I have an Accuracy International AT with 4 barrels that I shoot most of the time and really love the rifle.. I just sold my pre-2014 AX338 which I rarely shot, so since I reload I have plenty of 338 Lapua components available..I was thinking about a Desert Tech srs a1 338 with a 6.5 Creedmoor conversion. If I was going to buy new, this would cost $3000 less than an AI AXMC. And I really like the Desert Tech rifle but not enough to sell my AT. Does anyone out there have both platforms..your thoughts..Thanks, Ray
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I had an AT and still have a DTA, I owned them Both at the same time and really enjoyed them both. What it came down to for me and why I no longer have the AT is this. I liked the AT a lot, it shot great and felt great. I absolutely love the DTA platform, I hunt with it, it's handy in the cab of a pickup, fits great in an Eberley stock pack, and super versatile as far as chamberings go. So between "like it" and "love it" I chose love it. I am however in the market for a short action AX though just to say I tried it.
Funny, I'm kinda the opposite --I have a DTA HTI and am referring to .50's but very similar just larger. I think the AI offering is a finer rifle in most areas and is more "worthy" of the markup IMO despite being a much larger markup. It's the price differential really. The DTA is something that I could build myself with a proper shop if I had one, I'm not skilled enough to copy the AI rifle. It's a very simple weapon, less parts than a Glock I'd bet. That's not a bad thing though. Still, the HTI is a fine rifle and DTA did a fine job with it. For size, weight and convenience it's impossible to beat. Oh, one other thing that rubs me wrong is the high price for HTI mags considering what you get for your money. AI mags are better comparatively and cost less, particularly for the .338; DTA mags work but are very costly for what they are. VERY expensive for a single stack mag. For price, it offers more than the lesser ones, but not as much as the better ones and at a higher price differential.
DTA uses the Elite Iron can which is a FINE can. I have one for the .50 and a custom brake timed to my rifle (unfortunately the damn DTA HTI QD brakes are worthless as mounts and Elite won't put their name on anything they don't stand behind). I liked it so much I bought the .338 can and brake before 41f and I still don't have the .338 yet. With the .338, the brake will work with the can and the cans are made by Elite Iron (99.9% positive).
As for the .338 and myself, well, I've looked around and it's either coming down to a Surgeon in an AI chassis or the AI modular rifle itself. Cadex may be that third one I was considering, can't be sure. TRG M10 is nice but too costly I believe, for me anyway. Same with Remington's and a couple others.
If you do go with the DTA, I'd consider buying their barrel extensions and having the barrels cut elsewhere for less. DTA uses fine barrels which I think are overpriced but they do make it easy for you to contract out your own barrel with the extensions --not sure if I'll have to buy AI's offering or if I can have one custom cut.
Good luck, at least with .338's anything over $4k will net a DAMN fine rifle regardless.
DTA uses the Elite Iron can which is a FINE can. I have one for the .50 and a custom brake timed to my rifle (unfortunately the damn DTA HTI QD brakes are worthless as mounts and Elite won't put their name on anything they don't stand behind). I liked it so much I bought the .338 can and brake before 41f and I still don't have the .338 yet. With the .338, the brake will work with the can and the cans are made by Elite Iron (99.9% positive).
As for the .338 and myself, well, I've looked around and it's either coming down to a Surgeon in an AI chassis or the AI modular rifle itself. Cadex may be that third one I was considering, can't be sure. TRG M10 is nice but too costly I believe, for me anyway. Same with Remington's and a couple others.
If you do go with the DTA, I'd consider buying their barrel extensions and having the barrels cut elsewhere for less. DTA uses fine barrels which I think are overpriced but they do make it easy for you to contract out your own barrel with the extensions --not sure if I'll have to buy AI's offering or if I can have one custom cut.
Good luck, at least with .338's anything over $4k will net a DAMN fine rifle regardless.
I have both a DT (6.5CM and 338LM) and an AT (6.5x47, 6xc and 308) The reason I have both is because I love 338 LM from the DT but prefer to shoot a traditional bolt rifle (AT) in PRS style events. The mag changes are just easier in the AT where as the DT mag well can be finicky while in a rush.
If push came to shove and I could only have one, I would keep my DT. I have had a custom defiance, DT and the AT and whether in 6.5 or 338LM, the DT just flat out shoots the best. The nodes just seem to be wider in load development and it's quick change system is flawless. I mainly shoot 338LM out of my DT and I am extremely pleased with its functionality and footprint for that application. If you can afford to have both then you're all set. The triggers are very different, but I have never had that be an issue. All of my barrels for all of my rifles come from Short Action Customs and they have been perfect.
If push came to shove and I could only have one, I would keep my DT. I have had a custom defiance, DT and the AT and whether in 6.5 or 338LM, the DT just flat out shoots the best. The nodes just seem to be wider in load development and it's quick change system is flawless. I mainly shoot 338LM out of my DT and I am extremely pleased with its functionality and footprint for that application. If you can afford to have both then you're all set. The triggers are very different, but I have never had that be an issue. All of my barrels for all of my rifles come from Short Action Customs and they have been perfect.
I have AIAT (308, 6.5x47L, 6 Creedmoor) and DTA (308, 6.5x47L, 6 Creedmoor, 338lm, and 300 norma). I feel like my AIAT is the more accurate rifle, but I like how the DTA switches calibers and short action to long. The DTA balances better but the AI has better magazines.
Both are great rifles in their own ways.
Both are great rifles in their own ways.
I've never owned an AI and my time behind a number of their offerings is less than 200 rounds total, but I am on my second DTA. I think the DTA is a great rifle, but I can also appreciate what it does well as well as the shortcomings it has.
Before you buy a DT, I would highly suggest you spend some time behind one and really manipulate the bolt, swap a mag, etc. In my experience, people either love the position of the bolt or they hate it. There is really no in-between and if you don't immediately say, "Yeah, this isn't bad! I can get used to this!" to yourself, chances are you never will.
What I love about my DTA: It's incredibly accurate. Zero shifts between barrels are repeatable. Just yesterday, I swapped from my 6.5 Creedmoor to my 308 barrel. I dialed my adjusted DOPE and had bullets on steel. Barrel swaps are pretty quick. If I'm not changing the bolt face, barrel swaps can take right around a minute. If you need to swap the bolt face, add another minute or so. Your choice of calibers is almost limitless, though there are some that won't feed or eject correctly. The SRS or Covert can go from 223 to 338 with just a barrel and bolt face swap. If you want 50, any of the CheyTac rounds, etc, you'll have to go with the HTI, just like you'd have to go with the AX50 for the AI counterpart. The trigger is very good, borderline great considering it's a bullpup, and adjustable for trigger shoe position, creep, and pull weight. It's incredibly compact and very well balanced for most of the caliber/barrel length choices. Like others have said, if you're hunting with it, it's so compactyou can throw it in a backpack, especially if you go with the Covert and a shorter barrel, and hike to your shooting position.
What I don't care for: Since StrykerVet mentioned it, I'll start with the magazines. HTI mags are expensive. Hell, even the short or long action mags are expensive, especially for what you get. 6-round SA or LA mags are $90, 8-round LA and 10-round SA mags are $140, and the 5-round HTI mags are $255 (about $100 more than the AX50 mags), and no one but DT makes them, so it's not like you can find a less expensive alternative from Alpha or someone else like you can AI mags. Fit and finish on the DT is good, but not great. I may be off base here, but I would attribute this to AI having a 30 year head start on DT. I would hope that DT will continue to improve as the years go by, and they've shown they'll update their rifles, but for now the AI just exudes quality, while the DT is still a bit rough around the edges. Barrels for the DT can be expensive. Some of the top smiths are charging $1300+ for a DT barrel. I go with a guy on the Hide that is very popular with DT shooters who does top notch work and I'm still paying around $1k for a barrel. Want the 223 conversion kit from SAC? That's $1700 for the barrel, 223 bolt face, and magazine. While you can shoot most cartridges in a DT, you can't shoot every cartridges. I'd love to be able to shoot a 6 Dasher in my DT, but it won't eject correctly 30% to 40%. I know there are a few other rounds that just won't work with the DT.
Overall, I'm happy with my DT. I admit I lust after the AXMC, but even if I sold my DT, barrels, bolt faces, mags, etc, and received top dollar, I'd still need to come up with another $2k to $3k to buy an AX with all the additional barrels and accessories. To me, the price differential is large enough to keep me shooting my DT.
Before you buy a DT, I would highly suggest you spend some time behind one and really manipulate the bolt, swap a mag, etc. In my experience, people either love the position of the bolt or they hate it. There is really no in-between and if you don't immediately say, "Yeah, this isn't bad! I can get used to this!" to yourself, chances are you never will.
What I love about my DTA: It's incredibly accurate. Zero shifts between barrels are repeatable. Just yesterday, I swapped from my 6.5 Creedmoor to my 308 barrel. I dialed my adjusted DOPE and had bullets on steel. Barrel swaps are pretty quick. If I'm not changing the bolt face, barrel swaps can take right around a minute. If you need to swap the bolt face, add another minute or so. Your choice of calibers is almost limitless, though there are some that won't feed or eject correctly. The SRS or Covert can go from 223 to 338 with just a barrel and bolt face swap. If you want 50, any of the CheyTac rounds, etc, you'll have to go with the HTI, just like you'd have to go with the AX50 for the AI counterpart. The trigger is very good, borderline great considering it's a bullpup, and adjustable for trigger shoe position, creep, and pull weight. It's incredibly compact and very well balanced for most of the caliber/barrel length choices. Like others have said, if you're hunting with it, it's so compactyou can throw it in a backpack, especially if you go with the Covert and a shorter barrel, and hike to your shooting position.
What I don't care for: Since StrykerVet mentioned it, I'll start with the magazines. HTI mags are expensive. Hell, even the short or long action mags are expensive, especially for what you get. 6-round SA or LA mags are $90, 8-round LA and 10-round SA mags are $140, and the 5-round HTI mags are $255 (about $100 more than the AX50 mags), and no one but DT makes them, so it's not like you can find a less expensive alternative from Alpha or someone else like you can AI mags. Fit and finish on the DT is good, but not great. I may be off base here, but I would attribute this to AI having a 30 year head start on DT. I would hope that DT will continue to improve as the years go by, and they've shown they'll update their rifles, but for now the AI just exudes quality, while the DT is still a bit rough around the edges. Barrels for the DT can be expensive. Some of the top smiths are charging $1300+ for a DT barrel. I go with a guy on the Hide that is very popular with DT shooters who does top notch work and I'm still paying around $1k for a barrel. Want the 223 conversion kit from SAC? That's $1700 for the barrel, 223 bolt face, and magazine. While you can shoot most cartridges in a DT, you can't shoot every cartridges. I'd love to be able to shoot a 6 Dasher in my DT, but it won't eject correctly 30% to 40%. I know there are a few other rounds that just won't work with the DT.
Overall, I'm happy with my DT. I admit I lust after the AXMC, but even if I sold my DT, barrels, bolt faces, mags, etc, and received top dollar, I'd still need to come up with another $2k to $3k to buy an AX with all the additional barrels and accessories. To me, the price differential is large enough to keep me shooting my DT.
I sold my DTA, saving for an AI...
I've had a DTA for a while now and finally aquired an AT though I've wanted one since they came out. I don't have enough time on it yet but I'm loving it so far. As far as the DTA goes, I can't see ever selling it due to the fact that it's a far better in my opinion for hunting. Though it doesn't way much less than the AT, it feels much lighter and I can make some reasonable shots off hand that I can't imagine doing with the AI.
I have a Barrett MRAD in 338 and fucking love it. You can get caliber conversions for it as well!
I have an AIAE MK 3 and a Desert Tech. If I had to choose one system I would go with the Desert Tech. The Desert Tech did take some getting used to but the ability so run so many different calibers is what appeals to me so much. I wanted a long range caliber but didn't want to drop 4k on a rifle plus another 2k on optics for a gun that would only get shot a couple times a years because of the lack of places to shoot past 700 yards in my area. I still want an AXMC but dropping 10k for the rifle and a second conversion is hard for me to do even though I think I would like it better than the DTA.
I have had both. I still have the AI. The DT magazines were subpar, and the company lost my trust by not being able to deliver products I paid for when promised (not even close, never actually recieved the product). The DT shot well for me, and I didn't mind the bullpup bolt manipulation at all. The trigger was quite good. The caliber conversions are way overpriced IMHO. For my use, the additional cartridge possibilities of the DT were of less value than what some others have expressed. The LA and magnum offerings hold little appeal, as I would never hunt with a rifle that heavy, and they are not needed for competition. If I wanted the additional flexibility, I would stick with the AXMC. Overall, I find the AI to be a more reliable and refined package. YMMV.
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Sold my DT, picking up an AIAX. My complaints with the DT were the mags and mag well mostly. The trigger was nice and the caliber changes were repeatable and fast. I wasn't a fan of the ergo's on the bolt throw either so it's gone. Only time will tell if I like the AIAX better but I have a feeling it's what I have been missing all along.
I've had both platforms and still have a relatively new AX308. I liked the DT platform well enough but never fell in love with it. It has it's advantages, but for me, those didn't overcome some of its shortcomings. I would not sell an AI to switch to a DT.
I owned DTA. I'm saving for an AXMC. Too much bullshit with bolts going click instead of bang. Many returns to the factory. Bolt bushings falling out mid match.
The DTA was an accurate rifle, but I thank god I never made the infamous steel safari failed rifle video.
My teammate named the DTA 'Dont Take Anywhere'.
The DTA was an accurate rifle, but I thank god I never made the infamous steel safari failed rifle video.
My teammate named the DTA 'Dont Take Anywhere'.
Just curious which generation DT you owned?
Mine was a Gen 1 DTA. Lot of money for something that was so unrelieable, I got to be a beta tester.... I'm sure the Gen 2's are more relieable, but for something when I bought it that was almost as expensive as an AI at the time, I made the wrong choice.
It's your money so voting with your feet is the best option. Having said that, everything has issues. Just look at the AI extraction issues thread going at the moment. Furthermore, it's been said a hundred times but worth it again that the early gen DT's lacked a polish that they now have. May be worth another look? Nothing else comes close.
And for Aussie shooters, there's maybe 1 - 3 AI dealers that are overly expensive. DT's now can be pretty much bought from any dealer. Region specific, but a big plus for me.
In fairness, probably worth another look. In reality, customer service was so spotty, and it let me down in so many matches (my team mate for team matches named it Dont Take Anywhere) I just can't think of going back to the cheating whore.
Coupled with the 10 rd mag problems, and the fact that a tikka has kicked it's ass for me in matches for several years, I'll wait for the AI.
If you have customers that are early adopters of your gen 1 system, if you took care of them instead of nickel and diming them at $400 a pop for gen 2 upgrades, they might have a loyal base.
If you buy a Gen 1 MDR you need your head examined.
You definitely make good points. Customer service is important.
I swear the DT guys were quite active on this forum a few years ago. They helped a lot of members out, but they've either gone quiet out of shame for the MDR or moved on I guess.
I'm going to bump this zombie thread because A) I got the notification this morning that someone liked my comment in this thread, and B) in the 3 years since I made this post, I bought an AX, so I'm better qualified to comment on AI vs DT
The AI is, to me, the pinnacle of purpose built sniper rifles. The trigger is a thing of beauty. The fit and finish are much better than the DT. Honestly, there are a lot of things the AI does better, but I must acknowledge that AI also has a 25× year head start.
I still love my DT, and you're talking to someone who owned the 16th Gen 1 SRS that came off the line, so I've owned them for quite a while. They do a lot of things very well. The AI, in my opinion, just does them a little better. The bolt runs ten times smoother on the AI. The trigger on the AI is better. The DT trigger is very good, especially for a bullpup. The AI is just better. Accuracy and precision will be equal. I've printed some extremely tiny groups with both rifles. Swapping calibers is much quicker on the DT, which i absolutely love! I swap barrels in under a minute. The AI takes a bit longer to unthread the old barrel and twist on the new one. You're also paying a bit more for the AI. You can probably buy a DT chassis with two barrels, maybe three, an extra bolt, and extra goodies for the price of admission of the AXMC. Is the price difference worth it? I don't know. If the AI is a 10, my experience with my DTs has been a 9.5, but I have to add I've never needed to use DT's customer service, which I've heard is hit or miss
The AI is, to me, the pinnacle of purpose built sniper rifles. The trigger is a thing of beauty. The fit and finish are much better than the DT. Honestly, there are a lot of things the AI does better, but I must acknowledge that AI also has a 25× year head start.
I still love my DT, and you're talking to someone who owned the 16th Gen 1 SRS that came off the line, so I've owned them for quite a while. They do a lot of things very well. The AI, in my opinion, just does them a little better. The bolt runs ten times smoother on the AI. The trigger on the AI is better. The DT trigger is very good, especially for a bullpup. The AI is just better. Accuracy and precision will be equal. I've printed some extremely tiny groups with both rifles. Swapping calibers is much quicker on the DT, which i absolutely love! I swap barrels in under a minute. The AI takes a bit longer to unthread the old barrel and twist on the new one. You're also paying a bit more for the AI. You can probably buy a DT chassis with two barrels, maybe three, an extra bolt, and extra goodies for the price of admission of the AXMC. Is the price difference worth it? I don't know. If the AI is a 10, my experience with my DTs has been a 9.5, but I have to add I've never needed to use DT's customer service, which I've heard is hit or miss
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For guys that have now had experiences with barrel changed with both. Does the DTA return to zero between barrel swaps consistently? My AX with a FAT wrench was extremely good with this. i would often go from .308 >6.5cm>.260 while the scores were being tallied from a previous relay and when I would revert back to .308 it was always dead on. i would just write down the adjustment in my scope when going from one caliber to another. the way the DTA uses the barrel extension, it seems like this would only make it more consistent, but I have not have any experience with the DTA.
My return to zero has always been spot on with my DT. I do ensure my barrel swaps are consistent, meaning I seat the barrel, give the barrel a clockwise twist to seat it the same way every time, and torque the bolts in the same pattern (4, 2, 3, 1)
I had both at different times, sold both - neither were the price over a decent custom for the type and amount of shooting I do.
The DT was interesting because it was a bullpup, but trigger was not great, and overall it feels very "utilitarian" - some mags dont drop free and require a washer, both throw is a bit rough, and FWIW, there seems to be a lot of turnover at that company - I had to contact CS 3 times for various things and everytime there was a new manager. It never felt "refined", but it was easy to cartridge swap if that is your thing, and it was undoubtedly very accurate.
The AI was the exact opposite; it was incredibly refined. Id describe it like a ferrari, but with the reliablity of a toyota corolla. Im not a huge fan of pistol grip rifles, so that was a personal con. Other than that, there were zero complaints (other than price). Unless you needed/wanted a very short overal length, the DT just didnt stack up to the AI IMHO.
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