308 winchester vs lapua brass

[timelinex]

OK, so I know there's a ton of threads talking about Lapua vs Winchester BUT they all seem to be based around how much prep is needed and price. This brass will be for an AI AX308.

Price isn't much of an issue for me since I am usually able to save all my brass and after a couple reloads the price difference is negligible. Prep isn't an issue either since I would do a full prep workup on the first time anyways(flash hole uniform,pocket uniform, neck trim/deburr and neck size the first time around) on any brass I get, no matter what.

My goal is accuracy, but not to a crazy degree. I won't be able to tell the difference between .3moa or .35moa.

With these parameters, would Winchester brass actually be better brass at a cheaper price, since it fits more powder?

 

[redbullitt]

I like Lapua for uniformity. If you just shoot both brands out of the box, no sorting etc, Lapua will be more consistent. Enough to matter? That's up to you lol.

I have shot both prepped and unprepped... Both shot well on my steel lol.

 

[johnsta]

I've had excellent results in my rifle with Winchester brass. I used to do all the prepping like you do. Now I just resize, trim, debut/chamfer and load. The load produces 1/2 MOA and below accuracy when I do my part - which is good enough for me. My smallest 3 shot load was .25 MOA. I am becoming more and more convinced that once you find that OCW, the brass prep becomes less important. The Lapua brass is awesome for uniformity, however, I haven't had great results with it in my rifle since it has a VERY tight chamber and have experienced high pressure signs. My advice would be to start with the Winchester, and if it produces sufficient accuracy, stick with it. Although, Lapua brass seems to be easier to find now-a-days. I haven't seen Winchesteer .308 brass forever.

Btw, you really don't need to prep the virgin Lapua brass (my opinion). Just load it and shoot, and than you can prep it to your liking for future loadings. Good luck!

 

[kansas]

As soon as I bought my .308 I bought a hundred rounds of Lapua and 500 rounds of once fire FGMM. I could always get near zero runout with the Lapua and always had some runout with the Fed. Never tried Win but one of my shooting buds kept getting loose primer pockets after 4 or 5 times with both Win and Rem. I've got 6 loadings on most of my Lapua and haven't had a loose primer pocket or cracked neck yet. I've heard of 20-30+ reloads on Lapua if you anneal often. It's worth the few cents per round more for the Lapua.

 

[ZombieMonkey]

I've got no issues with either one, both have been very consistent. I will say that I buy almost exclusively Lapua brass now, it's consistency is great. Just gotta be careful with it as you can't rely on it to always tell you if you're running into pressure issues. I don't see pressure signs in Lapua brass as soon as I do with Hornady or Winchester brass. I anneal every two firings and the brass keeps on going. I haven't bothered to do any real prep on factory Lapua brass except for a quick chamfering of the neck to make seating smoother.

Powder valley usually has some of the best prices on Lapua brass in case you haven't located it elsewhere.

 

[alman1531]

+1 for Lapua consistency and availability. I have not seen Winchester brass for a long time. I also have an AX308 and it loves Lapua brass.

 

[Pinecone]

Winchester brass is showing up.

I got some .30-06 Winchester brass from both Bass Pro and Cabelas.

 

[timelinex]

So then the consensus is to go for lapua brass, regardless of prep?

Are you guys really finding minimal accuracy differences between no prep and prep of lapua cases? Can a fully unprepared case still produce 1/2 moa or less out of a rifle like the ax308.

 

[Sweetyzfd]

I love the lapua brass. Don't have too much experience with Winchester

 

[ZombieMonkey]

So then the consensus is to go for lapua brass, regardless of prep?

Are you guys really finding minimal accuracy differences between no prep and prep of lapua cases? Can a fully unprepared case still produce 1/2 moa or less out of a rifle like the ax308.

Yeah, I've even done load development with brand new factory brass. But I also don't spend hours doing case prep like some of the people here either. As long as the necks look fine I've got no issues using them in factory condition with the exception of a quick chamfer of the necks to make seating easier.

 

[Twoboxer]

FWIW, my own experience with Lapua brass in my 308 is that case capacity increases by about 8% after being fire formed. It remains pretty consistent after that for any given brass length. IOW, the shoulders on new brass are "significantly" lower before fire forming.

 

[jkkfam89]

I use win. because when you lose the lapau at competitions or range, you get pissed. Win is consistant and Im ok when I lose it

 

[timelinex]

I read that with new lapua brass that the main thing that will increase accuracy is straightening out the necks with a Sinclair mandrel and die. Is this the same thing as just using my Redding NS bushing die with its expander (but just take out the bushing)

 

[71firebird400]

I read that with new lapua brass that the main thing that will increase accuracy is straightening out the necks with a Sinclair mandrel and die. Is this the same thing as just using my Redding NS bushing die with its expander (but just take out the bushing)

Err- brain dead post.

 

[timelinex]

Typically the expander in a sizing die will over expand the neck so that the bushing can size it to the proper OD. If you don't want the separate Sinclair die I'd just run them through your neck sizing die. I do like my Sinclair die but unless you plan on going through a lot of virgin Lapua brass I'd probably stick with what you've got.

Wouldn't your up stroke reopen it up, since it's oversized?

 

[dauntedfuture]

Laupa brass is great. If you do all the prep work for Winchester brass it will be good too. Lapua brass is slightly thicker in the neck then WIN brass is so if you are using bushing dies you will want a slightly larger bushing for Laupua brass then for the WIN. I think you will find that as good as you can make WIN brass, the Lapua brass starts almost that good and you can sort to make better. You can also find Lapua brass at the moment, I cant find WIN anywhere.

 

[steve123]

So then the consensus is to go for lapua brass, regardless of prep?

Are you guys really finding minimal accuracy differences between no prep and prep of lapua cases? Can a fully unprepared case still produce 1/2 moa or less out of a rifle like the ax308.

Lapua brass has drilled flash holes whereas most Co's brass is punched. That means it's unnecessary to prep flash holes.

I usually turn necks even on Lapua brass but the necks aren't that bad, it's just my preference. IMO, primer pocket reaming is a waste of time. I'd say just load and shoot.

 

[Khromo]

I find I have to turn the necks on Lapua brass to get them within 0.001", same as Winchester. The only prep step I don't find necessary on both is flash hole deburring on the Lapua, as the drilled flash holes seem to be pretty clean out of the box. As another poster noted, the neck thickness is larger on the Lapua by enough that it needs a different bushing, if you use them.

The concentricity gauge slightly prefers Lapua .308, in my limited experience. If I wasn't shooting past 300 yards, I probably wouldn't buy Lapua if Winchester was available.

I haven't seen any Winchester brass for sale in a really long time.

 

[MitchAlsup]

My goal is accuracy, but not to a crazy degree. I won't be able to tell the difference between .3moa or .35moa.

With these parameters, would Winchester brass actually be better brass at a cheaper price, since it fits more powder?

Won't even be visible.

I use (currently) Win Brass, mainly because I built up a large base of twice fired Win Brass from Black Hills once fired boxes of 308.
I then completely match preped the brass, and developed a load using Optimal Charge Weight techniques.
The developed load would typically give me one 5-shot group in the 3's (0.3xx) two 5-shot groups in the 4's, and one 5-shot group in the 6's from a box of 20.
Between shooting, the cases were Neck Only sized most of the time, with a body die used when they measured out of spec.
Factory Remmy M40 VNC with no mods other than mounting a scope.

Legend says if I Full Length sized the cases accuracy would have been better.

Oh, and by the way, I got 35 reload cycles on the brass shooting 155 Scenars with 47.8 gr Varget not loosing a single primer pocket or neck (no annealing performed).

 

[timelinex]

Alright guys, 300 pieces of lapua ordered! I won't be doing anything to them other than running them through my redding type s neck sizer with the expander put on (to insure even neck tension).

Thanks for all the advice

 

[Victor N TN]

I hand prep all my match brass. Right now I would say buy what's available. I have used several different brands. They all work similar. But if both were on the shelf at the same price, (for match purposes) I would take the Lapua.

Good luck.
Victor