- Thread starter Im2bent
- Start date
If my grandmother was still alive, I’m pretty sure she’d pick that post-menopausal grape color.
Maybe if Scott at Liberty can somehow bring them in I bet he could probably sell them for $1500 or less.
The biggest difference between the Zeiss S3 and G3 Razor that matters the most to me is their vastly different warranties. The Vortex is no questions asked lifetime bumper to bumper including their electronics and Vortex even sends you a prepaid shipping label if and when you need to send it in for warranty and their quick turnaround time while the Zeiss only has a 5 year limited warranty on their electronics (illuminated reticles) and does Zeiss send a prepaid shipping whenever they need warranty and how long do they take to repair what's the turnaround time? The out if pocket shipping with full insurance for it's value is $80-$100 right there whenever you need to send it in for warranty and after their 5 years warranty expires, how much do they actually charge to fix their electronics or will they even have that repair option assuming the customer pays for all the parts and labor and shipping?
I would rather choose the lighter weight Element Theo's 6-36x56 instead which has a lifetime warranty including their electronics next time they go on sale for $1900 or less if weight was a concern, it's probably the lightest in it's class. If they try to screw you over not honoring their written lifetime warranty there's the internet and forums and YouTube comments to grieve about it then they will make it right. They're known for trying to pull a fast one saying within specs nothing was wrong until you squawk about it publicly. I honestly don't like their previous Element Optics scopes TBH and feel they aren't a good value for the prices they charge below average quality but the new Theos has my attention only when they go on sale for around $1900 or less or when certain dealers offer their half price promo sale as they did before for their other Element Optics scopes.
I'd really like to compare it side by side to the G3 Razor 6-36x56 and Sightron SVIII 5-40x56. The draw is the lighter than average weight (weighs like an Athlon Cronus 4.5-29x56) and lifetime warranty including their electronics.
The G3 razor compares more to the S5, not the S3. I have played with both, not really that impressed with either, and not a fan of their reticles. I know Rob loves them , but The only optics I have shot/owned/seen that are better than the G3 from a pure performance perspective are ZCO, Tangent and Minox.
Yeah, I’m not a real big fan of the red accents…When’s the all black XTR Pro showing up
Knowing that they'll give me a brand new scope if it's fucked is what matters... if it's all they have, I'm fine with grape.
This cannot be said too many times.
I've had to send my Tangents in twice this year. First time to the tune of $600. I'm still waiting on the bill for the second. Sold the first one and picked up a G3 Razor in black. I'll gladly roll with them for their CS and warranty.
Curious what happened to them and why they charged you so much? Reticle change?
Lense replacement. I had a scratch in my objective lense. It wasn't a defect on their end but it's a hard pill to swallow when Vortex will take care of you no questions asked.
What does it take to scratch an obj lens? Transportation?
Gotcha. One of the big reasons I went from ZCO to Vortex. The fast turn around and no questions CS cant be beat.(i had to use it recently, week turn around from shipping out to back to me) I thought about buying another tangent, and still may, but shit like this is what keeps me from spending 3x as much as a g3 razor on one.
I honestly haven't the slightest idea. Always transported with caps on and cole tac rifle caddie.
So was it a scratch or a crack? Wouldnt be the first one to crack going from warm to cold and back again.
It looked like a scratch to me. I actually had to have my DFAT adapter screwed in to see it clearly. Without the adapter I could just barely pick it up.
Lifetime accidental damage totally free replacements no questions asked. How many other company brands actually offer this type of guarantee for life? Plus they can even be bought for half price or even less through certain dealers.
It kind of makes paying even regular street prices for them worth it if you're accident prone or really rough with your equipment.
Paying $600 for an accidental scratched lens is a bummer. Even more bummers if the companies don't offer repairs even if customers offer to pay out of pocket to fix any expired or outside of warranty repairs.
I think keeping a spare scope or two just in case the main ones need service knowing its gonna take a long turnaround time to fix is a good idea to avoid down time for certain non Vortex brands. Even if you have a Leupold its good to have a spare on the side due to their 6-8 week minimum turn around repair time and other brands that take forever and a day to replace your scope under warranty.
Customers don't only prefer a hassle free no questions asked bumper to bumper type lifetime warranty including their electronics but minimal wait time as well. As stated many times Vortex even pays round trip shipping for warranty. That's at least $80-$100 shipping and full insurance saved compared to other brands that customers have to pay to ship and insure to send their scopes in for warranty.
I am really surprised even Arken is still paying and eating round trip shipping for their own customer warranty needs considering how cheap their scopes are selling for lately.
Either they're not making money, or the margins are so high on the lower end non razor stuff that it offsets the revenue loss. I'm betting their highest rates of return are on the cheaper stuff which they sell a pile of. I used to hate on vortex, even the gen1 and 2 razors, not a fan. But their gen3, and new rail mount lrf, are great. Innovation and performance that can be had at very good prices. I'm betting a razor level glass lrf bino with geo ballistics is right around the corner.
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Personally, I think it’s just good business…
Vortex’s higher end stuff like the Razor line is all pretty beefy, so it’s not like they all have to go back, but the way they handle things as compared to other companies turns customers with issues into loyal customers for life instead of turning them off.
…and yeah, they probably sell enough container ship’s worth of the lower end stuff to cover it.
Vortex’s higher end stuff like the Razor line is all pretty beefy, so it’s not like they all have to go back, but the way they handle things as compared to other companies turns customers with issues into loyal customers for life instead of turning them off.
…and yeah, they probably sell enough container ship’s worth of the lower end stuff to cover it.
Seems like it comes in handy when a retailer scams a pile of people too.
Did you mean when most customers happily and willingly choose to pay full price for them? Who don't even know they can actually be bought for way cheaper? Who probably have way too much extra disposable money to throw away to even bother looking for the cheapest places to buy them from or even try to negotiate better prices over the phone?
No, I mean when Scott at Liberty Optics takes payments for a pile of Vortex gear, never orders it, and disappears with everyone’s money….
Vortex is stepping in and looking after the victims of the scam as best they can with some awesome pricing etc to try and help everyone out. Not many companies that would do that!
WHAAAAT??? I'm guessing this must be some sort of a mistake. I know it takes around 3 months or longer to receive the G3 Razor once ordered through Scott.
I have spent tens of thousands through Scott over the years and not once did I not receive what I paid him for. In fact one of my last orders was for over 20k and it went without any hiccups and I have never had to nor even wanted return anything either since they were priced so ridiculously cheap.
Scott @ liberty optics did a massive sale banked all the money. Never paid vortex for the scopes. Shut off his website, disconnected his phone number, voluntary dissolved his LLC with Montana, then started deleting threads on here and locked his the main thread on SH. (Believe frank was able to undo the lock.).
Premeditated fraud that got a lot of us... Btw I'm out of charge back range and screwed. Its like 2 threads away from this one:
Liberty Optics Still Legit?
I've purchased optics from Liberty Optics before. This time around it's been 8 days and no word on shipping. I tried calling but the number provided in my order confirmation has been deactivated. Wondering if Liberty is still G2G or if people have been having issues with them? Thanks
www.snipershide.com I find this quite shocking. I've been doing business with Scott for nearly 4 years. I have 4 gen3 razor scopes, a LHT, an eotech thermal, furk 10k all through his company. He's always been a 100% stand up guy. He lives local to me, and I know him on a face to face basis. I'm not saying there isn't a greed that makes what you're saying impossible of happening, just mind blowing with my 100% positive history with Scott.Scott @ liberty optics did a massive sale banked all the money. Never paid vortex for the scopes. Shut off his website, disconnected his phone number, voluntary dissolved his LLC with Montana, then started deleting threads on here and locked his the main thread on SH. (Believe frank was able to undo the lock.).
That's why whenever I see a seller point me to their selling history and say trust me, don't use paypal protection, I quickly end it. Your online reputation means nothing to me. Any user here at any point can give a big F you and take your money. But what do I know.
You do know about the other thread about this, right?
Liberty Optics Still Legit?
I've purchased optics from Liberty Optics before. This time around it's been 8 days and no word on shipping. I tried calling but the number provided in my order confirmation has been deactivated. Wondering if Liberty is still G2G or if people have been having issues with them? Thanks
www.snipershide.com Man even you don't even see any history of screwing the customers over either over the years.
I just read it. I might have to drive by the addresses listed in the thread. I know what vehicles he drives lol, unless that's been changed too. I still find this all hard to believe. I talked to him on the phone 3 weeks ago about a strike eagle for a friend of mine who's getting into the game.You do know about the other thread about this, right?
Liberty Optics Still Legit?
I've purchased optics from Liberty Optics before. This time around it's been 8 days and no word on shipping. I tried calling but the number provided in my order confirmation has been deactivated. Wondering if Liberty is still G2G or if people have been having issues with them? Thanks
If you gonna check it out there yourself at least bring someone with you. Think ahead regardless if you think you're still buddy buddies worse case scenario man.
I'd like to see if he's ok hopefully not high on meth, that's really scary stuff.
It's concerning when someone calls the house and a woman hangs up the phone when Scott's name is mentioned though.
Because you as a buyer can’t file a dispute saying you were sent a box of rocks and fuck the seller? It goes both ways and you can screw them just as easily, perhaps easier with PayPal. I dealt with a dick head on eBay who scammed me on a $1K chainsaw in a similar fashion. He claimed I sent him something else and not only did I lose my chainsaw, I also had to pay $70 for him to “return” the chainsaw and he sent me some old POS craftsman.
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Can I still get a black razor from Scott at LO?
Asking for a friend
Asking for a friend
Actually that has nothing to do with the warranty.
I'm sorry for all the guys getting screwed with this Scott Liberty Optics fiasco, I almost ordered a G3 from him as well. I just didn't feel like waiting... and it turns out my impatience actually helped me for once.
That said, what I don't feel bad about is now maybe all the other guys who didn't get their scopes from Scott (before he went sketchy/ rogue) won't have to get as beat up if they decide to sell one of theirs on the secondary market. I recently sold a Razor G2 and had to take a bit of a haircut even though I had initially listed it at a very fair price due to all the "why bother when you can get a G3 for $1800" posts all over the site... and it's been worse for guys selling G3s, I saw some jerks posting shit like that in their ads, and whether unintentionally or not, those guys have been getting screwed over by Scott and Liberty Optics for a while.
Thankfully, it looks like Vortex is stepping up to make things right for the peeps that got screwed, but honestly, if Vortex is going to honor the Liberty Optics sale price, in fairness, they should extend that deal to everyone else and offer some sort of refund to those who paid more to companies that weren't blatantly circumventing their established MAP policies in the first place... @Shamus Terry ?
That said, what I don't feel bad about is now maybe all the other guys who didn't get their scopes from Scott (before he went sketchy/ rogue) won't have to get as beat up if they decide to sell one of theirs on the secondary market. I recently sold a Razor G2 and had to take a bit of a haircut even though I had initially listed it at a very fair price due to all the "why bother when you can get a G3 for $1800" posts all over the site... and it's been worse for guys selling G3s, I saw some jerks posting shit like that in their ads, and whether unintentionally or not, those guys have been getting screwed over by Scott and Liberty Optics for a while.
Thankfully, it looks like Vortex is stepping up to make things right for the peeps that got screwed, but honestly, if Vortex is going to honor the Liberty Optics sale price, in fairness, they should extend that deal to everyone else and offer some sort of refund to those who paid more to companies that weren't blatantly circumventing their established MAP policies in the first place... @Shamus Terry ?
Vortex actually doesn't owe anyone anything. They are stepping up to help but there is no fairness in this situation that Vortex has to live up to. I would not expect the LO pricing when getting some sort of help from Vortex and they should definitely not be offering the LO pricing to anyone else other than the people who got caught up in this situation. Thinking they do is just ridiculous.
It's a business, not a charity.
That they choose to help a few people shouldnt equate to owing anyone anything.
I'm sure they deal with enough toxic fudds to not need this community demanding refunds and lower than MAP pricing. Shooting your mouth off is how we end up with price increases and shitty customer service.
That they choose to help a few people shouldnt equate to owing anyone anything.
I'm sure they deal with enough toxic fudds to not need this community demanding refunds and lower than MAP pricing. Shooting your mouth off is how we end up with price increases and shitty customer service.
Look, I want all the guys who lost money to get their money back. I don't really have a dog in this fight and actually qualify for Vortex's LEO discount (though I've never used it because it's always required going on a backorder/waiting list).
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I do too but the liability does not fall on Vortex and then trying to extend any help they will give the people involved to those who bought elsewhere is just plain wrong.
This is true and I agree with you.
But, I'm not "shooting my mouth off" or demanding anything, just pointing out the fact that there are a lot of guys out here who bought scopes from vendors that weren't flouting Vortex's policies... and as I type this, not sure there's any way to make things fair for everybody here.
Yeah, you've made it clear a market price that was paid and agreed to at the time wasn't fair. Got it. It definitely comes off in a real negative way.
Just FYI, the Liberty Optics July 4th sale price was within a couple percent of the LE/mil/vet sale price at Euro Optic was running about the same time, and a few times a year expert voice has comparable pricing as well... So it's not like the pricing was substantially different than what is available at other vendors provided you meet the criteria.
The difference with Scott's sale price was that it was available to everyone and not just LE/mil/veteran/first responder.
Provided you actually received your scope... I'm in the "Scott submitted my order to vortex but didn't pay for it" camp, and I'm working with the credit card company and hoping to recover the money.
The difference with Scott's sale price was that it was available to everyone and not just LE/mil/veteran/first responder.
Provided you actually received your scope... I'm in the "Scott submitted my order to vortex but didn't pay for it" camp, and I'm working with the credit card company and hoping to recover the money.
Look, I didn't want to get into an endless back-and-forth about this. I haven't passed the bar and honestly have no idea what Vortex has to do or not in a situation like this (and suspect neither does anyone else).
Seems like a fucked-up situation all around.
Seems like a fucked-up situation all around.
See, that's an angle I didn't consider. That sucks and I'm sorry for those guys.
I was under the impression based on what was said in the other thread that Vortex was going to send scopes gratis to the guys who can't get their money back, and then honor the $1800 Liberty Optics sale price for the others that were able to get their money back. If I've got this fucked up... disregard what I said before.
This is one of those things where if I had a scope on order for $1800 and I'd been waiting I might be biased and feel differently...
I think everyone should be made whole here and the more Vortex is willing to do the better, good on them.
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It is a fucked up situation but what you typed is just wrong. Not everyone is entitled to the price LO was offering. Also you don't have to pass the bar to see that Vortex as a company has no liability at all in this. They just fill the orders sent in and then when paid by LO ship them out. Vortex does not have to do squat for anyone here and that they are trying to help shows they care about their customers. That doesn't entitle everyone who bought a scope from another vendor at a higher price the right to get some refund from Vortex for the difference. That is what it boils down to plain and simple. @Scott_at_Vortex and @Shamus Terry are going above and beyond anything they have to do either legally or morally. That is the take away from this situation.
This is legitimately the worst take I’ve seen on this situation.
