- Thread starter bodhisafa
- Start date
Unless you buy Norma dasher brass, I hate to tell ya, but, you're going to have to fireform. Hydroform will get you close but fireforming is how you get the brass to fit the chamber
Carry on if you're a seasoned BRer, but if you're new... here is my advice:
Do you have a BR crowd you shoot with? Or have you asked the smith who built the gun? (assuming you didn't put it together yourself).
If you're just getting into the BR crowd, best advice I can give you is to meet and make friends with some folks shooting all variations of the lil BR calibers. They'll have the insight and little pointers you are looking to learn.
As Geno said, you definitely want it fire formed to your specific rifle? And you might want to know the specs of the reamer used to cut your chamber.
My process:
105/107 loaded to 0.030" jam
Virgin unsized Lapua 6BR brass
30.0gr Varget
CCI-450
*pew*
Has worked well for me...YMMV
105/107 loaded to 0.030" jam
Virgin unsized Lapua 6BR brass
30.0gr Varget
CCI-450
*pew*
Has worked well for me...YMMV
If I was to do it all over again, I would use DJ's brass service. He offers hydroforming at a reasonable price. You still have to shoot to finish the process but it's easier and you can shoot a match with it. 31gr Varget, .010 in the lands 105 VLD was the recipe my smith gave me. Otherwise Renomd here did a decent tutorial on the fire forming with a false shoulder process.
Did my first 20 the other day with BoilerUP's method, (I used 29 gr varget) and then loaded those cases to check speed/consistency. no issues, So I have a almost a couple hundred to do.
phxfa are you saying that you have or know someone who has used the hydro form and the brass was close enough that the 2nd load was go to go?
Idahoorion
phxfa are you saying that you have or know someone who has used the hydro form and the brass was close enough that the 2nd load was go to go?
Idahoorion
In process of fireforming 300 cases, 225 already fired with 75 left to go. False shoulder method, prepped on Dillon 550. Expander mandrel in station 1 with .257 expander, Sizing die in station 2 set to size part of the neck, resulting in slight crush on the neck when closing the bolt. First 100 I did with a very firm bolt close effort, got blow lengths of around 1.538 and lost 3 cases to split shoulders. The rest I backed it out a bit so that it was more like a soft crush on bolt close, got blow lengths around 1.541 and only lost 1 case to split shoulder.
Loaded 29g of XBR8208, velocity of around 2750 fps from a 26" barrel, 105 amax jammed into the lands, federal 205 primer. Forms cases nicely, shot accurately 1/2 MOA with SD' of 10 from thrown powder charges. Have just been using them for barricade practice. After first firing and resizing they are a good match to the chamber and are ready for full duty.
I've heard jam and shoot works fine too, no brass prep at all just use factory neck tension and 30g of Varget with a softer primer like the 205.
Loaded 29g of XBR8208, velocity of around 2750 fps from a 26" barrel, 105 amax jammed into the lands, federal 205 primer. Forms cases nicely, shot accurately 1/2 MOA with SD' of 10 from thrown powder charges. Have just been using them for barricade practice. After first firing and resizing they are a good match to the chamber and are ready for full duty.
I've heard jam and shoot works fine too, no brass prep at all just use factory neck tension and 30g of Varget with a softer primer like the 205.
Bodhisafa, norma dasher brass will last, my experience with it was I couldn't load it like the lapua guys. It was a 100 fps behind and I still had sticky bolt on occasions, those 20 I just did in lapua, after fireforming I ran above the threshold for sticky brass and some ejector marks with Norma, this was with a reamer sold for the Norma brass. the lapua ran with no pressure signs and great extraction at 3010 fps, I have room to go higher and likely will to find the top. (26" barrel). now switching to Lapua I will have to be aware of the carbon ring on the longer neck of my chamber.
Idahoorion
pfxfa thanks I'll give them a ring
Idahoorion
pfxfa thanks I'll give them a ring
I'm running a TL-3 here but it will work on other actions, a buddy just set one up on his Defiance and it fed/ejected great.
Mines a Rem, just had to cut the ejector spring a little as the brass mouth was getting dented on ejection. Using primal rights mag kit. If I run it very slow it will leave the brass in action. med or faster ejection it comes out nice. I am lusting after a TL 3.
idahoorion
idahoorion
I've used the hydro-formed and fire-formed methods on Lapua brass and prefer to fire-form. My fire-forming load is close to what Boiler posted with .030 jam. The hydro method was messy, time consuming and offered no advantages as you still have to fire them in your chamber to get final case dimensions to begin load work up. Fire-formed loads were accurate but at a lower velocity than final loads so I used them for practice doing dot drills and positional shooting.
While the false shoulder method works, I can't justify the time spent expanding and resizing the necks. If the brass it produced were better, than the "jam" method, I might consider it but for now, the moderate load/jam works for me.
While the false shoulder method works, I can't justify the time spent expanding and resizing the necks. If the brass it produced were better, than the "jam" method, I might consider it but for now, the moderate load/jam works for me.
Supposedly,,,when you use the false shoulder method versus the jam method, there is less case stretch at the base of the cartridge. Less case separation issues in the future. A few reputable wildcatters told me this.
Once your dies are set on a Dillon, it's so easy to prep the brass for the false shoulder method. I actually like doin this shit as much as shooting,,,kinda
Once your dies are set on a Dillon, it's so easy to prep the brass for the false shoulder method. I actually like doin this shit as much as shooting,,,kinda
Supposedly,,,when you use the false shoulder method versus the jam method, there is less case stretch at the base of the cartridge. Less case separation issues in the future. A few reputable wildcatters told me this.
Once your dies are set on a Dillon, it's so easy to prep the brass for the false shoulder method. I actually like doin this shit as much as shooting,,,kinda
Yep. False shoulder brass prep on the Dillon took me maybe 30 minutes for 300 cases once the dies were set. Goes very fast, as quick as you can pull the lever and feed cases.
I should have been more specific when talking about effort/time with the false shoulder method, I was speaking with regards to a single stage press. Not every one uses a Dillon (progressive), but I can see the time savings when used.
You'll definitely see pressure with jamming or false shoulder, 30gr instead of 32.5-33.0 alleviates that, I pull the bolt every 3/5rds clean and lube the lugs lightly
No galling here, I just pulled the barrel and the receiver lugs look fine after 300 pieces formed
No galling here, I just pulled the barrel and the receiver lugs look fine after 300 pieces formed
180 lapua hydro formed brass in the mail today. I sent them Friday to DJ custom brass, 8 days later they are waiting for me at my mail box. pretty speedy service. had 3 split shoulders. and he charged .60 per piece. plus the freight. will be shooting this week!
Idahoorion
Idahoorion
Amen - I am loading up DJs and getting 1 hole groups at 100.
It may have gotten lost on scout, luckily the original tutorial is still on accurateshooter http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/6-dasher-fire-forming-false-shoulder-step-by-step.3918893/
I've done this method for another 300 rounds on my PVA dasher and the blow lengths have remained super consistent. I will still jam 10-15 thousandths into the lands though for added security.
Enjoy!
If you treat it right, darn near forever. Lots of guys talk about 20-30 firings and I've even heard of some shooters still working on the same brass after 50 reloads and a decade later.
Big things would be proper sizing (careful to avoid too much shoulder bump or excess headspace), not blowing the primer pockets loose with super hot loads, and annealing to prevent split necks.
Big things would be proper sizing (careful to avoid too much shoulder bump or excess headspace), not blowing the primer pockets loose with super hot loads, and annealing to prevent split necks.
I hydroformed 300 with DJbrass, loaded em up and shot ... was getting single holes at 100. I measured the datum of the shoulder on after i shot them to before, and the hydroformed ones were 2 thou shorter (i.e. as if they were bumped). I just washed my first 160 so will shoot a few side by side next weekend ...
I sized it back .0015” from 1.241 to 1.2395
On the second firing (I had the forster neck reamed out in between the first and second sizing for no expanding step however the mandrel still seems to up it half a thou- full disclosure)
It only grew .001 more than the first firings result.
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Has anybody used the cream of wheat method to fire form 6br cases into dasher cases?
There’s a video on YT with no narrations or info whatsoever, of a chap doing exactly this with 6.5mm wads.
Wanted to ask if anybody has a recipe for this? I’m not keen on making false shoulders or hydroforming?
There’s a video on YT with no narrations or info whatsoever, of a chap doing exactly this with 6.5mm wads.
Wanted to ask if anybody has a recipe for this? I’m not keen on making false shoulders or hydroforming?
I have not used the cow method, but my gunsmith has. He doesn't even use a wad, just keeps the muzzle elevated. The easy way is to get some cheap bullets and jam the hell out of them. As long as closing the bolt finishes seating the bullet I have had no problems. If I wanted to fireform during a match I would false shoulder.
