16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

[Johnnyscience]

I've got an IRA .308 lower that I would like to build soon both as a hunting rifle and also for defense/SHTF.

I wanted to go as short as possible, yet keeping as much of the specs of the .308 bullet as possible. (distance, fps, velocity etc)

I know 18" usually gives you enough length to burn up pretty much all ofthe powder to get everything out of a .308 bullet.

But it seems that a lot of people are now saying you can go 16" and the only difference from the 18" is just a loss of 100fps?

Is this true? You will still be able to reach the same distances accurately withthe 16" that you would with the 18" along with penetration/kill rate?

I assume a chrome lined barrel is the best choice? What kind of rifling do I want, 1/10?

I was thinking of adding a brake/flash combo on it either length...

Well for the 9/10 times I would want less than 800 yards, but with a serious knockdown punch. If 16" can do this for me then great. But if its just a paper puncher at 5-800 yards, I may opt for the 18" to get more knockdown power.

It will only be 1/10 times I would need to get out past 800 yards, but I wouldnt want a paper shooter for that and would also like serious knockdown power. So if 18" is what will do this, I may have to go 18"

18" still isnt terrible for 500 yards or less.

So if I want a 1/10 twist, what do I want the barrel to be made out of?

I was told not chrome? There are actually better options for the .308?

What about nitrited barrles? Do I want one that has that feature?

These seem like they are a great price....

http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2277

Anyone know the quality?

I dont mind spending more to get a higher quality barrel.

I remember a year ago when .308 barrels were 6-800 because there werent enough of them during the panic.

I'd like to pick a high quality one up soon while there seems to be a low time in the market and are readily available and reasonably priced.

Options?

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

POF makes a bitchin 12" 308 if you want short.

Personally I'm a 20" guy myself for my semi. No reason for me to go any shorter, and of POF made a 24" I would have gotten that.

For the rest of your questions there is a lot of info in this thread:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...540#Post2222540

 

[Shooter McGavin]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

I have a POF 308 with a 16.5" bbl. I have been using a NF NXS 2.5-10 x 32 with a LV ballistic reticle and it works great with M118LR. I have only taken it out to six hundred yards. However, at 300 yards on a flapper target I was just smacking it back and forth like it was nothing.

Jamie

 

[pc3]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

18" for mine, muzzle blast from 18" is bad. But the 16 1/4 I had was awful....... Yeh I know you should always wear muffs but i find it Very hard to hunt with earmuffs in the heat.

 

[Bruiser_Joe]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

i have a 20" ar10 and a 16" ar10 and my 16" is my favorite. the 20" is a hammer but isn't nearly as handy. my 16" is goin to get a 1-8 shortdot and probably be my go to rifle. out to 600 its a awesome gun. it has a rock creek barrel on it right now, and i love it.

 

[Johnnyscience]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

Does a 16" just punch paper out to 600 yards? Or does it still really have a lot of knockdown power?

What about out to 800+ yards, will a 16" just be a paper puncher, or will it drop heavy animals?

 

[Al Rick]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Johnnyscience</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Does a 16" just punch paper out to 600 yards? Or does it still really have a lot of knockdown power?

What about out to 800+ yards, will a 16" just be a paper puncher, or will it drop heavy animals? </div></div>

+1?

 

[scotharr]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

Not sure what the advantage of a short barreled hunting rifle is, but there sure are disadvantages: lots of muzzle blast/noise. Add that brake on and geez I sure wouldn't want to be around you when shooting. Most people hunt without hearing protection, so you should think about going with a longer barrel to tame the blast and noise: not shorter...and definitely not a brake. Get two barrels if you really need a short one: a longer sporter for hunting: 24" for example.

 

[Johnnyscience]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

Well ideally having 2 barrels would be nice, but I'm trying to find the sweet spot for a multi purpose .308.

Which around the 16-18" spot seems to be where it is for the most part.

Sure a 24" for hunting if it were just a dedicated hunting rifle, but this is also going to be a SHTF weapon as well and it seems that it can be accomplished around the 16-18"

If going 16" really only drops the .308 only around 100 fps, I think its worth going for the 16" then. I dont plan on shooting out past 800 yards very often, it will just be nice if it can.

Most shooting would be 800 yards or less & it seems the .308 can still drop a heavy animal at that distance properly.

And why not a brake?

I was going to get a brake/flash combo to cover both bases, that isnt a good idea?

I'd go with a can on the .308 & at 16" it is doable, but it still brings the length back up to around 20"

What kind of barrel material do I want?

I've seen SS, Nitrited, 4140 Chromium Molybdenum etc.

 

[Johnnyscience]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

I found some barrels on Rainer Arms & need some help figuring out whats best for me.

Their Ultramatch is made from Stainless Steel Match Grade Shilen Blank and is priced $395

Where as the Kaiser Defense Technologies 7.62×51 is made with Steel: 4140 Chromium Molybdenum & Finish: Ferritic Nitrocarburized and is priced $261

And finally the Noveske 7.62mm Barrel - 16 doesnt say what its made from but is priced at $555

So is the Noveske worth twice the amount as the Kaiser Defense? (And not just because of the name, I'm saying comparing barrel to barrel based on materials & heat treat etc)

So what is the real difference between all of these? Some are SS and some have a finish etc, so which one is preferred with or without a coating/finish?

I dont see where any of them say Nitrited barrel? I was told this is a good thing to have with .308 barrels?

 

[bignada]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

Johnny,

Really need to learn more before you get all dangerous with your spending. Bone up on what finish applications are out there. Don't know of any "nitrited" treatment that does anything but produce a cosmetic finish.

Chrome plated barrel is fine for a blaster, but aside from Armalite don't know of any 10 barrels commonly plated. More to the barrel length thing than just handiness. Gas system differences are real and influence accuracy. Longer the gas tube the more benign the impact upon brass.

18" barrel is very usable. Might find a 10T barrel in 24" and cut it to 18" and have the best of all worlds with the rifle length gas system versus carbine length.

Study up and determine what you propose to gain from a new barrel in the first place. Short barrel is for sure handy, but really fatiguing to have that fireball going off so close to your face every round you fire.

 

[pilotguy299]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

18" is probably the sweet spot for performance/size. that being said I have a lar-8 in 16" as I don't plan on shooting past 300, and appreciate the smaller size.

 

[Johnnyscience]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bignada</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Johnny,

Really need to learn more before you get all dangerous with your spending. Bone up on what finish applications are out there. Don't know of any "nitrited" treatment that does anything but produce a cosmetic finish.

Chrome plated barrel is fine for a blaster, but aside from Armalite don't know of any 10 barrels commonly plated. More to the barrel length thing than just handiness. Gas system differences are real and influence accuracy. Longer the gas tube the more benign the impact upon brass.

18" barrel is very usable. Might find a 10T barrel in 24" and cut it to 18" and have the best of all worlds with the rifle length gas system versus carbine length.

Study up and determine what you propose to gain from a new barrel in the first place. Short barrel is for sure handy, but really fatiguing to have that fireball going off so close to your face every round you fire. </div></div>

I'm here doing the research before I buy a barrel... hence all of the questions!

I'm surprised you're not familiar with nitriding... a lot of people swear by it and its not just for a cosmetic finish.

Apparently its an advancement that is better than chrome lining for multiple reasons, but it does the entire barrel, not just the inside like chrome.

I'm still torn between 16 & 18"

Some people say the fireball on a 16" isnt bad at all

And I plan on putting a brake/flash combo, so that should help reduce any fireball on a 16" correct?

 

[ArcticFun]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

What kind of heavy animals are you planning to take from 500-800 yards with a .308? That's a tall order where I'm from with a 24" .308 launching heavies. For 500 and less the 16" would be fine, just loud and with some stout recoil, a brake will make it even louder and make the fireball bigger. The 18" would probably give you the perfect balance between long range and being handy in a SHTF scenario.

Are you planning on rapid firing your .308 when you build it? If not I wouldn't bother with chrome or nitrided barrels, just get a good, custom SS barrel and have a good smith chamber it for you.

 

[Johnnyscience]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

The biggest animals I can

But honestly, I havent heard anyone doubt the power of a .308 out to 800 yards for big game except you...

I dont plan on reaching out that far that often, but it will be nice to be able to drop a large animal that far out with a 16" barrel.

I was getting a flash/brake combo, dont you think the flash would reduce the brake to an acceptable level, yet still giving you the help with recoil?

Should I go with just a flash hider on a 16" barrel to help with the fireball?

 

[Johnnyscience]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

Any more feedback on the brake/flash comobo yey or ney?

 

[SMH]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

I posted this some time ago in a different part of the forum but it might be of interest to you- (the 16 inch below was equiped with a flash hider)

I recently had the opportunity to shoot 3 different Rock River Arms LAR8s with different barrel lengths.(16 inch CM, 20 inch SS bull, 26 inch SS Bull)
Rifles were like new with round counts between 3 and 333.
All shots fired flawlessly from a 5 round magazine.

5 shots were fired with each of 3 loads from each rifle
(41 degrees F, Chrono at 10ft)
Winds were EXTREMELY erratic creating obvious grouping issues. Despite this, all 9 of the 5 shot groups averaged 1.1 inches at 100yds. (many groups had 4/5 shots around .5)

Loads were as follows-
168 HPBT (bought as "BH factory new" but pulled down to reveal fired brass and 41.7gr of extruded powder w/a gold primer)
16 ave vel 2310 ES 88
20 ave vel 2416 ES 31
26 ave vel 2558 ES 39

155 Amax (Lapua brass, 45.6gr Varget, CCIBR2)
16 ave vel 2563 ES 10
20 ave vel 2644 ES 42
26 ave vel 2788 ES 58

175 HPBT Black Hills Factory (Red Box)
16 ave vel 2437 ES 141
20 ave vel 2465 ES 123
26 ave vel 2615 ES 103

Velocity loss per inch of barrel length was as follows-
26 vs 20 inch barrel
Average of 24fps (24 with 168s, 24 with 155s and 25 with 175s)

20 vs 16 inch
Average of 18fps (27 with 168s, 20 with 155s, 7 with 175s)

26 vs 16 inch
Average of 22fps (25 with 168s, 22 with 155s, 18 with 175s)

The ES were extremely high.
The 155 Amax load was chronographed over the summer in the 26 inch barrel and showed ES about half of what was experienced this time.
A larger sample size is obviously needed for more meaningful data!

 

[SMH]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

The 20 inch barrel would drop 1.8 inches more at 300 yards, 12.6 more at 600 and 51 inches more at 1000 yards vs the 26 inch barrel.

The 16 inch barrel would drop 3 inches more at
300, 20.4 more at 600 and 84 more at 1000 yards vs the 26 inch barrel.

(using 155 Amax zeroed at 100 yards)

 

[scotharr]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

Johnny, let me be more direct. Most of the folks I know use a short 308 barrel do so with a suppressor to tame the muzzle flash and noise increase a short barrel causes. Exactly what SHTF scenario would you use a SBR 308 for? Home defense? That would be an awful choice with a rifle that will permanently deafen you, temporarily blind you, and shoot through several walls into your neighbors home. A brake on your SHTF rifle: just makes everything mentioned worse. You want a real SHTF gun: get a 12 gauge with buckshot. My recommendation would be to get a 24" barrel in a #5 contour for a nice shooter (& neighbor) friendly 308. You really want a SHTF rifle: get an AR.

 

[Jhnmdahl]

Re: 16" or 18" .308 barrel for hunting & defense/SHTF?

I've always wondered about rifles that seem designed for someone defending themselves in a closet when the shtf half a mile away as well. If there's no reason to go 24-26" and make full use of the 308, why choose a 308?