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1000 yards is too easy??

A

Austincqc

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
May 5, 2010
317
0
41
TX, USA
Hey all,

I've recently been taking my Savage 10pc .308 out to a grand with 175gr black hills (soon will be using SW ammo). The past few times I've done it, the wind has either been at my back or right in my face. I get first shot hits on all targets from 250 - 1000 and can hit any of them all day without issue.

Again, the wind has always been at my back or in my face. I know hitting a grand CAN'T and shouldn't be that easy. I want to learn more about adjusting for wind, and the few times that I have seen some cross wind, I just aimed a little off to one side or the other without any method other than reading my POA/POI. I've been documenting stuff like that too, so I have some basis of reference in the future.

Any ideas how to get more training on reading the wind? Maybe working more with the .22 trainer? I'm totally open.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

What are you shooting at? Try some smaller targets, and then some cross wind.

High winds and small targets make it more difficult.

I hit this can of spray paint yesterday. It was @1010 yards and with a 15mph wind @ 4 o'clock. I held 1.2-1.3 mils with my 6.5 Creedmoor
EQOcq.jpg
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Wow! That's impressive!

I don't have control over the target sizes, so maybe I just need to talk with the range to see if they will put something smaller.

I seem to hit where I want and don't count when I hit the side of a target when I meant to hit the center. I just wish I would get out there when there was some good cross wind. Depending on how you look at it, I'm just not getting lucky.

I'm far from a great shooter, but I'm not a crap shot either.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

A .22 LR is a good idea, great for practicing. What are the sizes of the targets at your range?

For 1k yards we use anything from 8" AR500 circles to 25"x15" silhouettes depending on what were doing.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

They're decent sized targets. I think two 20" gongs and some silhouettes.

I actually just called and asked if I could bring some steel targets to set up on a slow day - the answer is a definite maybe.
smile.gif


I'm not too happy with my bolt action 22 right now, so I'll probably use a $250 gift card my gf got me towards a new .22. Any wind affects those tiny bullets.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What are you shooting at? Try some smaller targets, and then some cross wind.

High winds and small targets make it more difficult.

I hit this can of spray paint yesterday. It was @1010 yards and with a 15mph wind @ 4 o'clock. I held 1.2-1.3 mils with my 6.5 Creedmoor
EQOcq.jpg
</div></div>


1.2-.3 mil hold at 1010....., with that wind?? That's awesome. And makes me want to look harder at the 6.5's....

I was needing that hold at half that distance with my 308 the other day.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Wow, that is some awesome shooting.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What are you shooting at? Try some smaller targets, and then some cross wind.

High winds and small targets make it more difficult.

I hit this can of spray paint yesterday. It was @1010 yards and with a 15mph wind @ 4 o'clock. I held 1.2-1.3 mils with my 6.5 Creedmoor
EQOcq.jpg
</div></div>
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

You need to find a place where your wind indicators are blowing in two different directions at once.

That'll get your blood pressure up.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

I agree, so substitute your scoped and mechanical supported Savage with an iron sight, sling supported AR based Service Rifle. After the dust settles and the smoke clears there will be no doubt how you appraise your skill. BTW, use a NRA LR bulls-eye target. It has scoring rings which will help you recognize your relative performance.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Max Owner</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You need to find a place where your wind indicators are blowing in two different directions at once.

That'll get your blood pressure up.</div></div> I would love that, but without driving 4 hours in any direction, there isn't a place to shoot. I'm really thinking of shooting my AR or .22lr more to get more practice reading wind if this keeps up. Having perfect conditions is great and all, but it's not helping me shoot better.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I agree, so substitute your scoped and mechanical supported Savage with an iron sight, sling supported AR based Service Rifle. After the dust settles and the smoke clears there will be no doubt how you appraise your skill. BTW, use a NRA LR bulls-eye target. It has scoring rings which will help you recognize your relative performance. </div></div>
No offense, but Shooting an AR with iron sights out to distance doesn't interest me at all. That's what I grew up doing and have enjoyed shooting with a scoped rifle.

I think you misread my post, Sterling. I wasn't saying I'll pop golf balls at a grand all day anytime/anywhere. I was saying, the conditions at my 1000 yard range have been consistently perfect eliminating the variables that require skill to hit what you want - so it's not helping me build my skill.

Suggestions so far have been to use smaller targets, use more wind, and to shoot a .22lr. Since I can't fit the wind in my range bag, maybe the smaller targets and .22lr will have to work for now.
smile.gif
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

It's tough to find a substitute for the real thing. There's nothing like high mph, changing value wind...
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

You are just awsome austin and apparently naturally gifted.it is now time to enter up in some precision rifle comps.see the match section of the forum.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

20" x 20" is a 2MOA size target at 1000. Try a 1.5 or 1 MOA target and it gets a bit more difficult.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

We usually put three targets at 1000, the biggest is 45% ipsc, the second is smaller, the third about 5" round. You'll be surprised how easy the big one is and how hard the small one is, and you add some cross wind, really hard. Try doing three or four distances out to a grand and leave the scope on "0", then give yourself a time limit and hold over using your reticle on all of them. Fun times!
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What are you shooting at? Try some smaller targets, and then some cross wind.

High winds and small targets make it more difficult.

I hit this can of spray paint yesterday. It was @1010 yards and with a 15mph wind @ 4 o'clock. I held 1.2-1.3 mils with my 6.5 Creedmoor
EQOcq.jpg
</div></div>\\
Nice one!!!
How many shots did it take?
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: procovert45</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You are just awsome austin and apparently naturally gifted.it is now time to enter up in some precision rifle comps.see the match section of the forum.</div></div>

This thread isn't me bragging about my mad skillz. I'm asking for advice on training techniques because conditions keep being ideal and aren't helping me any. I've only shot with cross winds between 2-4mph at a 45 degree angle coming towards me. It didn't do much to my POI.

I've heard a lot of people learning a lot from comps....maybe it's not a bad idea to go and pick up some info.

Hitting the 20" gong at a 1000 isn't easy, but isn't impossible either. I know my dope and spend a lot of time behind my rifle. I appreciate your "advice."

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 2shots</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We usually put three targets at 1000, the biggest is 45% ipsc, the second is smaller, the third about 5" round. You'll be surprised how easy the big one is and how hard the small one is, and you add some cross wind, really hard. Try doing three or four distances out to a grand and leave the scope on "0", then give yourself a time limit and hold over using your reticle on all of them. Fun times!</div></div>

I like this idea. 5 inches is tiny. Where did you get the targets?
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Old saying, "Only pigs can see the wind."

You can estimate, but . . . .

. . . . it changes, and generally just when ya pull the trigger.

SWAG.

Just my opinion.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Belisarius</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What are you shooting at? Try some smaller targets, and then some cross wind.

High winds and small targets make it more difficult.

I hit this can of spray paint yesterday. It was @1010 yards and with a 15mph wind @ 4 o'clock. I held 1.2-1.3 mils with my 6.5 Creedmoor
EQOcq.jpg
</div></div>\\
Nice one!!!
How many shots did it take?</div></div>

Took 4 this time, last time was with a .308 and it took me a few more.

I think the wind was more 4:30 5 o'clock
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinCQC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I get first shot hits on all targets from 250 - 1000 and can hit any of them all day without issue... I know hitting a grand CAN'T and shouldn't be that easy... Any ideas how to get more training on reading the wind?</div></div>Start shooting the matches. If you are really that good you will win them. If you don't win them you will get better at reading wind.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Hes not BSing!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Belisarius</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dieselgeek</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What are you shooting at? Try some smaller targets, and then some cross wind.

High winds and small targets make it more difficult.

I hit this can of spray paint yesterday. It was @1010 yards and with a 15mph wind @ 4 o'clock. I held 1.2-1.3 mils with my 6.5 Creedmoor
EQOcq.jpg
</div></div>\\
Nice one!!!
How many shots did it take?</div></div>

Took 4 this time, last time was with a .308 and it took me a few more.

I think the wind was more 4:30 5 o'clock </div></div>
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Try unknown ranges. If possible go out in the woods and shoot over valleys to other landings, learn some range estimation. Change places, altitudes, wind, the complete enviroment. Its amazing how a little angle, temp or baro can throw a shot. Even a few yds off at a grand can have a noticable effect. fixed courses are fairley easy after you get the dope for the range, than it just comes down to fundemantels, bone support, NPA, breathing ect. I also agree try smaller targets, from say 2moa to 1moa, these will realy test your basics. Just my 2cents.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KopfenJager</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Try unknown ranges. If possible go out in the woods and shoot over valleys to other landings, learn some range estimation. Change places, altitudes, wind, the complete enviroment. Its amazing how a little angle, temp or baro can throw a shot. Even a few yds off at a grand can have a noticable effect. fixed courses are fairley easy after you get the dope for the range, than it just comes down to fundemantels, bone support, NPA, breathing ect. I also agree try smaller targets, from say 2moa to 1moa, these will realy test your basics. Just my 2cents.
</div></div>

There are ranges where hitting at 1000m is easy, and there are others where hitting at 800m is tough. The terrain will dictate the difficulty of the shot.

Wind is typically easy to call on flat ground- its those hilly ranges with obstacles blocking wind or valleys changing wind conditions that really demonstrate a challenge.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Griffin Armament</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KopfenJager</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Try unknown ranges. If possible go out in the woods and shoot over valleys to other landings, learn some range estimation. Change places, altitudes, wind, the complete enviroment. Its amazing how a little angle, temp or baro can throw a shot. Even a few yds off at a grand can have a noticable effect. fixed courses are fairley easy after you get the dope for the range, than it just comes down to fundemantels, bone support, NPA, breathing ect. I also agree try smaller targets, from say 2moa to 1moa, these will realy test your basics. Just my 2cents.
</div></div>

There are ranges where hitting at 1000m is easy, and there are others where hitting at 800m is tough. The terrain will dictate the difficulty of the shot.

Wind is typically easy to call on flat ground- its those hilly ranges with obstacles blocking wind or valleys changing wind conditions that really demonstrate a challenge.</div></div>

Thanks - Both of you! I think you both gave me a good reason to go camping in the hill country!

Thanks Griffin for agreeing that hitting a 1000m shot can be easy (depending on the conditions).
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

There are days and times when we can all make called eye box shots at 1k. Wind is the issue.

I used to always want to shoot early in the morning when the wind was light and consistent. However in the last couple years I want to shoot in peak winds, just in front of a storm, falling snow, rain, whatever - that is where it is for me at this point - b/c if you really can - you can in any condition.

Also shoot in multiple locations - you get used to the prevailing winds and lighting conditions in a particular location. Seek out areas that have severe elevation changes along the path from the shooter to the target. Begin to recognize what topo features produce x effect at different points along the path. Sites that have 4 or 5 direction and velocity changes are pretty interesting.


Good luck
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Austin, you're probably shooting at 'Best of the West' in Liberty Hill. They might let you put up your own targets on a really slow day, but wouldn't let me do it when there was any kind of crowd there. You're best bet might be to talk around at the range and try to find someone who owns land or has a huntin lease nearby, and is willin to let you set up a makeshift range. I have land NW of austin and bought some regular 6 x 18" 1/2 in steel plates, then used a cuttin torch to cut 6" circles and a small hole in the top that i can fit a tow strap throuh, then some white spray paint and a makeshift welded 2" pipe stand, and I had my challenging 1000 yd setup (at least for me). The wind has been very calm lately around here, but knowing Texas, it will be blowin 20+ in no time. Good luck buddy...
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

2MOA target at 1000y supported is very easy. Especially with little or no wind.

If you want more challenge and fun then enter some comps...
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Heeler - yup been shooting at BOTW. Great guys and awesome range! I already talked with them and usually only make it out in the middle of the week or when a big game is on TV so I miss the crowd. If it's slow, I can have them put up my targets.
smile.gif


Lucks - I am starting to look into some comps, but want a lot more practice with wind first.

Since you two are around Central TX, maybe we can meet up and shoot sometime. It would be great having knowledgeable people to shoot with.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Yeah Im doint a lot of .22lr training right now just to keep learning and I fine it is working.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Austin - Don't worry about being fully prepared for your first match. I did my first this year, and I'm glad I didn't wait longer.

Really, as long as travel/lodging costs are not too much, the cost of a match usually isn't that bad. It is money well spent in terms of learning. At least that is how I felt.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinCQC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey all,

I've recently been taking my Savage 10pc .308 out to a grand with 175gr black hills (soon will be using SW ammo). The past few times I've done it, the wind has either been at my back or right in my face. I get first shot hits on all targets from 250 - 1000 and can hit any of them all day without issue.

Again, the wind has always been at my back or in my face. I know hitting a grand CAN'T and shouldn't be that easy. I want to learn more about adjusting for wind, and the few times that I have seen some cross wind, I just aimed a little off to one side or the other without any method other than reading my POA/POI. I've been documenting stuff like that too, so I have some basis of reference in the future.

Any ideas how to get more training on reading the wind? Maybe working more with the .22 trainer? I'm totally open. </div></div>

Just curious, what's your wind formula?
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Clay pigeons at 1k is fun at the gravel pit I shoot at. With my 6 dasher I can hit them about 80% of the time with 108 Bergers.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sled</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Austin - Don't worry about being fully prepared for your first match. I did my first this year, and I'm glad I didn't wait longer.
</div></div>

^^^



I'm glad I dove in when I did!
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

You can't underestimate the power of keeping it simple.

I always used wind charts instead of formulas- the more math, the more time, the more possibility of screwing it up.

At a military competition at one point I was given dope with the wrong elevation baseline from a spotter scared we wouldn't make time- just an example of how easy it is to screw up even the simple under stress- the round was so high, that the spotter lost trace, and there was no correction call.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

I was having this problem at 625 yards shooting a 7 inch disc. So I went and bought some 4 inch discs. Things are a little more interesting now. Wind will bring my 260AI off the steel now so I must actually compensate for it.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Will they let you paint a circle in the gongs at that range? At least give you hit/miss on the paint spot.

As far as big winds go, nothing you can do but find a place to shoot in them.

Edit:

Also, what you're experiencing is a natural progression. I, like many other shooters didn't like to go out in the wind. Instead I preferred to practice my technique and get my drops down pat without having to fight the wind. Once I got that then I realized some days are just going to be tougher than others and the need arose to call and shoot in the wind.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinCQC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey all,

I've recently been taking my Savage 10pc .308 out to a grand with 175gr black hills (soon will be using SW ammo). The past few times I've done it, the wind has either been at my back or right in my face. I get first shot hits on all targets from 250 - 1000 and can hit any of them all day without issue.

Again, the wind has always been at my back or in my face. I know hitting a grand CAN'T and shouldn't be that easy. I want to learn more about adjusting for wind, and the few times that I have seen some cross wind, I just aimed a little off to one side or the other without any method other than reading my POA/POI. I've been documenting stuff like that too, so I have some basis of reference in the future.

Any ideas how to get more training on reading the wind? Maybe working more with the .22 trainer? I'm totally open. </div></div>

eh? shoot in a different direction...?

must be missing something
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chanonry</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinCQC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey all,

I've recently been taking my Savage 10pc .308 out to a grand with 175gr black hills (soon will be using SW ammo). The past few times I've done it, the wind has either been at my back or right in my face. I get first shot hits on all targets from 250 - 1000 and can hit any of them all day without issue.

Again, the wind has always been at my back or in my face. I know hitting a grand CAN'T and shouldn't be that easy. I want to learn more about adjusting for wind, and the few times that I have seen some cross wind, I just aimed a little off to one side or the other without any method other than reading my POA/POI. I've been documenting stuff like that too, so I have some basis of reference in the future.

Any ideas how to get more training on reading the wind? Maybe working more with the .22 trainer? I'm totally open. </div></div>

eh? shoot in a different direction...?

must be missing something</div></div>

You might be missing the fact the range is oriented in one direction. Where he is at it takes a minimum of four hours to get to some place he can shoot in any direction.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Wish we had it that easy. We shoot pretty much all directions during our matches and across numerous valleys. On the longer targets we can get 3 or more different winds which really adds to the challenge.

Good luck, like others have said drop down to some smaller target sizes and if it's still too easy you can always try it with a pistol
smile.gif


Using a 22 out to 250 or 300 yards will also give you more practice with wind adjustments and you'll be surprised how accurate they still are at those distances and even beyond.

Topstrap
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

You could try rapid engagement drills. A color dot target can be used. 5 dots x 4 dots using four different colors in a random arrangement. Pick a color, start the clock, then get behind your rifle and see how fast and accurately you can engage each colored dot. Change the size depending on the distance. If you can use multiple distances you can switch from target to target using hold overs. If the weather ain't cooperating, then think up creative drills your range will allow.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Turn 90 degrees and shoot. Honestly bud, you spent most of your post bragging, and then asked a beginner question.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinCQC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey all,

I've recently been taking my Savage 10pc .308 out to a grand with 175gr black hills (soon will be using SW ammo). The past few times I've done it, the wind has either been at my back or right in my face. I get first shot hits on all targets from 250 - 1000 and can hit any of them all day without issue.

Again, the wind has always been at my back or in my face. I know hitting a grand CAN'T and shouldn't be that easy. I want to learn more about adjusting for wind, and the few times that I have seen some cross wind, I just aimed a little off to one side or the other without any method other than reading my POA/POI. I've been documenting stuff like that too, so I have some basis of reference in the future.

Any ideas how to get more training on reading the wind? Maybe working more with the .22 trainer? I'm totally open. </div></div>
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AustinCQC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I get first shot hits on all targets from 250 - 1000 and can hit any of them all day without issue.
Any ideas how to get more training on reading the wind? Maybe working more with the .22 trainer? I'm totally open. </div></div>
Damn... wish i had that problem, make a trip out here to SD, one day you can ring steel from 600-1300 all day long, the next day its 50 degrees cooler, 25mph radically changing wind, and some of the best conditions to hone your wind reading skills.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

Make a trip to Butner. 8 flags blowing 8 different directions will make your day.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

I had a day like that 2 weeks ago. Started at 700 yards, couldn't miss, by the time I got out to a mile, the mirage was bad. Took 3 shots, couldn't see where I was hitting, so I worked my back.

Stopping at 1000, where we have a 12", 8", and 5" squares. I let my gun cool down, saw that I had 10 rounds left, then started shooting at the 5 incher.
Next thing I know, I'm in my pickup, scratching my ass driving back to town, asking myself WTF.
Humility can be cruel sometimes.
 
Re: 1000 yards is too easy??

First of all a 20" gong is actually pretty big. Try shooting an F class target, with the 300 yd flag blowing one way, the 600 another and the 900 blowing at you.

You know how you shoot that? It takes a match or two to learn it but the answer is easy.






You sit up and watch for 5 minutes till things get better, and if it's still goofy at 5 min you wait 10....Now if I could just remember that more often I might actually break 190 one day.
 
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