Hi guys, here as kinda a last resort. I purchase a Viper pst gen 2 1-6, my first lpvo coming from RDS. I'm finding I greatly underestimated the balance/feel change that would happen and I don't like it. I have a proper cantilever mount, eye relief where it should be. Back end if eyepiece is just above charging handle, so it's mounted fine and I even tried moving it up and down on the reciever to see if it would help. I guess I'm asking if there's anything else to try other than getting a lighter lpvo or returning back to rds, at this point I'm listing it and going back to my T2. And stupid me bought from a local shop that does not offer returns otherwise I would do that. That's what I get for impatience. Anyway thanks in advance.
- Thread starter Bspreeolia291
- Start date
Eh...... That's the problem, don't think I want to.
Go back to the t2 then.
IMO, it doesn’t take that long to get used to and the juice is worth the squeeze, depending on application.
I shoot out ARs to 500y (+\-) and Id never go back to a RDS.
IMO, it doesn’t take that long to get used to and the juice is worth the squeeze, depending on application.
I shoot out ARs to 500y (+\-) and Id never go back to a RDS.
Ok. Starting to sway me twoards another try. But I 100% want to go as light as possible, and the viper gen II is not that. So I need to look into lighter options once this is gone. Recommendations? 1-4 is also ok for my application
How is the AR setup? Pistol? 16" ?
13.7 P/W light contour, Surefire 3prong, MCMR handguard. So lite overall
Gotcha, I've looked through the RT6 and it was nice but missing one huge requirement for me. Daylight bright dot. That's why I went pst genII. Just don't realize how much the weight is, feel able I guess on top of the reciever. Would 4 be a good number for the pst, just curious before it goes up. Really liking the Tr24 from what I'm seeing so far.
Mine is daylight bright
Leupold Patrol 6 is 16 oz.
Kahles K16i is 17 oz.
Steiner P4xi 1-4x is 17 oz.
Pair with a Scalarworks or other lightweight mount.
Kahles K16i is 17 oz.
Steiner P4xi 1-4x is 17 oz.
Pair with a Scalarworks or other lightweight mount.
It seems like the LPVO vs red dot has come up a lot lately.
The two things I see are claimed downsides to the LPVO-
1. Weight. Yes it weighs more, especially with a heavy mount. Did WWII vets cry about carrying around an MI Garand?
2. You can't run drills at 10 yards as well compared to an LPVO. Those are pistol distances for me. I prefer to shoot my carbine at 25 yards and typically beyond 100 where an LPVO does a better job.
The two things I see are claimed downsides to the LPVO-
1. Weight. Yes it weighs more, especially with a heavy mount. Did WWII vets cry about carrying around an MI Garand?
2. You can't run drills at 10 yards as well compared to an LPVO. Those are pistol distances for me. I prefer to shoot my carbine at 25 yards and typically beyond 100 where an LPVO does a better job.
The beauty of living in the U.S. first world problems lpvo vs dot. It's a dilemma.
Take a look at the Delta Stryker 1-6x LPVO. It comes in at almost six ounces lighter than the PST2 and has a day bright dot from the reviews I’ve seen. I’m planning to pick one up soon to try as well, and it comes recommended by Ilya Koshkin (the “Dark Lord of Optics”), as I need an LPVO for my current environment and don’t want a heavy pig either, if it can be avoided.
NF NX8 1-8 is 18 oz. Mines in a very lightweight mount.
I don’t see an explanation of what you are trying to do. I run a JP LRP-07 in 308 with a loopy mark six scope with a BDC reticle. For me the illumination is great. The entire rig weighs under 10 pounds. Shooting from a standing without support position I can do 18 inch groups at 200 yards if I get prone I can do 4 inch groups at 400 yards pretty easy. The scope weighs right at 17 ounces.
Delta Stryker 1-6x24 SFP (17.8ish ounces)(MSRP$849) or primary arms PLx Compact FFP 1-8x24(16.95 ounces)(MSRP $1499). Both are fantastic, just go with your preference for SFP or FFP and the one you can afford. Pretty big price gap between them but my favorite on the market I've looked through is the new PLx Compact, with the Delta being the best Japanese glassed, day bright "budget" lpvo and doesn't take a backseat. Both have flatter images on 1x then the PST which seems to aid speed.
That being said, all this gets down to application. If you just want to do home defense, cqb, shoot at a 50 yard range then a T2 is fine. If you want flexibility and an all purpose rifle out to 100 or more for a real situation where you would need PID, then imo you minimally need a 3-4x magnifier. At that point, unless you have multiple rifles for varying applications, I think the LPVO brings more to it than that red dot magnifier combination, especially if it's not a red dot with a bdc. Eye relief, eye box etc are all pretty poor on most magnifiers, especially the compact ones.
My advice is if you feel you want the flexibility to maximize your cartridge to maximum efficiency at unknown targets(PID) then you need magnification and the best at that imo is an lpvo. Also, don't be afraid to add an RDS offset if you have the budget.
That being said, all this gets down to application. If you just want to do home defense, cqb, shoot at a 50 yard range then a T2 is fine. If you want flexibility and an all purpose rifle out to 100 or more for a real situation where you would need PID, then imo you minimally need a 3-4x magnifier. At that point, unless you have multiple rifles for varying applications, I think the LPVO brings more to it than that red dot magnifier combination, especially if it's not a red dot with a bdc. Eye relief, eye box etc are all pretty poor on most magnifiers, especially the compact ones.
My advice is if you feel you want the flexibility to maximize your cartridge to maximum efficiency at unknown targets(PID) then you need magnification and the best at that imo is an lpvo. Also, don't be afraid to add an RDS offset if you have the budget.
Yes, the LPVO weight is greater than a red dot, but the capability increase offsets that for me.
I've had a few PA LPVOs and stepped up the the Gen II-E Razors and love them. They're heavy, but lighter than the Gen Is. My son-in-law has the Delta Stryker HD 1-6x and it's an amazing optic for the money. I've shot it side by side my Razors and if I was in the market for another LPVO, I'd go with the Delta. He has the Gen 1 with the moa/mil setup but I ain't dialing with a 1-6x so it doesn't bother me.
I've yet to try the PA platinum compact 1-8x but my brother is buying one to replace his SLx 1-8 FFP so I will get some time behind it in a few weeks or so.
I've had a few PA LPVOs and stepped up the the Gen II-E Razors and love them. They're heavy, but lighter than the Gen Is. My son-in-law has the Delta Stryker HD 1-6x and it's an amazing optic for the money. I've shot it side by side my Razors and if I was in the market for another LPVO, I'd go with the Delta. He has the Gen 1 with the moa/mil setup but I ain't dialing with a 1-6x so it doesn't bother me.
I've yet to try the PA platinum compact 1-8x but my brother is buying one to replace his SLx 1-8 FFP so I will get some time behind it in a few weeks or so.
Great insight guys. After reading through I am going to push forward and make the lpvo work, although a lighter variation. Likely the Stryker or potentially A Credo HX Red dot illumination hunter reticle paired with a Badger C1 1.70. Quite a big weight difference compared to the pst and can't see how I would not notice the improvement. So off to the bst's I go. Kicking myself I can't return this thing. Ughhhhh!! My fault though.
If you're that worried about weight, it looks like the Stryker is very light or you can get a Nightforce NX8 and see if you can run the optic with scope rings instead of a unimount with good-enough eye relief. If the eye relief is no good, get a Nightforce ultralight unimount. The PSTII is a great LPVO for the price but it is on the heavy side; the NX8 is on the other end of the spectrum. Unimounts themselves can also be heavy, and the Nightforce stuff is great, but if you can run regular rings you'll cut the mount weight in half.
I love my Burris rt6. Actually sold my razor 1-6 and went to this. Better reticle and weight in my opinion.
Another thing I did was went to a heavier stock to help make the rifle “feel” lighter while shouldered. For me the extra weight in the back seemed to act like a counter weight when swinging between targets
Another thing I did was went to a heavier stock to help make the rifle “feel” lighter while shouldered. For me the extra weight in the back seemed to act like a counter weight when swinging between targets
If you're looking at 1-4 or 1-6, then SFP will be just as good, if not better, than FFP because you're more than likely going to be either at 1x or maximum magnification. For lightweight SFP scopes, you probably can't do better than the Kahles 1-6 or Steiner 1-4. They both have great glass, great FOV, and true daylight bright red dots.
When considering weight, remember that to get any magnification with a red dot, adding a magnifier will get you much closer to the weight of a lightweight LPVO. Apples vs. apples.
When considering weight, remember that to get any magnification with a red dot, adding a magnifier will get you much closer to the weight of a lightweight LPVO. Apples vs. apples.
You can try a lighter LPVO, but that will still be closer in weight to PST Gen2, than to a red dot. If you decide to do that, your best bet that is not too far off from the PST Gen2 in price is Delta Stryker 1-6x24.
Another option is to get the T2 back on the rifle and get some sort of a lightweight magnifier in a QD mount. That is a notably lighter total package. I have been playing with PA's new Micro 3x magnifier and it is pretty decent given how inexpensive and lightweight it is. If you are trying to keep weight at a minimum, that's a good option.
Option #3 is to get a lightweight prismatic scope of some sort and set it up with an offset red dot. That requires a little re-training, but works. That's roughly the same weight budget as a red dot with magnifier.
ILya
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