and costs quite a bit more than your competition, eventually most everyone who wants them, has them.
There’s also 16 years worth of them on the used market. And they hold up to wear and tear very well. So, after 16 years, you’re also competing with your own used product on the market.
They also spent a lot of time and resources on a tikka inlet. I’m sure some people welcomed this, but really, how many people out there but a tikka and drop it in an $1800 chassis?
Also didn’t evolve with the times. They admittingly created the grip at a time when more prone shooting was happening and an angled grip was preferable. Now with positional shooting being prevalent, a more vertical grip is preferred.
When asked about a different grip, their response was they were putting time and effort into the tikka.
This is pure speculation, but I’m guessing over saturation of cheaper and more adaptable chassis, along with the demand for their only real product dropping, likely put them out of business.
If you don’t diversify, you better be producing something that is consumable or is providing a service that will be needed constantly.
Here we go.
If they were profitable within reason, not many reasons out there for them not to have sold the business.
You think they closed the doors, deleted all of their social media, and ghosted everyone who had made down payments for anything other than not being out of money?
I like their chassis, but don’t get emotionally invested to the point where you overlook logic.
Where does it say they sold the business? More speculation.
Lisa is still my friend on FB, and their Instagram is still up.
In case that was directed at me...
To our valued customers and fans of J. Allen:
It is with great sadness that after 16 years of designing and manufacturing one of the highest quality chassis systems in the world, we have recently had to layoff our employees and close our doors.
We appreciate all of you and wish that it did not have to come to this, but we were unable to find a solution to stay open. Please understand and respect that this is extremely difficult for our family and employees, and wish that we could have kept on going.
For everyone on our 5 person team, customers were our number 1 priority and it hurts us that it ended this way. At this time, we are unable to give any more info, and if that changes in the future, we will let you know.
Thank you to all who have believed in our products and loved them as much as we did. This was our life.
Sincerely,
Lisa, Jeff, and J. Allen Team
July 15, 2019
so what about everyone who had their name on the waiting list? did they prepay? are they out of that money or what? I hate to hear of any small business closing doors as I have a small business as well. the only thing that I could think of that might've been the main weight on the shoulders would be the overhead cost.
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