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McGowen introducing ECM rifled barrels...

Wannashootit

Gunny Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
  • Sep 3, 2010
    2,274
    575
    FL
    Noticed they have a "coming soon" for this on their home page.
    Didn't know this process has apparently gone beyond R&D.
    Not aware of any other major players doing this- have I been asleep?
     
    You can get them in certain calibers now from Carbon Six. I’ve shot them at the range. Three of the guys in our group shot ECM Carbon Six barrels at the NF Challenge.

    I’ve got a 6.5PRC ECM barrel on order from Carbon Six.
     
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    You can get them in certain calibers now from Carbon Six. I’ve shot them at the range. Three of the guys in our group shot ECM Carbon Six barrels at the NF Challenge.

    I’ve got a 6.5PRC ECM barrel on order from Carbon Six.

    carbon six = mcgowen steel blank

    just in case anyone is unaware

    At shot show they said they were doing 6.5mm only, but will expand to the entire line up by end of this year
     
    You can get them in certain calibers now from Carbon Six. I’ve shot them at the range. Three of the guys in our group shot ECM Carbon Six barrels at the NF Challenge.

    I’ve got a 6.5PRC ECM barrel on order from Carbon Six.
    How did their rifles shoot? All the C6 blanks I looked into that were 2-4 years old, looked like shit, but shot pretty well. Didn't appear they put much work into lapping out the tooling marks.
     
    How did their rifles shoot? All the C6 blanks I looked into that were 2-4 years old, looked like shit, but shot pretty well. Didn't appear they put much work into lapping out the tooling marks.
    They shot pretty well for shooting 6.5PRC in those conditions and being first time competitors. I’m a member and friends with the guy from Roaming Shot range here and all of his custom rifle builds use Carbon Six barrels. He used their barrel in Alaska when we shot the NRL course, just took a 300 PRC to an ELR Pro-Am (Not ECM if I remember correctly), but I haven’t seen any issues with them. I’ve never borescoped one to look at it, but I plan to when my barrel is ready.
     
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    I bought a C6 barrel from a member here, chambered in 6.5PRC. It’s a hammer. I don’t believe it was ECM. Loved it so much that I ordered another one 2ish weeks ago. He told me at the time of my order that I’d be getting the ECM barrel. Fixin to screw it on a Zermatt Origin and shoot the hell out of it. I’ll do a 100 shot review after each 100 shots with updates on accuracy and barrel wear.
     
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    I've had a pile of them. For remage setups they're a great deal.

    They've never screwed up a barrel and every one has been a shooter.

    Proof started their reputation on their blanks, now carbon six is using them.

    But people love to shit on them for some reason.
    Because at times their chambering or threading looks like it was done by a rabid beaver.
     
    Being 100% honest... I was completely unfamiliar with this method until going through this thread. I did a little reading about the process. I am mainly curious if this is just a cool new way of doing things or if its an actual game changer in any way. How much more performance can you get if your already shooting 1/2 - 1/4 with cut rifling from a top tier manufacturer in a PRS application?
     
    I've had a pile of them. For remage setups they're a great deal.

    They've never screwed up a barrel and every one has been a shooter.

    Proof started their reputation on their blanks, now carbon six is using them.

    But people love to shit on them for some reason.
    I would like to see a picture of some of their threads. I have 2 McGowan remage barrels that look like this and they were replacements for a third. None shoot, all threads have been well undersized and extremely sloppy fitting. So when I hear they never miss I want to see proof. I just saw one for sale in PX a couple months ago with the same terrible threads.

    My ar 15 barrel of theirs points about 5 mils left and 5 mils low from my other ar 15s. I had to remove the barrel extention locating pin and grind it down so a barrel nut would fit over it. It shoots at least though.
     

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    I've read lots of mcgowan/c6 prefit problems reported. Poor threads, poor chambers, crooked and rough, also improper headspace. I don't think there is anything wrong with a Mcgowan/C6 barrel, I just sure as hell wouldn't let their team cut the threads/chamber.
     
    I've read lots of mcgowan/c6 prefit problems reported. Poor threads, poor chambers, crooked and rough, also improper headspace. I don't think there is anything wrong with a Mcgowan/C6 barrel, I just sure as hell wouldn't let their team cut the threads/chamber.
    I've chambered dozens of McGowen barrels, they're solid mid-tier blanks- but I have had issues with a couple of short-chambered prefits that I'd taken in to complete for customers- one needed to be returned as the tenon OD was substantially over spec and I didn't want to fuck with it to make it right.
     
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    McGowen blanks aren't the issue. It's everything else they do. I was also a victim of their poor machining. Literally looked like the guy had no idea what he was doing. Just do a search for McGowen and see all their failures.

    I have a CarbonSix which is simply awesome and has proven accurate with a number of different bullet weights.
     
    I am mainly curious if this is just a cool new way of doing things or if its an actual game changer in any way.

    It will ultimately be a game changer from a manufacturing standpoint.

    Legacy processes will be kept alive by incumbent producers with sunk costs & inflexibility, but ECM will eventually kill button rifling all together & probably even cut rifling. CHF isn’t going anywhere.

    ECM rifling already substantially reduces or removes many barriers to entry for blank production, which will continue to diminish as the capital & technical requirements are further reduced or removed. I would expect the number of barrel makers to grow over the next two decades, which invariably means price competition.

    This is a song that’s been sung before… check back in 10 years
     
    It will ultimately be a game changer from a manufacturing standpoint.

    Legacy processes will be kept alive by incumbent producers with sunk costs & inflexibility, but ECM will eventually kill button rifling all together & probably even cut rifling. CHF isn’t going anywhere.

    ECM rifling already substantially reduces or removes many barriers to entry for blank production, which will continue to diminish as the capital & technical requirements are further reduced or removed. I would expect the number of barrel makers to grow over the next two decades, which invariably means price competition.

    This is a song that’s been sung before… check back in 10 years
    The barrel maker price competition market has sure been great as of late. Average price for an upper shelf tube is around $420-$440, 2 years ago 15% less, 5 years ago 20% less. Tarrifs on foreign steel, gonna climb again. Prices won't be changing downward due to competition. They will all just go up together.
     
    I was not claiming that prices paid by the end user would necessarily go down. As you point out, input costs can increase. There are some caveats regarding purchasing volume and supplier relationships.

    What new tech (in any industry) often enables is new entrants competing at lower start up costs than incumbents. For example, with regard to barrel manufacturing, this would make it easier for smaller firearm OEMs to manufacture their own barrels in house. As that occurs, the industry will see excess capacity in barrel blank production (unless demand outpaces supply).

    If a new tech with a lower cost of entry also enjoys lower operating costs, some incumbents typically find themselves in a tough spot. The economic and production assumptions that incumbents’ business models relied upon will have been undermined, yet they are burdened by assets that will eventually not make sense to maintain. A great example is the advent of steel mini mills & the demise of the integrated mill.

    To be clear, I’m not claiming this will be a fast process, it’s usually slow & starts with niche use cases. Also, ECM tech won’t be advanced by barrel manufacturers - they’re downstream of companies with R&D budgets that are individually orders of magnitude greater than the combined R&D budgets of the entire barrel making industry (e.g. aerospace companies).