If any of you hunt with a .308 I was wondering what grain bullets you like to use for Deer and Wild Boar? I'm new to hunting, but I shoot a lot of the 175 SMKs at steal. I'm thinking it might not be the best round for Deer/Boar. Thoughts?
Hunting & Fishing .308 for midsize game????
- Thread starter usmcmk12
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My next pig round is gonna be 155SMK. 175 would be fine for pig and deer, lots of people using that.
YES! YES! YES! YES! for F@CK sakes YES!
You are very mistaken, to the level of full retard.
Here are just a few detailed threads from the FIRST PAGE of the hunting forum, read through them and you shall have your answer. You will also notice a common trend in the discussions, at least I hope you will notice. But I'll give you a hint in case your Fu is off; No bullet is perfect, and every bullet can fail. Shot placement is the closest thing to a guarantee you can get. Pick a bullet, (practically any bullet) and go with it, practice till you think you cant miss. Then your close.
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/snipers-hide-hunting-fishing/196168-hornady-amax-hunting.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting.../106997-post-your-smk-match-bullet-kills.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/snipers-hide-hunting-fishing/221179-best-308-bullet-deer.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...547-berger-185gr-juggernaut-deer-results.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...hing/222021-upset-silvertips-performance.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/snipers-hide-hunting-fishing/196168-hornady-amax-hunting.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting.../106997-post-your-smk-match-bullet-kills.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/snipers-hide-hunting-fishing/221179-best-308-bullet-deer.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...547-berger-185gr-juggernaut-deer-results.html
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...hing/222021-upset-silvertips-performance.html
I know your tired of the match bullet for hunting questions and debates cold bore but breathe in, breathe out. Lol
I'm pretty sure his question is legit and he didn't search before asking but he is also very new to the forum & hunting most important.
OP, yes a lot of people use smk's to hunt and many other match bullets with great success. Know its strengths and weaknesses of how it performs. Google is your friend here with more info than you can digest in a week. I use Amax's my self, its not magical or better than smk's but in my 308 I'm very comfortable with it. I use the same load year round paper, steel, & fur so I'm very confident in it and placing it where I want, which is #1.
Pick a bullet you are comfortable with and trust. Confidence is key!
Good luck
My buddy and I hunt deer and hogs together. There have been several occasions where he was using 168gr SMKs and I was using regular old ballistic tips 165/168gr. His hogs have ran a ways into the brush while mine DRT. It may be poor shot placement on the few we haven't recovered of his.
This is my opinion, but my experience is that the ballistic tips at lower velocities (like my 16" LAR-8, around 2450-2500FPS @ muzzle) are very effective on deer and hogs out to 200yds. That's the farthest I've taken either animal and all but once they've exited with about 3/4"-1" hole. All deer have DRT except a doe with a liver shot and a doe that I clipped 1 lung. Hogs up to 250lbs haven't moved (other than the spin/flop once they're dick dirted).
This is my opinion, but my experience is that the ballistic tips at lower velocities (like my 16" LAR-8, around 2450-2500FPS @ muzzle) are very effective on deer and hogs out to 200yds. That's the farthest I've taken either animal and all but once they've exited with about 3/4"-1" hole. All deer have DRT except a doe with a liver shot and a doe that I clipped 1 lung. Hogs up to 250lbs haven't moved (other than the spin/flop once they're dick dirted).
This is the likely answer to every instance regardless of bullet or caliber.
For the past few seasons, I have done 90% of my deer and hog hunting with 168gr Amax in .308. Almost all of them have been pinpoint precise shots and the animals have fallen over dead in their tracks. I did hit a buck a little far forward in the shoulder last year and he ran a very short distance before collapsing dead. That shoulder was pretty well annihilated, but the deer did not go far. Last week, I shot a whitetail buck with an Amax heart shot and he fell down DRT. Extensive internal damage, but no meat loss. Over the past few decades, I have used a variety of bullets on large game and I agree that any adequate bullet, properly placed, is going to get the job done. As others have said here, use any bullet you want as long as you put it in the right place. My choice for using Amax was based solely upon the fact that I know for certain that the load I've worked up with that bullet is going to strike exactly where I intend for it to.
I personally wouldnt shoot match ammo at deer or hogs. It will go in and out and not have that big of an exit wound unless it hits something. But thats jsut my opinion.
And what is this opinion based on? Something you read, or non anecdotal evidence?
Lack of a functional grounding in terminal ballistics.
I use Copper Creek 175 they are excellent I have used FGMM 168 same thing. I'm in Texas so plenty of deer and hogs. I hunt hogs a lot no problems if you put it where it needs to be.
Having hunted Africa 2 summers back, I am a TTSX fan, to say the least. They fly true and do immense damage before they exit (if they exit.)
Short of that, I shoot many deer and hogs with 168-Amax.
Lastly, Sierra says everywhere that SMK is not designed for hunting. I have hunted SMKs in various calibers and taken animals cleanly; however, as has been said, a well designed and purpose-built hunting bullet will give you more forgiveness if your shot does hit a little off the mark.
Can it be done: absolutely. Should it be done: I see no reason to tempt the fates - especially as a new hunter. Few things suck more than hitting an animal and not recovering it. If you are new to hunting, get bullets built for hunting, you need some forgiveness.
Short of that, I shoot many deer and hogs with 168-Amax.
Lastly, Sierra says everywhere that SMK is not designed for hunting. I have hunted SMKs in various calibers and taken animals cleanly; however, as has been said, a well designed and purpose-built hunting bullet will give you more forgiveness if your shot does hit a little off the mark.
Can it be done: absolutely. Should it be done: I see no reason to tempt the fates - especially as a new hunter. Few things suck more than hitting an animal and not recovering it. If you are new to hunting, get bullets built for hunting, you need some forgiveness.
If you learn how to shoot, and shoot well at your intended hunting ranges, your match bullets will get the job done.
Too many hunters rely on the, "Magic in a Bottle" syndrome.....when they should be out there burning powder.
Too many hunters rely on the, "Magic in a Bottle" syndrome.....when they should be out there burning powder.
If your off the mark, you wont make up for it with a purpose built bullet. Unless its purpose is to turn and seek vitals. And it gives a false sense of security relied on by far too many.
.308 for midsize game????
If I could shoot as well as Pat I wouldn't even need bullets: The game would die of fright without me having to fire a shot.?
I generally don't shoot deer with any thing smaller than a .375 cal bullet and usally need the ultramag to knock those armor plated deer down.............. I have proven to my self time and time again that amax on deer and such a boringly reliable when hitting your mark
Thanks for the advice.
HAHAHA, was thinking the same thing, I think everyone should hunt with .50Cal just to be on the safe side.
With all the great bullets designed for hunting, why would anyone knowingly choose a hunting bullet whose manufacturer says "not designed for hunting"? Not an attack on anyone who uses this bullet, but a serious question. You have most likely chosen a very accurate rifle, high quality scope, etc. So, if you bought the best components for your rifle, shouldn't you also buy the best bullet to kill your game animal? After all, the bullet is the only thing that actually comes into contact with the animal, shouldn't it be the one capable of doing the best job?
there job is to sell bullets so why would they not tell that people that. This has been hashed out about as many times as breaking in a rifle bbl........
You stopped short in your line of thinking. Why would you shoot a different bullet than you always do? Why introduce variables into your hunt (particularly when hunting scenarios have so many uncontrollable variables already) the time, expense, and change (however small) in downrange performance and accuracy aren't worth it to some, for a "percieved" advantage. Add to that the confidence a shooter has with his "go to" load goes out the window when he switches bullets. And lastly, the best bullet by far is the one that hits where you want it to, be it hunting bullet, or not. That is the bullet that will kill your game. Take a look down the memory lane that is the match bullet kill thread posted above, the multitude of kills shown clearly illustrate that bullets placed properly do the job very well. In almost every one of my personal big game kills with match bullets as well as those Ive witnessed first hand, I cannot see how any bullet could have done a better job.
308 is more than you need for deer and pigs, a 223 will put them in the dirt. Another way to look at it is 308 uses the same bullet as 300WM which people uses all the time for grizzlies and moose, 308 is just about 200-300FPS behind in velocity. It will kill anything in north america.
As far as bullets for deer and pigs are concerned, any of your typical hunting or target bullets will do. I used Berger 185gr juggernauts this year which actually have a thicker jacket than their hunting bullets and they performed perfectly. I have also used Lapua Scenars, Hornady Amax's, and Nosler custom competitions with perfect results as well. Hornady actually lists the Amax's as medium game hunting bullets in their loading manual.
I'd pick one bullet to do both and never look back.
As far as bullets for deer and pigs are concerned, any of your typical hunting or target bullets will do. I used Berger 185gr juggernauts this year which actually have a thicker jacket than their hunting bullets and they performed perfectly. I have also used Lapua Scenars, Hornady Amax's, and Nosler custom competitions with perfect results as well. Hornady actually lists the Amax's as medium game hunting bullets in their loading manual.
I'd pick one bullet to do both and never look back.
It saw a thread with pics of animals killed with match ammo- it was disgusting. Did not look like any of those rounds passed clean-through at all. Them critters all looked to be dead-as-can-be and probably not one of em could comment on their bullet preference
I did take a look a the thread you mentioned. It was very surprising and eye-opening. I had no idea so many people are using SMK for big game hunting-not a topic I have ever searched. The pictures shown all report clean kills and show, in some instances, immense damage.
Does anyone know why Sierra recommends against using this bullet for hunting? From a business standpoint it doesn't make sense. If the SMK is a good hunting bullet, why not advertise it like Berger does. Advertising that a match bullet is also good for hunting would only attract more buyers. Target shooters only care about results, not marketing hype, so they wouldn't care. By saying it should not be used for hunting only reduces potential sales. What am I missing here?
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Haha, I use 180 Grain Sierra Game Kings. CBM, you're so gentle 
. .308 is a great caliber for your purposes. Have fun....
. .308 is a great caliber for your purposes. Have fun.... they sell the skg to the guys who think they need a hunting bullet and a smk to the same guy to shoot targets. So they sell more bullets making people think they need a "hunting" bullet.
Acceptable: yes.
"Best": no.
From one Marine to another (assuming the handle is accurate): there is the tool built for the job, and there is the tool built for a different job but will do OK at your job, decide accordingly. In precision shooting, the game is about getting the round there; in hunting, the game is about getting it there AND what it does when it gets there.
Can it be done: yes.
"Best": no.
So, do I have to break my barrel in with hunting bullets after I have already broken it in with my match bullets?
Where is my horse beating stick at......
Ryan
Where is my horse beating stick at......
Ryan
in your mag if you would alternate hunting and match and clean after each shot for 320 times you would probably be about there. personally I like to go about 500 rounds alternating cleaning after each shot to bare metal......
This question was discussed here several years ago, but I cannot find the thread.
Some of the responses which appeared logical and informed stated that it has to do with selling the SMK's to the military for use in combat, and the government having to comply with the Hague Convention.
The Hague Convention, among other things, prohibits the use of soft-point/expanding bullets in international warfare.
The 175 Sierra Match King was designed specifically for the newer version of the M118 ammunition for those hunting more than just deer.
Some pencil pushing Dilbert decided that SMK's violated the Hague Convention and our snipers could not use them. Further, careful legal analysis determined that match bullets are acceptable.
Hornady used to recommend Amaxes for hunting, but then won a government contract and now they also do not recommend them for hunting.
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Are you suggesting that 308 is not a good round for deer and hogs?
I dont know or wish to speculate why Sierra doesn't recommend them, but others already have and their suggestion does make sense. What I do understand is why people use them. There are thousands of examples of bullets, match and otherwise working perfectly, as well as failing. Simply saying "it can be done, but its not the best" isn't a fair statement, the same can be said and argued about almost any aspect of hunting. I'd wager that far more animals are shot and not recovered by hunting bullets, than by match bullets. For the time proven fact that hitting your target properly is the key, and match bullets perform very well at accurately hitting the target, which is why people shoot them. I'd add to that statement that those who shoot match bullets are typically more dedicated to their trade, and practice far more than those who dont, resulting in better shooting, and more accurate kills. I have yet to see someone complaining about match bullet performance produce any evidence proving so. Some of us have long said that these "poor performances" were more likely poor shot placement, a simple picture would confirm that, but they dont show. The stories go like this; "so and so shot a deer at only XXX yards, the bullet just penciled through, and the deer ran off" followed by " then we had to shoot it three more times to finish it off" or " we never recovered the deer". But there never is any pictures or evidence to go along. But as I mentioned, there are plenty of pictures and stories of the same bullets working perfectly, time after time. The evidence speaks for itself. Perhaps Sierra is of the old mindset shared by so many, that you have to use specific bullets for specific practices.
Maybe I've just been lucky with match bullets for hunting.....................hundreds of times.
Yes, thankfully a Marine JAG colonel overruled the pencil pushing Dilbert.
Sniper Use of Open-Tip Ammunition
He said, and the JAGs of all other service branches and even Foggy Bottom agreed, that the SMK open tip was not a hollow point intended to aid expansion, but an artifact of the process that makes the most accurate bullets. Tests showed that otherwise identical closed-tip bullets were not as accurate as OTM. Accuracy = more kills, less collateral damage from airballs flying around the battlefield. If SMK OTMs happen to yaw and fragment on impact, well, tough tamales, since most modern FMJ spitzers will do the same, and some (like German FMJ 762x51mm in the Fackler tests) tear holes far worse than OTMs.
The paper concludes that since the Hague and Geneva Conventions don't care about results, only intentions, OTM projectiles are kosher for Passover--even if they do in fact make great gaping holes, they don't mean to. That, I agree, is why Sierra doesn't advertise them for hunting. But Sierra loses all control over their bullets after they leave the factory, so party on. The last hog I know I hit, a 300-pounder at least 250m away, dropped on the spot from a 168SMK out of my 16" LR-308. We all know we need long barrels and heavily advertised hunting bullets and wooden-stocked bolt rifles to hunt with, but I like being rebellious.
I recommend everyone to NOT use match bullets for hunting. Leaves that many more for me
I am most certainly NOT suggesting that. My prior post says I kill many of both with a 308 (mostly 168 Amax); I am suggesting one most definitely can hunt with match bullets, but that a purpose-built hunting bullet is a better choice, especially for a new hunter.
Match bullets are designed for one thing, hunting bullets for another (in most cases.)
I've killed with both, but for a new hunter, I recommend hunting bullets.
Ok just clarifying. It was hard to tell because of how the post was written.
That's interesting; never heard of that. I'm going to pick up some "deer bombs" from southwestammunition.
That's interesting; never heard of that. I'm going to pick up some "deer bombs" from southwestammunition.
