Hunting & Fishing 800yd Whitetail Cartridge?

[1slow01z71]

Ive had my stand set up where the longest shot I could take was 150yds so my suppressed 300blk AR has done the job well, but Im moving one of my stands to an area where I might need to take an 800yd shot. Judging by the way the game has been moving in that area most shots will be sub 500yds but Id hate for the big boy to walk out at 800 and me not be able to do anything about it. Ive got a few cartridges on hand that I could use, just not sure which one to start doing load development on as Ive only got enough time to build up one.

7mm STW
300WSM
300WM
7mm-08
308
7mm Mag
338RUM

In a perfect world Id like to use the 308 as its the 5r with the nice HS stock and would be more suitable to long range load development but I realize its probably lacking in the horsepower department to make an ethical 800yd shot. Im leaning towards the 300WSM as Ive made a 550yd shot with it before and its got nice ballistics. All the other calibers besides the 308 are just regular deer hunting style rifles in the R700 platform. Itll be topped with a vortex 6-24 pst. If I could find some 178 amaxs the 300WSM would be an easy choice. Unfortunately the decision to move the stand was just made this past weekend so I haven't stocked up on longer range bullets. All Ive got on hand is 175SMKs, 220SMKs, and 208 Amaxs. I should be able to scrounge up some other bullets from some friends though if it comes down to it.

This load will only be used on whitetail or axis, well the occasional hog too but no real big game. When my 5r 300WM comes in(2-3 months) Ill be developing a 208 amax load for it but until then Im stuck with the choices above. I know some may say 800yds is too far for an ethical kill, but Ill will be putting in the work at the range to make sure I can put the bullet on target when the time comes. Ive also got a kestrel on the way so all my ducks should be in a row by the time Im shooting more than just paper.

 

[former naval person]

Too far. Unless the "big boy" is lying down, unpredictable movements by the animal can negate your skill set. I've seen it happen too many times to be comfortable with taking that long a shot. Your decision may be different from mine. JMHO

 

[MLC]

Set up some steel at 800 yards and shoot it with what you've got and decide what you can realistically do.
I've seen deer lost on 150 shots, that's orders of magnitude less searching area than an 800 yard shot.
Think of ethical long range hunting as a 3 legged stool, you have proficiency, gear and lethality.
If one of those legs is drastically short then you're going to fall on your ass.

 

[1slow01z71]

I'd prefer to keep the discussion to the topic at hand. In my 25 years of hunting I've never lost a deer. Thus far the hardest shots I've had to make were a kneeling position 365yd shot on a cow elk in full run and a pronghorn antelope from a 550yd prone position with my binoculars and a glove as my rest. Both with my 300wsm topped with a leupold vxl 14x, both bullets found their home with a DRT result. Im sure a little luck was involved as I'll never claim to be an expert shooter but my skills have served me well thus-far. Ive made 800yd shots witj the 300wsm on water puddles for shits and grins (and a little bet money) when bored at the deer camp so I know I can do it. Just looking to get more exact to reduce the margin of error. A properly developed load for the right cartridge, topped with a good scope along with good ballistics data I see no reason that the shot wouldnt be makeable with great consistency in decent conditions.

If people regularly print 6" groups at 1000, I see no reason I shouldnt be able to do 8"(my opinion on max boiler room size) groups at 800 with some good handloads and the supporting equipment.

 

[Wyfox]

The 300wsm is a good choice, I killed an elk at 724yds with my Kimber Montana using a 185gr Berger and it dumped him just fine. So I'm pretty sure you'll be good @ 800 on a small Texas whitetail.

 

[seanh]

The issue with the 308 isn't about the energy. Think about how much energy a 45acp round has at the muzzle...very easy to kill a deer point blank range. The only issue I'd have is can YOU place the bullet in the proper location given all the unknowns that occur in hunting.

 

[sierracharlie338]

800yd Whitetail Cartridge?

The 300wsm is a good choice, I killed an elk at 724yds with my Kimber Montana using a 185gr Berger and it dumped him just fine. So I'm pretty sure you'll be good @ 800 on a SMALL TEXAS WHITETAIL.

That being the key part. ^^^^ I can speak from experience being a fellow Texan and in my opinion 800 is a high expectation on a TX deer without destroying everything. That being said if you are a horn hunter do what you gotta do.

On to the question at hand. The 300s get my vote. Either the Win Mag or WSM.


Sierracharlie out....

 

[Niles Coyote]

At long range you want as much advantage on your side as you can get, with that said I rate your selection as
1-338RUM
2-300WM
3-7mm STW
4-7mm Mag
5-300WSM
6-7mm-08
7-308

IMO, 800 yards would be a little too far for 7mm-08 and definitely for 308. 500 is about as far as I would trust the 308, maybe 600 in absolutely perfect conditions in an area I have done a lots of shooting and know it characteristics intimately... 7mm-08 depending on the bullet being used I may add 100 more to it. My personal max range limit is whatever distance the bullet and load drop below 1800 fps as that is generally the slowest velocity for many bullets to show signs of expansion. For me and my 308 load that is right around 550 and my 260 about 100 yards more.

 

[slm9s]

Any one of these:
1-338RUM
2-300WM
3-7mm STW
4-7mm Mag
5-300WSM
Whichever is most accurate. Practice a lot. Practice in weather conditions you'll encounter, especially wind.

 

[Hairball]

The answer to your problem is not a larger caliber but correct shot placement. If you are confident that you can place a .308 in a vital area at 800 yards then a .308 is fine. I shoot 167 gr in my .308's and that gives me a little over 800 ft. lbs. at 800 yards. While distances beyond 800 may greatly affect the .308, up to 800 you are GTG. Many have argued that "you need 1000 ft. lbs. for deer" but that's B.S. and those that argue this assumption seem to never support the position farther than what they have always been told. Put it another way, a Glock model 20 10mm with full power loads has about 700 ft. lbs. of energy at 5 yards and I know that shooting a deer from five yards with a 10mm would have no problem putting it down then why would a larger bullet with more energy be any less effective. Again, shot placement is key, if you do your part the .308 will work just fine.

 

[long range newbie]

a 338rum has a little too much power for what your doing a 300 wsm will do you good with 200+gr bullets and will drop a dear in a heartbeat

 

[1slow01z71]

The 300wsm is a good choice, I killed an elk at 724yds with my Kimber Montana using a 185gr Berger and it dumped him just fine. So I'm pretty sure you'll be good @ 800 on a small Texas whitetail.

While I haven't personally done it my dad killed a mule deer at about the same range with his 300WSM with regular ole federal fusions. So Ive got pretty good confidence in the cartridge being able to get the job done.

The issue with the 308 isn't about the energy. Think about how much energy a 45acp round has at the muzzle...very easy to kill a deer point blank range. The only issue I'd have is can YOU place the bullet in the proper location given all the unknowns that occur in hunting.

I guess using the word horsepower was wrong in describing the 308. With it not being able to sling the real heavy pills at a very fast rate its going to be a lot more susceptible to wind and get there slower allowing the deer to move more once the bullet has left the pipe.

That being the key part. ^^^^ I can speak from experience being a fellow Texan and in my opinion 800 is a high expectation on a TX deer without destroying everything. That being said if you are a horn hunter do what you gotta do.

On to the question at hand. The 300s get my vote. Either the Win Mag or WSM.


Sierracharlie out....

What do you mean destroying everything? Biggest blowout I had was shooting a smallish cull buck mule deer in the panhandle with my 300WSM. He was walking in and out of the fence line and was always lined up with a doe in front or behind him. He finally got clear and was fixing to walk back in the brush so I had to take the shot. Bullet entered between the front legs mid chest height and exit out his hindquarter. Blew about a softball size chunk out of the ham area. So I lost out on a little meat and made hamburger out of the quarter instead of getting more normal hams and steaks. I eat everything I shoot except varmints obviously. I was underwhelmed with the taste of the mule deer so I doubt Ill shoot another one though, especially since my current lease has axis.

At long range you want as much advantage on your side as you can get, with that said I rate your selection as
1-338RUM
2-300WM
3-7mm STW
4-7mm Mag
5-300WSM
6-7mm-08
7-308

IMO, 800 yards would be a little too far for 7mm-08 and definitely for 308. 500 is about as far as I would trust the 308, maybe 600 in absolutely perfect conditions in an area I have done a lots of shooting and know it characteristics intimately... 7mm-08 depending on the bullet being used I may add 100 more to it. My personal max range limit is whatever distance the bullet and load drop below 1800 fps as that is generally the slowest velocity for many bullets to show signs of expansion. For me and my 308 load that is right around 550 and my 260 about 100 yards more.

I most likely will be shooting amaxs as they seem to cut the wind well and have good terminal effects once on target as well as being relatively cheap to do load development. I probably wont use the 338RUM simply because its a kicking mule and Im not going to put a break on it as I don't want to go deaf if I have to take a shot with it elk hunting next to a rock embankment.

Any one of these:
1-338RUM
2-300WM
3-7mm STW
4-7mm Mag
5-300WSM
Whichever is most accurate. Practice a lot. Practice in weather conditions you'll encounter, especially wind.

Once I decide on caliber and get a load worked up at the local 1000yd range Ill be taking my rig out to the lease and practicing shooting down the veins of the canyon where Ill have the potential long shots.

The answer to your problem is not a larger caliber but correct shot placement. If you are confident that you can place a .308 in a vital area at 800 yards then a .308 is fine. I shoot 167 gr in my .308's and that gives me a little over 800 ft. lbs. at 800 yards. While distances beyond 800 may greatly affect the .308, up to 800 you are GTG. Many have argued that "you need 1000 ft. lbs. for deer" but that's B.S. and those that argue this assumption seem to never support the position farther than what they have always been told. Put it another way, a Glock model 20 10mm with full power loads has about 700 ft. lbs. of energy at 5 yards and I know that shooting a deer from five yards with a 10mm would have no problem putting it down then why would a larger bullet with more energy be any less effective. Again, shot placement is key, if you do your part the .308 will work just fine.

I don't have any experience with the 308 at long distance but from what Ive read on here it seems to be affected by wind quite a bit which is why I was thinking it wouldn't be a good choice. I just really like the gun since it has a nice stock and a heavy quality barrel. So with it being a relatively slow cartridge with its propensity for wind drift I figured it wouldn't be a contender for my intended use.

I agree on the energy thing. An arrow doesn't carry much energy, as does the 220gr SMK trucking along at less than 1000fps out of my 300BLK but it gets the job done just fine. As you said shot placement is key. Running the numbers a 178amax at 3000fps at 800yds is still going to be packing 1100ftlbs and 1700fps. That's plenty to get the job done I believe and at only 5.5 mils with a 100yd zero. Once I get my 300WM it looks like itll be the ticket with the 208s having a 200fps and 500ftlb advantage not to mention it bucks the wind a heck of a lot better. The 300WM Ive got right now is my grandpas so Id rather not beat on it too much.

a 338rum has a little too much power for what your doing a 300 wsm will do you good with 200+gr bullets and will drop a dear in a heartbeat

Really looks like the 300WSM "go-to" load is the 178amax, with the 24" barrel on my WSM I don't think Ill be able to push a 208 hard enough.

 

[sierracharlie338]

All I'm saying is there is potential to have a lot of meat damage.






Sierracharlie out....

 

[1slow01z71]

"Regularly" shooting 6" groups at 1,000 is different than a first round hit at 1,000, and very few people can "regularly" shoot 6" 1,000 yard groups.

The next biggest difference is that this is not a stationary target. The time for perception, reaction, and flight time is around 1.5 seconds at best, and toss in some wind shift. The animal could easily move and things go from good to bad before there is a blink of an eye.

As a bit of practical reality, the initial question leads me to believe that working on load development and practice this year would be a good start towards being ready a year from now and even that would take some steady dedicated practice.

Tight groups are only the beginning of being ready, then the goal is first round, cold bore hits.

Finally, if it is a "big" deer, it ought to be much closer to be able to accurately age it and make a correct call on go/no go. When trying to manage for trophy deer, the biggest challenge is in letting the biggest ones walk until they are fully mature.

When in doubt, err in favor of the animal and the ranch and let it walk.

I agree, if I don't get to the point that I can make cold bore hits like I feel I should then I wont. Ive had to track way too many winged deer from idiots who cant shoot. We've got a few big guys we've seen on the game cameras which is why Im moving one of the stands to cover more ground and have a short shot stand setup for guests. Ive got a leupold gold ring 40x spotting scope thatll suck him on in close enough to tell if its the one Ive been following. I plan on spending a lot of time out at Best of the West getting better at long distance shots. Ill also already know what distance theyre at, at various spots so dialing elevation shouldn't be a problem, reading the wind and waiting for them to stop will be the biggest hurdles to cross. If its a windy day I simply wont take the shot without a doubt. 800yds is also the absolute max distance he could cross and still be in my area so most likely(hopefully) itll be a closer shot.

My dad got this one last year off the lease which Id consider a mature buck


Ive caught this guy on one of my cameras consistently, just never at my feeder when Im there. Im pretty sure I saw him on the next ridge over but I only had my 300BLK and Im not comfortable making a 600yd shot with it as well as only having my 8x binoculars so I couldn't ID him well enough. He looks pretty mature to me.

Also found this rub in my area which I believe to be from the buck in the above picture since he is the dominant buck in this area

This is the last one I took about 5 years ago off the adjoining lease 32" in velvet, also happen to be holding my 300WSM in this pic

 

[1slow01z71]

All I'm saying is there is potential to have a lot of meat damage.






Sierracharlie out....

Absolutely, that's why Im trying to start off with the best cartridge to build on as well as put in the practice to minimize the chance of ruining meat and worse having a deer run off.

 

[sierracharlie338]

Then I would agree with someone else at starting with the 178 or maybe 190 VLD. Lets us know if you get some good results.


Sierracharlie out....

 

[Niles Coyote]

I agree with Hairball, it all comes down to shot placement... Personally I have a hard time making a guaranteed first round hit at 800 with my 308 when shooting at a 12” steel target at my home range.

But I also want more than a caliber sized entry and exit as well.

I’ve been hunting corn feed whitetail (200 pounds plus)here in Michigan with a handgun with bore sizes from .357 to .451 and muzzleloader using round lead 50 cal ball or .429-451 sabot for the last 19 years. While it is true that the energy of a handgun type projectile adequately kills deer, the way the projectile works and wound characteristics is different from a high velocity rifle as well. The same can be said of the old black-powder cartridges. Handgun, muzzleloader/black-powder cartridges typically have very large and flat nose surfaces and depending on the type of bullet being used, may be designed to expand at very low velocities.

One trend I have noticed on the deer I have taken, if you use an expanding bullet or a semi-wadcutter, the deer tend to go down quicker than a round nose or pointed design (handgun/muzzleloader velocity comparison here) when the shot was in the heart/lung area. Upon dressing them out the damage inflected on the vitals is different as well. This damage is increased further if the bullet was supersonic while in the game, often leading to a DRT result. Flat surfaces cut, tear or rip and RN or pointed projectiles puncture often leaving a smaller than caliber size hole. Most modern rifle bullets don’t have that large flat meplat advantage so we depend on velocity and/or hard media (bone) to assist the opening of the bullet at extended distances, energy plays a part but is less important in the results I’ve seen on game.

Case in point I shot a mulie at right around 300y with my 308 a few years back using the well respected Lapua Scenar but it has a hard jacket. The impact velocity was around 2350 energy around 1900 and the bullet transitioned the chest cavity near the heart. It slipped right through both sides without hitting any bone and destroyed both lungs leaving the heart intact. That deer was up for a good 20 seconds still moving dead on its feet. Had the deer ran it could have gone a long way in that time. It was only upon processing the animal that I found the exit and which BTW had zero meat damage, the bullet didn’t expand as best as I could tell.

I would not put myself in a situation at 800 yards where I can pretty much guarantee the bullet isn’t going to expand at all while moving along at 1500-1650 unless I happen to hit bone. My hunting handgun velocities, depending on caliber, are 1000-1800 but at 800 yards with a modern BTHP I don’t have the large caliber flat nose or low velocity/hollow cavity expanding design to help out. At that distance if you don’t hit bone I could see the tracking taking a while, and may lead to the possibility of not recovering the critter depending on the type of terrain/cover that is in your area. If I had access to one of the mags you listed I’d kick my own A**.

I think one of your 7mm or 300 mags would be much better suited for this task if you don’t wish to absorb 338 punishment.

 

[jeffbird]

SlowZ,
One suggestion is start shooting the Smack The Smiley competition. It's "only" 100 yards, but requires and teaches a high level of fundamental skills.

One of Bill Davison's favorite sayings is master the 100 yard target, then add the distance and wind.

 

[1slow01z71]

I agree with Hairball, it all comes down to shot placement... Personally I have a hard time making a guaranteed first round hit at 800 with my 308 when shooting at a 12” steel target at my home range.

But I also want more than a caliber sized entry and exit as well.

I’ve been hunting corn feed whitetail (200 pounds plus)here in Michigan with a handgun with bore sizes from .357 to .451 and muzzleloader using round lead 50 cal ball or .429-451 sabot for the last 19 years. While it is true that the energy of a handgun type projectile adequately kills deer, the way the projectile works and wound characteristics is different from a high velocity rifle as well. The same can be said of the old black-powder cartridges. Handgun, muzzleloader/black-powder cartridges typically have very large and flat nose surfaces and depending on the type of bullet being used, may be designed to expand at very low velocities.

One trend I have noticed on the deer I have taken, if you use an expanding bullet or a semi-wadcutter, the deer tend to go down quicker than a round nose or pointed design (handgun/muzzleloader velocity comparison here) when the shot was in the heart/lung area. Upon dressing them out the damage inflected on the vitals is different as well. This damage is increased further if the bullet was supersonic while in the game, often leading to a DRT result. Flat surfaces cut, tear or rip and RN or pointed projectiles puncture often leaving a smaller than caliber size hole. Most modern rifle bullets don’t have that large flat meplat advantage so we depend on velocity and/or hard media (bone) to assist the opening of the bullet at extended distances, energy plays a part but is less important in the results I’ve seen on game.

Case in point I shot a mulie at right around 300y with my 308 a few years back using the well respected Lapua Scenar but it has a hard jacket. The impact velocity was around 2350 energy around 1900 and the bullet transitioned the chest cavity near the heart. It slipped right through both sides without hitting any bone and destroyed both lungs leaving the heart intact. That deer was up for a good 20 seconds still moving dead on its feet. Had the deer ran it could have gone a long way in that time. It was only upon processing the animal that I found the exit and which BTW had zero meat damage, the bullet didn’t expand as best as I could tell.

I would not put myself in a situation at 800 yards where I can pretty much guarantee the bullet isn’t going to expand at all while moving along at 1500-1650 unless I happen to hit bone. My hunting handgun velocities, depending on caliber, are 1000-1800 but at 800 yards with a modern BTHP I don’t have the large caliber flat nose or low velocity/hollow cavity expanding design to help out. At that distance if you don’t hit bone I could see the tracking taking a while, and may lead to the possibility of not recovering the critter depending on the type of terrain/cover that is in your area. If I had access to one of the mags you listed I’d kick my own A**.

I think one of your 7mm or 300 mags would be much better suited for this task if you don’t wish to absorb 338 punishment.

All good info for sure. Ive done a lot of reading on longrangehunting and they really seem to like the Amax as well as a couple threads on here. Even though its technically a match bullet, with its relatively thin jacket it seems to perform well at lower velocities as well as having a great BC lends itself well to long range bullet. I hunt with a 500SW occasionally and youre right its amazing the difference between a rifle bullet and a pistol bullet.

SlowZ,
One suggestion is start shooting the Smack The Smiley competition. It's "only" 100 yards, but requires and teaches a high level of fundamental skills.

One of Bill Davison's favorite sayings is master the 100 yard target, then add the distance and wind.

Ive never heard of that competition before but it looks like fun. Ill have to try that out. I see youre from my neck of the woods, where do you shoot at? Im actually in Kyle so I usually shoot at Lonestar but they've only got a 100yd range unfortunately so that leaves BotW for longer range stuff.

Im a pretty good shot as far as a hunter is concerned but Iveonly recently gotten into reloading and doing more of the tactical type shooting. Which the type of shot Im talking about making is definitely more akin to a tactical skill type shot. Thus doing a bit more research and getting better equipment. I started amassing reloading equipment last fall then the great firearm apocalypse happened and now Im just getting ready to reload my first round within the next month. Bit of a steep learning curve for someone trying to go at it by their self.

This was from my last outing, the one and only target I shot with my 223 AR(was there to zero the 300blk) which only has a 1-4pst and with PMC bronze 55r ammo. I don't think its too bad for a less than ideal setup for shooting tight groups.

I believe my trigger control and basic form is pretty good. I need to work on my breathing, and most of all wind reading. The rest I believe Im fine with calculating. Ive got a long ways to go and you very well may be correct in that this type of shot may be best left for next year. Never hurts to get a bit more direction and in some cases a reality check by more experienced shooters.

 

[jeffbird]

SZ,


Here's a link to the smack the smiley match: Smack the Smiley --- Home of the Tactical Shooter's Local Rifle Match

Drop me a PM and let's go shoot some

 

[105amatt]

Unless you are looking for an excuse to get a new rifle, stick with your 300 short mag.

 

[dk17hmr]

I'm a 300wsm fan boy. 208gr A-max in the 2850-2900fps would work very well on deer at extended ranges. I shoot the 208 at 2875 in my 300wsm and on a good day its .75-1 moa at 1 mile. I flattened my cow elk last season at 517 yards with my WSM and have no doubt it would be very effective on deer at twice that distance, the trouble would be a first round kill zone hit.

Off topic...do you work for Terracon? I use to here in Wyoming but found a better position doing the same thing for the state government.

 

[1slow01z71]

SZ,


Here's a link to the smack the smiley match: Smack the Smiley --- Home of the Tactical Shooter's Local Rifle Match

Drop me a PM and let's go shoot some

Will do, sounds like a plan. Ill have to get some of those targets to practice on once I get my scope back from Vortex.

Unless you are looking for an excuse to get a new rifle, stick with your 300 short mag.

Id love to build a new rifle but my second son will be here in September so Im trying to be a bit frugal til all the associated costs of a newborn are over with. Next year Ill build me a rifle but itll probably be a 6.5c but Ive got a couple ARs I need to finish and glass to buy for my 5r 308 and 5r 300WM.

I'm a 300wsm fan boy. 208gr A-max in the 2850-2900fps would work very well on deer at extended ranges. I shoot the 208 at 2875 in my 300wsm and on a good day its .75-1 moa at 1 mile. I flattened my cow elk last season at 517 yards with my WSM and have no doubt it would be very effective on deer at twice that distance, the trouble would be a first round kill zone hit.

Off topic...do you work for Terracon? I use to here in Wyoming but found a better position doing the same thing for the state government.

That's good to hear, Ive read the 300WSM is a pretty tough cartridge when loaded right. Its been my favorite factory load cartridge for a while now and has put a lot of meat in my freezer.

Yes I work for Terracon, been there for almost 8 years now. Its a pretty good gig now that I don't have to do the shit jobs and paid a little better. Id go crazy caged up behind a desk all day. Plus I get free snazzy camo hats haha.

 

[relentless]

My vote is for the 300 WM.
relentless

 

[Drifter™]

I believe my trigger control and basic form is pretty good. I need to work on my breathing, and most of all wind reading. The rest I believe Im fine with calculating.

Don't forget range estimation. Incorrect distance = miss. Obtain and learn to use the right tools (laser rangefinder, mil-based reticle, etc). The basic budget laser rangefinders ain't gonna work at 800.

 

[shooter1054]

I will say that I have some ethical issues with such long range shots on deer. That being said, if you can make the shot, I won't condemn you for it. For me, the distance cut off is 500. And that has to be a perfect scenario. Where I hunt the longest shot I can take is 250 with an average shot of <50 yards. With your criteria, I would go with the 300 in either wsm or wm configurations. I shoot a 300wsm for target practice(not a legal caliber in IN). I can hold sub moa out to 600 with a 150 gn Hornady SST at 3250 fps. I am working it out to 1k and right now I'm running about 1.5 moa at 1k. It's a Browning A-bolt.

 

[Ark. Trapper]

I'd pick the 7STW first, if it will shoot 162-175gr bullets good. I've got a buddy that has killed 10+ deer at between 525 and 820 yards with his STW shooting 140gr Accubonds. I'd shoot a heavier bullet if it was mine but it's hard to argue with his results.

 

[turbo54]

308 has plenty of energy.

708 has more, and way less wind.

Besides the obvious marksmanship difficulties, consider your bullet choice, as some don't do their job well at slower speeds.

As a point of reference, I hit a whitetail doe a few years ago at 675 yards with a 308 and 180smk @ ~2550fps MV.

Really, it was a lucky shot because it ripped the heart in half. Other tissue damage was marginal at best, and probably would not have been successful had it not hit the heart. The bullet just penciled through.

Obviously, the 180smk is NOT a game bullet with terminal ballistics considered in its design. However, I've shot other deer at much closer range with it, and it looked like a bomb went off inside the chest cavity.

Bottom line: 308 will do it with a good shot. Any of the others would make it easier and more forgiving.

 

[rhildy77]

I would have to stick with the 300 win mag. The past two years i have killed one each year thats all we are allowed in AZ. The first one was at 730 yards DRT and the other was at 650 yards DRT. Bullet of choice was a 190 VLD and it did the job. Neither one walked but two steps and fell over dead.

 

[kraigWY]

You must have some huge deer in Texas.

I don't see any reason why the 308 wouldn't work on White Tail at 800 yards. Something in the lines of a 165 gr 308 bullet starting out at 2700 fps is going to give you about 775 ft lbs of energy at 800 yards, more then enough for White tail unless you have some elk size deer.

You can shoot it cheaper, meaning you can learn what it will do at any range you decide to shoot.

 

[Barrel Nut]

Lots of good info here.....but not sure why everyone is rating the 300WM above the STW. ...that is just wrong.....STW rules for a long range hunter round

 

[bohem]

Hunter skill training is the most important thing here. Anything you listed in the original post will kill deer ethically at that distance, even the 308, but it would be on the bottom of the list.

When I read the title my first thought was "30-06 with heavy bullets" and I don't see it anywhere on the list but the 300WSM is ballistically the same thing, there isn't much difference between the two of them.

Any of the 7's discussed will maintain ample energy for vitally placed shots to kill at that distance, even my 6.5CM does, but it doesn't matter if you're hunting with a 338LM or 375CT, the hunter must be able to place the shot and that is more important than the caliber employed.

 

[40xs]

The biggest concern imho is not the kinetic energy of a given bullet, but the calculation of the distance #1 and time of flight #2. a missed read on distance of just 30-40 yds. at around 800 is several inches in elevation. And the time of flight at 800 for most bullets is right at a full second. An animal can do a lot of things in one second from the time you squeeze the trigger.

 

[CHEYTAC]

My vote is for a 300 WM

 

[huntermanpaul]

I hunt with a modified Remington 700 PSS in.308 and I have taken a few deer and antelope at ranges beyond 500 yds with it and I killed an elk with it an 950 last fall, Pics are on here somewhere. Having said that I know I am capable of making shots at those kinds of ranges with that rifle and I know the gun can do it as well. I am a bigger fan of having a gun you shoot well over having 4000 fps velocity and not shooting it well. At the same time I have to say some of my longer range kills have really made me question whether I should be taking those shots. My elk I killed last year was hit between two ribs through the lungs and still didnt have the energy to pass through the other side. I know you can kill things without passing through but if my energy drops that far I have to ask myself if I should be taking that risk. The risk is even greater when hunting whitetails out of a tree stand because follow up shots will be difficult if not impossible in timber....

 

[Tackleberry]

7 mm's does a great job. 300's do a great job. 338's are even better. Wind plays a huge part at long range. I like all the extra entergy I can find. 300wm with some 210 vld works really well and ammo is pretty easy to find even in today's world. If you are really pissed at them and wanto the extra knock down a 338lm knocks whitetails off their feet at most any distance, if prefer a 300 smk.

 

[hornet shooter]

The .308 win pushing 178amax will get the job done for sure. But you really need to know what you are doing at those ranges. I set my limit to 700yd last year and took multiple white tail at that range with DRT results. This year I will be pushing out to 800 but that will be my cap. Now pigs are a different story if I can see them they are going to get a pill launched at them. That is how I got the best practice actually you can shoot steel all day and think you know what you are doing. It is different story when you have a constantly moving target, increased pulse and less than ideal shooting position.

 

[XL Mammal]

BLUF: 7 STW=good, .300 WSM/WinMag=better, .338=better yet.

I'm with Tackleberry. I hunt whitetail every year out to 1040 yds in TX. A well-placed .308 will probably get the job done, but at 800 yds you're likely looking at around 1300 fps and 700 ft-lbs. It'll get the job done assuming the bullet expands at that speed. Otherwise, you'd better put your tracking boots on. We lost one last year when it made it off the property about 100 yds away. The shot was just a little back, good blood trail...just not enough energy imparted to drop it at that range. Hell, I've seen a doe shot through the heart still make it about 150 yds when I didn't have the sense to go for a high shoulder shoulder shot with a 168g SMK. She had a .308-size exit wound. I use a 7 WSM for long ranges, but one of the .30 Magnums is a better choice. Of course, this year it'll be a .338 if DTA can get me my A1 before November.