Rifle Scopes 40 MOA mount too much?

[Covertnoob5]

Hey guys I have my AMG currently sitting in a 20 moa Spuhr mount. I'm getting about 18 mils of up elevation right now zeroed at 100 yards. I want to be able to stretch the legs a bit and I'm looking at getting a mount with more cant. I'm wondering though, if a 40 moa mount is too much? The AMG has 28 mils of total up elevation, but from what I've read it's not good for a scope to be too close to the bottom of the erector. Any input or first hand experience would be great. Thanks!

 

[dannySH]

How far are you planning to shoot? What caliber? With 18 mils you have more than enough for getting in to the 1000 yards territory. Adding a 40 MOA base will eliminate the possibility of zeroing at 100 yards.

 

[NovaHunter]

It doesn't hurt a scope to be at the top or bottom of the erector. It just isn't optimal.

A 6.5 usually needs 8 to 9 mils to get to 1000. A .308 needs around 10 mils +/-. Can vary a bit depending on conditions and if you are shooting at sea level or in Colorado.

Unless you are shooting out past 1500 yards, 18 mils is more than enough adjustment.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[TripleBull]

Spuhr also sells a 30 MOA mount so that may be an option.

 

[Jordan Smith]

You've still got 10 mils remaining below zero. You'll be fine with a 40 MOA mount, or even 50 MOA if you had the option.

 

[Opticsspecialist]

It doesn't hurt a scope to be at the top or bottom of the erector. It just isn't optimal.

A 6.5 usually needs 8 to 9 mils to get to 1000. A .308 needs around 10 mils +/-. Can vary a bit depending on conditions and if you are shooting at sea level or in Colorado.

Unless you are shooting out past 1500 yards, 18 mils is more than enough adjustment.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

I concur. 18 Mils should get you close to 1500.

 

[Fursniper]

40 moa will still allow you a 100 yd zero with 28 mils of usable elevation. My gen II razor has 28 mils of useable elevation as well and sits atop s 50 moa rail and I still have a 100 yd zero. At 2500 yds it still gives me a nice target picture at 23 mils. Easy peasy. Yes, it's true that at the extreme ends of the top or bottom ranges of your scopes elevation travel your target picture will possibly be distorted or just less clear but with a 40 rail you'll still be enough off the bottom of your scopes travel you'll be fine, assuming 28 mils of USEABLE elevation travel is there. Even with my 50 rail my 100 yd zero is clear enough to easily see a 1/2" dot & hits on paper.


Edit: Op, I just looked up the specs on your AMG. Vortex specifies 27.5 mils of TOTAL elevation for your scope. This does not correlate to total useable elevation in your scope. I just recently went through all this with Vortex on my Gen II razor which the website states has 33 total mils of elevation. Turns out that my useable elevation was only 28 mils, so, the claim of 33 mils is true BUT.....you'd have to have the zero stop disengaged which would also necessitate removing the turret rotation indicator which would leave the scope subject to dirt and water intrusion as well as killing the function of the zero stop. The specs direct you to the features tab which identifies this KIND OF, it's not terribly clear the way they have it worded. Probably because of "Marketing Speak". So, in reality, what Vortex has listed as total elevation adjustment is somewhat misleading unfortunately and they admitted to me as much & told me they "probably " need to revise how the specs are written so it would be more clear lol! Apparently they have not done this yet. So the same relative restriction in elevation adjustment would apply to the AMG as well but you'd have to contact Vortex to get the exact amount of USEABLE elevation from them. I went through this exercise prior to insuring I was choosing the maximum amount of rail I could use & still maintain a 100 yd zero which turned out to be perfect with a 50 moa rail. Having said all this, it would appear that with a rail with 10 moa less than my 50, a 40 rail would still allow you a 100 yd zero but you'd still have to have Vortex confirm useable adjustment prior to making that decision.

 

[_Windrider_]

40 moa will still allow you a 100 yd zero with 28 mils of usable elevation. My gen II razor has 28 mils of useable elevation as well and sits atop s 50 moa rail and I still have a 100 yd zero. At 2500 yds it still gives me a nice target picture at 23 mils. Easy peasy. Yes, it's true that at the extreme ends of the top or bottom ranges of your scopes elevation travel your target picture will possibly be distorted or just less clear but with a 40 rail you'll still be enough off the bottom of your scopes travel you'll be fine, assuming 28 mils of USEABLE elevation travel is there. Even with my 50 rail my 100 yd zero is clear enough to easily see a 1/2" dot & hits on paper.

Usually going from 20 MOA to 40MOA recovers about 6 mils of travel in my experience. Obviously results will vary.

 

[MontanaMarine]

If you still have 7 mils 'down' from your 100 yard zero, with your 20 moa base, you should be fine with a 40 moa base.

One thing I like about having plenty of 'extra' up available is that when you are shooting your furthest shots, your erector is not nearly topped out. I say that because my Leupold MK4's optical quality and eye-relief got very compromised near the top end. Having an extra rev or half rev, kept them far easier to see through.

 

[Covertnoob5]

Thanks guys! I should have specified a little more, I'm trying to take my 6.5 to 1 mile while still maintaining a 100 yard zero.
My rifle is a DTA SRS and I'm shooting in California. The scope is currently zeroed for my .308 barrel but I think maybe I should re-zero and have the base zero as the 6.5 instead?


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....

 

[_Windrider_]

Thanks guys! I should have specified a little more, I'm trying to take my 6.5 to 1 mile while still maintaining a 100 yard zero.
My rifle is a DTA SRS and I'm shooting in California. The scope is currently zeroed for my .308 barrel but I think maybe I should re-zero and have the base zero as the 6.5 instead?


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....

They still let you have cool toys like that in californiastan eh

 

[Covertnoob5]

If you still have 7 mils 'down' from your 100 yard zero, with your 20 moa base, you should be fine with a 40 moa base.

Yea so when I look at the L-tec turret it's just past 7 mils, closer to 8 mils. So it seems like I'll be ok, even though I'll be pushing the bottom of the scope. Hopefully the image quality doesn't degrade too bad.


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....

 

[Covertnoob5]

They still let you have cool toys like that in californiastan eh

Haha yea but trust me, it's one of the few toys we have left. I wish we could have cans.


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....

 

[_Windrider_]

Haha yea but trust me, it's one of the few toys we have left. I wish we could have cans.


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....

I grew up in cali. I had enough so I left. It's hilarious surefire can make cans in socal but can't sell them there.

 

[Rob01]

You should be fine with a 40 MOA base and the AMG. It has a little more internal elevation than the S&B 5-25x and people have been using 40 MOA bases on them for years and still getting 100 yard zeros.

 

[MontanaMarine]

Yea so when I look at the L-tec turret it's just past 7 mils, closer to 8 mils. So it seems like I'll be ok, even though I'll be pushing the bottom of the scope. Hopefully the image quality doesn't degrade too bad.


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....

I believe the added 20 moa equates to about 5.8 mils, so sounds like you will have about 2 mils left at the bottom. That seems like a good place to be.

 

[Covertnoob5]

Thanks guys for all the help! Really appreciate it. I'll be making the move to a 40 MOA mount. Does anyone have any suggestions for a good one? I don't think spuhr offers one in a 30mm tube. And neither does ARC.
I've only found the ADM 40 MOA mount, but I've read those can be a little tricky when mounting a scope. Any advice on mounts? Thanks


Better to have it and not need it, than to not have it and say oh shit.....

 

[MontanaMarine]

I'm using Badger Ordnance 45 moa rails on two rifles, and a Nightforce 40 moa rail on another. They seem to be good quality.

 

[Rob01]

I believe DTA makes a mount with 40 MOA.

 

[Fursniper]

http://mirageulr.com/scoperails.html Here's the contact for Mirage ULR, if you have either a STILLER or Remington action, they make superb steel and aluminum rails for either of those actions. My 50 moa rail was made by them for my 338 lapua improved, the workmanship/receiver fit was fantastic.

 

[FatBoy]

I'm using Badger Ordnance 45 moa rails on two rifles, and a Nightforce 40 moa rail on another. They seem to be good quality.

I run a 40MOA NF steel base on my 700/300 with a 5.5-22 NXS. Zero is 18 MOA off the bottom which gives me 80 usable MOA up. Zero issues with this setup on a 300wm shooting 230 OTMs and I can dial up WAY past any range I have access to.

 

[customones]

I run a 20 moa spuhr, on top of a 20 moa rail ,with a march 3-24, and have it zeroed at 100.

 

[Saracen7]

I run a 40MOA NF steel base on my 700/300 with a 5.5-22 NXS. Zero is 18 MOA off the bottom which gives me 80 usable MOA up. Zero issues with this setup on a 300wm shooting 230 OTMs and I can dial up WAY past any range I have access to.

I have a Remington Sendero in 300 Win Mag, and due to my new scope being 34mm tubed DELTA STRYKER, and already having a 20 MOA rail fitted, I dug through my box of bits, and cradled the scope in a 45 MOA Accuracy International one piece mount. Plus 65 MOA is interesting.....
I've only fired three shots to achieve about 1 inch high at 100 yards using 230 SMK bullets ; and this leaves me about 0.7 Miliradian of down adjustment left.
I was fearing having it very close to be bottomed out, coukd be a problem, but it would appear I shouldn't be too concerned. Is that right?

 

[patriot07]

I prefer to be in the middle of the lenses wherever I shoot the most. If you shoot all long range, have your setup maxed out for your 100-yard zero. If you shoot mostly close and will only occasionally push it out, then leave some margin under your 100-yard zero and use reticle holdover if necessary for the long shots if you don't have enough travel. Just a question of what trade-off you want to make.

 

[jaywhite97]

Really appreciate al the information so what’s minimum one can have

 

[dustingaunder]

If a scope has 100MOA+ internal I’d go with 40-45MOA rail.
90MOA internal I’d go with a 30-40MOA rail.
Less than 90 I’d go with a 20-30 MOA rail.
If s scope had 70MOA internal a 30MOA rail will still leave you plenty on the bottom for a 100 yard zero.

I’d take internal travel / 2 then make sure that number was 5-10MOA more than the rail I was going to use for cushion. You’ll get a few MOA back too when you come up to zero at 100.

 

[jaywhite97]

So guys quick question
With my vortex says it has a max adjustment of 20 MRAD.

I’ve got 20 moa base on it is like to use a 20 moa mount I would like to have a 200 yard zero

 

[dustingaunder]

Difference between 100 and 200 is only like 1.5MOA. 20 Mils is about 70MOA. I’d say it would be close to get a 200 yard zero. You’ll be all the way bottomed out with 40 total in the mount.

 

[jaywhite97]

Difference between 100 and 200 is only like 1.5MOA. 20 Mils is about 70MOA. I’d say it would be close to get a 200 yard zero. You’ll be all the way bottomed out with 40 total in the mount.

which most likely isn't recommended?

 

[lal357]

Digging this older thread becuase this is my question.
Remington 700 long action
300 winmag
Vortex razor gen 1
Currently has a 20 moa base
It has 23mils of usable adjustment left in the scope (39mils total scope travel but has zero stop set at 100 yards)
Took this out yesterday for some elr shooting no problem dialing for a mile but ran out of dial for 2309 yards . Im wanting to change to either a 40 or 50 moa base since this setup is mainly shot at 1000 yards and out will a 50 moa give me enough down ( im think 12 mils extra should = 35mils total up travel ) or should i play 8t safe and go with a 40 and use hold over like i did yesterday

 

[Jumper]

In the Stiener manual for the T5xi and also the M7xi they recommend using a 45moa rail.

 

[deersniper]

 

[Steel head]

View attachment 7389031

 

[Steel head]

Digging this older thread becuase this is my question.
Remington 700 long action
300 winmag
Vortex razor gen 1
Currently has a 20 moa base
It has 23mils of usable adjustment left in the scope (39mils total scope travel but has zero stop set at 100 yards)
Took this out yesterday for some elr shooting no problem dialing for a mile but ran out of dial for 2309 yards . Im wanting to change to either a 40 or 50 moa base since this setup is mainly shot at 1000 yards and out will a 50 moa give me enough down ( im think 12 mils extra should = 35mils total up travel ) or should i play 8t safe and go with a 40 and use hold over like i did yesterday

The gen 1 razor has a lot of elevation if I’m not mistaken.
I’m guessing a 40 moa base or a bit more would be perfectly fine and a 50 should work.
I use a 45 moa on my 7mm with a Cronus and I easily can zero at 100 and dial to 2400ish.
I use a Charlie tarac macro for 2400+

 

[lal357]

View attachment 7389031

To much for me this is just a play toy max I'll try is 2500 yards

 

[acudaowner]

if your happy with a 40 moa base then its all good . Id love to see and shoot 2500 yards lol one day maybe .

 

[littlepod]

Somewhat similar question - I have a Vudoo V22, shooting out to 400 yards so I'm dialing upto 24mils. I ran a few 32mil scopes that left me with about 21.5 mils of adjustment, and then 10.5 down. I was thinking of lightening things up and switching to a Razor HD AMG.

The Razor HD AMG says 27.5mils of elevation adjustment, (though their MOA version says only 71moa which is less than 27.5 mils). Assuming 27.5 mils, running on my Vudoo's 40moa base, I probably will have around 23-24mils of adjustment up, and then 3.5 down. That puts it pretty off from the optical center. I am worried about the optical clarity, and yeh 90% of my shots are shot within 1-7mils of adjustment (25-200 yards), but it is nice to have that range for the 200+ shots that generally start at 11mils out to 24mils. Though the 1/4" targets are the ones at 35-50 yards.

Any issue running that low to the bottom? How bad does the optical clarity get?

Thanks for any advice.

 

[srt-4_uk]

Optical clarity will degrade, how much depends on the scope. You may run into other things as well. I know an Optika6 5-30 maxed at either end will stop giving you a full image circle.

 

[littlepod]

Optical clarity will degrade, how much depends on the scope. You may run into other things as well. I know an Optika6 5-30 maxed at either end will stop giving you a full image circle.

Thanks, then I guess I'm curious what people are noticing on the Razor HD AMG. Or I guess stick with a 34mm tube.

 

[Rob01]

Somewhat similar question - I have a Vudoo V22, shooting out to 400 yards so I'm dialing upto 24mils. I ran a few 32mil scopes that left me with about 21.5 mils of adjustment, and then 10.5 down. I was thinking of lightening things up and switching to a Razor HD AMG.

The Razor HD AMG says 27.5mils of elevation adjustment, (though their MOA version says only 71moa which is less than 27.5 mils). Assuming 27.5 mils, running on my Vudoo's 40moa base, I probably will have around 23-24mils of adjustment up, and then 3.5 down. That puts it pretty off from the optical center. I am worried about the optical clarity, and yeh 90% of my shots are shot within 1-7mils of adjustment (25-200 yards), but it is nice to have that range for the 200+ shots that generally start at 11mils out to 24mils. Though the 1/4" targets are the ones at 35-50 yards.

Any issue running that low to the bottom? How bad does the optical clarity get?

Thanks for any advice.

Answered an almost identical question on Facebook but I have an AMG on a 40 MOA base and there are no issues using it on a 40 MOA base. Optical clarity is fine. No issues with a 50 yard zero on the Vudoo. If you wanted to lighten up then you will be fine with an AMG.

 

[JacksBack]

I know the bolts rule the roost but, I want to stretch the gasser out using the Steiner v5xi 5-25/56 need a Picatinny riser w/ 30moa as low as possible dose anybody make this? I have searched the web any help would be appreciated.