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Hunting & Fishing Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
- Thread starter Mk4
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Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Do a search. Topic of match bullets for hunting has been beaten to death on several dozen threads. I'm done taking part on the topic as all it does is turn into a pissing match.
Do a search. Topic of match bullets for hunting has been beaten to death on several dozen threads. I'm done taking part on the topic as all it does is turn into a pissing match.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do a search. Topic of match bullets for hunting has been beaten to death on several dozen threads. I'm done taking part on the topic as all it does is turn into a pissing match. </div></div>
You're obviously not done since you're here posting.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do a search. Topic of match bullets for hunting has been beaten to death on several dozen threads. I'm done taking part on the topic as all it does is turn into a pissing match. </div></div>
You're obviously not done since you're here posting.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
I've done a search or I wouldn't be here asking.
Got any links or better keywords than I have, I'm all ears.
I've done a search or I wouldn't be here asking.
Got any links or better keywords than I have, I'm all ears.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mk4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've done a search or I wouldn't be here asking.
Got any links or better keywords than I have, I'm all ears. </div></div>
I don't recall the VLD specifically talked about. Mr. Bumble is referring to a thread where someone asked about hunting with SMK. In that thread Mr. Bumble ran his mouth about how he'd shoot an Elk up the ass given the opportunity. While I have never shot game animals with VLD I have shot animals with "match" bullets and they died very quickly.
You shoot an animal correctly and it will die, what's left to say?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mk4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've done a search or I wouldn't be here asking.
Got any links or better keywords than I have, I'm all ears. </div></div>
I don't recall the VLD specifically talked about. Mr. Bumble is referring to a thread where someone asked about hunting with SMK. In that thread Mr. Bumble ran his mouth about how he'd shoot an Elk up the ass given the opportunity. While I have never shot game animals with VLD I have shot animals with "match" bullets and they died very quickly.
You shoot an animal correctly and it will die, what's left to say?
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
edited by moderator
edited by moderator
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
The bullet in question (Berger 308 185gr VLD)is advertised on the Berger web site as for hunting.
That's my inquiry.
The bullet in question (Berger 308 185gr VLD)is advertised on the Berger web site as for hunting.
That's my inquiry.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Speaking of visits...IIRC, we offered to bring you down to TX and you didnt even acknowledge it...
That said, I think Humble did mention that projectile back a while and said it was a killer. (I may be wrong there, but I though he gave it the GTG)
Personally, I think any round is a killer with proper placement. Some just more than others.
Speaking of visits...IIRC, we offered to bring you down to TX and you didnt even acknowledge it...
That said, I think Humble did mention that projectile back a while and said it was a killer. (I may be wrong there, but I though he gave it the GTG)
Personally, I think any round is a killer with proper placement. Some just more than others.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mk4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The bullet in question (Berger 308 185gr VLD)is advertised on the Berger web site as for hunting.
That's my inquiry.
</div></div>
I wouldn't give it a second thought, it'll do fine.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mk4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The bullet in question (Berger 308 185gr VLD)is advertised on the Berger web site as for hunting.
That's my inquiry.
</div></div>
I wouldn't give it a second thought, it'll do fine.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shaggyback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Speaking of visits...IIRC, we offered to bring you down to TX and you didnt even acknowledge it...
That said, I think Humble did mention that projectile back a while and said it was a killer. (I may be wrong there, but I though he gave it the GTG)
Personally, I think any round is a killer with proper placement. Some just more than others. </div></div>
I'll pitch in for airfare and beer, let me know where to send the money.....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shaggyback</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Speaking of visits...IIRC, we offered to bring you down to TX and you didnt even acknowledge it...
That said, I think Humble did mention that projectile back a while and said it was a killer. (I may be wrong there, but I though he gave it the GTG)
Personally, I think any round is a killer with proper placement. Some just more than others. </div></div>
I'll pitch in for airfare and beer, let me know where to send the money.....
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Mk4
Berger has two VLD bullets, both have J4 Jackets. One is marketed as a Match/Hunting Bullet and the other is marketed as Match only. This stems from 6.5x284 bullets blowing up due to high velocities and the core becoming molten while still in the bore. The thick Jacket was born, hence "Match Bullets" The hunting version is the old style J4 jacketed bullet and its GTG. I've personally seen and harvested Whitetail Deer and Wild Hogs taken with the Hunting Berger VLD in the following calibers; 300 Jarrett, 7mmRM, 300WM, 6.5x284, .257 Roy, 300RUM, 6.5x47L and 7/300wsm. Bullet weights ranged from 115 to 210. No deer was crippled or lost, most were bang flops and all had exit wounds. There will always be those that protest Match Grade bullets for hunting but, they do work. If you’re trying to kill at a distance no greater than 400 yards, almost any bullet will do. 500 and further requires a different approach.
Mk4
Berger has two VLD bullets, both have J4 Jackets. One is marketed as a Match/Hunting Bullet and the other is marketed as Match only. This stems from 6.5x284 bullets blowing up due to high velocities and the core becoming molten while still in the bore. The thick Jacket was born, hence "Match Bullets" The hunting version is the old style J4 jacketed bullet and its GTG. I've personally seen and harvested Whitetail Deer and Wild Hogs taken with the Hunting Berger VLD in the following calibers; 300 Jarrett, 7mmRM, 300WM, 6.5x284, .257 Roy, 300RUM, 6.5x47L and 7/300wsm. Bullet weights ranged from 115 to 210. No deer was crippled or lost, most were bang flops and all had exit wounds. There will always be those that protest Match Grade bullets for hunting but, they do work. If you’re trying to kill at a distance no greater than 400 yards, almost any bullet will do. 500 and further requires a different approach.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you were not such a ... edited by moderator... Come on, make my day.</div></div>
Larry, why does your profile say you're in Cora Wyoming?
I thought I was on ignore?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you were not such a ... edited by moderator... Come on, make my day.</div></div>
Larry, why does your profile say you're in Cora Wyoming?
I thought I was on ignore?
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mk4
Berger has two VLD bullets, both have J4 Jackets. One is marketed as a Match/Hunting Bullet and the other is marketed as Match only. This stems from 6.5x284 bullets blowing up due to high velocities and the core becoming molten while still in the bore. The thick Jacket was born, hence "Match Bullets" The hunting version is the old style J4 jacketed bullet and its GTG. I've personally seen and harvested Whitetail Deer and Wild Hogs taken with the Hunting Berger VLD in the following calibers; 300 Jarrett, 7mmRM, 300WM, 6.5x284, .257 Roy, 300RUM, 6.5x47L and 7/300wsm. Bullet weights ranged from 115 to 210. No deer was crippled or lost, most were bang flops and all had exit wounds. There will always be those that protest Match Grade bullets for hunting but, they do work. If you’re trying to kill at a distance no greater than 400 yards, almost any bullet will do. 500 and further requires a different approach.
</div></div>
wnroscoe,
Currently, I'm running 178 AMAX's which are a major step above SMK's in terms of terminal performance (besides shooting better in my rifle). Now I want to try the VLD's.
Should be better for downrange performance but not sure if any better than the AMAX for terminal performance.
To be more specific, that is the basis for my question.
Thanks.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mk4
Berger has two VLD bullets, both have J4 Jackets. One is marketed as a Match/Hunting Bullet and the other is marketed as Match only. This stems from 6.5x284 bullets blowing up due to high velocities and the core becoming molten while still in the bore. The thick Jacket was born, hence "Match Bullets" The hunting version is the old style J4 jacketed bullet and its GTG. I've personally seen and harvested Whitetail Deer and Wild Hogs taken with the Hunting Berger VLD in the following calibers; 300 Jarrett, 7mmRM, 300WM, 6.5x284, .257 Roy, 300RUM, 6.5x47L and 7/300wsm. Bullet weights ranged from 115 to 210. No deer was crippled or lost, most were bang flops and all had exit wounds. There will always be those that protest Match Grade bullets for hunting but, they do work. If you’re trying to kill at a distance no greater than 400 yards, almost any bullet will do. 500 and further requires a different approach.
</div></div>
wnroscoe,
Currently, I'm running 178 AMAX's which are a major step above SMK's in terms of terminal performance (besides shooting better in my rifle). Now I want to try the VLD's.
Should be better for downrange performance but not sure if any better than the AMAX for terminal performance.
To be more specific, that is the basis for my question.
Thanks.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Another option is 180gr Nosler BT and Nosler Accubonds. They are interchangeable so you can shoot the less expensive NBT for practice and the Accubons when hunting. They sport a higher BC than SMK as well.
Another option is 180gr Nosler BT and Nosler Accubonds. They are interchangeable so you can shoot the less expensive NBT for practice and the Accubons when hunting. They sport a higher BC than SMK as well.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Mk4
Last year there were three deer I know of that were harvested with the 162 Amax from a 7mmSTW. Ranges were between 300 & 450 yards. That bullet was way to soft resulting in bullet blow up on initial impact. The core partially stayed intact resulting in kills but, a lot of meat was wasted. My cousin is the one that was using them and he's an experienced hunter/shooter. He dropped the Amax like they were hot and went back the SGK. In the last 6 years I've tried Accubonds, Ballistic Tips, Partitions, SGK, SMK, Swift Sirocco and the Berger VLD. Other than the Partition the Berger VLD is the only one that has exited for me every time. If I wasn’t shooting the Berger VLD I'd be shooting the SGK. Run the VLD and don’t think twice, its one hell of a bullet.
Mk4
Last year there were three deer I know of that were harvested with the 162 Amax from a 7mmSTW. Ranges were between 300 & 450 yards. That bullet was way to soft resulting in bullet blow up on initial impact. The core partially stayed intact resulting in kills but, a lot of meat was wasted. My cousin is the one that was using them and he's an experienced hunter/shooter. He dropped the Amax like they were hot and went back the SGK. In the last 6 years I've tried Accubonds, Ballistic Tips, Partitions, SGK, SMK, Swift Sirocco and the Berger VLD. Other than the Partition the Berger VLD is the only one that has exited for me every time. If I wasn’t shooting the Berger VLD I'd be shooting the SGK. Run the VLD and don’t think twice, its one hell of a bullet.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mk4
Last year there were three deer I know of that were harvested with the 162 Amax from a 7mmSTW. Ranges were between 300 & 450 yards. That bullet was way to soft resulting in bullet blow up on initial impact. The core partially stayed intact resulting in kills but, a lot of meat was wasted. My cousin is the one that was using them and he's an experienced hunter/shooter. He dropped the Amax like they were hot and went back the SGK. In the last 6 years I've tried Accubonds, Ballistic Tips, Partitions, SGK, SMK, Swift Sirocco and the Berger VLD. Other than the Partition the Berger VLD is the only one that has exited for me every time. If I wasn’t shooting the Berger VLD I'd be shooting the SGK. Run the VLD and don’t think twice, its one hell of a bullet.
</div></div>
This is what I was looking for....some BTDT feedback.
Interesting about the AMAX's. I would "almost" hope that the VLD wouldn't work because of expense but can't help myself.
The high G7 on the VLDs is what I find very appealing.
Been a while since I've wondered into the Hunting Section. Geeeezz didn't realize I was going to open a can of "bullet" worms....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mk4
Last year there were three deer I know of that were harvested with the 162 Amax from a 7mmSTW. Ranges were between 300 & 450 yards. That bullet was way to soft resulting in bullet blow up on initial impact. The core partially stayed intact resulting in kills but, a lot of meat was wasted. My cousin is the one that was using them and he's an experienced hunter/shooter. He dropped the Amax like they were hot and went back the SGK. In the last 6 years I've tried Accubonds, Ballistic Tips, Partitions, SGK, SMK, Swift Sirocco and the Berger VLD. Other than the Partition the Berger VLD is the only one that has exited for me every time. If I wasn’t shooting the Berger VLD I'd be shooting the SGK. Run the VLD and don’t think twice, its one hell of a bullet.
</div></div>
This is what I was looking for....some BTDT feedback.
Interesting about the AMAX's. I would "almost" hope that the VLD wouldn't work because of expense but can't help myself.
Been a while since I've wondered into the Hunting Section. Geeeezz didn't realize I was going to open a can of "bullet" worms....
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
The one thing I found while in search for the "Perfect" bullet is this. Bullets weighing 200 grains or less, driven at a velocity of 3,000 fps or faster used to shoot animals at ranges of 300 yards or closer stand a greater chance of blowing up on impact or failing to exit. My 7/300wsm shoots the 180 Berger VLD at 2,900ish fps and has shot completely through a 200+ Lb hogs and Whitetail Deer. No blow ups and all pass through. The 300RUM's I've built are all shooting the 210 grain Berger VLD at 3,200+ fps and to date, no blow ups and all pass through. They've killed from under 100 yards to 550 yards with authority. Even the SGK, my second favorite bullet will, on occasion, fail to exit but, I've never lost an animal using it. Failure in the way of 100% exit, yes, failure to kill 100% of the time and recover the animal, no.
Try the Berger, either the 175 or 185 VLD Hunting Bullet, you'll be sold on the first kill.
<span style="font-weight: bold">I also found that there is no such thing as the “Perfect Bullet”</span>
The one thing I found while in search for the "Perfect" bullet is this. Bullets weighing 200 grains or less, driven at a velocity of 3,000 fps or faster used to shoot animals at ranges of 300 yards or closer stand a greater chance of blowing up on impact or failing to exit. My 7/300wsm shoots the 180 Berger VLD at 2,900ish fps and has shot completely through a 200+ Lb hogs and Whitetail Deer. No blow ups and all pass through. The 300RUM's I've built are all shooting the 210 grain Berger VLD at 3,200+ fps and to date, no blow ups and all pass through. They've killed from under 100 yards to 550 yards with authority. Even the SGK, my second favorite bullet will, on occasion, fail to exit but, I've never lost an animal using it. Failure in the way of 100% exit, yes, failure to kill 100% of the time and recover the animal, no.
Try the Berger, either the 175 or 185 VLD Hunting Bullet, you'll be sold on the first kill.
<span style="font-weight: bold">I also found that there is no such thing as the “Perfect Bullet”</span>
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The one thing I found while in search for the "Perfect" bullet is this. Bullets weighing 200 grains or less, driven at a velocity of 3,000 fps or faster used to shoot animals at ranges of 300 yards or closer stand a greater chance of blowing up on impact or failing to exit. My 7/300wsm shoots the 180 Berger VLD at 2,900ish fps and has shot completely through a 200+ Lb hogs and Whitetail Deer. No blow ups and all pass through. The 300RUM's I've built are all shooting the 210 grain Berger VLD at 3,200+ fps and to date, no blow ups and all pass through. They've killed from under 100 yards to 550 yards with authority. Even the SGK, my second favorite bullet will, on occasion, fail to exit but, I've never lost an animal using it. Failure in the way of 100% exit, yes, failure to kill 100% of the time and recover the animal, no.
Try the Berger, either the 175 or 185 VLD Hunting Bullet, you'll be sold on the first kill.
<span style="font-weight: bold">I also found that there is no such thing as the “Perfect Bullet”</span>
</div></div>
That is interesting.
Nothing like empirical data and yours is significant.
I'm already liking the AMAX's over the SMK's. It will be interesting to see how the VLD's work.
....and thanks (to all) for the response(s).
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The one thing I found while in search for the "Perfect" bullet is this. Bullets weighing 200 grains or less, driven at a velocity of 3,000 fps or faster used to shoot animals at ranges of 300 yards or closer stand a greater chance of blowing up on impact or failing to exit. My 7/300wsm shoots the 180 Berger VLD at 2,900ish fps and has shot completely through a 200+ Lb hogs and Whitetail Deer. No blow ups and all pass through. The 300RUM's I've built are all shooting the 210 grain Berger VLD at 3,200+ fps and to date, no blow ups and all pass through. They've killed from under 100 yards to 550 yards with authority. Even the SGK, my second favorite bullet will, on occasion, fail to exit but, I've never lost an animal using it. Failure in the way of 100% exit, yes, failure to kill 100% of the time and recover the animal, no.
Try the Berger, either the 175 or 185 VLD Hunting Bullet, you'll be sold on the first kill.
<span style="font-weight: bold">I also found that there is no such thing as the “Perfect Bullet”</span>
</div></div>
That is interesting.
Nothing like empirical data and yours is significant.
I'm already liking the AMAX's over the SMK's. It will be interesting to see how the VLD's work.
....and thanks (to all) for the response(s).
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
One 190 VLD worked great for me last season on a mulie, it dropped on impact. Complete pass through and removed one vertebra. I don’t see why the 185 wouldn't do the same. If your gun likes them, go with it.
One 190 VLD worked great for me last season on a mulie, it dropped on impact. Complete pass through and removed one vertebra. I don’t see why the 185 wouldn't do the same. If your gun likes them, go with it.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you were not such a edite by moderator </div></div>
A-Max or SMK will work. Make a good shot.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you were not such a edite by moderator </div></div>
A-Max or SMK will work. Make a good shot.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you were not such a f ... Edite by moderator ... Come on, make my day.</div></div>
Larry, why does your profile say you're in Cora Wyoming?
I thought I was on ignore? </div></div>
He's not in Cora that's for sure. He does see a lot of Antelope trail however.
To the OP.
wnroscoe has it right.
There is no perfect bullet. However, there are more accurate bullets/powder combination that individual rifles like.
Find the combination yours like and don't give it a second thought. If you are accurate in your placement. You will be successful in your harvest.
Too often ( as in Humbles case ) individuals will rely on the imaginary perfect bullet because some marketer has named it a hunting bullet. Then they relax and mentally have this feeling of security that if the shot isn't perfect ..well it's ok, it's a hunting bullet, it will kill anyway.
In the end accuracy wins.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you were not such a f ... Edite by moderator ... Come on, make my day.</div></div>
Larry, why does your profile say you're in Cora Wyoming?
I thought I was on ignore? </div></div>
He's not in Cora that's for sure. He does see a lot of Antelope trail however.
To the OP.
wnroscoe has it right.
There is no perfect bullet. However, there are more accurate bullets/powder combination that individual rifles like.
Find the combination yours like and don't give it a second thought. If you are accurate in your placement. You will be successful in your harvest.
Too often ( as in Humbles case ) individuals will rely on the imaginary perfect bullet because some marketer has named it a hunting bullet. Then they relax and mentally have this feeling of security that if the shot isn't perfect ..well it's ok, it's a hunting bullet, it will kill anyway.
In the end accuracy wins.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Niles Coyote</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One 190 VLD worked great for me last season on a mulie, it dropped on impact. Complete pass through and removed one vertebra. I don’t see why the 185 wouldn't do the same. If your gun likes them, go with it. </div></div>
I had a similar experience with an 175 SMK. If your gun likes the VLD, then I would use them.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Niles Coyote</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One 190 VLD worked great for me last season on a mulie, it dropped on impact. Complete pass through and removed one vertebra. I don’t see why the 185 wouldn't do the same. If your gun likes them, go with it. </div></div>
I had a similar experience with an 175 SMK. If your gun likes the VLD, then I would use them.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> </div></div>
Minute of Deer Ass.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Minute of Deer Ass.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Give the VLD's a try, what's the worst that could happen, you have to shoot the animal twice?
Here are some of the reviews of Triple shock, it isn't exactly a death ray.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">LAWRENCE ROOT of Pinedale, WY Date posted: 5/1/2005
Opening morning 2004 my buddy from PA borrowed my 1958 721 300 H&H loaded with 168 3x BTs at 3100 fps that put 3 in 3/4" @100. A 14" buck trotted by his rock blind at 225 yards. First shot a bit low broke right shoulder, buck stopped and quartered toward him. Second shot (He's an old bolt action match shooter!) hit high lungs, broke spine and dropped the Lope dead at about 200 yds. No recovered bullets (Never are with Xs). Accurate, deadly, always 2 holes and work in everything from my 25-06 to 12 bore (sabots). Why are there other bullets at all?</div></div>
Barnes Midway Review
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Jerry Starkey of Claremore, OK Date posted: 8/15/2009
After watching the TV shows I just had to find out for myself. So I loaded a 175 VLD Hunting 30 cal up with a load of H4350 in a 30-06. The round was chronographed at 2750fps. The groups were pretty good out of my 24 bbl Rem 700. I would say a 1/2 3 shot average. My son shot a 6 ft black bear at 40 yards. Just behind the shoulder for a perfect double lung hit. The bullet took out everything in its path and trampolined the skin on the other side. It had about 15% of its weight left. The bear just flipped over and died. This is what I expected and was not let down. I wanted to release a ton of energy quickly. It did! Too many people use too strong of a bullet on thin skinned game. I know this from experience. I’m a guide in Alaska for the big bears and hunt Africa a lot. I’ve seen lots of game fall. Most of the game that runs off is from under-expansion. Most die within a min or so , but you will be tracking. An animal can cover a lot of ground in a min. I will be using the Bergers again in the near the future. Hope this helps. </div></div>
Berger Midway Review
Give the VLD's a try, what's the worst that could happen, you have to shoot the animal twice?
Here are some of the reviews of Triple shock, it isn't exactly a death ray.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">LAWRENCE ROOT of Pinedale, WY Date posted: 5/1/2005
Opening morning 2004 my buddy from PA borrowed my 1958 721 300 H&H loaded with 168 3x BTs at 3100 fps that put 3 in 3/4" @100. A 14" buck trotted by his rock blind at 225 yards. First shot a bit low broke right shoulder, buck stopped and quartered toward him. Second shot (He's an old bolt action match shooter!) hit high lungs, broke spine and dropped the Lope dead at about 200 yds. No recovered bullets (Never are with Xs). Accurate, deadly, always 2 holes and work in everything from my 25-06 to 12 bore (sabots). Why are there other bullets at all?</div></div>
Barnes Midway Review
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Jerry Starkey of Claremore, OK Date posted: 8/15/2009
After watching the TV shows I just had to find out for myself. So I loaded a 175 VLD Hunting 30 cal up with a load of H4350 in a 30-06. The round was chronographed at 2750fps. The groups were pretty good out of my 24 bbl Rem 700. I would say a 1/2 3 shot average. My son shot a 6 ft black bear at 40 yards. Just behind the shoulder for a perfect double lung hit. The bullet took out everything in its path and trampolined the skin on the other side. It had about 15% of its weight left. The bear just flipped over and died. This is what I expected and was not let down. I wanted to release a ton of energy quickly. It did! Too many people use too strong of a bullet on thin skinned game. I know this from experience. I’m a guide in Alaska for the big bears and hunt Africa a lot. I’ve seen lots of game fall. Most of the game that runs off is from under-expansion. Most die within a min or so , but you will be tracking. An animal can cover a lot of ground in a min. I will be using the Bergers again in the near the future. Hope this helps. </div></div>
Berger Midway Review
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Okay "experts" any 30 caliber rifle from 308 on up with a decent hunting bullet that will shoot inside 2" at 100 yards will kill any lower 48 big game at responsible hunting ranges.
The "experts" who target shoot using live animals to "prove" they can kill at 500-2000 yards are not hunters in the traditional sense of hunting. Anyone who disputes the fact that the chance of wounding an animal at those ranges is far greater than at 300 or less is just dead wrong. Further, it would appear they lack basic hunting skills a or are just to lazy to get out of the truck or off the ATV to actually stalk the animal. One wonders how archers actually kill animals at 40 yards or less that, according to the "experts" are impossible to approach closer than 1000 yards.
On Bergers or other match bullets for hunting: All the PUBLISHED stories I have read say they will kill, BUT typically the entrance hole is closed by the skin and there is no exit hole.
I happen to like TWO holes in an animal should tracking be required. I agree with guys like Elmer Keith, Jack O'Connor and Craig Boddington but the "experts" all know they are just paid off hacks whose experience is worthless. The other "hacks" who write for respected magazines like Handloader and Rifle have actually tested various bullets on ballistic gel, other media and lots of animals.
There is one consistant fact: Well constructed hunting bullets (Swift, Barnes, Accubond, Partitions etc) can be counted on to penetrate and break large bones when required.
So, I am left with the never to be answered question:"Why use a match bullet?"
This made for a dead Elk, bits of jacket material and a lead spray, may or may not. You choice, your ethic.
Okay "experts" any 30 caliber rifle from 308 on up with a decent hunting bullet that will shoot inside 2" at 100 yards will kill any lower 48 big game at responsible hunting ranges.
The "experts" who target shoot using live animals to "prove" they can kill at 500-2000 yards are not hunters in the traditional sense of hunting. Anyone who disputes the fact that the chance of wounding an animal at those ranges is far greater than at 300 or less is just dead wrong. Further, it would appear they lack basic hunting skills a or are just to lazy to get out of the truck or off the ATV to actually stalk the animal. One wonders how archers actually kill animals at 40 yards or less that, according to the "experts" are impossible to approach closer than 1000 yards.
On Bergers or other match bullets for hunting: All the PUBLISHED stories I have read say they will kill, BUT typically the entrance hole is closed by the skin and there is no exit hole.
I happen to like TWO holes in an animal should tracking be required. I agree with guys like Elmer Keith, Jack O'Connor and Craig Boddington but the "experts" all know they are just paid off hacks whose experience is worthless. The other "hacks" who write for respected magazines like Handloader and Rifle have actually tested various bullets on ballistic gel, other media and lots of animals.
There is one consistant fact: Well constructed hunting bullets (Swift, Barnes, Accubond, Partitions etc) can be counted on to penetrate and break large bones when required.
So, I am left with the never to be answered question:"Why use a match bullet?"
This made for a dead Elk, bits of jacket material and a lead spray, may or may not. You choice, your ethic.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The "experts" who target shoot using live animals to "prove" they can kill at 500-2000 yards are not hunters in the traditional sense of hunting.</div></div>
Define traditional sense...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BUT typically the entrance hole is closed by the skin and there is no exit hole.</div></div>
eerrr.. why does your entrance hole not close and mine does?
I prefer not to track. You pay your guide to do that.
I use SMK's, Bergers, A-maxs. pretty much DRT.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The "experts" who target shoot using live animals to "prove" they can kill at 500-2000 yards are not hunters in the traditional sense of hunting.</div></div>
Define traditional sense...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BUT typically the entrance hole is closed by the skin and there is no exit hole.</div></div>
eerrr.. why does your entrance hole not close and mine does?
I prefer not to track. You pay your guide to do that.
I use SMK's, Bergers, A-maxs. pretty much DRT.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">.
</div></div>
Take a new pic for god's sake.
Mr. H, do you like Wayne Van Zwoll as well?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">.
Take a new pic for god's sake.
Mr. H, do you like Wayne Van Zwoll as well?
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All the PUBLISHED stories I have read say they will kill, BUT typically the entrance hole is closed by the skin and there is no exit hole.</div></div>
That’s part of the problem. Most here are basing their statements on actual Hunting/Field experiences and your basing your negative statements about the use of Match Bullets for hunting on what you've read. Yes, under 400 yards, almost any bullet will work and be accurate enough to kill. The problem is this "Accurate enough" isn’t good enough. I want it all in the way of accuracy.
I've seen the nose of a 180 grain Nosler Partition blown off at impact on whitetail deer. Muzzle velocity was 3,180 fps. The entrance hole in the meat was no smaller than 6"-8"
I've seen one of your beloved Barnes TSX after passing through a whitetail and lodging in the dirt. Other than being bent from impact, it almost looked like it could be loaded again. Zero expansion.
I've seen SGK's blow up on impact, Ballistic Tips pencil hole straight through a whitetails shoulder, Accubonds and Combined Tech fail to exit at 500 yards, Hornaday Inner bonds blow up on impact etc, etc, etc.
This is what led me to the Berger VLD's. I figured that if any of the aforementioned bullets could and would fail the Berger would fit right in. I chose accuracy first and foremost but, the Berger also expands, creates a generous wound channel and exits. Two holes, major vital organ damage and blood loss equal blood trail and dead animule at the end of said Blood Trail.
Real world testing and real world results will always trump a magazine article. If you don’t like a certain bullet fine, don’t keep coming on these threads and pissing down our leg. You shoot what you like and that’s fine. There’s Chocolate and Vanilla ice cream for a reason.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All the PUBLISHED stories I have read say they will kill, BUT typically the entrance hole is closed by the skin and there is no exit hole.</div></div>
That’s part of the problem. Most here are basing their statements on actual Hunting/Field experiences and your basing your negative statements about the use of Match Bullets for hunting on what you've read. Yes, under 400 yards, almost any bullet will work and be accurate enough to kill. The problem is this "Accurate enough" isn’t good enough. I want it all in the way of accuracy.
I've seen the nose of a 180 grain Nosler Partition blown off at impact on whitetail deer. Muzzle velocity was 3,180 fps. The entrance hole in the meat was no smaller than 6"-8"
I've seen one of your beloved Barnes TSX after passing through a whitetail and lodging in the dirt. Other than being bent from impact, it almost looked like it could be loaded again. Zero expansion.
I've seen SGK's blow up on impact, Ballistic Tips pencil hole straight through a whitetails shoulder, Accubonds and Combined Tech fail to exit at 500 yards, Hornaday Inner bonds blow up on impact etc, etc, etc.
This is what led me to the Berger VLD's. I figured that if any of the aforementioned bullets could and would fail the Berger would fit right in. I chose accuracy first and foremost but, the Berger also expands, creates a generous wound channel and exits. Two holes, major vital organ damage and blood loss equal blood trail and dead animule at the end of said Blood Trail.
Real world testing and real world results will always trump a magazine article. If you don’t like a certain bullet fine, don’t keep coming on these threads and pissing down our leg. You shoot what you like and that’s fine. There’s Chocolate and Vanilla ice cream for a reason.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
well said
well said
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
With as good as Barnes bullets are I don't know why anyone in their right minds would choose something else.
With as good as Barnes bullets are I don't know why anyone in their right minds would choose something else.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
I'm leaving tonight for a high buck hunt here in WA State.
I'll be using 190 VLD's in the 300 WSM.
Bergers are a superb hunting bullet that I have all confidence in.
http://www.bergerbullets.com/
I'm leaving tonight for a high buck hunt here in WA State.
I'll be using 190 VLD's in the 300 WSM.
Bergers are a superb hunting bullet that I have all confidence in.
http://www.bergerbullets.com/
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rootmanslim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With as good as Barnes bullets are I don't know why anyone in their right minds would choose something else.</div></div>
Nothing is guaranteed or perfect. Shoot several thousand rounds down range and kill with several different bullet types, you'll start to develop a data base in your head and see first hand what works and what doesn’t. Barnes are great bullets and at distances under 400 yards, accuracy is "Good enough" although I have seen them fail to expand. I was never able to make them shoot any better than 1 to 1.5 moa.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rootmanslim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With as good as Barnes bullets are I don't know why anyone in their right minds would choose something else.</div></div>
Nothing is guaranteed or perfect. Shoot several thousand rounds down range and kill with several different bullet types, you'll start to develop a data base in your head and see first hand what works and what doesn’t. Barnes are great bullets and at distances under 400 yards, accuracy is "Good enough" although I have seen them fail to expand. I was never able to make them shoot any better than 1 to 1.5 moa.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rootmanslim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With as good as Barnes bullets are I don't know why anyone in their right minds would choose something else.
</div></div>
Because most of us shoot match grade bullets,a lot of match grade bullets,and hunt with what we are used to using,or very close to it.Shot placement kills.
Snipers Hide:For the Serious Tactical Marksman
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rootmanslim</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With as good as Barnes bullets are I don't know why anyone in their right minds would choose something else.
</div></div>
Because most of us shoot match grade bullets,a lot of match grade bullets,and hunt with what we are used to using,or very close to it.Shot placement kills.
Snipers Hide:For the Serious Tactical Marksman
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
The new world record Elk was killed with........
LMFAO!
The new world record Elk was killed with........
LMFAO!
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
The new world record Elk was killed with........
LMFAO!
BTW, don't bother responding to "Rootmanslim". It is a stolen user name from the past (on ebay). The person does not exist, does not live in Pinedale and is just some other wimp member hiding under a false flag. Typical of the ignored gang of 10 who offer nothing based on verifiable published facts. Anyone can get on the net and make any claim they want.
As I said there has been one detailed article published in a respected magazine on the use of Berger bullets on game in New Zealand. I doubt many of the "experts" have read it and are therefore unable to comment on real world results by men who are willing to put their credibility on the line in a reputable publication.
None of these dipwad internet experts can tell us why the use of match bullets on game is necessary, given the plethora of fine bullets actually designed for hunting.
It's just blah, blah and attack the messenger.
It's boring and a waste of time.
The new world record Elk was killed with........
LMFAO!
BTW, don't bother responding to "Rootmanslim". It is a stolen user name from the past (on ebay). The person does not exist, does not live in Pinedale and is just some other wimp member hiding under a false flag. Typical of the ignored gang of 10 who offer nothing based on verifiable published facts. Anyone can get on the net and make any claim they want.
As I said there has been one detailed article published in a respected magazine on the use of Berger bullets on game in New Zealand. I doubt many of the "experts" have read it and are therefore unable to comment on real world results by men who are willing to put their credibility on the line in a reputable publication.
None of these dipwad internet experts can tell us why the use of match bullets on game is necessary, given the plethora of fine bullets actually designed for hunting.
It's just blah, blah and attack the messenger.
It's boring and a waste of time.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This one time....at Craig Boddington Camp.......
</div></div>
too funny...
Humble,
I bet nothing else would have worked right...dipshit
NZ, has always been the proving grounds as well.. good Lord you're ignorant.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This one time....at Craig Boddington Camp.......
</div></div>
too funny...
Humble,
I bet nothing else would have worked right...dipshit
NZ, has always been the proving grounds as well.. good Lord you're ignorant.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Guys, the original post was... about Berger 185 VLDs.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mk4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Any experiences here? </div></div>
Let's not go crazy. Yes that topic has been covered before. But give the guy a benefit of the doubt.
Mk4: learn to scroll back through the previous pages of this forum to find older threads if you have trouble with the search function.
<span style="font-weight: bold">TO ALL OTHERS: Learn to go easy on the personal attacks... Period.</span>
Guys, the original post was... about Berger 185 VLDs.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mk4</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Any experiences here? </div></div>
Let's not go crazy. Yes that topic has been covered before. But give the guy a benefit of the doubt.
Mk4: learn to scroll back through the previous pages of this forum to find older threads if you have trouble with the search function.
<span style="font-weight: bold">TO ALL OTHERS: Learn to go easy on the personal attacks... Period.</span>
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The new world record Elk was killed with........
LMFAO!
BTW, don't bother responding to "Rootmanslim". It is a stolen user name from the past (on ebay). The person does not exist, does not live in Pinedale and is just some other wimp member hiding under a false flag. Typical of the ignored gang of 10 who offer nothing based on verifiable published facts. Anyone can get on the net and make any claim they want.
As I said there has been one detailed article published in a respected magazine on the use of Berger bullets on game in New Zealand. I doubt many of the "experts" have read it and are therefore unable to comment on real world results by men who are willing to put their credibility on the line in a reputable publication.
None of these dipwad internet experts can tell us why the use of match bullets on game is necessary, given the plethora of fine bullets actually designed for hunting.
It's just blah, blah and attack the messenger.
It's boring and a waste of time. </div></div>
I think you have me confused with someone else. Here is my account on TDR: http://www.turbodieselregister.com/forum...tml#post2083513
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The new world record Elk was killed with........
LMFAO!
BTW, don't bother responding to "Rootmanslim". It is a stolen user name from the past (on ebay). The person does not exist, does not live in Pinedale and is just some other wimp member hiding under a false flag. Typical of the ignored gang of 10 who offer nothing based on verifiable published facts. Anyone can get on the net and make any claim they want.
As I said there has been one detailed article published in a respected magazine on the use of Berger bullets on game in New Zealand. I doubt many of the "experts" have read it and are therefore unable to comment on real world results by men who are willing to put their credibility on the line in a reputable publication.
None of these dipwad internet experts can tell us why the use of match bullets on game is necessary, given the plethora of fine bullets actually designed for hunting.
It's just blah, blah and attack the messenger.
It's boring and a waste of time. </div></div>
I think you have me confused with someone else. Here is my account on TDR: http://www.turbodieselregister.com/forum...tml#post2083513
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys, the original post was... about Berger 185 VLDs.</div></div>
Agreed, I haven't ever used the 185 VLD and after the respectful explanations here I think I'd like to give them a try. Thanks for your help guys.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys, the original post was... about Berger 185 VLDs.</div></div>
Agreed, I haven't ever used the 185 VLD and after the respectful explanations here I think I'd like to give them a try. Thanks for your help guys.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
I don't have you confused with anyone else. You know that is NOT your account on TDR. If it is, post a current picture of the truck taken from the rear quarter..... I can because it is my account and my truck, you can't because you are a liar and a coward. Put up or shut up and BTW I am reporting you to the moderator as a "false flag" member.
I don't have you confused with anyone else. You know that is NOT your account on TDR. If it is, post a current picture of the truck taken from the rear quarter..... I can because it is my account and my truck, you can't because you are a liar and a coward. Put up or shut up and BTW I am reporting you to the moderator as a "false flag" member.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
Personally I hunt with Nosler Partitions. Not that they are better than some of the newer brand models. But several years back I bought a BUNCH of them for what I was using at the time.
Again, PERSONALLY I don't hunt anything bigger than ground hogs or crows with a hollow point bullet. I have lost several white tail deer shot in the chest with SMKs. After someone else killed 2 of them I asked if I could chase down my bullets. One exploded on the skin and the other exploded on a rib. Neither made anywhere near full penetration and exit. I have never had to shoot any animal more than once using the Nosler Partitions. That's from 90 yards to 425 yards. But when money frees up a bit, I'm thinking about checking out some of the new Barnes "X" bullets and the Schirroco (?) A frame bullets. I'll run them through the inspection instruments and see what does what.
My way of thinking is why spend all the money on the gear, permits, range time, time from work and everything else and NOT take the deadliest bullet for the game you're after???
Personally I hunt with Nosler Partitions. Not that they are better than some of the newer brand models. But several years back I bought a BUNCH of them for what I was using at the time.
Again, PERSONALLY I don't hunt anything bigger than ground hogs or crows with a hollow point bullet. I have lost several white tail deer shot in the chest with SMKs. After someone else killed 2 of them I asked if I could chase down my bullets. One exploded on the skin and the other exploded on a rib. Neither made anywhere near full penetration and exit. I have never had to shoot any animal more than once using the Nosler Partitions. That's from 90 yards to 425 yards. But when money frees up a bit, I'm thinking about checking out some of the new Barnes "X" bullets and the Schirroco (?) A frame bullets. I'll run them through the inspection instruments and see what does what.
My way of thinking is why spend all the money on the gear, permits, range time, time from work and everything else and NOT take the deadliest bullet for the game you're after???
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't have you confused with anyone else. You know that is NOT your account on TDR. If it is, post a current picture of the truck taken from the rear quarter..... I can because it is my account and my truck, you can't because you are a liar and a coward. Put up or shut up and BTW I am reporting you to the moderator as a "false flag" member. </div></div>
I read some of your posts and I think you have really stooped to a new low. You're not even in Pinedale, your profile even says so.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't have you confused with anyone else. You know that is NOT your account on TDR. If it is, post a current picture of the truck taken from the rear quarter..... I can because it is my account and my truck, you can't because you are a liar and a coward. Put up or shut up and BTW I am reporting you to the moderator as a "false flag" member. </div></div>
I read some of your posts and I think you have really stooped to a new low. You're not even in Pinedale, your profile even says so.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rootmanslim</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't have you confused with anyone else. You know that is NOT your account on TDR. If it is, post a current picture of the truck taken from the rear quarter..... I can because it is my account and my truck, you can't because you are a liar and a coward. Put up or shut up and BTW I am reporting you to the moderator as a "false flag" member. </div></div>
I read some of your posts and I think you have really stooped to a new low. You're not even in Pinedale, your profile even says so. </div></div>
"Rootmanslim" has been caught and banned. I asked for and saw the proof.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rootmanslim</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mr. Humble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't have you confused with anyone else. You know that is NOT your account on TDR. If it is, post a current picture of the truck taken from the rear quarter..... I can because it is my account and my truck, you can't because you are a liar and a coward. Put up or shut up and BTW I am reporting you to the moderator as a "false flag" member. </div></div>
I read some of your posts and I think you have really stooped to a new low. You're not even in Pinedale, your profile even says so. </div></div>
"Rootmanslim" has been caught and banned. I asked for and saw the proof.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">. But when money frees up a bit, I'm thinking about checking out some of the new Barnes "X" bullets and the Schirroco (?) A frame bullets. I'll run them through the inspection instruments and see what does what.
My way of thinking is why spend all the money on the gear, permits, range time, time from work and everything else and NOT take the deadliest bullet for the game you're after???</div></div>
That's certainly an excellent point Victor.
I have nothing but great things from guys (and girls for that matter) that have used the Scirocco.
I actually quite liked 858's idea of using the NBT for practice and then dropping the Accubond on top of whatever loads shoots out of your gun well. An economical way of going about getting the proper amount of practice to make a 'ethical' long shot, and to have perhaps, and I do say perhaps a better bullet for the ultimate end task.
I think there have been plenty of guys here that have demonstrated thru REAL world experience that the VLD, SMK, and A-Max all work and work quite well if the DRIVER of the stick is up to the task. elkhuntinguide, jeffbird, PGS, and roscoe all come to mind.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone who disputes the fact that the chance of wounding an animal at those ranges is far greater than at 300 or less is just dead wrong. Further, it would appear they lack basic hunting skills a or are just to lazy to get out of the truck or off the ATV to actually stalk the animal. One wonders how archers actually kill animals at 40 yards or less that, according to the "experts" are impossible to approach closer than 1000 yards.</div></div>
There are a whole host of assumptions in there that may or may not be correct. For one thing I do not EVER remember hearing a single person here ever (not once) say that its impossible to approach closer than a 1000 yards. Not sure how you are able to just 'assume' that people are 'lazy' or are even on ATV's (I myself don't own one).
It's interesting that the subject of archers is brought up because I would say it requires a great degree of skill to 1.) shoot a big Elk with a bow at 25 yards and make a shot kill 2.) it also requires a great degree of skill to shoot an Elk at 600+ and get a one shot kill. And yet, only once approach is somehow 'valid'?
Point being is that there are probably plenty of people that shouldn't shoot anything with a bow at 25 yards, at 75 yards with a rifle, and at 800 yards with a rifle. So, its the people, not the technique.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">. But when money frees up a bit, I'm thinking about checking out some of the new Barnes "X" bullets and the Schirroco (?) A frame bullets. I'll run them through the inspection instruments and see what does what.
My way of thinking is why spend all the money on the gear, permits, range time, time from work and everything else and NOT take the deadliest bullet for the game you're after???</div></div>
That's certainly an excellent point Victor.
I have nothing but great things from guys (and girls for that matter) that have used the Scirocco.
I actually quite liked 858's idea of using the NBT for practice and then dropping the Accubond on top of whatever loads shoots out of your gun well. An economical way of going about getting the proper amount of practice to make a 'ethical' long shot, and to have perhaps, and I do say perhaps a better bullet for the ultimate end task.
I think there have been plenty of guys here that have demonstrated thru REAL world experience that the VLD, SMK, and A-Max all work and work quite well if the DRIVER of the stick is up to the task. elkhuntinguide, jeffbird, PGS, and roscoe all come to mind.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Anyone who disputes the fact that the chance of wounding an animal at those ranges is far greater than at 300 or less is just dead wrong. Further, it would appear they lack basic hunting skills a or are just to lazy to get out of the truck or off the ATV to actually stalk the animal. One wonders how archers actually kill animals at 40 yards or less that, according to the "experts" are impossible to approach closer than 1000 yards.</div></div>
There are a whole host of assumptions in there that may or may not be correct. For one thing I do not EVER remember hearing a single person here ever (not once) say that its impossible to approach closer than a 1000 yards. Not sure how you are able to just 'assume' that people are 'lazy' or are even on ATV's (I myself don't own one).
It's interesting that the subject of archers is brought up because I would say it requires a great degree of skill to 1.) shoot a big Elk with a bow at 25 yards and make a shot kill 2.) it also requires a great degree of skill to shoot an Elk at 600+ and get a one shot kill. And yet, only once approach is somehow 'valid'?
Point being is that there are probably plenty of people that shouldn't shoot anything with a bow at 25 yards, at 75 yards with a rifle, and at 800 yards with a rifle. So, its the people, not the technique.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
On swapping bullets on a proven load... I tried it several years ago. There are very small differences between bullet models as well as makers. I found out the hard way that switching isn't very safe. Drop a few grains powder and work back up using the new bullets. I blew a primer and got my glasses singed a bit. Everything didn't go down into the trigger like it was thought to. The primer blew in the corner of the cup near the outside of the primer pocket. Good thing my glasses were prescription safety glasses.
On swapping bullets on a proven load... I tried it several years ago. There are very small differences between bullet models as well as makers. I found out the hard way that switching isn't very safe. Drop a few grains powder and work back up using the new bullets. I blew a primer and got my glasses singed a bit. Everything didn't go down into the trigger like it was thought to. The primer blew in the corner of the cup near the outside of the primer pocket. Good thing my glasses were prescription safety glasses.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Victor, do you remember what you switched for what?
I believe Nosler says use the same data for both the bullets in question.
Thank you!
</div></div>
The NBT and the Accubond are interchangeable.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Victor, do you remember what you switched for what?
I believe Nosler says use the same data for both the bullets in question.
Thank you!
</div></div>
The NBT and the Accubond are interchangeable.
Re: Berger 308 185 VLD for Hunting?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Victor, do you remember what you switched for what?
I believe Nosler says use the same data for both the bullets in question.
Thank you!
</div></div>
The NBT and the Accubond are interchangeable. </div></div>
I would surmise that the jacket material and the bearing surface lengths are the same then? Thank you sir!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JLM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Victor, do you remember what you switched for what?
I believe Nosler says use the same data for both the bullets in question.
Thank you!
</div></div>
The NBT and the Accubond are interchangeable. </div></div>
I would surmise that the jacket material and the bearing surface lengths are the same then? Thank you sir!
