Thinking of this over 338LM.
Pics, range reports, ballistics reports, component lists all welcome.
Pics, range reports, ballistics reports, component lists all welcome.
- Thread starter garandman
- Start date
There is honestly not a lot of guys shooting the 338 Norma Mag. If more people knew about it, it would be just as popular as the Lapua Mag. It's a nice compact little round.
I can tell you that I payed $1.70 each for brass, which is much cheaper then Lapua brass. Brass quality is about the same between the two (Norma/Lapua). I sorted my brass and checked them all out and I didn't throw a single one of the Norma brass, it's very nice stuff.
The Norma Mag likes the heavies from all the reports that i've read. I'm currently sitting on the 300 berger Hybrid OTM's and 285grn Hornady HPBT, to try when I get that far. Some others would be the 300grn Lapua Scenar, or the 300grn Accubonds.
Just use you're googlefu and search the internet and i'm sure you'll find some info on the little horse of a round.
xdeano
I can tell you that I payed $1.70 each for brass, which is much cheaper then Lapua brass. Brass quality is about the same between the two (Norma/Lapua). I sorted my brass and checked them all out and I didn't throw a single one of the Norma brass, it's very nice stuff.
The Norma Mag likes the heavies from all the reports that i've read. I'm currently sitting on the 300 berger Hybrid OTM's and 285grn Hornady HPBT, to try when I get that far. Some others would be the 300grn Lapua Scenar, or the 300grn Accubonds.
Just use you're googlefu and search the internet and i'm sure you'll find some info on the little horse of a round.
xdeano
I'm down with the 338 Norma. I was going with the new build in a 338 Lapooey but my smith Roberto Gradous talked me into the 338 Norma so here we go! The problem with the lapua is when you shoot the 300's as I will do in my Norma the magazines offered don't have enough length thus your bullet is seated too far in. Something like that.
Yep, it takes up a lot of case space, where you can fill it with powder instead. They've done a CIP mag to counter this problem, it just allows a guy to have longer mags to accomidate seating the bullet out longer.
xdeano
xdeano
take a look at this data for the 338 lapua mag and compare it to the info that i sent you.
18 loads available in .338 Lapua Magnum with bullet weight equal 300
or this one, again in LM.
http://www.beyond556.com/bboard/showthread.php?5132-338-Lapua-Magnum-Reloading-Data
xdeano
18 loads available in .338 Lapua Magnum with bullet weight equal 300
or this one, again in LM.
http://www.beyond556.com/bboard/showthread.php?5132-338-Lapua-Magnum-Reloading-Data
xdeano
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Looks like NM is about 10% faster (fps) than LM. Does that translate into a flatter shooter?
Reloader's Nest Forum - 338 NORMA
"I own one. This is a non- belted case. Wikipedia publishes the specs. Forster makes great dies for this cartridge- RCBS #48 shellholder purchased from Midway USA. Pacific Tool and Gauge makes great reamers for chambering. Load data is out there and most people have been getting the best results from H- 1000 & RE- 22. Personally my best velocity and accuracy has been from H- 1000 88 Grains, FED 215M primers w/ 300 Grain Berger OTM's seated .005 off lands and grooves- 2750 FPS. The fact is it uses less powder than the Lapua and usually exceeding Lapua in most all catagories. There is a lot of room to play with seating depths without having to do extensive work to a magazine well, whereas with the Lapua extensive Mag well work is a must. Make sure you use a good muzzle break. The teams are using this cartridge now." -palen1067
read the last post on this page, it pretty much sums it up.
xdeano
"I own one. This is a non- belted case. Wikipedia publishes the specs. Forster makes great dies for this cartridge- RCBS #48 shellholder purchased from Midway USA. Pacific Tool and Gauge makes great reamers for chambering. Load data is out there and most people have been getting the best results from H- 1000 & RE- 22. Personally my best velocity and accuracy has been from H- 1000 88 Grains, FED 215M primers w/ 300 Grain Berger OTM's seated .005 off lands and grooves- 2750 FPS. The fact is it uses less powder than the Lapua and usually exceeding Lapua in most all catagories. There is a lot of room to play with seating depths without having to do extensive work to a magazine well, whereas with the Lapua extensive Mag well work is a must. Make sure you use a good muzzle break. The teams are using this cartridge now." -palen1067
read the last post on this page, it pretty much sums it up.
xdeano
Well, just emailed Bugholes re: 338NM. We'll see....
The thing that is throwing me is the shorter 338 Norma Mag case, which SHOULD mean you get less speed, more drop over distance, less terminal velocity, etc... ???
IMHO 338 Norma is a superior cartridge, but the Lapua was in it's prime when the Norma came up & got little interest. The Norma was designed to basically shoot the 300's. You can seat the bullets out farther, and still be able to use the mag. 300 Berger Hybrids going 2,750 is what it's all about. The only draw back is there is not a lot of reload data for the cartridge.
What will be really interesting is when somebody ackley improves it.
What will be really interesting is when somebody ackley improves it.
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Have you looked into 300 Norma? Looks like this has the ballistic performance of the 338 LM with a 30 cal. I've heard it's called the poor man's Lapua.
There is a great article that you read about here that summarizes 300 Norma against 338 LM and 300 WM: www.accuracy1stdg.com/content/docs/Binder7.pdf
There is a great article that you read about here that summarizes 300 Norma against 338 LM and 300 WM: www.accuracy1stdg.com/content/docs/Binder7.pdf
IIRC the NM has less case taper than the LM so the shorter case still has only a slight difference in case capacity. I have shot a friends .338NM built by RW Snyder and it made me consider selling a kidney to fund a build.
I've thought about 300WM, but really want a BIG boolit. That may make me a shallow person, but I can live with that. 
300NM linky no workie.
300NM linky no workie.
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I agree the 300 NM would be a hell of a cartridge also, pushing the 230's. It would be a hair cheaper to shoot too. The difference in cost is only about $15/100 projectiles. Everything else is a moot point, still going to use the same brass, primers and a similar charge. One thing that you have to put into perspective is barrel life on the 300, when you're pushing similar powder charges as the 338 down a 30cal tube you'll have a bit more erosion. It would still be fun.
I agree, if someone would AI this cartridge or at least do an Improved 30 shoulder on it, it would be even better.
xdeano
I agree, if someone would AI this cartridge or at least do an Improved 30 shoulder on it, it would be even better.
xdeano
go here;
Accuracy 1st: Sniper Training & Products
then go to "Press Room" up on the top right.
Then go down to 7 to "Sniper Magazine - Issue II - .300 Norma
March 29, 2012: .300 Norma "
xdeano
Accuracy 1st: Sniper Training & Products
then go to "Press Room" up on the top right.
Then go down to 7 to "Sniper Magazine - Issue II - .300 Norma
March 29, 2012: .300 Norma "
xdeano
My 338 Norma Mag arrived today. Happy times. Stiller action, Krieger 26.5"bbl, Manners T5A MCS-DBM, AI mag. Like the OP, I'd be very happy to hear some load details, especially with H1000 or Retumbo. Brass price here's a killer though, $3.56 per case for Norma and currently on back-order.
$3.56 per case? Ouch. I wonder if we can ship you brass internationally. What are your laws?
There's a bit of feedback on the web concerning H1000 or Retumbo in the norma. Only issue, most of it's conflicting. I would think H1000's burn rate would be about right.
Thanks for the thought garandman. It's not too much of a problem at this end, it just requires a permit from the state police to show to customs. I think the bigger problem is getting it out of the US. It needs an export licence.
Thanks anyway.
Love my 338 NM.
Specs: Badger M2008 receiver, Benchmark 27" barrel, XLR Extreme Evolution HD chassis, LRA bipod, Dagley Brake, Spuhr mount holding a Razor HD.
She pushes the 285 hornady's with 92 grains of Retumbo at 2890 fps.
The only thing that sucks about this cartridge is when you tell people you have a Norma...doesn't sound as cool as Lapua which is a very important issues
Specs: Badger M2008 receiver, Benchmark 27" barrel, XLR Extreme Evolution HD chassis, LRA bipod, Dagley Brake, Spuhr mount holding a Razor HD.
She pushes the 285 hornady's with 92 grains of Retumbo at 2890 fps.
The only thing that sucks about this cartridge is when you tell people you have a Norma...doesn't sound as cool as Lapua which is a very important issues
XLR -
Greg at Southern Precision will be contacting you to get my XLR chassis for my 338NM.
Love my XLR on my 6.5 C.
Greg at Southern Precision will be contacting you to get my XLR chassis for my 338NM.
Love my XLR on my 6.5 C.
Love my 338 NM.
Specs: Badger M2008 receiver, Benchmark 27" barrel, XLR Extreme Evolution HD chassis, LRA bipod, Dagley Brake, Spuhr mount holding a Razor HD.
She pushes the 285 hornady's with 92 grains of Retumbo at 2890 fps.
The only thing that sucks about this cartridge is when you tell people you have a Norma...doesn't sound as cool as Lapua which is a very important issues
May I ask what you coated the chassis with? Looks unreal!
if you go norma you will never go back
My Brux is on it's way! Converting my McMillan TAC-338 into a Norma Magnum. The only downside is; like XLR said, I can't call it an ultra-cool "Lapua" anymore.
I agree the 300 NM would be a hell of a cartridge also, pushing the 230's. It would be a hair cheaper to shoot too. The difference in cost is only about $15/100 projectiles. Everything else is a moot point, still going to use the same brass, primers and a similar charge. One thing that you have to put into perspective is barrel life on the 300, when you're pushing similar powder charges as the 338 down a 30cal tube you'll have a bit more erosion. It would still be fun.
I agree, if someone would AI this cartridge or at least do an Improved 30 shoulder on it, it would be even better.
xdeano
OhNoMrBill just did a 40 degree Imp version
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Mine is officially started being built. Have her at the smith now. Decided to go 25" on the barrel.
Update:
300 gr Berger OTM's
89.0 gr H-1000
2.902 COL
I get 0.3 - 0.4 MoA repeatable.
Pics:
Love it.
300 gr Berger OTM's
89.0 gr H-1000
2.902 COL
I get 0.3 - 0.4 MoA repeatable.
Pics:
Love it.
Update:
300 gr Berger OTM's
89.0 gr H-1000
2.902 COL
I get 0.3 - 0.4 MoA repeatable.
Pics:
Love it.
Have you ever ran Retumbo?
I got 2 lbs ready to load up some. Xdeano loaded some up and had good results. IIRC loads were a little lighter than H-1000. I don't have the info here, but can get his load data at the house.
Retumbo under some 300 mk's is what I'm experimenting with first. Went from 85 up to 88. Had a very slight primer crater at 88 grains.
Best group I had so far was during barrel break in. w/ 85 grains it was .5" horizontal, but only .1" vertical. I'm going to do some load testing today yet. Yesterday I did ladder testing to figure some handload pressures.
Here's at 400 yards. Got tired of walking 400 yards after each bullet, so I switched to 200 yards.
400 yards:
200 yards:
Looks like at 400 you have a nice node with the 86 and 85.4. What velocities were you getting.
No clue on my velocities. I'm going to chrono my loads today.
Let me know what you get. How long is your barrel. I have a 22" Ackley Improved .338 Norma Magnum. Haven't done any load work up yet. I have so much normal .338 Norma Magnum to shoot and fire form first.
Just got back from the range
My most accurate load was 87.7 grains of retumbo. Velocity was 2,769 fps average with a 300 smk. I'm running a 25" Brux w/ 1-9.5"
My most accurate load was 87.7 grains of retumbo. Velocity was 2,769 fps average with a 300 smk. I'm running a 25" Brux w/ 1-9.5"
Awesome. I will have to see what my max is with the AI chamber.
It's common for Retumbo to give you around 100 fps more than H1000 before showing pressure signs in the 338 Norma.
250 MK 87.7 Retumbo shot off bipod and rear bag. The flyer was from a clean barrel with CLP in it. Might have to load some more 250s up.
