.277 SIG Fury Demystified
Speculation on the .277 SIG Fury has practically broken the internet. GunsAmerica spoke directly with SIG to get the scoop on this revolutionary cartridge.
www.gunsamerica.com
I can't imagine this being real. Pushing a 140 from a SA with a 16" barrel @3,000+ FPS. Perhaps the technology is in Sig's hands and they will prove their numbers to be accurate. If so, if like to get in on that. Imagine the ballistics of a .27 cal 140gn pill launched from longer barrel bolt action...
When you're pushing a (claimed) chamber pressure of 80k PSI, then stupidly high MVs tend to follow - assuming the barrel or bolt doesn't let go.
I'd imagine that barrel life would be relatively low but they are also claiming that whatever we think or assume, barrel life wise, is likely to be incorrect and that it is actually much better. All these claims and forecasts, they're making it seem like they were able to develop a new round that checks off all the boxes. The better part of me wants to think that somewhere along the line, there has to be some tradeoff. I hope I'm wrong though.
What we have found so far is at 132k we have no damage or lose of function with the weapon system, at 151k (failure point of the brass case) we had to cut the barrel out of the breech cylinder in order to check the bolt face...not even a broken extractor.
Was thinking about y’all new ammo when I read the article. How similar are the cases for your ammo and sigs? Are y’all just hot rodding the cases harder than sig is?Hi,
And just think...Sigs ammo is not the current lead for that NGSW ammunition proposal, others are topping it by a pretty far margin.
We (Hoplite Arms) have been testing higher pressure cartridge systems for a couple years now in which we specifically designed a receiver system to handle and operate at the increased pressures. What we have found so far is at 132k we have no damage or lose of function with the weapon system, at 151k (failure point of the brass case) we had to cut the barrel out of the breech cylinder in order to check the bolt face...not even a broken extractor.
We are now testing bimetal 2 piece case designs along with some thicker designed RCC cases.
The pressure "limits" the industry currently runs at is decades out of date in regards to weapon designs, tolerances, capabilities, etc etc.....SAAMI has been petitioned for years to "raise" their scale but seems to like the 1940s era pressure thresholds....luckily SAAMI is a voluntary organization
Sincerely,
Theis
Hi,
We are not utilizing any "standard" cartridge case dimensions for our HP cartridges....So they cannot be mistakenly put into a rifle that cannot hold those pressures.......gotta love insurance and lawyers ? .
We are doing 2 "Phases" of HP....
Phase 1 will be with normal 1 piece case designs but with thicker brass and lathe turned; not cup and draw.
Phase 2 will be with bimetal 2 piece case designs that thread together instead of the internal clip that Sig is using.
Sincerely,
Theis
Really looking forward to what you have to offer. Definitely going to be a customer. What have you guys seen in barrel life? Any insight into the pixie dust coating they are referring to in the article?
and requires very specific "expanding" rear monolithics to seal and take the squeeze
So modern, monlithic Minie ball?
I know Sig has tons upon tons of money but the idea/marketing that they somehow have a barrel coating to do what they are saying..YET entire rifle is to retail at what...under $1600 is raising every alarm in my body!!
IMO the (Immediately available) key to barrel life in HP cartridges is being able to use a faster igniting powder to ramp the pressure curve up while at same time to have lower burn temperature and lower burn dwell time per say....
Much different that the normal method of pumping more volume of slower burning powder.....
Yeah but a surprising number of companies that should know better insist on calling nitride a coating. Just saying.Hi,
Yes, fully aware of nitriding but Sig is saying a coating so in reality that should not be nitriding they are referring to since it is not a coating...
Sincerely,
Theis
Thanks for a good explanation. Have y’all experimented with Nitrided barrels?Hi,
THANKS!! We are still testing barrel life with various projectile designs.
I know Sig has tons upon tons of money but the idea/marketing that they somehow have a barrel coating to do what they are saying..YET entire rifle is to retail at what...under $1600 is raising every alarm in my body!!
Chrome lining the chamber and throat area would be great, but I have not found a company on this planet that will guarantee the tolerances needed so that the precision barrel does not become machine gun barrel accuracy.
Then there is progressive bore/lands/grooves technology but that is still in its infancy and SUPER expensive and requires very specific "expanding" rear monolithics to seal and take the squeeze....realistically IMO that is 2-3 years out.
IMO the (Immediately available) key to barrel life in HP cartridges is being able to use a faster igniting powder to ramp the pressure curve up while at same time to have lower burn temperature and shorter burn dwell time per say....
Much different that the normal method of pumping more volume of slower burning powder.....
Sincerely,
Theis
Good info! Any ideas on if AIs and Desert Techs might have the strength to use this with just a barrel swap? ThanksHi,
And just think...Sigs ammo is not the current lead for that NGSW ammunition proposal, others are topping it by a pretty far margin.
We (Hoplite Arms) have been testing higher pressure cartridge systems for a couple years now in which we specifically designed a receiver system to handle and operate at the increased pressures. What we have found so far is at 132k we have no damage or lose of function with the weapon system, at 151k (failure point of the brass case) we had to cut the barrel out of the breech cylinder in order to check the bolt face...not even a broken extractor.
We are now testing bimetal 2 piece case designs along with some thicker designed RCC cases.
The pressure "limits" the industry currently runs at is decades out of date in regards to weapon designs, tolerances, capabilities, etc etc.....SAAMI has been petitioned for years to "raise" their scale but seems to like the 1940s era pressure thresholds....luckily SAAMI is a voluntary organization
Sincerely,
Theis
I'm sure it will be $2.00 + per round.Hope ammo isn’t super expensive.
Hi,
THANKS!! We are still testing barrel life with various projectile designs.
I know Sig has tons upon tons of money but the idea/marketing that they somehow have a barrel coating to do what they are saying..YET entire rifle is to retail at what...under $1600 is raising every alarm in my body!!
Chrome lining the chamber and throat area would be great, but I have not found a company on this planet that will guarantee the tolerances needed so that the precision barrel does not become machine gun barrel accuracy.
Then there is progressive bore/lands/grooves technology but that is still in its infancy and SUPER expensive and requires very specific "expanding" rear monolithics to seal and take the squeeze....realistically IMO that is 2-3 years out.
IMO the (Immediately available) key to barrel life in HP cartridges is being able to use a faster igniting powder to ramp the pressure curve up while at same time to have lower burn temperature and shorter burn dwell time per say....
Much different that the normal method of pumping more volume of slower burning powder.....
Sincerely,
Theis
Agreed. Suppressor manufacturers are probably gonna need to evaluate it as well.I wonder what the uncorking pressure wave of 80k psi will feel like just 16 inches from your face? Probably won’t have many friends at the range if you put a brake on it.
The article said significantly more barrel life than you would expect. So hopefully 800 round barrel life ?600rd barrel life, what's not to love? ??
The article said significantly more barrel life than you would expect. So hopefully 800 round barrel life ?
But really the round was designed for belt feed machine guns, so would need to be in the thousands to be viable at all.
Well I’m older and my back hurts, so I’ll wait at least three months before jumping on this band wagon.Glad I'm older and wiser