Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

[crush310]

Hi all, I have been behind bolt guns for the past 25 years. Rem 700 with AICS in recent times. About a year ago I purchased a AI MKII, 20" with muzzle brake in 308. I have a Nightforce 5.5X22X56 with a AI one piece scope mount. All bolts/screws etc. are torque properly. 500 rounds have been sent through the gun. Cleaning procedure is always the same. AND I'm the first to belame ME...but I have taken me out of the picture. When firing the "Cold Bore" with a clean or dirty bore, the first shot is 2 1/2 to 3 minutes low at 100 yards. Then when followed up with four rounds, all four round are right on which you could place a nickle over. I've had other people fire this gun with the same results. I've also tried another scope and had the same results. Any ideas....I'm ready to go back to my Rem. Cant have a cold bore that far off when you do what I do...Fustrated. Thanks to all

 

[jpspeeddemon]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Do you have the action screws torqued to 89 in-lbs/10 Newton meters?

They changed the torque specs a couple years ago from like 55 to 89 in-lbs.

If that isn't the problem, take out another rifle and shoot about 10-20 rounds. Then change over to your AE and shoot a group, see what happens.

Finally, call AI North America.

 

[ddavis]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

I had a rifle with a cold bore shot similar to yours. It was a Savage, so I screwed a different barrel on it, with the same result, which tells me it is not the barrel. I believe it has something to do with the action to stock fit. The rifle was accurate, but I sold it. Life is too short to be dealing with crap like that. Assuming it's a factory rifle, I'd ask the manufacturer.

 

[Jackalope33B]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jpspeeddemon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do you have the action screws torqued to 89 in-lbs/10 Newton meters?

They changed the torque specs a couple years ago from like 55 to 89 in-lbs.

If that isn't the problem, take out another rifle and shoot about 10-20 rounds. Then change over to your AE and shoot a group, see what happens.

Finally, call AI North America. </div></div>


-
Are you 100% sure about the torque specs? Stacy from AINA said the torque has been changed to I believe around 54inlbs. For the action screws.. as soon as I find the post I post the link for it.

 

[juniors]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Here's a post stating the 10nm as well (89 in-lbs):

http://snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2958096

Hope it helps.

 

[jpspeeddemon]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1998973

89 inch-lbs near the bottom of the thread

 

[Cactus Kid]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Are you taking the action out of the stock?

The recoil lug might not be aginst the recoil surface on the first shot.

 

[Texar2]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

My friends A.I. does the same thing. I will ask him if he has a remedy.

 

[Jackalope33B]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Im guessing the AI MKII is not the same chassis as the AICS or AX chassis?
Here is the thread I was talking about. http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2542829

It says "AICS systems across the board", but if the AI MKII is not the same, then Im wrong

 

[TallShot]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Mine would do something similiar, though not as dramatic; but with a clean bore. After several rounds thru it, it was gtg afterward...

 

[nolo263]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Stop cleaning it. Do not clean it anymore till the rifle starts to shoot crappy.Seriously

 

[ddavis]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

My rifle would do it no matter how clean or dirty. If it had 15 minutes or so to sit between shots, the next shot would be off. It was repeatable, but a pain in the ass. I'm willing to bet his is the same way. It has nothing to do with cleaning, but something to do with the bedding/stock fit.
-Dan

 

[Tactical30]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

First barrel i bought for a bolt gun was a Bartlein and i have absolutly NO POI shift on my cold bore shot even after cleaning. None of my other barrels have ever done this.

I only have bought Barlein after this. Im glad that barrel was put on my Warner Tool Built .300WM. Other barrels i bought after have some shift, i must have won the lottery on the first one!

 

[LoneWolfUSMC]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Call AI North America. Explain the problem. They will probably want you to send the rifle back with a sample of the ammunition you are using.

I had a similar issue with the cold bore on my AE MkII AFTER the first time I took it out of the chassis. I contacted AINA when Stacey was still there and he said it would probably need to come back so they could look it over. The problem went away before I could get around to sending it back. The moral of the story is if a rifle is shooting well, I need to learn not to screw with it.

 

[X-fan]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Barrel or bedding....And I suspect the bedding.
That is a pretty significant POI shift!

Contrary to popular belief the Remington 700 is not ground round. Rather (from what I understand) it is hand belted to finial finish..In the process it gets whatever shape it gets and every Remington is slightly different.

Is there any reason the Rem 700 can not be skim bedded to the AICS in the same fashion we skim bed scope bases?

I suppose it is also possible that the mag system is binding or creating undue pressure somewhere?

 

[regatoni5]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LoneWolfUSMC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Call AI North America. Explain the problem. They will probably want you to send the rifle back with a sample of the ammunition you are using.

I had a similar issue with the cold bore on my AE MkII AFTER the first time I took it out of the chassis. I contacted AINA when Stacey was still there and he said it would probably need to come back so they could look it over. The problem went away before I could get around to sending it back. The moral of the story is if a rifle is shooting well, I need to learn not to screw with it. </div></div>

oh man do i know this problem well haha. words to live by gents

 

[Break Bad]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: X-fan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barrel or bedding....And I suspect the bedding.
That is a pretty significant POI shift!

......

I suppose it is also possible that the mag system is binding or creating undue pressure somewhere?</div></div>

I am thinking of getting an AE, but stuff like this makes me want to invest in AW.

 

[Lowlight]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Here is an example of a "problem" AE Covert, and I shot this Friday... the complaint was the gun would not group, fliers, cold bore, the whole ball of wax... so on Friday I picked the rifle up, drove a couple miles to the range and stone cold, first time ever touching the rifle I shot this with the "problem" AE...

Have I seen rifles walk, or have deviations, absolutely, any make can have issues, but they are not always the gun, and in my experience it can be fixed with either a re-torquing of the actions screws or a retightening of the barrel, beauty of the Accuracy International system, tear it down put it together see if fixes it. Any one can have a bad barrel, so if that doesn't fix change the barrel.

But I have also seen guns like above, reported to have issues, and voila ... in the hands of different shooter, well the results speak for themselves. The supplied group was easily 1.5 MOA, mine --- what 3/8ths.

I will say this, the primary culprit of this rifles issue, the factory ammo used, just did not work. Yet the same bullet from a different manufacturer repeated groups just like this... some times the velocity / node is just not right.

 

[X-fan]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BreakBad</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I am thinking of getting an AE, but stuff like this makes me want to invest in AW. </div></div>

Well...The beauty of the AICS is its a dead stick simple bar of aluminum that the guns hangs off of....Simple gets fked up too....And you can't really blame the design of the AICS.
Garbage in = Garbage out

The "cold bore" shot being 3moa out would be enough for me to get my gas can and set the POS on fire....Might as well be 3 feet!
I have seen this 25 years ago in a hunting rifle. A Remington KS Custom in 30-06. In the end my gunsmith traced it back to a bent chamber...Ya...you read that right. The rifle would stack CCB into less than 3/4" at 100 and all the rest would go into a little inch group 3.5-4 inches away...If you made the mistake of getting the barrel warm it shot all over hells half acre....Which was most confidence inspiring....
That gun nearly melted my fking head.


The thing is these days I am so confident in my shooting (and shooting systems) I would immediately know I had a mechanical issue.
Unfortunately back then I did not posses the self diagnostics, notes (don't overlook this look this little word), or shooter fundamentals to be sure of what I was seeing.

To the OP,
If you are not sure about your shooting have someone you trust wring out the gun for you. If nothing else it will stop keeping you awake at night and should confirm a mechanical issue.

BTW Rebarreled to 280 (twice now) and I still have it.

 

[crush310]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Hi all and thanks for responding. Sorry it took a while for me to get back. I was at sniper craft all week competing in FL. I did speak with AI during the week. They have seen this problem and say its a burr on the indexing pin on the barrel. Im told to send the gun back to AI and it will be fixedfixed. Again thanks to all that responded.

 

[crush310]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

Sorry it took a while for me to get back. I was at sniper craft all week competing in FL. I did speak with AI during the week. They have seen this problem and say its a burr on the indexing pin on the barrel. Im told to send the gun back to AI and it will be fixedfixed. Thanks to all that responded.

 

[ivankonev]

Re: Accuracy International "Cold Bore Shot"

I almost always chronograph my sessions at the range. It's been my experience that my cold shot is always far slower than the median, and more than that, it is usually the slowest of the 20 rounds I fire. The following shots get much faster very quickly. My rifles are all floated and bedded, so in my experience, I fall into the clean bore/fouled bore believers to account for cold shot differences.