I'm trying to decide on a new rifle to use at the range and to whack some coyotes. I like the looks of a 20 inch heavy barrel. I am considering the remington 700 sps tactical or the Howa 1500. Any opinions on these or other suggestions???
- Thread starter bulldogto
- Start date
Re: .223 for newbie
I have a savage 10 ugly black synthetic stock in .223 with a plain bushnell 4-12x50 it does not have a heavy barrel, its light weight and accurate enough out to 300 yards. I also own a model 12 bvss in .223 with a bull barrel and a simmons 4-20x50 scope but I never take it hunting, super accurate just way to heavy. Im also considering a savage 10 predator with a semi-bull barrel, I think it weighs in at 7.5lbs. hard to justify the price to replace my model 10 which really works just fine.
I have a savage 10 ugly black synthetic stock in .223 with a plain bushnell 4-12x50 it does not have a heavy barrel, its light weight and accurate enough out to 300 yards. I also own a model 12 bvss in .223 with a bull barrel and a simmons 4-20x50 scope but I never take it hunting, super accurate just way to heavy. Im also considering a savage 10 predator with a semi-bull barrel, I think it weighs in at 7.5lbs. hard to justify the price to replace my model 10 which really works just fine.
Re: .223 for newbie
savage 10 predator or rem 700 ltr both great guns for what your doing.
savage 10 predator or rem 700 ltr both great guns for what your doing.
Re: .223 for newbie
Howa 1500 is nice. There is a review of the Howa 1500 Supreme Varminter on snipercentral.com I think. THey also sell a beginner package using the Howa 1500 or you can pay a little more and they will use a Remmington 700.
Howa 1500 is nice. There is a review of the Howa 1500 Supreme Varminter on snipercentral.com I think. THey also sell a beginner package using the Howa 1500 or you can pay a little more and they will use a Remmington 700.
Re: .223 for newbie
I came to the same impasse a while ago.
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=752641#Post752641
I went with howa. I love my 223 howa.
I came to the same impasse a while ago.
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=752641#Post752641
I went with howa. I love my 223 howa.
Re: .223 for newbie
I'm really liking the savage predator with the medium contour barrel. For the money that and the Howa look pretty good
I'm really liking the savage predator with the medium contour barrel. For the money that and the Howa look pretty good
Re: .223 for newbie
Take a look at a Tikka T3 platform as well if you have a chance. Very nice rifle out of the box. Gets even better in a new stock.
madd0c
Take a look at a Tikka T3 platform as well if you have a chance. Very nice rifle out of the box. Gets even better in a new stock.
madd0c
Re: .223 for newbie
I'd look for a PSS in 223. They are around from time to time and are very accurate rifles. IMO a better rifle than the SPS.
I'd look for a PSS in 223. They are around from time to time and are very accurate rifles. IMO a better rifle than the SPS.
Re: .223 for newbie
I'm currently saving my shells for a couple of 223's for my son and I. In the mean time, we've been shooting my dad's old S&W 223. This elderly stick shoots very accurately. I've found out that the S&W action was made by Howa. In fact, we have been so impressed with the precision and accuracy of the Howa action that we are going to order two 1500 barreled actions to serve as the foundation of two custom 223AI projects.
I believe the Howa is the equal, if not slightly better than, the Rem 700. Just my 2-cents.
I'm currently saving my shells for a couple of 223's for my son and I. In the mean time, we've been shooting my dad's old S&W 223. This elderly stick shoots very accurately. I've found out that the S&W action was made by Howa. In fact, we have been so impressed with the precision and accuracy of the Howa action that we are going to order two 1500 barreled actions to serve as the foundation of two custom 223AI projects.
I believe the Howa is the equal, if not slightly better than, the Rem 700. Just my 2-cents.
Re: .223 for newbie
I drink the howa koolaid! only downfall is lack of twist rate.
I drink the howa koolaid! only downfall is lack of twist rate.
Re: .223 for newbie
I had a savage 10fp in 308 and 24" barrel. It shot great out of the box. I am a newbie shooter and could get it to easily do 1" or less groups @ 100yds. They offer these in 223 and also the predator packages might work for your needs.
Not saying Savage is the only way to go, cause I'm not. Thats just the experience I had with mine and haven't owned one of the other brands. In fact I still have the action it now has a 6.5x47 lapua barrel on it.
At the end of the day any of the ones mentioned will serve you well and have good accuracy. Your just going to have to pick the one that you like best and will fill the happiest with. whether the final deciding point is looks or what, if you don't like it then you'll always wish you would have went a different route.
Would recomend going to a sporting goods store and pesonally laying your hands on these rifles. Cause one may fit you build better than the others.
Just my opinion though.
I had a savage 10fp in 308 and 24" barrel. It shot great out of the box. I am a newbie shooter and could get it to easily do 1" or less groups @ 100yds. They offer these in 223 and also the predator packages might work for your needs.
Not saying Savage is the only way to go, cause I'm not. Thats just the experience I had with mine and haven't owned one of the other brands. In fact I still have the action it now has a 6.5x47 lapua barrel on it.
At the end of the day any of the ones mentioned will serve you well and have good accuracy. Your just going to have to pick the one that you like best and will fill the happiest with. whether the final deciding point is looks or what, if you don't like it then you'll always wish you would have went a different route.
Would recomend going to a sporting goods store and pesonally laying your hands on these rifles. Cause one may fit you build better than the others.
Just my opinion though.
Re: .223 for newbie
Anybody know the twist rate on the Howa 1500 with 20 inch heavy barrel in .223???
Anybody know the twist rate on the Howa 1500 with 20 inch heavy barrel in .223???
Re: .223 for newbie
Savage M10PC
Tikka.
Howa.
Last time I looked Howa twists were slow
Savage M10PC
Tikka.
Howa.
Last time I looked Howa twists were slow
Re: .223 for newbie
Looks like the Howa twist is 1 in 12. I would rather have 1 in 9
Looks like the Howa twist is 1 in 12. I would rather have 1 in 9
Re: .223 for newbie
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bulldogto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Looks like the Howa twist is 1 in 12. I would rather have 1 in 9 </div></div>You can get one with a 1:10 twist.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bulldogto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Looks like the Howa twist is 1 in 12. I would rather have 1 in 9 </div></div>You can get one with a 1:10 twist.
Re: .223 for newbie
I think I have narrowed it down to the remington 700 sps tactical or the savage 10 precision carbine. I can get the remington for about $130 cheaper which would give me more money for glass, but I think the stock on the savage precision carbin (accustock) is better
I think I have narrowed it down to the remington 700 sps tactical or the savage 10 precision carbine. I can get the remington for about $130 cheaper which would give me more money for glass, but I think the stock on the savage precision carbin (accustock) is better
Re: .223 for newbie
the savage has a floating bolt...that along with the MUCH superior factory barrel will yield better results, accuracy wise. the rem has a houge stock which sucks, badly, and the machining on the rem's isn't always very good...unless you get lucky. if it were me, though, i'd just get a regular savage 10fp...and put it in a better stock. not sure why you're set on a 20" barrel...other than looks...but if you're buying the gun for "looks" then you just need to buy a .22lr
the savage has a floating bolt...that along with the MUCH superior factory barrel will yield better results, accuracy wise. the rem has a houge stock which sucks, badly, and the machining on the rem's isn't always very good...unless you get lucky. if it were me, though, i'd just get a regular savage 10fp...and put it in a better stock. not sure why you're set on a 20" barrel...other than looks...but if you're buying the gun for "looks" then you just need to buy a .22lr
Re: .223 for newbie
+1 for savage 10, otherwise go custom.
+1 for savage 10, otherwise go custom.
Re: .223 for newbie
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GSRswapandslow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the savage has a floating bolt...that along with the MUCH superior factory barrel will yield better results, accuracy wise. the rem has a houge stock which sucks, badly, and the machining on the rem's isn't always very good...unless you get lucky. if it were me, though, i'd just get a regular savage 10fp...and put it in a better stock. not sure why you're set on a 20" barrel...other than looks...but if you're buying the gun for "looks" then you just need to buy a .22lr</div></div>
The 10FP is also an option. The only reason for the 20 inch is trying to shave a few ounces since I will be coyote hunting also. The more I think about it though, I don't think I will notice a difference in the weight of a 20 inch bull barrel and a 24 inch barrel
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GSRswapandslow</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the savage has a floating bolt...that along with the MUCH superior factory barrel will yield better results, accuracy wise. the rem has a houge stock which sucks, badly, and the machining on the rem's isn't always very good...unless you get lucky. if it were me, though, i'd just get a regular savage 10fp...and put it in a better stock. not sure why you're set on a 20" barrel...other than looks...but if you're buying the gun for "looks" then you just need to buy a .22lr</div></div>
The 10FP is also an option. The only reason for the 20 inch is trying to shave a few ounces since I will be coyote hunting also. The more I think about it though, I don't think I will notice a difference in the weight of a 20 inch bull barrel and a 24 inch barrel
Re: .223 for newbie
now don't think i was trying to come off rude with the .22lr comment....i should have elaborated on what i meant... i was just saying, if you have no other need for a 20" barrel, than for looks...then you're gonna be limited to just a few choices.. rem tactical, rem LTR, savage 10pc, etc...but if you allow up to say, 26" barrel...you'll have a TON more choices. I still say the 10fp is the route to go...or if you want a nice rifle for a good price...Dick's carries a 10fcp that's got a flutted 22" barrel for under $700...but it's in .308.
now don't think i was trying to come off rude with the .22lr comment....i should have elaborated on what i meant... i was just saying, if you have no other need for a 20" barrel, than for looks...then you're gonna be limited to just a few choices.. rem tactical, rem LTR, savage 10pc, etc...but if you allow up to say, 26" barrel...you'll have a TON more choices. I still say the 10fp is the route to go...or if you want a nice rifle for a good price...Dick's carries a 10fcp that's got a flutted 22" barrel for under $700...but it's in .308.
Re: .223 for newbie
I am thinking about buying some kind of Remington 700, but I would like to know if there are any model that are chambered for the 5,56 x 45 mm Nato-ammunition.
I have read that .223 Rem Works fine in weapons made for the 5,56 mm ammo, but that it dosent work the other way around.
So, are there any Rem 700 rifles made for tha 5,56 mm ammo?
I am thinking about buying some kind of Remington 700, but I would like to know if there are any model that are chambered for the 5,56 x 45 mm Nato-ammunition.
I have read that .223 Rem Works fine in weapons made for the 5,56 mm ammo, but that it dosent work the other way around.
So, are there any Rem 700 rifles made for tha 5,56 mm ammo?
Re: .223 for newbie
I have a Remington VSSF .223.
Now, I am kind of biased here since my 1st rifle ever was a Rem 700 ADL (from what I remember) caliber .308, and I have always had an affection for the 700-action.
This one came with the HS Precision stock, fluted 26" SS barrel 1-12 twist.
The rifle was pretty much gtg from the box, groups about 1/2" at 100+ without trying too hard.
As with any .223, recoil is not much of an issue and it is well balanced, perfect for a "training" rifle with relatively cost-effective fodder.
This particular one was bought before the X-mark trigger came into play, but I have never had any issues tuning a stock Remington 700 trigger to my liking, there are holes in the trigger sideplates that reveals the trigger/sear engagement so one can be sure it is engaging properly after adjustment.
That said, mess with it at own risk... <---(PC statement)
Overall the gun is a great little plinker, only a couple of points;
The stock has two sling adapters up front, with a Harris 6-9" I have not been able to utilize the #2 adapter for my sling so before I have the time to rework a bipod for it, the front sling goes on the bipod sling adapter (a bit awkward to say the least...)
One thing that can be a PITA with the 700 action in .223 is reloading, especially in the snow with gloves or similar, due to the fact that the bolt travels a bit too far to the rear (since it is basically a universal action designed for other cartridges as well), making the aft end of the cartridge to catch on the receiver below the bolt and dip bulletfirst into the mag.
Quickest fix when this happens is sometimes to dump it all through the hinged mag bottom and start over, although with a little practice you learn to slide the bolt slightly forward and lock it with your thumb to make sure there is a straight edge the cartridges can slide down.
I have been toying with the thought of making another bottom metal from T6 something and try to fit AR mags, just because I have a bunch of those in different shapes though, but that is a different story...
The SPS stock compared to the HS of the VSSF is a piece of rubber, so I have no doubt that if I was to buy another one I would either buy SPS just to get the action and barrel and replace stock ASAP or step up a notch.
The lovable thing about the 700 is the simplicity, and the availability of alternative parts, along with its outstanding history for both military and civilian applications.
It is basically up to everyone what they want and how bad they want it.
Oh, and as for the 5.56 - I would buy the .223, shoot the heck out of it with .223, and when you shoot as well as the rifle and it is time to step up, have it re-barreled with a 1:8 or 1:7 twist and re-chambered for 5.56 if you really need the 5.56.
In an AR platform for "shorter" range mixing 5.56 and .223 aint that bad, but if you want to stretch the rifle all the way you are most likely limited to the chambered caliber to retain max precision.
John - out
PS
ost #100...a frickin aniversary!
I have a Remington VSSF .223.
Now, I am kind of biased here since my 1st rifle ever was a Rem 700 ADL (from what I remember) caliber .308, and I have always had an affection for the 700-action.
This one came with the HS Precision stock, fluted 26" SS barrel 1-12 twist.
The rifle was pretty much gtg from the box, groups about 1/2" at 100+ without trying too hard.
As with any .223, recoil is not much of an issue and it is well balanced, perfect for a "training" rifle with relatively cost-effective fodder.
This particular one was bought before the X-mark trigger came into play, but I have never had any issues tuning a stock Remington 700 trigger to my liking, there are holes in the trigger sideplates that reveals the trigger/sear engagement so one can be sure it is engaging properly after adjustment.
That said, mess with it at own risk... <---(PC statement)
Overall the gun is a great little plinker, only a couple of points;
The stock has two sling adapters up front, with a Harris 6-9" I have not been able to utilize the #2 adapter for my sling so before I have the time to rework a bipod for it, the front sling goes on the bipod sling adapter (a bit awkward to say the least...)
One thing that can be a PITA with the 700 action in .223 is reloading, especially in the snow with gloves or similar, due to the fact that the bolt travels a bit too far to the rear (since it is basically a universal action designed for other cartridges as well), making the aft end of the cartridge to catch on the receiver below the bolt and dip bulletfirst into the mag.
Quickest fix when this happens is sometimes to dump it all through the hinged mag bottom and start over, although with a little practice you learn to slide the bolt slightly forward and lock it with your thumb to make sure there is a straight edge the cartridges can slide down.
I have been toying with the thought of making another bottom metal from T6 something and try to fit AR mags, just because I have a bunch of those in different shapes though, but that is a different story...
The SPS stock compared to the HS of the VSSF is a piece of rubber, so I have no doubt that if I was to buy another one I would either buy SPS just to get the action and barrel and replace stock ASAP or step up a notch.
The lovable thing about the 700 is the simplicity, and the availability of alternative parts, along with its outstanding history for both military and civilian applications.
It is basically up to everyone what they want and how bad they want it.
Oh, and as for the 5.56 - I would buy the .223, shoot the heck out of it with .223, and when you shoot as well as the rifle and it is time to step up, have it re-barreled with a 1:8 or 1:7 twist and re-chambered for 5.56 if you really need the 5.56.
In an AR platform for "shorter" range mixing 5.56 and .223 aint that bad, but if you want to stretch the rifle all the way you are most likely limited to the chambered caliber to retain max precision.
John - out
PS
ost #100...a frickin aniversary!
Re: .223 for newbie
I just ordered a 10FP in .223 to learn on.
The Remington does not impress me, the .308 AAC I bought from them turned into a rust pit in a matter of days, and I caught nothing but headache from Remington and their reps trying to get it fixed. It'll still likely be gone another month or two before I get it back. Remington lost me as a customer, permanently.
Savage makes a wide variety of .223's in faster twist rates. I wish they did more 1:8's or 1:7's, but oh well. I got a 10FP because it'll drop into a B&C stock without the need to inlet it for magazines (and the finish is supposed to be a little better on it than the 12FV).
When I want a new caliber or faster twist barrel, I won't need to pay out the ass to get it switched over like I would with a Remington.
From my research, it seems like the Savage 10 and 12 series rifles are tough to beat when it comes to price and accuracy.
I just ordered a 10FP in .223 to learn on.
The Remington does not impress me, the .308 AAC I bought from them turned into a rust pit in a matter of days, and I caught nothing but headache from Remington and their reps trying to get it fixed. It'll still likely be gone another month or two before I get it back. Remington lost me as a customer, permanently.
Savage makes a wide variety of .223's in faster twist rates. I wish they did more 1:8's or 1:7's, but oh well. I got a 10FP because it'll drop into a B&C stock without the need to inlet it for magazines (and the finish is supposed to be a little better on it than the 12FV).
When I want a new caliber or faster twist barrel, I won't need to pay out the ass to get it switched over like I would with a Remington.
From my research, it seems like the Savage 10 and 12 series rifles are tough to beat when it comes to price and accuracy.
