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284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

mwroseberry

mwroseberry

Gunny Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Dec 31, 2009
1,106
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urbana, ohio
The more I look at this round the more I like it. I would like to hear from guys that run the 284 Winchester. I would like to hear about barrel life as I can't seem to find any expected round numbers out of the barrels. Also what twist rate should I be looking at to run the heavier grain weight rounds. I will of coarse be reloading and I know this round bucks with wind MUCH better than my current 308 setup. But is it good enough that I should invest in a new barrel and dies for it?

Also can I get the velocities I need to make this round affective with a 24" barrel with a 1 in 9" twist?

Thanks ahead of time for the opinions.

Thanks,
Merritt
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

24" is on the short side for 7mm. 284 is more than capable of getting you way the fuck out there and barrel life should be 2-3000 rounds if you dont push it real hard. 1/9 twist should do just fine. Back to barrel length, if you are going to be shooting either 162 A-Max's or 168 Bergers, you can get decent speeds out of 24-26" barrel, but with the 180s, you are going to wish you went with a longer barrel. All depends on what bullet and what speeds you expect out of them.

As for it being good enough to invest in.....once you go 7, you will wonder why in the hell you wasted so much time and money on 30cal.

hope this helps
Joe
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

One more thing, try not to waste too much money on the Bergers. The 162 A-max's shoot so well out to 1500 yards, that it doesnt make any sense to load expensive Bergers. I refuse to load up bergers unless Im shooting over 1500 yards, which doesnt happen often.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Some guns won't shoot the AMAXs.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

And some wont shoot the Bergers, wont know till you try.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

32 inch barrel -55 grains reloader 17 -180br vld berger =around 3000fps , good luck trying to carry this rig though , go to 6mmbr as there is some excellent info there for you. i am going to use this combination with a .284 imp to take over the fclass world as my own skills are unable to do it alone
http://www.6mmbr.com/7mm284.html
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

My 7mm-08 is 18" long and it attains 2600fps with IMR4064 and 162gr AMAX's.....works extremly well. For the 180s though a longer barrel and a slower powder would be better.

But consider the speed I get with my 7mm-08 without pressure signs.....then get even better with a 284Win and a few more inches of barrel.

Basicly pick a bullet and then pick the caliber that suits your needs with the previously chosen bullet.

1)Pick Rifle Goal
2)Bullet
3)Pick chambering
4)Have built/buy
5) Knock the shit out of some steel.....


In the ADD case of most Snipershide members...

Liquidate. Change directions, Repeat as needed!!
laugh.gif
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I looked at this, in fact was dead set on it. Bought dies, brass, barrel, etc...

Then I realized that you can't run the 168 or 180 Bergers in a short action and still have enough bullet/neck contact. Switched to a .260 and could not be happier. I think there was 0.1 MIL difference in my wind all the way out there. Not worth the hassle and extra powder.

For a hunting cartridge with 140gr bullets, the story is different.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

What, short action? A 284 was never a short action to start with. mwroseberry, run with it, make an improved if you hand load and don't mind the little extra work. I shoot side by side with one every now and then with my 7WSM. Very similar ballistics. In fact we would offten use each others dope for a double check. Probably have better barrel life.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

actually the .284 was designed as a short action cartridge.

personally i wouldnt run it in one, but thats what it was designed for.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Just stick with the .308. It's a "classic". Besides .... 7mm bullets are hard enough to find without more people shooting them
laugh.gif



Really, I'd say go for it since your thinking of dropping some coin on a new barrel anyway. Make it a 26" 9 twist and shoot 162 Amaxs. You could always get some money back out of the .308 stuff or just hang onto it for next year's rifle. The .260 seems to have a loyal following as well. Either cartridge would give you better performance at longer ranges than the .308.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I thought the 260 was a long action. I will have to do some more research on it if I can get it in a short action it may be the way to go. Then I would just keep my 308 barrel and dies if I want to go hunting. Decisions Decisions....
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Short action may not be the answer...You are going to be limited in your seating depth with a short action, which in turn may limit your powder capacity. The .284 is one hell of a round, a sleeper to be exact...I say you build one and let er' rip!
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Also the reason I was looking at the 284 win was because it was a SA. Is it not safe to run on a short action receiver?
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Also is a 26" barrel long enough to take advantage of the cart. or do I need to jump up to a 28". I want to be able to run and gun and I don't think anything longer than a 26" would be easy to move with.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

The difference 2" will make is marginal, but noticeable in terms of velocity. I do not know where your are getting the short action thing from, unless I am missing something. What are you trying to do with it? If you are going to compete or shoot matches, then the velocity may mean something to you...If not build the 26" and let er' rip...Some of the F-class guys are now shooting straight .284's over 6.5-284's, food for thought.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

The .284 cartridge is a stinkin' boiler room! It never really caught on too much until the wildcatters started necking it down to 6.5mm, its an excellent long range round, with a LOT of over bore causing short barrel life. The straight .284 should yield a tremendous amount of barrel life over the 6.5-284 due to the larger diameter of the 7mm...
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Glock_and_roll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Short action may not be the answer...You are going to be limited in your seating depth with a short action, which in turn may limit your powder capacity. The .284 is one hell of a round, a sleeper to be exact...I say you build one and let er' rip! </div></div>

You stated earlier that it wouldn't be good to run the 284 as a short action. Is it safe to run it in short action and just limit my seat depth? I have a short action receiver and don't plan on switching out to a long action as the cost wouldn't make it worth it to me.

And can I run 168gr SMK with this setup or is it true as stated before that I wouldn't be able to get enough contact on the bullet. If I switch I would like to get up to or close to the 168gr projectiles.

Thanks,
Merritt
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Are you running it in a Savage?

Aren't all the Savages L/A wven for the 308 Win based rounds?

You can run the 162AMAX in a S/A...with modifications to the feed ramps or have the barrel throated way short so that you can jump .010 and be at mag length with the chosen bullet.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

284 Win is a great round. It has just about the same case capacity as my 280 AI.

I get 2860 with 180 Bergers in a 26 inch tube

I am a huge Berger fan. I have never personally seen a gun that won't shoot bergers. Experiment with diffrent powders and seating depths and You will find a load that bugholes.

Long action is where it needs to be. But that depends on how your gun is set up (bottom metal choice, single shot or repeater)

IMO if you shoot a fast 7mm And compare it to a 308. Well... Your 308 will probally start to collect dust!!

On another note for a repeater short action, I would look hard at a 260, a friend just had Wnroscoe barrel one up and it is a true hammer. It has great velocity And I would say around 2400 rounds of barrel life with hard use.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Hmmmm I have alot to think about. Thanks everyone for all the info. I have a bad feeling that other factors like my Jeep needing a lift kit may win and I may end up getting a custom barrel in 308 just to save on component and die costs. Time will tell.

Thanks gentlemen,
Merritt
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

i load my 284 to 3.1" oal with 175 smks and get about 2850 fps with 54.5 grains of 4831sc. i use a long action for mine but that load would fit in a short action with the new seekins bottom metal. on the other hand, i can load 6 rounds of .284 into a 5 round 300wm aics magazine.

the guys around here shooting the same load got right about 3k rounds of barrel life. i am at 2k rounds now through mine and it shoots as good now as it ever has. i am not shooting it at the moment because for some reason sierra hasn't made 7mm 175 smks since before last october. i don't want to start working up a new load using a different bullet and this point in the barrel life.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Merritt: the .284 has been on my mind lately as well. To answer your question, a .284 is safe in a short action. The dilemma has always been whether to run a short or long action. The .284 is right on the edge. A standard 700 mag box will force you to seat long bullets deep, crowding the engine room. A long action of course will add length which is a negative for a tactical rifle, but no big deal for an F-Classer.

If your going to run a short action, use the Badger M5 with accurate mags (or modified AI or AW mags) and you'll pic up another .010 in OAL. A 3.00 mag well would be magic. My suggestion is to find someone shooting a .284 in a short action and see whether the velocity is what your expecting.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I just built a 700la 284 w/26" 9 twist barrel I will be taking it to the range for the first time tomorrow I will update you on velocities I will be trying the 162 amax and the 180bergers vlds with rl17.

here is a pic to inspire you to go for it.

IMGP6806.jpg
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

mwroseberry,

The .284 Win is an excellent round. It was originally designed to work out of a short action..."as a hunting round." That means light short ogive bullets. Heavy bullets had to get pushed down deep in the case a little. That so it would cycle through a Win model 88 or 100. But they still performed respectably.
The case size was so they could get .280 Rem power out of a short action. Problem was, no one ever looked at this as a target round. In fact, no one looked at the 6.5-.284 as a target round until twenty years after the .284 came out and a wildcatter necked his version down to 6.5mm. It was really when long bullets started getting made on a mainstream basis that the 6.5-284, then the .284, got looked at as viable target cartridges. Of course the 7mm Rem mag won at Perry in '68 but that didn't seem to matter.

So, bottom line, the .284 is safe in either a long or short action. It's going to do you a lot better in a long action because you can load bullets out a ways and still run them through a magazine. If you single feed, as in LR, BR or F-class, a short action won't be an issue. If you want to use this as a tactical comp rifle then long action is what I'd suggest. You don't have to worry about magazine length and chase out the lands as far as they'll go.

FWIW, your last statement about going ".308" because it would be easier is a classic cop-out. If you're going to build a long range rifle with some serious capability, then do that while it's one cost. It doesn't cost anymore than you would spend on a .308 to get into a .284. So get the performance instead of the standard and do something with it.
The .284 can launch high BC bullets out in the high deserts of the West out to one mile. (hot days high altitude) Yes, accuracy to one mile. The .308 can only dream of that.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I built one last year, on a Savage short action, for a long range hunting rifle and with 162 amax over 53gr of h4350 I am getting 29++ fps and 1/2-3/4 moa out to 850yds.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

A friend of mine has a Ultra Light Arms Mod.20 chambered for 284. It's a very nice rifle. The M20 has a 3" mag and is a perfect fit for the 284 and 6.5x55.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

what kind of OAL are the long actions using with a 180gr vld berger ? My AICS short action mag could have an OAL of 2.85" as a mag fed round -that leaves very little play within the over all length of the mag which is 2.88" -might need to shorten the OAL of the round depending if it bothers the hollow point.I shoot around a farm at different distances at plates from a bipod then shoot against the F-Class crew with my same 28" barrel in 260 in an AICS STOCK on a rest -with some success I might add -get a beating some time too.I am thinking of slipping in a 30' tube into the same stock and Barnard SM MAG FED action which has a long thread to recieve the longer barrel and single feeding the Berger 180vld so to increase powder volume-the ballistics are awesome 1.57 mills wind drift at 10 at 3 over 1000 yards and still super sonic at 1500 yards -2 to 3000 rounds before changing barrels depending on loading -great target round
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

just got back from range with my new 284 and without any pressure signs I was pushing the 180 bergers to 2915fps and the 162amax to 3050fps both were just under 1/2moa. mind you my overall length is 3.20" with bergers.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ch'e</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what kind of OAL are the long actions using with a 180gr vld berger ? My AICS short action mag could have an OAL of 2.85" as a mag fed round -that leaves very little play within the over all length of the mag which is 2.88" -might need to shorten the OAL of the round depending if it bothers the hollow point.I shoot around a farm at different distances at plates from a bipod then shoot against the F-Class crew with my same 28" barrel in 260 in an AICS STOCK on a rest -with some success I might add -get a beating some time too.I am thinking of slipping in a 30' tube into the same stock and Barnard SM MAG FED action which has a long thread to recieve the longer barrel and single feeding the Berger 180vld so to increase powder volume-the ballistics are awesome 1.57 mills wind drift at 10 at 3 over 1000 yards and still super sonic at 1500 yards -2 to 3000 rounds before changing barrels depending on loading -great target round
</div></div>

with short action aics mags, with a slight modification you can get 2.94" oal. in my opinion, you are still handicapping the .284 by loading this short. to take the most advantage of them with the 175 smks, they should be around 3.1" oal and around 3.2" oal for the 180 vlds.

there is a thread on here where someone did a short action .284. i was not impressed with the numbers. i'll see if i can find that thread and link it here.

edit: here's the thread: link

 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I think I may go 284 on my next rifle but I think I'll go long action with it. I want to be able to feed my rounds and still get the potential of the ammo. Putting a 284 in a short action you can feed from a magazine is like putting a Nascar motor in a school bus.

Thanks,
Merritt
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mwroseberry</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think I may go 284 on my next rifle but I think I'll go long action with it. I want to be able to feed my rounds and still get the potential of the ammo. Putting a 284 in a short action you can feed from a magazine is like putting a Nascar motor in a school bus.

Thanks,
Merritt </div></div>

Now you got it...
smile.gif
Go long action if you want to use this round.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ch'e</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what kind of OAL are the long actions using with a 180gr vld berger ? My AICS short action mag could have an OAL of 2.85" as a mag fed round -that leaves very little play within the over all length of the mag which is 2.88" -might need to shorten the OAL of the round depending if it bothers the hollow point.I shoot around a farm at different distances at plates from a bipod then shoot against the F-Class crew with my same 28" barrel in 260 in an AICS STOCK on a rest -with some success I might add -get a beating some time too.I am thinking of slipping in a 30' tube into the same stock and Barnard SM MAG FED action which has a long thread to recieve the longer barrel and single feeding the Berger 180vld so to increase powder volume-the ballistics are awesome 1.57 mills wind drift at 10 at 3 over 1000 yards and still super sonic at 1500 yards -2 to 3000 rounds before changing barrels depending on loading -great target round
</div></div>

with short action aics mags, with a slight modification you can get 2.94" oal. in my opinion, you are still handicapping the .284 by loading this short. to take the most advantage of them with the 175 smks, they should be around 3.1" oal and around 3.2" oal for the 180 vlds.

there is a thread on here where someone did a short action .284. i was not impressed with the numbers. i'll see if i can find that thread and link it here.

edit: here's the thread: link

</div></div>

FWIW, you can load out to 3.205" in a Savage short action magazine. That would mean you could start out in a short action magazine, but as you started chasing the lands your going to run out of room in short order. Just one more case for a long action.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kyreloader</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here is one you may want to read about:

http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek095.html </div></div>

Ditto what kyreloader said. I was going to suggest the same article. Seems the ol' 284 is making a move with F-Classer's.

FWIW, I also read about a guy who is kicking butts using a 30-06 too on the same web site.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I've been debating this round for a while now and even more so now after measuring my FN mag well and finding it is 3.0"
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Any new updates from the .284 Shooters?

Someone correct my if I am wrong but sounds like 180 Bergers can be shot to around 2900 in a .284 Win out of a 26'' barrel- similar to what a 7mm Rem Mag can due but with less powder and twice the barrel length??

Deciding between a .284 Win on a LA or a 7mm Rem Mag for my next build and looking for some direction here. Thanks in advance.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

That is pushing the 180's too hot in a 284 in my opinion.

I shoot them at 2795 fps w/ RE17.

You do not need to run them that fast.

Those speeds are more in line with a 7saum or 7wsm.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

Realistic .284 speeds are 2750-2850. My guess is if anyone says they are shooting a straight 284 at 2950 they need a new chronograph
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I'm with M14er.

It would take serious pressure to get a 180 going 2900 from a 26" barrel in the 284.

The 284 is a nice cartridge and IMHO, strikes a nice balance between powder consumption, recoil, ballistics and barrel life....

BUT IT AIN'T NO MAGNUM

There is no such thing as a free lunch. There is no magic cartridge that is going to achieve equal velocity with significantly less powder - not with similar pressure, anyway.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I've pretty much decided to swap to a LA for my Shehane, i wanna run those long Bergers and still use a mag.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I went through alot of the same things trying to pick a 7mm cartridge. I have been shooting the 284 shehane for awhile and I love it. As far as barrel life my rifle is at 535 rounds and the throat has grown .003" so its not a barrel burner.
As far as barrel length goes I wouldnt run any shorter than 28". My rifle is shooting the 180gr berger at 2930fps with 4831sc and 3150fps with RL17. That is out of a 29" brux. When I rebarrel it will be to a 32" brux 8.5 twist.

If you want to push the heavy 7mm projectiles at high speeds the 284 will disappoint you. On the other side the faster you push the projectile the more throat erosion you are going to see. I have not noticed any significant accuracy changes from 2850fps all the way to 3150fps to 1000yds.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

I get 2830fps out of a 25" barrel with Reloader 17 and the 180's, might be able to push it to 2850 but its not really worth it since that extra 20fps seems to work the brass a lot harder.
 
Re: 284 Winchester, should I switch to this round?

What do you guys think about a Barnard P Action and the 284 with 180gr Hybrid Bergers?
 
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