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300 Blackout Newbie Please Help!!

T

tacticalbeard

Guest
So I have a question. I'm new to this. I am building a ar for two calibers. My one barrel is a 16 inch 5.56 and my 300 blackout will be 7.5 inch. Here's my question, do I have to use two separate buffer springs and tube to run each caliber? I'm basically looking for a rifle that I can go to the range and basically pop the 5.56 off and pop the 300 on. Is this doable, please help!


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You'll have to swap buffers or get an adjustable gas blocks and tune them around a specific buffer. Personally you might want to reconsider getting at least an 8.5" barrel for the 300 since it takes about 8.5-9" to burn up all the powder.
 
Is there anything I can do to run both with same buffer just different uppers obviously. And what would be ideal length for the 300 just for a range toy


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Is there anything I can do to run both with same buffer just different uppers obviously. And what would be ideal length for the 300 just for a range toy


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I just told you. Run an adjustable gas block on each upper and tune the gas to one buffer like an H or an H2. As for ideal length it depends on exactly what you want from it. Are you looking for accuracy and speed or are you wanting to run subsonic and stay within 100-300yds? If you're wanting an SBR subsonic then a 8.5-9" is ideal at minimum so you're getting a full powder burn. If you're wanting to go as far as possible and super sonic then why bother with the short barrel and run a 16".
 
I'm looking to do subsonic so adjustable gas block is what I need for 8.5 and what kind of buffer set up. I have a noveske flaming pig can that I am going to install as well


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I'm looking to do subsonic so adjustable gas block is what I need for 8.5 and what kind of buffer set up. I have a noveske flaming pig can that I am going to install as well


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The Noveske Flaming Pig is a Flash Suppressor, not a can, so running subsonics is kind of pointless. If you were to have an actual "can" then I would run an H1 buffer with a Syrac adjustable gas block.
 
What is a can how's that for noob lol


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What is a can how's that for noob lol


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You can't see it... but I literally double face palmed... If you actually have a beard please go shave, then spend a few weeks reading up on AR's, SBRs, and suppresssors... then come back and realize you're asking questions about multiple items you don't own nor can you build without a nice little 6-8 month wait and multiple tax stamps unless you're building a pistol in which case I would hope you wouldn't be slapping a 16" 223 barrel on it.
 
Nope just doing research first


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I'm asking questions I'm a first timer in the sbr world no need for the hostility I'm sure you guys were all there once. That's why I, looking for knowledgable guys like you to answer a few questions.


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I'm asking questions I'm a first timer in the sbr world no need for the hostility I'm sure you guys were all there once. That's why I, looking for knowledgable guys like you to answer a few questions.


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Do you have a Tax Stamp on a Form 1 or a Form 4?
 
No need to put an adjustable gas block on a SBR blackout. You would set up the lower to run the blackout, you need all the gas you can get to run the carrier. Then set up the 223 upper with adjustable gas block and tune it to the lower.
 
No need to put an adjustable gas block on a SBR blackout. You would set up the lower to run the blackout, you need all the gas you can get to run the carrier. Then set up the 223 upper with adjustable gas block and tune it to the lower.

That's only for subsonic.
 
For a 16" .223/5.56 gun you would ideally want to run an H buffer(depending on gas port size), MAYBE even an H2 if you are over gassed. For a short(8.5-9") 300BLK an H2 is the recommended. I ran a few thousand rounds using an H-buffer with a 9" AAC factory 300BLK upper before swapping to an H2. Ran great, ran everything(subs, supers, suppressed, unsuppressed). Swapping to an H2 increased lock time slightly and I could tell the gun was SLIGHTLY quieter(whether it is or not, I dont have a meter).

So if I was going to run 1 lower it would have an H buffer in it. No need for adjustable gas, no need for anything else crazy, just an H buffer. However it takes about 5 seconds to swap buffers and they cost $30. I wouldnt jack with adjustable gas when a $30 buffer and 5-10 seconds to change when changing uppers is all that is really needed. But again, an H buffer will run really well with both uppers and if your 5.56 upper is overgassed, an H2 might be needed which sets you up perfectly for the short 300BLK upper.
 
For a 16" .223/5.56 gun you would ideally want to run an H buffer(depending on gas port size), MAYBE even an H2 if you are over gassed. For a short(8.5-9") 300BLK an H2 is the recommended. I ran a few thousand rounds using an H-buffer with a 9" AAC factory 300BLK upper before swapping to an H2. Ran great, ran everything(subs, supers, suppressed, unsuppressed). Swapping to an H2 increased lock time slightly and I could tell the gun was SLIGHTLY quieter(whether it is or not, I dont have a meter).

So if I was going to run 1 lower it would have an H buffer in it. No need for adjustable gas, no need for anything else crazy, just an H buffer. However it takes about 5 seconds to swap buffers and they cost $30. I wouldnt jack with adjustable gas when a $30 buffer and 5-10 seconds to change when changing uppers is all that is really needed. But again, an H buffer will run really well with both uppers and if your 5.56 upper is overgassed, an H2 might be needed which sets you up perfectly for the short 300BLK upper.

I'd rather spend the extra and tune each upper so it's dialed exactly where I want it, but I see your point.
 
Thanks guys. How do i unregister from this forum?

Don't know. But I suggest that you understand the legal constraints on short barrels unless you want to share a room with Bubba at the Club Fed.

Simply put, build a pistol with SIG brace for a 9" 300AAC upper and keep your existing lower with the 'real' stock together with a 16" (minimum) barrel.

Putting a short barrel upper on a lower with rifle or carbine stock is a big no-no unless you got a SBR (short barreled rifle) tax stamp after paying $200 and waiting for 6-9 month to receive the stamped paperwork. Even having a short barreled upper 'laying around' without a pistol lower or without a registered SBR lower but while possessing a rifle lower is considered constructive (criminal) intent. In essence, ATF is assuming that you will do what you suggested: i.e. pop the shorty on your rifle lower without paying the piper first and they will slap you with the same penalties that are applicable for the actual deed.

I hope you understand now why people got a little brash here. If not, go to an electrician's forum and ask what tools you should use to work on high voltage transmission lines. The response will be most likely: "If you do not know, don't even think about touching the thing."

It is your responsibility to educate yourself. The defense "Nobody on the xyz forum was willing to help" is not going to save you in federal court nor will it impress St. Peter after you turned yourself into an arc-lamp.
 
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I'd rather spend the extra and tune each upper so it's dialed exactly where I want it, but I see your point.

I dont see a point as IMO its not needed. 300BLK was designed to not need adjustable gas as Mr. Silvers points out repeatedly.

16" .223 runs AWESOME with an H buffer. If its over gassed(like a S&W or something like that) than an H2 will generally get you rolling perfectly. No need for adjustable gas IMO. This is proven time and time again that the guns run with either of these two buffers.

9" 300BLK runs AWESOME with an H buffer as well. The recommended is an H2, but an H runs like a raped ape. The H2 will be SLIGHTLY quieter. Ive probably run 3k+ on an H and probably 2k+ on an H2. No appreciable difference in how the gun runs really(im running 99% subsonic 300BLK). Im sure somebody with more high tech equipment than me could prove the gun runs better(cyclic rate) or is quieter(DB reduction from the can) or whatever. If I was running more supers than subs, the H buffer MAY have run to fast, I dont know, dont have enough experience running supers. Most 300BLK barrels in my experience are WAY under gassed and an adjustable block wont help you out at all and running an H2 buffer in those will cause nothing but issues.

I run an adjustable on an 18" SPR because I am using JP low mass carrier and silent capture spring. You NEED adjustable gas to tune that system. But with either 16" carbine 5.56 or 9" 300BLK an H buffer will run either and run it reliably. Now if you were talking needing a C buffer in the 5.56 gun and an H2 in the 300BLK, THEN I would consider saying "get adjustable gas to tune", but with an H running happily in either(in MOST guns), I would tend to leave it be and just rock the H. If the 16" 5.56 would run well with an H2, again, run it and leave it be. I tend to err on the side of simplicity and adjustable gas adds a level of complexity that if I dont personally NEED it(as in the case that my SPR needs it) I would rather tune with a buffer or spring. I also tend to never run low powered Wolf, im either running XM193 or im running fairly hot M193 clone reloads so I dont ever feel in my carbine gas guns I need a C buffer to get it to run right. I actually run the H2 with my 9" 300BLK and my 10.5" 5.56 runs like a raped ape with it as well so I just roll with it. So in some people's setups or ammo they run, an adjustable gas with a C buffer might be the way to roll, but me personally, and I also believe in the OP's case(since he doesnt seem to know a ton of the technical in's and out's) simpler is better so I would still say in his case just running an H buffer for both uppers would be the way to go. It all though in the end comes down to the overall setup of the gun and the ammo being shot. A properly drilled 16" .223 gun runs great on an H buffer. A properly drilled 9" 300BLK gun will run awesome on an H buffer(even though the recommended is an H2). So if I only had 1 buffer to choose, it would be an H.

BUT it seems as this discussion is purely academic as the OP's has decided he doesnt want to stay and learn about the systems and just wants to go away.
 
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I dont see a point as IMO its not needed. 300BLK was designed to not need adjustable gas as Mr. Silvers points out repeatedly.

16" .223 runs AWESOME with an H buffer. If its over gassed(like a S&W or something like that) than an H2 will generally get you rolling perfectly. No need for adjustable gas IMO. This is proven time and time again that the guns run with either of these two buffers.

9" 300BLK runs AWESOME with an H buffer as well. The recommended is an H2, but an H runs like a raped ape. The H2 will be SLIGHTLY quieter. Ive probably run 3k+ on an H and probably 2k+ on an H2. No appreciable difference in how the gun runs really(im running 99% subsonic 300BLK). Im sure somebody with more high tech equipment than me could prove the gun runs better(cyclic rate) or is quieter(DB reduction from the can) or whatever. If I was running more supers than subs, the H buffer MAY have run to fast, I dont know, dont have enough experience running supers. Most 300BLK barrels in my experience are WAY under gassed and an adjustable block wont help you out at all and running an H2 buffer in those will cause nothing but issues.

I run an adjustable on an 18" SPR because I am using JP low mass carrier and silent capture spring. You NEED adjustable gas to tune that system. But with either 16" carbine 5.56 or 9" 300BLK an H buffer will run either and run it reliably. Now if you were talking needing a C buffer in the 5.56 gun and an H2 in the 300BLK, THEN I would consider saying "get adjustable gas to tune", but with an H running happily in either(in MOST guns), I would tend to leave it be and just rock the H. If the 16" 5.56 would run well with an H2, again, run it and leave it be. I tend to err on the side of simplicity and adjustable gas adds a level of complexity that if I dont personally NEED it(as in the case that my SPR needs it) I would rather tune with a buffer or spring. I also tend to never run low powered Wolf, im either running XM193 or im running fairly hot M193 clone reloads so I dont ever feel in my carbine gas guns I need a C buffer to get it to run right. I actually run the H2 with my 9" 300BLK and my 10.5" 5.56 runs like a raped ape with it as well so I just roll with it. So in some people's setups or ammo they run, an adjustable gas with a C buffer might be the way to roll, but me personally, and I also believe in the OP's case(since he doesnt seem to know a ton of the technical in's and out's) simpler is better so I would still say in his case just running an H buffer for both uppers would be the way to go. It all though in the end comes down to the overall setup of the gun and the ammo being shot. A properly drilled 16" .223 gun runs great on an H buffer. A properly drilled 9" 300BLK gun will run awesome on an H buffer(even though the recommended is an H2). So if I only had 1 buffer to choose, it would be an H.

BUT it seems as this discussion is purely academic as the OP's has decided he doesnt want to stay and learn about the systems and just wants to go away.

Are your running your 223 suppressed as well?
 
Are your running your 223 suppressed as well?

The 10.5", yes. Its an LMT. Runs great with the H2. It runs a tiny bit fast suppressed(ejects about 3 oclock instead of 4-5 oclock), but I am ok with that. With the H buffer suppressed it ran pretty fast throwing out about 2 oclock. I tend to focus less on ejection angle than I do on reliability though for certain guns. For my 10.5" SBR which ends up being a house gun quite a bit with the can on it, I dont want to mess with an adjustable gas system and maybe forget to set it for the correct configuration. I would rather have it run slightly fast with the can on it then to forget to set the gas correctly and have it not run at all without the can(because I have choked off the gas).

The 18" rifle length with adjustable gas, I have found I dont have to mess with the gas system either between suppressed and unsuppressed. I dont know why, maybe barrel length, maybe gas system length, maybe its the load I run in it. It seems to run exactly the same suppressed vs. un-suppressed. But to be honest I havent messed with it to see if I could turn it down even more(I bet I could, but it is so soft shooting no matter which way I run it).

Now those are my two guns which the LMT is generally considered to have a pretty spot on gas port for a 10.5" barrel and the 18" is a Krieger done up by Compass Lake which, again, is known to have the gas port size pretty spot on. If you have a gun that is way over gassed to begin with or way under gassed to begin with, throw everything out the window because the only way to control it might be with an adjustable gas block.
 
I've built quite a few .300 BLK uppers. The .300 BLK generates only about half the chamber pressure of the 5.56mm. Unsuppressed, I find it runs significantly better with a lighter buffer than a 5.56mm of the same barrel length would require.

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The 10.5", yes. Its an LMT. Runs great with the H2. It runs a tiny bit fast suppressed(ejects about 3 oclock instead of 4-5 oclock), but I am ok with that. With the H buffer suppressed it ran pretty fast throwing out about 2 oclock. I tend to focus less on ejection angle than I do on reliability though for certain guns. For my 10.5" SBR which ends up being a house gun quite a bit with the can on it, I dont want to mess with an adjustable gas system and maybe forget to set it for the correct configuration. I would rather have it run slightly fast with the can on it then to forget to set the gas correctly and have it not run at all without the can(because I have choked off the gas).

The 18" rifle length with adjustable gas, I have found I dont have to mess with the gas system either between suppressed and unsuppressed. I dont know why, maybe barrel length, maybe gas system length, maybe its the load I run in it. It seems to run exactly the same suppressed vs. un-suppressed. But to be honest I havent messed with it to see if I could turn it down even more(I bet I could, but it is so soft shooting no matter which way I run it).

Now those are my two guns which the LMT is generally considered to have a pretty spot on gas port for a 10.5" barrel and the 18" is a Krieger done up by Compass Lake which, again, is known to have the gas port size pretty spot on. If you have a gun that is way over gassed to begin with or way under gassed to begin with, throw everything out the window because the only way to control it might be with an adjustable gas block.

I run my 18" SPR with an H3 and the gas is tuned to cycle w/o the can and it cycles great also with the can just like yours, so IMO it sounds like the 18" is the most reliable for both without a lot of adjustment.
 
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I meant SPR, but I wouldn't expect you to figure that out since it would require some common sense and thinking and you might end up hurting yourself.
 
I'd rather spend the extra and tune each upper so it's dialed exactly where I want it, but I see your point.

+1. For only $20, you can get a 'baby Govnah' as pictured below.
It is basically a standard low profile gas block that we machine in house. Except that the port in the gas block is only .043 so you just drill it out to the point it works optimally for your configuration and done.

babygovnah3-1024x768.jpg


Note also that the port is slightly countersunk to allow for some misalignment of the block and port in the barrel. While our regular Govnah has an alignment hole to confirm perfect alignment with port in the barrel (one of the patented features).
More info, vids and pics on my site:MicroMOA - Home of the Govnah - Modular Adjustable Gas Block
 
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