I am thinking of building a 25-45 sharps for a do it all kind or ar15, any info or your experiences with the cartridge would be appreciated!
25-45 sharps ar build
- Thread starter Mtnhntr8.6
- Start date
Pros:
You can drive 70-75gr from 2900-3100fps from a 24” barrel.
87-90gr from 2700-2900fps
100gr 2550-2700fps
.257” bore volume allows quicker evacuation than .224” or .243”/6mm bores, for faster velocities for same weight bullets.
Readily-available and plentiful brass from 5.56 or .223 Rem and easy neck-up to .257”.
Barrel drop-in conversion, works with standard AR-15 mags and 5.56 bolts, no loss of mag capacity compared to 5.56x45.
Cons:
Limited in projectile selection from 70-100gr
Case length relative to projectile and ogive lengths is high, limiting COL
BCs limit it to close ranges mostly, which is fine for hunting varmints and medium game within 200yds.
Your 900ft-lb reach is at about 250yds from a 24” barrel.
Limited TGT and intermediate range effectiveness as a result of case length, ogive length constraints.
For .257” bores in the AR-15 for a do-all set-up, you really need a shorter, fatter case, which means new magazines and different parent case source. The .350 Legend, 6.8 SPC/.224 Valkyrie, and 6.5 Grendel cases make better parent cases for .257” bullets, however none of them support loading the new wave of 131-135gr extremely high BC projectiles that have hit the market in the last 7 years. Those require more ogive length and COL than the AR-15 mag well will allow.
But the 117-120gr class of .25 cals can be shot from the larger capacity intermediate cases. 70-90gr can be fired from the larger cases at 24” Sharps velocities, from shorter barrels.
For reference, Federal 90gr TNT in 6.5 Grendel does 2698fps avg from my 12” Grendel, which requires different bolts and magazines. The same factory load does 2900fps from my 17.6” Grendel. The largest capacity 6.5 Grendel mags are 25rd.
Everything is a trade-off.
You can drive 70-75gr from 2900-3100fps from a 24” barrel.
87-90gr from 2700-2900fps
100gr 2550-2700fps
.257” bore volume allows quicker evacuation than .224” or .243”/6mm bores, for faster velocities for same weight bullets.
Readily-available and plentiful brass from 5.56 or .223 Rem and easy neck-up to .257”.
Barrel drop-in conversion, works with standard AR-15 mags and 5.56 bolts, no loss of mag capacity compared to 5.56x45.
Cons:
Limited in projectile selection from 70-100gr
Case length relative to projectile and ogive lengths is high, limiting COL
BCs limit it to close ranges mostly, which is fine for hunting varmints and medium game within 200yds.
Your 900ft-lb reach is at about 250yds from a 24” barrel.
Limited TGT and intermediate range effectiveness as a result of case length, ogive length constraints.
For .257” bores in the AR-15 for a do-all set-up, you really need a shorter, fatter case, which means new magazines and different parent case source. The .350 Legend, 6.8 SPC/.224 Valkyrie, and 6.5 Grendel cases make better parent cases for .257” bullets, however none of them support loading the new wave of 131-135gr extremely high BC projectiles that have hit the market in the last 7 years. Those require more ogive length and COL than the AR-15 mag well will allow.
But the 117-120gr class of .25 cals can be shot from the larger capacity intermediate cases. 70-90gr can be fired from the larger cases at 24” Sharps velocities, from shorter barrels.
For reference, Federal 90gr TNT in 6.5 Grendel does 2698fps avg from my 12” Grendel, which requires different bolts and magazines. The same factory load does 2900fps from my 17.6” Grendel. The largest capacity 6.5 Grendel mags are 25rd.
Everything is a trade-off.
Build one and check it out. Sharps barrels are very good, and their BCG's are some of the best on the market if you choose to get one of theirs . I strictly just been Night hunting with using the .25x45 since I started with this Cal. . ( me ) , I got zero complaints with the .25-223 and it a hard hitter.
I been shooting the .25-223/sharps for 7+ years now . . Have no plans of move past it either . You can buy factory brass or ammo but I never have . Brass prep. is just lube and 1-stroke on the press. So it simple to just roll your own .
The .25-223 feed smooth, and Zero hickup's with using just standard AR Mags.
If you want to run a Can on your barrel muzzle a 16-inch is a good length. Keeps the length pretty handy . I never have gone shorter than 16"on barrel length with 25x45 so I can't say the performance getting on the shorties.
On a ( 16" ) I get 2600+ Vel. with 87 grn. , and I get 2700+ with 70 grn Sierras .
When I run ( 20" ) barrel i get 2825 Vel. with 87 grn. , and I get 3050 Vel. with 70 grain.
I have tried a LOT of different Powders for hand loading on .25-223 . ( for me ) my GoTo Powder is common found, A2230 or Ramshot X-terminator .. Same/same powder .
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I am thinking about going with sharps 18 inch stainless barrel and bolt to build off of a bear creek aide charging upper. Would possibly use on whitetail and pigs, possibly coyotes as well.
I do like the idea or converting 223 brass, not so bad if you loose cases every once in a while while hunting.
I'm thinking about going with the 18 inch from sharps as well as their bolt for a build with a bear creek side charging upper
Depends on what you want. A reloader that wants cheap brass and have it only for hunting, 25-45 for sure. One pass in a resizer and you are done. There's like 10 bullets that work and none of them have good BC for distance. It's def a short-medium range cartridge in an AR.
If you don't care about cheap brass, both 6.5G and 6 ARC are better for a do all.
I do like the 25-45. I have a 20" upper that collects dust though. Getting good speeds means longer barrel. By the time a suppressor is on there, it's a longer setup than what I want. Might have to revisit as a bolt gun in the future.
All these loads are at a 2.31" COAL.
87gr TNT or Hotcor @ 2850fps with H335
90gr Gameking @ 2900fps with AA2230
Also made a load for 75gr TNT that moved.
Mag selection is also important. ASC stainless mags have about the most internal space for a longer COAL.
Theres also 6x45 which is the middle ground of 223 and 25-45. Better BC than 25-45. Heavier weight than 223.
I do not recommend all 3 because sorting brass is an absolute whore when the head stamp is the same. Seriously, only idiots have all three. I made the mistake of mixing all 3 in the tumbler once. Should have just thrown it all away. What a pain.
223---6x45---25-45
The 6x45 is for a bolt gun so the OAL is longer. The 25x45 is at mag length.
I think im leaning towards 6.5 grendel, the main benefit i saw with the 25-45 was keeping the 223 sized bolt face
I’ve been loading for 5.56 for a long time, and I’ve been in a place for years now where I will never even think about wasting a Small Rifle Primer on 5.56/.223 cases again. It’s too easy to just buy factory ammo for it at similar cost.
The only cartridges I will load a SRP into are Grendel really, maybe some Palma-based .308 case pushing 6.5 or 7mm. (I have .260 Rem and 6.5CM SRP brass, for example.)
You have 140 different factory loads available for 6.5 Grendel, with a really wide range of bullets from 80gr to 156gr.
You’ll get the 25-45 Sharps 24” velocities from 12"-18” Grendels, which gives you more mobility and suppressor options without turning it into a musket.
If I could go back in time to Fort Benning and ArmaLite, I would have set the military SCHV case configuration spitting a .257” bullet though, from a shorter, slightly-fatter case. I would have erased any mention of .224” in all of their program and technical documents. Make a cartridge that would have provided the high round count we got with 5.56x45, and also would have made an excellent Light Sniper/DM cartridge with higher BC bullets, as well as an ideal LMG cartridge for the SAW in the 1970s. That’s neither here nor there now. I’m a big fan of the quarter bore, but it’s one of the most neglected bore diameters out there, even though .250 Savage, .257 Roberts, and .25-06 have all proven to be excellent cartridges over the last century.
The only cartridges I will load a SRP into are Grendel really, maybe some Palma-based .308 case pushing 6.5 or 7mm. (I have .260 Rem and 6.5CM SRP brass, for example.)
You have 140 different factory loads available for 6.5 Grendel, with a really wide range of bullets from 80gr to 156gr.
You’ll get the 25-45 Sharps 24” velocities from 12"-18” Grendels, which gives you more mobility and suppressor options without turning it into a musket.
If I could go back in time to Fort Benning and ArmaLite, I would have set the military SCHV case configuration spitting a .257” bullet though, from a shorter, slightly-fatter case. I would have erased any mention of .224” in all of their program and technical documents. Make a cartridge that would have provided the high round count we got with 5.56x45, and also would have made an excellent Light Sniper/DM cartridge with higher BC bullets, as well as an ideal LMG cartridge for the SAW in the 1970s. That’s neither here nor there now. I’m a big fan of the quarter bore, but it’s one of the most neglected bore diameters out there, even though .250 Savage, .257 Roberts, and .25-06 have all proven to be excellent cartridges over the last century.
Had a couple, I still have a BCA side-charger. They are pretty beefy thick walled upper, The ones I got both were in-Spec. I actually have zero complains with the side charge upper . . But
the BCG comes with upper . You need the Side-handle/Carrier .. ' So 1st thing is Toss ' the Bolt and Firing-Pin, and use a better quality Bolt and Pin. .. especially if you decide to move into a Grendel or ARC
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