Drejka Verdict In: Manslaughter

[Maggot]

The problem here with this is I have little control over what scares you.

If I’m 18” and 100lbs bigger than a person
Me getting their attention because they dropped something could scare them, I don’t want to take a bullet because of that.

As history has shown a young Blackman in a hoodie is more likely to scare someone than a middle aged white man in a polo

Personally I fall in the camp that says you have to be willing to accept a certain level of risk to avoid a mistake

We have executed and have held enough people on death row who ended up being innocent to say that the death penalty is a problem.

I think that as gun owners and those who carry have to be willing to allow a situation to develop further to be able to properly analyze the threat beyond my own fear.

Typically between the moment of fear and the time when a threat becomes a reality a person usually has opportunity to remove themselves from the situation As a gun owner I hold myself to that standard to have the awareness to avoid.


The reality is unjustified shoots because of perception of fear without a real threat is the quickest way to empower the left

More than a problem its unacceptable for that very reason. Once taken a life cannot be refunded.

 

[Inifinty]

1:46 the shove (its a big one) occurs and the attacker takes three steps forward and pulls up his shorts as if he may also throw a kick. While the steps forward are happening the shooter rotates to where the attacker is in view and his mind said draw.

As I said his mind appeared stuck on finding the target and having a hard time with it. Which could potentially explain why the no shoot thought couldn't register.

Potential lack of training is where I'm going with this. I'm just making observations not saying anything done was right.

 

[PolarisBreach]

The problem here with this is I have little control over what scares you.

If I’m 18” and 100lbs bigger than a person
Me getting their attention because they dropped something could scare them, I don’t want to take a bullet because of that.

As history has shown a young Blackman in a hoodie is more likely to scare someone than a middle aged white man in a polo

Personally I fall in the camp that says you have to be willing to accept a certain level of risk to avoid a mistake

We have executed and have held enough people on death row who ended up being innocent to say that the death penalty is a problem.

I think that as gun owners and those who carry have to be willing to allow a situation to develop further to be able to properly analyze the threat beyond my own fear.

Typically between the moment of fear and the time when a threat becomes a reality a person usually has opportunity to remove themselves from the situation As a gun owner I hold myself to that standard to have the awareness to avoid.


The reality is unjustified shoots because of perception of fear without a real threat is the quickest way to empower the left

You might not have much control over other people's feelings, but I can tell you that any person alive is going to read being blindsided and forcefully thrown to the ground as THREAT. If that same someone that threw them to the ground then advances on them, THREAT. Someone getting out of their car to get in your face, THREAT.

I fail to see where race plays into this at all. Are you trying to argue that if the attacker was white the guy wouldn't have shot?

Someone could just is easily argue it the other way. You don't get a do-over if your assailant kills you. People can and do die every day from head trauma. All it takes it one blow to the head. The "knockout game" comes to mind. Being indecisive is not a risk I'm willing to take.

If we're going to stick to the facts of the case, here are the questions that need to be asked:

1) Would a reasonable person assume that if they called another person out for committing a parking violation, it would lead to a physical confrontation? I would say no - people yell at each other in parking lots all the time. Healthy adults let it go.

2) Would a reasonable person assume that if someone exited a vehicle to confront them on foot, that they are looking to escalate the situation? Pretty easy yes from me - most people feel some level of safety inside their vehicle (and courts have agreed), and leaving the safety of your vehicle to confront someone is an aggressive act. Shooter in this case was not blocking the vehicle in any way, advancing on the vehicle, throwing something at the vehicle, etc., so no reason for her to exit the vehicle.

3) Would a reasonable person interpret being forcefully pushed to the ground as a threat? No shit.

4) Would a reasonable person interpret an attacker, who has already forced you to the ground, further advancing on you in a compromised position as a threat? Fair to say that anybody would.

I already said shooter is a fucking idiot. But shoot looks justified to me. Dead guy and his GF both escalated the situation - he by resorting to violence, her by exiting the car - effectively simultaneously. Shooter put himself in a dumb situation, but there wasn't much of an opportunity to de-escalate. A gun is not a good way to de-escalate a threatening situation, but it's a damn good way to end it.

 

[RyanScott]

SYG doesn’t change the standard for the use of force except to eliminate any duty to retreat. And the standard for police and citizen use of force is similar, although applied differently in practice.

 

[Tims]

Apparently Drejka has a history of doing this. One of the people called to testify for the prosecution testified that at the same store a few weeks earlier, at the same parking spot Drejka threatened to shoot him for parking in the handicap spot with no tags. Drejka belongs in prison. The jury found him guilty. I dont think being shoved to the ground justifies shooting someone.

 

[MtnCreek]

There’s 2 Floridians who won’t be driving to slow in the smoky mtns!

That’s a shame.

In the blue ridge it’s pronounced Floridiots.

 

[FS1]

Started stupid, stayed stupid and ended stupid.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

So he made you his bitch even though you were perfectly legal?
After tucking your tail and leaving you are now going to thump your chest about fighting and not backing down.
let me just say.. bwaahaha.

I'm a reasonable person. And I have a handicapped plate (disabled vet) . And interestingly enough I had a guy roll up on me in front of the local home depot telling me I can't park there and "fuck me".



so mind you, I'm not a bitch. If you want to fight, lets fight and let that be the end of it. And I definitely don't take well to some
stranger telling me to go fuck myself for something that I am allowed to do.

Since you tucked tail and left....... yeah, you are. Now you are chest thumping? Nice.



So I calmly told the guy, yes I can legally park here and that he did not understand the laws concerning DV plates in Texas.




It ended with me getting in my car and leaving. Been called worse by better people than him. oh well. just another idiot.

 

[j-huskey]

You might not have much control over other people's feelings, but I can tell you that any person alive is going to read being blindsided and forcefully thrown to the ground as THREAT. If that same someone that threw them to the ground then advances on them, THREAT. Someone getting out of their car to get in your face, THREAT.

I fail to see where race plays into this at all. Are you trying to argue that if the attacker was white the guy wouldn't have shot?

Someone could just is easily argue it the other way. You don't get a do-over if your assailant kills you. People can and do die every day from head trauma. All it takes it one blow to the head. The "knockout game" comes to mind. Being indecisive is not a risk I'm willing to take.

If we're going to stick to the facts of the case, here are the questions that need to be asked:

1) Would a reasonable person assume that if they called another person out for committing a parking violation, it would lead to a physical confrontation? I would say no - people yell at each other in parking lots all the time. Healthy adults let it go.

2) Would a reasonable person assume that if someone exited a vehicle to confront them on foot, that they are looking to escalate the situation? Pretty easy yes from me - most people feel some level of safety inside their vehicle (and courts have agreed), and leaving the safety of your vehicle to confront someone is an aggressive act. Shooter in this case was not blocking the vehicle in any way, advancing on the vehicle, throwing something at the vehicle, etc., so no reason for her to exit the vehicle.

3) Would a reasonable person interpret being forcefully pushed to the ground as a threat? No shit.

4) Would a reasonable person interpret an attacker, who has already forced you to the ground, further advancing on you in a compromised position as a threat? Fair to say that anybody would.

I already said shooter is a fucking idiot. But shoot looks justified to me. Dead guy and his GF both escalated the situation - he by resorting to violence, her by exiting the car - effectively simultaneously. Shooter put himself in a dumb situation, but there wasn't much of an opportunity to de-escalate. A gun is not a good way to de-escalate a threatening situation, but it's a damn good way to end it.

Your #2. Why would a reasonable person under some circumstances exit the vehicle under similar circumstances?

To ftf negotiate the de-escalation of the event (because ftf you can see and read de-escalation body language),
to move the potential escalation away from the vehicle where children were, ie, protect the children from the event (sure, driving away would do the same thing... but.... under FL SYG, she had no obligation to drive away.),
or perhaps legitimately in the parking place, to remove the discussion away from the children, because its obvious she was dealing with an asshole and she didnt want the children subjected to it....

Each person's view will be different based on their beliefs, opinions, and previous experiences, ftf is always normally "the preferred negotiation method" in most real life situations. It is DNA ingrained.

Normal people respond the same way as young adults as they did on the school playground.
As people age and experience difficulties, they change their approach to reduce conflict if they learn from their previous experiences.

Ymmv,
I worked LE 38 years, dealt with this junk more than I care to think about, and I have worked with defense lawyers since from the other side.

This case, in todays world was a slam dunk prosecution conviction. White man (armed) (not handicapped) with absolutely ZERO authority who has repeatedly tried to enforce a parking lot VIOLATION (not misdemeanor or felony)(something LE issues a "citation" for, not arrestable.) , hostile-ly approaches a woman and children to illegally try to enforce a parking lot violation, escalates the confrontation when she does not acquiesce to his illegal approach, and causes witnesses concern, enough to make them go inside and say something that causes the man to go outside and push the rough looking irrationally arguing white man away from his family member.

And THEN be STUPID enough to tell the world, "It was all about my 'pet peeve'".... put the rope around your neck fool....

Pick the right jury, some women, minorities, and liberal people and a conviction is TOO EASY, especially in todays society.

Pick a well groomed attractive liberal discipled believer of a prosecutor who can sell himself and see the defendant go to jail.

Be a rough looking middle aged white man with a burly surly looking defense attorney and reduce your chances on appearances alone. An attractive Latino female lawyer would have had a much better chance of getting a better result.

The posted news pictures show much of what I describe...

Ymmv, feel free to disagree and believe what you want in this case, but in any case, be very aware that appearances are critical, the appearance of aggression, the appearance of continued aggression (this case in spades on both sides), and the appearance to 12 people who have no clue to real world court shenanigans and the lengths a prosecutor will go depending on their zealous belief in a particular law and their career path.

Our world is changing, and this case should be a warning to every ccw carrier out there. You will see more convictions of people like US who think reasonably like PolarisBreach does.

Even if he had been the defense lawyer, his reasoned arguments above (that make sense to most of us), would have carried ZERO weight with that jury. That jury....

Which gave the defendant the benefit of the doubt and convicted him of manslaughter rather than murder.

All of you use this case on what NOT to do, from either side, you approach someone, or they approach you...
Please....

 

[oneshot86]

VERY, well said.
Thanks for those 38 years stud

 

[Fig]

Not that I like this guy (I don’t), but on the appeal I’d waive the jury, ask for a bench trial, and hope I got a non-lefty/traitor judge who followed the law. As @j-huskey said, anytime you go into a courtroom, no matter how justified and how much the law is on your side you are rolling the dice between prosecutor, judge, and jury.

I’ve lived in the red zone, and it makes me less likely to MMQB or second guess what a person will do when their FOF kicks in, not more likely.

The more complex your theory gets the more bullshit it is.

 

[j-huskey]

VERY, well said.
Thanks for those 38 years stud

Thank you !

 

[The King]

I’m also going to add this:

What would you guys have done if someone had come into a convenience store and said,

“Hey man. Some crazy motherfucker is out there screaming at your wife and kids about where you are parked. Dude is whacked the fuck out, has a gun, and threatened to kill me here in the parking lot last week for the same thing...”

I think most here would have felt that the BF had most of a good shoot on his hands.

 

[FS1]

I am always armed and it makes me very docile rather than aggressive. I am afraid of confrontation because I don’t want to be that guy.

Some folks are emboldened when they carry. I become a pussy. I like it that way. My greatest fear is having no other choice but to shoot. Because I know I will shoot if given no other option.

 

[disciple556]

havent watched video and wasnt there. no dog in the fight on specifics of this particular case. but i feel like it should be said loud and clear for all america to hear....you put hands on somebody over words you can and maybe will end up shot. right wrong legal, its just nature. you escalate from verbal to physical prepare for further escalation. thats american as apple pie. liberal laws have convinced thugs for too long that pushing and punching is ok but shooting is criminal. hogwash.

 

[disciple556]

and what is this provoked a fight? words dont provoke anything from rational civil human beings. were not apes.

 

[oneshot86]

u r going to have to back me in a corner or have me witness a forcible felony to get me involved

 

[Fig]

Only 1% fucktard thinks he’s parking kontrol.

 

[FS1]

havent watched video and wasnt there. no dog in the fight on specifics of this particular case. but i feel like it should be said loud and clear for all america to hear....you put hands on somebody over words you can and maybe will end up shot. right wrong legal, its just nature. you escalate from verbal to physical prepare for further escalation. thats american as apple pie. liberal laws have convinced thugs for too long that pushing and punching is ok but shooting is criminal. hogwash.

The human male has a protective primal instinct. Especially where the family is concerned. The man is wrong for getting physical. But is he dead wrong.

Like I said stupid, stupid and more stupid.

 

[W54/XM-388]

havent watched video and wasnt there. no dog in the fight on specifics of this particular case. but i feel like it should be said loud and clear for all america to hear....you put hands on somebody over words you can and maybe will end up shot. right wrong legal, its just nature. you escalate from verbal to physical prepare for further escalation. thats american as apple pie. liberal laws have convinced thugs for too long that pushing and punching is ok but shooting is criminal. hogwash.

To counter that a bit.
Part of the problem is people now feel that they can spew any hateful offensive garbage at another person and get away with it.

Back when life was a lot more "civilized" and there was a lot less crime, showing up at the local store and unleashing a foul mouthed tirade at some woman and her kids would have many folks thinking about lining up to adjust your jaw, and if you then pulled a gun, you'd have been lucky to make it to the gallows and not wound up dead on the street.

It's only recently folks have started to feel they can fly off the handle and berate others without consequence & I think that has had a very bad effect on our society.

 

[FS1]

You could say Darwin took out two idiots at once. It is pretty hard to see which one was more stupid. The shooter was stupid twice.

That gun did not do shit. Emotions did this one.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

I agree with most everything else you'd said, pretty much. But this statement can/should be taken one step further. And I have heard far too many people say this, or something like this:

We have executed and have held enough people on death row who ended up being innocent to say that the death penalty is a problem.

We have incarcerated and punished enough people in jail/prison who ended up being innocent to say that the prison/incarceration is a problem.

So, using the EXACT same analogy, are people saying that we should do away with prisons/holdings/Propane-Masters too? I think not. How about instead of just 'blanket stereotyping' one thing, we can just do that one thing better. There's lots of people out there (on death row) who need ......... their sentence competed.

 

[lonegunman762x51]

1. It is not your job to enforce traffic laws, even in Florida. Absolutely none of this would have happened if this idiot would have shut the hell up and minded his own business.

2. T-Bone was not beating his ass, he was running his mouth.

I'm of the mind the idiot got the guilty verdict he deserved. Yes, Florida is the rectum of America and every idiot from the northeast moves there and ruins it a little more every day. That being said, a creeper looking to create a confrontation so he can pull his gat and shoot someone is happening far too often, here is my story.

Three weeks ago I'm driving north on a 4 lane road with a concrete center divider, old bastard in 1 ton Dodge truck pulls next to me and violently swerves into my lane. I hit the brakes and horn immediately and swerve to right to avoid getting hit. Old bastard hits blinker, slams on brakes and stops in middle of road, asshole behind me stops angled across both lanes. ( this is at 3pm in moderate weekday traffic )

It looks questionable, I cannot pull out or back up and am suddenly in a pickle. I unholster my gun, keeping it out of sight. Enraged old bastard is screaming and yelling as he approaches, right hand in fumbling with windbreaker jacket that is bound up on shitty holster. Failing utterly at being discrete. I check my six and step out away from both guys, tell old bastard to "choke on my dick" call him a string of colorful and highly offensive names and comment about his shit driving. I point to asshole from rear truck and give a nice shout for him to stay back please.

Old bastard keeps up his ranting, about his right to drive where ever he pleases, his passenger is filming thru back window of truck. I remind him his parents should have aborted him and recommend he fuck off and get his ass back in his truck. He starts to move right hand, I quickly remind him his life will be over shortly if he fucking tries it. He has no draw speed, he probably bought that piece of shit S&W M&P for $399 at the Cabela's three weeks ago. He also got a shitty Uncle Mike's holster and has almost a box of shells thru it and he has been regaling his fucktard son-in-law with 'nam stories or some shit and they're out looking for trouble.

Guy #2 is back in his truck, he saw what was behind my leg. Old bastard is seconds away from making his wife a happy woman. He shuts the fuck up, it is still traffic loud. he is out of ideas, he wants to be a tough guy but he is fucked and figuring it out. He is not going to make it, definitely. I have his attention now. I tell him very clearly and in a loud voice, "If you attempt to draw your gun I will kill you, period. You have no fucking chance on earth of living." Asshole is still filming his gay daddy from truck. Thru closed windows, not sure if they got audio.

Old bastard is stuck, he ran out of balls. I strongly suggest he fuck straight the hell off and leave while he can. Old bastard backs to truck, climbs in and drives off slowly, probably still trying to unholster his piece of shit gun. I wait for asshole behind me to drive off, staying away from either asshole so they cannot accidentally run me over. Make notes of plates and get on with my day.

 

[Veer_G]

1. It is not your job to enforce traffic laws, even in Florida. Absolutely none of this would have happened if this idiot would have shut the hell up and minded his own business.

2. T-Bone was not beating his ass, he was running his mouth.

I'm of the mind the idiot got the guilty verdict he deserved. Yes, Florida is the rectum of America and every idiot from the northeast moves there and ruins it a little more every day. That being said, a creeper looking to create a confrontation so he can pull his gat and shoot someone is happening far too often, here is my story.

Three weeks ago I'm driving north on a 4 lane road with a concrete center divider, old bastard in 1 ton Dodge truck pulls next to me and violently swerves into my lane. I hit the brakes and horn immediately and swerve to right to avoid getting hit. Old bastard hits blinker, slams on brakes and stops in middle of road, asshole behind me stops angled across both lanes. ( this is at 3pm in moderate weekday traffic )

It looks questionable, I cannot pull out or back up and am suddenly in a pickle. I unholster my gun, keeping it out of sight. Enraged old bastard is screaming and yelling as he approaches, right hand in fumbling with windbreaker jacket that is bound up on shitty holster. Failing utterly at being discrete. I check my six and step out away from both guys, tell old bastard to "choke on my dick" call him a string of colorful and highly offensive names and comment about his shit driving. I point to asshole from rear truck and give a nice shout for him to stay back please.

Old bastard keeps up his ranting, about his right to drive where ever he pleases, his passenger is filming thru back window of truck. I remind him his parents should have aborted him and recommend he fuck off and get his ass back in his truck. He starts to move right hand, I quickly remind him his life will be over shortly if he fucking tries it. He has no draw speed, he probably bought that piece of shit S&W M&P for $399 at the Cabela's three weeks ago. He also got a shitty Uncle Mike's holster and has almost a box of shells thru it and he has been regaling his fucktard son-in-law with 'nam stories or some shit and they're out looking for trouble.

Guy #2 is back in his truck, he saw what was behind my leg. Old bastard is seconds away from making his wife a happy woman. He shuts the fuck up, it is still traffic loud. he is out of ideas, he wants to be a tough guy but he is fucked and figuring it out. He is not going to make it, definitely. I have his attention now. I tell him very clearly and in a loud voice, "If you attempt to draw your gun I will kill you, period. You have no fucking chance on earth of living." Asshole is still filming his gay daddy from truck. Thru closed windows, not sure if they got audio.

Old bastard is stuck, he ran out of balls. I strongly suggest he fuck straight the hell off and leave while he can. Old bastard backs to truck, climbs in and drives off slowly, probably still trying to unholster his piece of shit gun. I wait for asshole behind me to drive off, staying away from either asshole so they cannot accidentally run me over. Make notes of plates and get on with my day.

Well, I award you style points.

 

[Dthomas3523]

Boy, that's a tough one. Drejka (like George Zimmerman) is an idiot and took it upon himself to enforce handicap parking laws (though we as citizens should have that right).

By the video the wise thing would be to hold off on pulling the trigger. However, one could make the argument that if the pistol is drawn, the decision has been made to pull the trigger already. SO was he justified and drawing the firearm? That's tougher to say. He was arguing a verbal argument and McGlockton is the one who escalated to physical confrontation.

If we are arguing over which is better, 9mm or .45 or any other useless argument and it gets heated, does that give you the right to push me to the ground? At what point did McGlockton feel his family was in danger and needed to use force to protect his family?

It may have been closer if Drejka did not have a history of threatening people.

There is zero argument over a decision already being made to fire when you draw a weapon.

You are responsible for your own actions and being able to responsibly handle any weapon you may be in possession of.

There are times when drawing your weapon prior to being absolutely ready to use it is the best idea.

Also, you need to be prepared for the attacker to de-escalate once you produce a weapon. So, if you pull your weapon and the person stops (as it appears this person did), you as a responsible person have to be aware enough to not pull the trigger as that person is no longer a threat.

In this case, this dummy has been going around for years looking for a reason to shoot someone. I think the jury made the right call here.

 

[Dthomas3523]

If someone is not capable of drawing a weapon and then being able to make a decision not to fire if the situation changes, they should:

A: seek better training and practice

Or

B: not carry a firearm

Stress is a choice and training is how we get better with that choice. If you want to carry a weapon around, it’s your responsibility to learn how to use it in most any situation.