F T/R Competition Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

[XTR]

Looking at ordering a barrel from Rock River, how long do you guys running dedicated F class rifles finish at? Do you start with a 31" blank and have it finished at 30 or can you go out to a 32" finished length?

I
m hearing most people running 30" tubes, but then I hear some of the HP guys running 32" and I'm wondering if we can in F class and if there is an advantage? I've been looking and I don't see any barrel length restrictions, am I missing something?

 

[Tactical]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

Dude, you writing a book on F TR, because if you are some us should get credit for answering all the questions. LOL

The problem is WEIGHT. You throw together that package anyway you like as long as it comes in under the max weight and is chambered for 308W. Now be advised some of us are pushing to have chambers checked so I would say dont fng cheat like som do and blow out cases and make home boy improved 308s

I run a 30" medium weight Palma taper

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

The F-class rules are fairly wide open still at this point... and I hope they stay that way. Like Mike said... whatever length you can make weight with. The Palma guys use the barrel lengths they do primarily for sight radius first, velocity second (though some might argue that point). 32, 34" all work... but compromises usually follow. For us, weight is the main one. Next is finding (gun) cases that fit the dang thing. The amount of velocity gained at that length of barrel considering the limited case volume of a .308 Win to start with... I think the iron sight guys probably get somewhat more benefit from the extra sight radius than we would from the minuscule extra velocity...

 

[XTR]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

No, not writing a book, but I'm definitely beginning to feel like the guy who asks the which is better moa or mils, what rings should I use, how about my base? Look at it this way, at least we are building a database of info for the next guy(s). I also don't want to build something that won't work or is not legal.


My "problem" if you will, is that the ORSA, my local club, is all Camp Perry types. One guy here for the matches this past weekend has actually dropped F class for HP and is pretty frantically trying to get enough matches to go to perry as an Expert and not unrated.

I think the AMU will have been here 3 times before the summer is over; I know they have already been here x2, and I am going to go what is our 3rd CMP clinic of the year in August and start shooting my AR in service rifle just for giggles.

With all that going on there is nobody else here shooting TR. We've got what has got to be one of the nicest range facilities in the east and as far as I can tell I'm about the only person here interested in shooting TR so I have nobody to compare ideas and what does and doesn't work. Our Monday afternoon 1000 yd practices I'm lucky to have one other F class guy there to squad with. Plenty of guys with slings and tube guns, and a few out there with some really nice F/O rigs.

When we hold matches if I see a bipod and not a front rest it's either someone from two hours or more away or the occasional guy with a hunting rifle shooting in open for giggles. (like the guy with the 338 Winmag last weekend) The result is I come in here ask too many questions.

Anyway.

Thanks for the input, I had an idea it was a weight thing, the tube guns are obviously an attempt to keep the weight down among other things.

At this point I've only exchanged email with the guy I want to build my rifle, (Chris Mathews) and I'm sure I could get some of that feedback from him, but I'm getting a pretty good basis here.

And no I never considered some kind of 308improved, how could anyone be proud or happy with a win knowing they did something like that? yea, I know people cheat in everything.


I doubt if I was the only person who asked for it, but a few days before this forum popped up I actually sent Lowlight a PM suggesting an F class forum. I thought we might actually have a fair population of F class shooters here and I wanted to quit bugging the guys in the Tactical Comps forum. I like to think I contributed to the idea.

 

[Trevor]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

Side note…. Don’t discount the TR guys with the exception of sights they shoot similar or in some cases the EXACT same type of gun we do in F/TR. The difference for us is that we have a weight limit. The TR guys know how to read the wind just as well as the F class guys. Everyone likes talking gear but Wind reading wins you championships.

If you want to have some fun with the TR guys start the conversation with how hot it is after watching him put on his 2nd sweatshirt and that big heavy leather jacket…

As to barrel length the others have addressed it pretty well a longer tube is better then shorter. Whether or not you want a 30 or 32 is based on weight and what you think the benefits are of one over the other.

I am aware of one guy who has a 28 in barrel with a massive Hall B action it works for him.

Trevor

 

[leadbullet]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

I run a 30 in 243 AI and a 25 in 308, wish the 308 was a few inches longer. both wih kreiger #17 taper, still a few pounds under max weight.

 

[Emilio]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

I run a 30" medium PALMA.

 

[proneshooter]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Trevor</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Side note…. Don’t discount the TR guys with the exception of sights they shoot similar or in some cases the EXACT same type of gun we do in F/TR.
</div></div>
Correct. You should be asking us who shoot Palma/TR rifles as what we shoot is the same as yours minus the scope and bipod.

In fact, I can scope my Palma gun and screw a bipod attachment onto the handstop rail and you couldn't tell my rifle apart from most F/TR rigs today.

 

[Arkhangel5]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

XTR,
My F T/R rifle has a Brux Heavy Varmint 30in barrel on it. I have it in a B&C A2 stock with a Mcgee Precision adjustable cheekpiece on it. With bipod and scope it comes in at ~17lbs.

Before, I had it in a B&C A5 adjustable stock, it was heavy and stable, but could not make any other changes to it, as I was right at 18lbs and I wanted to make some adjustments. Switched to the A2 stock to save weight but keep the bedding block arrangement.

It was pushing the Berger 185 LR BT @2750fps over Varget.If I had to do it again, would probably go with a med palma @ 32in.

SY

 

[Nora23]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

I have a 28" Broughton MTU contour (.930" at the muzzle). I like the balance compared to other guns I've had with 30" barrels. Also, I am not 100% convinced another two inches would make any difference in substantial velocity gain. Also, I had to consider weight and the set up as it is, weighs approximately 17.5 pounds.

Chris

 

[jonbearman]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

I just purchased a savage ftr rifle and naked it weighs 12.65 lbs according to savage's catalog. I havent weighed it yet,but wondering what is the legal weight the rifle can be. The savage has a 30" heavy varmint taper by looks. I guess the medium palma taper would be the way to go. It seems on other forums that taper is the one they go with.

 

[XTR]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

The max weight for F-TR is 8.25 kilos, about 18.18lbs. I'd be shooting for an 18lb max weight for the rifle. If you're at 18.1 on your scale and 18.2 on the one at the match then you have a problem.

 

[justshoot]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

Remember with the weights listed above must include bi-pod. I use a 32" heavy palma fluted with FN action, A4 Mcmillan stock, Night Force 12-42X56 NXS, Seekins BM and Sinclair bi-pod. With all that still under weight.

Go for it with a finished 32"

Just something to think about here. Look at a .223 with 80 grain bullet ballistics. It will be better than a .308 with 185 Bergers

 

[inscomsmag]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

The only restriction you have in F-T/R is the overall weight. Your are allowed 8.2 kelo that is about 18.4 pounds. That total weight including the bipod, the scope and any other thing you have attached to the rifle during the the match. Jack Leather of Leathet Bilt Precision Rifles builds a lot of AR-15 (F-T/R) rifle utilizing a finished lenght of 30 inches. His rifles will shoot 1/4 inch groups at 100 yards.
Sgt Major Becquet

 

[dar1246]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

I run a 30" med palma 13twist barrel.

 

[tarzan]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

Just something to think about here. Look at a .223 with 80 grain bullet ballistics. It will be better than a .308 with 185 Bergers


dont think i have seen a 223 win a ftr match mabey so dont know

 

[nesikabay]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

SGT Maj Nice to see someone getting new shooters involved. If you want to shoot an AR and are happy good . I have several ARs Les Baur I got a couple of Hollingers @ Compasslake guns. I like them and love them. I wish enerone but me shot an AR in F/TR. <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sgt Maj Becquet</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The only restriction you have in F-T/R is the overall weight. Your are allowed 8.2 kelo that is about 18.4 pounds. That total weight including the bipod, the scope and any other thing you have attached to the rifle during the the match. Jack Leather of Leathet Bilt Precision Rifles builds a lot of AR-15 (F-T/R) rifle utilizing a finished lenght of 30 inches. His rifles will shoot 1/4 inch groups at 100 yards.
Sgt Major Becquet </div></div>

 

[coulthard_west]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

you wanna look at balance. the longer the barrel you get the skinnier it needs to be to remain balanced. a heavy varmint barrel you want no longer than around 26" where as if you go with a lighter palma style barrel you can go around 30-31" finished length. its all up to what you want. my advice it to go to an f class match and talk to the tr shooters and see what there shooting. i am personally shooting a savage 10 fp action, kreiger barrel finished at 26" long and that thing is accurate.

 

[RStewart]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tarzan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">


dont think i have seen a 223 win a ftr match mabey so dont know </div></div>

I have on several occassions.

I personally shoot a Remmy 700 in .223. HS Precison Stock, Harris bipod, 30" Bartlein Barrel (1:6.5 twist), NF 12-42x56 scope. Weight is a shade under 18 lbs. In our Regional in April I placed 4th out of 16 (only 2- .223 rifles, the rest were .308's) and did win my division. Shooting 80 SMK's.
Shooting a .223 will definitely make you a better wind reader. IMHO.

I also shoot a match AR. White Oak Armaments upper (26" barrel with a 1:7 twist barrel) and a RRA lower. Shoot it in Field Precision and have shot it in F/TR once or twice.

 

[memilanuk]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tarzan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">dont think i have seen a 223 win a ftr match mabey so dont know </div></div>

Last summer, the first and second place F/TR shooters @ the BCRA Int'l Rifle Match (four days of shooting pair fire @ 300, 400, 500 & 600 meters) were shooting .223 Rem. One shooting B82BTs, the other shooting S80MKs. 1st F/TR also qualified as 5th in the *overall* (i.e. Open) agg.

Yes, the .223 can shoot. Not my first choice for LR, but for MR it can be dang tough to beat.

 

[scotharr]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

Agreed, out to 600 yards the 223REM is awesome. When the wind kicks up or the distance is >600yds, the edge goes to 308WIN.

 

[esromvre]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

+1

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Scooter-PIE</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Agreed, out to 600 yards the 223REM is awesome. When the wind kicks up or the distance is >600yds, the edge goes to 308WIN. </div></div>

 

[SIE107]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

At Oak Ridge, your a masochist to be shooting the .223 at 1000 yards. Mine is an absolute hammer from 800 yards in, but after that, it gets beat up pretty bad. Though, best score has been a 196-8X at 1K, it is not always the norm. But from 800 yards and in, I have cleaned on several occasions.

 

[REELDOC]

Re: Barrel length, how long on a dedicated F-TR gun?

I run a 32" Lilja. Can set back a couple of times.