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223 Remington Tactical owners

Niles Coyote

Gunny Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
  • Aug 13, 2007
    4,646
    1,602
    South West, MI
    223 Remington Tactical owners

    I thought I would pass on some good info.

    I have been searching for the best long range bullet this gun could handle with the 1-9 twist for some time. First I tried the 80 A-max, ha, that was nowhere near stable... Often not even making it to the 100 yard target backer let alone the target.
    sick.gif


    Then I moved on to the 75 A-max and 80 SMK, those landed on target but in a rifle that will shoot into 3/4” at 100 on a bad day these two would only shoot groups in the 3” to 4” range. Stable enough to hit point first but I could not push them fast enough get any real accuracy from them.

    I moved on to 70 grain Berger VLD’s thinking that a BC matching the 77smk it may be a great alternative. While it did work I could never get it to shoot that well. MOA was about the best I could get. So I went back to the 69 that shot well. The 77’s will work but I just couldn’t run them fast enough to really outperform the 69’s. That is where I have been for the last year, using the rifle mostly for short to mid range varmints with a little steel plate shooting from time to time 500y on in.

    Enter the 75 grain Berger VLD and its .423 G1.

    This bullet is not new by any means but I somehow never thought to run it through the Rem Tac until now. For the last three weeks I have been developing the load at 100y and while everything looked great, I wanted to wait till I had the opportunity to shoot at the 1000y range to be sure, prior to posting and calling it a success.
    smirk.gif


    Today was the day.

    My load is running 2850 FPS at the muzzle and with today’s DA of 0’ (45 degrees at 960 ASL) it required 10.4 mils at 1000y, just barely supersonic. The only issue is the size and weight of the projectile; it makes it almost impossible to see an impact. As long as no one else is shooting you can hear the little “tink” as it impacts steel.



    The following target is not posted as to show how great of a shot I am but to prove they are arriving pointy end first at 1000y. It would have been a 5 shot group but without knowing where I was hitting on the 36" target I missed judged the wind. I was holding 1.5 mil and should have held 1.2ish. Shots 1,2 and 3 all hit the left side while shot 4 missed. I thought I saw a minor disturbance in the force, I mean dirt, just off the left of the steel so I ended up over correcting for shot 5 by half a mil.
    blush.gif
    Had all shots struck I am sure I would have had a nice 10-12” group in todays wind but instead I have 3 in 8” with a straggler.
    001-5.jpg



    So in closing, if you have a Remington Tactical in 223 and want to push the envelope as far as you reasonable can. Try the 75 Berger VLD, the ballistics are very close to my 175 smk 308 load at 2650, using about the same wind hold and just about a mil less in elevation.


    UPDATE:
    I have revisted 80 grain BTHP's in the Nosler CC flavor and they are working now, not sure what the issue was before... maybe I was using a powder other than varget??? But varget is working and I am around 2825fps.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    I am using a stiff charge of Varget powder, LC brass and WSR primers loaded to seat in the lands about .005" with ~.004" neck tension, runs fine if you are using a AI mag or have modified you internal mag box. I think the OAL on my rounds are around 2.47"

    I want to try some H4895 next as I have heard shooters that run heavier bullets in the 223 can squeeze a little more FPS with it vs. varget. RL15 would be another option, for the same reason, but I want to stick to the Extreme Hodgdon’s line if I can since I live with big temperature swings here in Michigan.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    Thanks for the info. I have a buddy who just got a really nice Savage in 308 and this might allow me to shoot with him at 800 yds now. I have a Rem 700 SPS Tactical that I have in a B&C A5. I only have a 20" bbl so I am not sure if I will be able to develop enough speed/spin to handle these Bergers.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    Thats great info, might want to give that a try. How may grains of Varget?
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: doyputasos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I only have a 20" bbl so I am not sure if I will be able to develop enough speed/spin to handle these Bergers.</div></div>

    20" barrel here as well.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DarkD</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> How may grains of Varget?</div></div>

    Varget lots very, but I am less than a full grain over max published 25.0 grains. No pressure signs in my rifle or indicated on the brass and I am on my third loading and primer pockets are still tight. So work up and watch for pressure as your lot and rifle may behave differently.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    Good information, thanks. My current load is N140 with 69gr SMK's which works well out to around 800. I'll look forward to giving these a go and stretching things out a little further.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    Very interesting, I will definetely have to try that. Thanks for thinking a little bit out of the box and sharing.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    Good info! Good to hear that our lit' old factory .223 Tac can make it to the edge. I too will be ordering some and see what I can do with it.

    I have a bunch of new Winchester cases which I want to go through before ordering new cases. And I have some factory ammo which I need to check out also.

    Did you try Win brass ?

    BTW Niles, I should have some time next month to come up to your place for that coating we spoke about. But that's for a .243, not the .223.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    We have shooters that use the 75 gr Berger backed up by H4895. It works well with a 1:9 twist barrel. Don't discount the Hornady 75 gr match HP BT. In a bolt gun they can be pushed to the low 2900s. Most weapons that will shoot at all will stack them in a little cluster. Their OAL will fit in a AR platform magazine and still feed like a champ.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Radar86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Did you try Win brass ?

    </div></div>

    Nope, I wanted to start on brand new brass as I looked for pressure working this load up as I knew I may have to load hot and wanted easy and reliable measurements on the brass. All my Winchester brass has been fired several times. I have H20 numbers around here somewhere, but I don’t remember the LC brass I have being that much different in capacity.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Radar86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BTW Niles, I should have some time next month to come up to your place for that coating we spoke about. But that's for a .243, not the .223. </div></div>

    You may have me confused with someone else, OR I have completely lost my mind...
    laugh.gif

    What coating do you speak of???
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    I did confuse you! There's another member who has Coyote in his name that does Teflon coating for actions and barrels.

    BTW, I ordered some Berger's this evening. Thanks for the post.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    Too bad Rem uses The 9 twist....At leats it isn't the 12 twist any more!
    smile.gif

    They seem to think the average guy is a varmint hunter I guess...

    Mine shot the 75Amax pretty well and near bug holed with the 77Sierrra. The rifle bug holed with the 50 ballistic tip and 50gr Vmax.
    It now wears an 8 inch twist and shoots everything without fouling like a filthy pig.

    Good luck
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    Damn I have to let my buddy know about this. Thanks for the post.





    Aron-
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    I tried the 75 VLD's in my Rem XCR compact tactical and they wouldn't stabilize any better than the 75 A-max, about 3 moa. I settled on 70g VLD's with a stiff charge of Ramshot Tac.
     
    Re: 223 Remington Tactical owners

    I have give up on going past 800 with a 9 twist 223 case,,and really 750 is where I start to have trouble,,but 600 in I Love shooting the 69 Sierra at 3025fps,,I almost have my dope memorized to 700


    any farther than that I want something a lot bigger,,338 type bigger,,
     
    I have a sps tactical that won't even stabilize 69 smk's. I think it is hit or miss on these rifles. It bugholes 60 vmax but that's about it.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I547 using Tapatalk
     
    This is the third .223 SPS tactical I have owned over the past several years and the other two would shoot everything up to 73 grain Bergers. One especially loved 69 SMK's and 70 Berger VLD's. This one, however, will not stabilize anything, that I have found, over 60 grains.

    I am at 250 ft. above sea level. Litz's calculator says that the stability factor, on this bullet, from sea level to 5000 feet, changes from 1.67 to 1.99. 1.4 is the line between marginal and comfortable stability.
     
    I will have to try the VLD's, I have been running the 75 AMAX with 24.5gr H4895 and having excellent results. have not tried 1000 yet, but it killed a coyote at 354 and 452 this year. If the wind is calm, I can usually do pretty good on my one and only gong at 635 yards. 8"x8"
     
    I just put my new scope on my new sps tac .223 I have not even fired it. I am going to shoot a bunch of factory 55g to "break in" the barrel. Then I have some 69g hand loads I am going to see if they are stable. After that I will ladder test the 69g bullets. And then try some 75g for fun. I live at 6500ft and shoot up to 9000. So I think it might do well.
     
    Thanks for the post. I've been running 69gr SMK over Varget but wanted to find something with a little more "umph". I'll have to give them a try.