I am thinking about getting a level that mounts on my pic scope base. Is this really needed for long range shots(800yds+)? Does anyone have a suggestion on brand?
-Matt
-Matt
Rifle Scopes Bubble Level?
- Thread starter 105amatt
- Start date
Re: Bubble Level?
I like my training wheels.
I feel anything that lends consistency shot to shot can't hurt. I love my USO SN3 with the built in level.
I like my training wheels.
I feel anything that lends consistency shot to shot can't hurt. I love my USO SN3 with the built in level.
Re: Bubble Level?
I have been using the Flatline Ops level for a while and while I think it is pretty overpriced, I have to say its a great level. Very well thought out and stays in your FOV at all times. As long as both of your eyes are open that is.
I have been using the Flatline Ops level for a while and while I think it is pretty overpriced, I have to say its a great level. Very well thought out and stays in your FOV at all times. As long as both of your eyes are open that is.
Re: Bubble Level?
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69_313&products_id=2430
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69_67&products_id=460
Check those out ^ Holland's, US Optic, Flatline Ops, Etc...
I recently ordered one of the Holland's scope mounted levels, the rifle I'm putting it on doesn't have a rail.
If you use a ballistic plex or hold over on targets and your crosshairs are not level then your bullet impact can be off.
When I'm sighting in, I level the target with a construction type level, then make sure your rifle/scope is level and it will make a big difference. Give it a try and it should make sense to you.
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69_313&products_id=2430
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69_67&products_id=460
Check those out ^ Holland's, US Optic, Flatline Ops, Etc...
I recently ordered one of the Holland's scope mounted levels, the rifle I'm putting it on doesn't have a rail.
If you use a ballistic plex or hold over on targets and your crosshairs are not level then your bullet impact can be off.
When I'm sighting in, I level the target with a construction type level, then make sure your rifle/scope is level and it will make a big difference. Give it a try and it should make sense to you.
Re: Bubble Level?
Weaver makes a reasonable priced level that attach's to the picatinny mount.
$13 to $20 dollars at Optics Planet.
They also have other levels.
Weaver makes a reasonable priced level that attach's to the picatinny mount.
$13 to $20 dollars at Optics Planet.
They also have other levels.
Re: Bubble Level?
I don't have one right now... and man, you can tell the difference. All in all, the USO fixed level is the one that I would go with if the funds were available. $75 is not a bad price for what you get.
Although, I have done rather well with the cheapo B-Square level too. They can be used effectively, just don't be rough with them.
DK
I don't have one right now... and man, you can tell the difference. All in all, the USO fixed level is the one that I would go with if the funds were available. $75 is not a bad price for what you get.
Although, I have done rather well with the cheapo B-Square level too. They can be used effectively, just don't be rough with them.
DK
Re: Bubble Level?
I have the vortex bubble level on my 4x16 pst. I have it mounted on the scope behind the turrets by the objective. I can see it from any shooting position without moving my head. In fact,i can shoot with both eyes open--left eye on bubble, right eye on reticle. $39 ish from optics planet. So far, I highly recommend it!
I have the vortex bubble level on my 4x16 pst. I have it mounted on the scope behind the turrets by the objective. I can see it from any shooting position without moving my head. In fact,i can shoot with both eyes open--left eye on bubble, right eye on reticle. $39 ish from optics planet. So far, I highly recommend it!
Re: Bubble Level?
My favorite bubble level is inside one of the scope I own. Its a FFP springfield armory 4-14x50.
I always wondered why this ide did not take off in other high end scopes. I love it in the SA scope.
If NF put this in their line up, Id be set.
My favorite bubble level is inside one of the scope I own. Its a FFP springfield armory 4-14x50.
I always wondered why this ide did not take off in other high end scopes. I love it in the SA scope.
If NF put this in their line up, Id be set.
Re: Bubble Level?
Hollands scope mounted=50 bucks well spent. I can see the bubble superimposed in the reticle if keeping both eyes open. I like not having to move from my cheekweld.
RT
Hollands scope mounted=50 bucks well spent. I can see the bubble superimposed in the reticle if keeping both eyes open. I like not having to move from my cheekweld.
RT
Re: Bubble Level?
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69_67&products_id=2431
^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^
This is the Holland's one that I ordered. Mine will be on a hunting rig so I like that there are no sharp edges and the level is not sticking way out to snag on stuff and it looks fairly well protected. $50
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69_67&products_id=2431
^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^
This is the Holland's one that I ordered. Mine will be on a hunting rig so I like that there are no sharp edges and the level is not sticking way out to snag on stuff and it looks fairly well protected. $50
Re: Bubble Level?
I've tried the cheapie that sits on the mount and sticks out the side but found that they aren't always right. They also will slightly change depending on how tight you tighten the screw. I prefer the one that fits on the scope and have them on both our long range guns. For us glancing up over the eyepiece isn't a problem to double check for level but for a rifle shooter it might take a change in your way of setting up for the shot.
It's been the most accurate for me after setting the scope up perfect after tracking it in then aligning the bubble last. I don't think they are as important at closer distances but start stretching it out to 1000 and beyond and that slight cant can be the difference between a hit and a miss.
Topstrap
I've tried the cheapie that sits on the mount and sticks out the side but found that they aren't always right. They also will slightly change depending on how tight you tighten the screw. I prefer the one that fits on the scope and have them on both our long range guns. For us glancing up over the eyepiece isn't a problem to double check for level but for a rifle shooter it might take a change in your way of setting up for the shot.
It's been the most accurate for me after setting the scope up perfect after tracking it in then aligning the bubble last. I don't think they are as important at closer distances but start stretching it out to 1000 and beyond and that slight cant can be the difference between a hit and a miss.
Topstrap
Re: Bubble Level?
i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint)
i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint)
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slothlacrosse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint) </div></div>
Surgeon made some rings like this but stopped for some reason. They are still floating around out there though.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slothlacrosse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint) </div></div>
Surgeon made some rings like this but stopped for some reason. They are still floating around out there though.
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Topstrap</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've tried the cheapie that sits on the mount and sticks out the side but found that they aren't always right. They also will slightly change depending on how tight you tighten the screw. I prefer the one that fits on the scope and have them on both our long range guns. For us glancing up over the eyepiece isn't a problem to double check for level but for a rifle shooter it might take a change in your way of setting up for the shot.
It's been the most accurate for me after setting the scope up perfect after tracking it in then aligning the bubble last. I don't think they are as important at closer distances but start stretching it out to 1000 and beyond and that slight cant can be the difference between a hit and a miss.
Topstrap </div></div>
those are some high rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Topstrap</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've tried the cheapie that sits on the mount and sticks out the side but found that they aren't always right. They also will slightly change depending on how tight you tighten the screw. I prefer the one that fits on the scope and have them on both our long range guns. For us glancing up over the eyepiece isn't a problem to double check for level but for a rifle shooter it might take a change in your way of setting up for the shot.
It's been the most accurate for me after setting the scope up perfect after tracking it in then aligning the bubble last. I don't think they are as important at closer distances but start stretching it out to 1000 and beyond and that slight cant can be the difference between a hit and a miss.
Topstrap </div></div>
those are some high rings
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: macman2564</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slothlacrosse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint) </div></div>
Surgeon made some rings like this but stopped for some reason. They are still floating around out there though. </div></div>
with the backlog of 591s and they are going to make rings?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: macman2564</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slothlacrosse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint) </div></div>
Surgeon made some rings like this but stopped for some reason. They are still floating around out there though. </div></div>
with the backlog of 591s and they are going to make rings?
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slothlacrosse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint) </div></div> Actually, Flatline Ops does make such an animal http://www.flatlineops.com/levels/mark4-leupold
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slothlacrosse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i've always wondered why somebody didn't make a replacement for the top for a Mark 4 scope ring with a level built in (hint hint) </div></div> Actually, Flatline Ops does make such an animal http://www.flatlineops.com/levels/mark4-leupold
Re: Bubble Level?
Don't buy the Vortex level. It's not very good quailty. I ended up buying the Hollands and it's much better. Also the Vortex won't fit under my Badger standard rings witout touching the rail.
Don't buy the Vortex level. It's not very good quailty. I ended up buying the Hollands and it's much better. Also the Vortex won't fit under my Badger standard rings witout touching the rail.
Re: Bubble Level?
every body has favorites, but ANY bubble level is better than nothing! I happen to have a USO and a Flatline and im getting ready to buy a couple more and i think i will buy flatline again. They are a bit more dough but i like the versatility with the two position availability.
Im buying a Vortex to try out as well as i figured WTH?
every body has favorites, but ANY bubble level is better than nothing! I happen to have a USO and a Flatline and im getting ready to buy a couple more and i think i will buy flatline again. They are a bit more dough but i like the versatility with the two position availability.
Im buying a Vortex to try out as well as i figured WTH?
Re: Bubble Level?
The Vortex looks kinda cheap, has sharp edges and the finish/coating looks slim whatever it is, cheap anodizing maybe. Don't have mine yet but for the $50 range the Holland's just looked nicer.
The Vortex looks kinda cheap, has sharp edges and the finish/coating looks slim whatever it is, cheap anodizing maybe. Don't have mine yet but for the $50 range the Holland's just looked nicer.
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
with the backlog of 591s and they are going to make rings? </div></div>
What backlog?
I got mine shipped in less than a week direct from Surgeon earlier this month...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
with the backlog of 591s and they are going to make rings? </div></div>
What backlog?
I got mine shipped in less than a week direct from Surgeon earlier this month...
Re: Bubble Level?
There is a thread on here somewhere that someone else posted that shows how even a small cant will cause you to miss. Some experienced shooters may find they don't need one for long range competition but I like it to just give another way to double check that your crosshairs are perfect every shot. Some might line up on the post the target is hung from but what if that post isn't straight? Just cheap insurance to help make it right.
Yup, they are a bit taller than what most would use but we've found that the ring height doesn't matter and these really are comfortable at that height when we get lined up. These are on my sons new gun and we used those particular rings so they matched up with my gun for heights since I used a different mount on mine and we can use the same settings from JBM.
Don't know where that it says the scope has to be sitting on top of the barrel, it hasn't affected us or our trajectory out to 1000 yards. There might be a slight chance it can affect cant if not perfectly level when increasing elevation at farther distances but if it tracks right and charts work right then we're happy.
Topstrap
There is a thread on here somewhere that someone else posted that shows how even a small cant will cause you to miss. Some experienced shooters may find they don't need one for long range competition but I like it to just give another way to double check that your crosshairs are perfect every shot. Some might line up on the post the target is hung from but what if that post isn't straight? Just cheap insurance to help make it right.
Yup, they are a bit taller than what most would use but we've found that the ring height doesn't matter and these really are comfortable at that height when we get lined up. These are on my sons new gun and we used those particular rings so they matched up with my gun for heights since I used a different mount on mine and we can use the same settings from JBM.
Don't know where that it says the scope has to be sitting on top of the barrel, it hasn't affected us or our trajectory out to 1000 yards. There might be a slight chance it can affect cant if not perfectly level when increasing elevation at farther distances but if it tracks right and charts work right then we're happy.
Topstrap
Re: Bubble Level?
The military version has an indexing mark on the body of the level so the shooter can tell if the level has been bumped and shifted out of position. The shooter would have to mark his scope body with a corresponding mark once the level is set in place.
The military version has an indexing mark on the body of the level so the shooter can tell if the level has been bumped and shifted out of position. The shooter would have to mark his scope body with a corresponding mark once the level is set in place.
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Badshot308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The military version has an indexing mark on the body of the level so the shooter can tell if the level has been bumped and shifted out of position. <span style="text-decoration: underline">The shooter would have to mark his scope body with a corresponding mark once the level is set in place. </span> </div></div>Good call, I make marks on my bow sight for the same reason. Makes good sense to make hash marks on the level and scope. Thanks haha
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Badshot308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The military version has an indexing mark on the body of the level so the shooter can tell if the level has been bumped and shifted out of position. <span style="text-decoration: underline">The shooter would have to mark his scope body with a corresponding mark once the level is set in place. </span> </div></div>Good call, I make marks on my bow sight for the same reason. Makes good sense to make hash marks on the level and scope. Thanks haha
Re: Bubble Level?
No pictures, I emailed them a while back about the military model and that's what they told me.
No pictures, I emailed them a while back about the military model and that's what they told me.
Re: Bubble Level?
Some can shoot effectively without them and consider them unnecessary. I feel that they add another level on consistency to your shooting and I choose to use them. I, however, passed on the version that attaches to the rail and opted for the ring mount style. I have the USO ring mount swivel model on my SN-3 and the Holland 34mm Ring on my Premier.
Some can shoot effectively without them and consider them unnecessary. I feel that they add another level on consistency to your shooting and I choose to use them. I, however, passed on the version that attaches to the rail and opted for the ring mount style. I have the USO ring mount swivel model on my SN-3 and the Holland 34mm Ring on my Premier.
Re: Bubble Level?
There was a thread on here not too long ago about the USO level. A lot of people had complaints about it as far as price vs quality. I don't have any experience with the USO levels so I can't quantify any of these opinions but the thread is worth checking out.
There was a thread on here not too long ago about the USO level. A lot of people had complaints about it as far as price vs quality. I don't have any experience with the USO levels so I can't quantify any of these opinions but the thread is worth checking out.
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GardDog223</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some can shoot effectively without them and consider them unnecessary. I feel that they add another level on consistency to your shooting and I choose to use them. I, however, passed on the version that attaches to the rail and opted for the ring mount style. I have the USO ring mount swivel model on my SN-3 and the Holland 34mm Ring on my Premier. </div></div>
I think as long as you achieve consistancy with them you are golden.
So, I agree.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GardDog223</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some can shoot effectively without them and consider them unnecessary. I feel that they add another level on consistency to your shooting and I choose to use them. I, however, passed on the version that attaches to the rail and opted for the ring mount style. I have the USO ring mount swivel model on my SN-3 and the Holland 34mm Ring on my Premier. </div></div>
I think as long as you achieve consistancy with them you are golden.
So, I agree.
Re: Bubble Level?
Probably not the most cost effective option but they look great, are the spuhr rings.
http://www.spuhr.com/
Probably not the most cost effective option but they look great, are the spuhr rings.
http://www.spuhr.com/
Re: Bubble Level?
are there any other levels other then the flatline, us opt or holland out there
Maybe badger should make one hint hint hint Marty
are there any other levels other then the flatline, us opt or holland out there
Maybe badger should make one hint hint hint Marty
Re: Bubble Level?
These will work fine. Pick your size.
http://www.adorama.com/SearchSite/Default.aspx?searchinfo=vortex%20level
These will work fine. Pick your size.
http://www.adorama.com/SearchSite/Default.aspx?searchinfo=vortex%20level
Re: Bubble Level?
I don't own either the Vortex or Holland's, but there is apparently just a nickle's worth ($.05) of difference in them:
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2431
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2247
(at least from LRS. You may find a bigger price difference elsewhere)
I don't own either the Vortex or Holland's, but there is apparently just a nickle's worth ($.05) of difference in them:
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2431
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2247
(at least from LRS. You may find a bigger price difference elsewhere)
Re: Bubble Level?
I never see the vials radius or the 2mm sensitivity listed on these things. I would
think a gun with a 400 inch drop at a 1000 it is going to cause a greater error
than a cartridge that drops 280 or so. Common vials can range from 30mm radius
to 100,000mm radius. The better ones start in the 4000mm range. They are accurate to around 2 moa. Has anyone done the math on minutes of cant verses
error? I found a thread. http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2179751 After reading it seems they don't have to
be even a good vial. Degree accuracy not minute is all that's needed.
I never see the vials radius or the 2mm sensitivity listed on these things. I would
think a gun with a 400 inch drop at a 1000 it is going to cause a greater error
than a cartridge that drops 280 or so. Common vials can range from 30mm radius
to 100,000mm radius. The better ones start in the 4000mm range. They are accurate to around 2 moa. Has anyone done the math on minutes of cant verses
error? I found a thread. http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2179751 After reading it seems they don't have to
be even a good vial. Degree accuracy not minute is all that's needed.
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ThrottleJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What level options are there for a trg22 using s&b 5-25 on 34mm sako optic mount? </div></div>
Sell the Sako mount and get a Spuhr 34mm mount for the TRG-22. Better mount and it has a built in level.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ThrottleJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What level options are there for a trg22 using s&b 5-25 on 34mm sako optic mount? </div></div>
Sell the Sako mount and get a Spuhr 34mm mount for the TRG-22. Better mount and it has a built in level.
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: John in WYO</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't own either the Vortex or Holland's, but there is apparently just a nickle's worth ($.05) of difference in them:
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2431
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2247
(at least from LRS. You may find a bigger price difference elsewhere)</div></div>
I have both, and perceive Holland's to be of better quality. But either will serve their purpose.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: John in WYO</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't own either the Vortex or Holland's, but there is apparently just a nickle's worth ($.05) of difference in them:
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2431
http://longrangesupply.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=69&products_id=2247
(at least from LRS. You may find a bigger price difference elsewhere)</div></div>
I have both, and perceive Holland's to be of better quality. But either will serve their purpose.
Re: Bubble Level?
I just bought the newly engineered USO swivel bubble level. It's nice but I've had to mount it as far forward on the scope base as possible...because at my age I can't focus my vision very closely. Even with it on the front of the base I am having trouble seeing it clearly. Does Brownells sell new eyes?
I just bought the newly engineered USO swivel bubble level. It's nice but I've had to mount it as far forward on the scope base as possible...because at my age I can't focus my vision very closely. Even with it on the front of the base I am having trouble seeing it clearly. Does Brownells sell new eyes?
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bazgab</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ThrottleJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What level options are there for a trg22 using s&b 5-25 on 34mm sako optic mount? </div></div>
Sell the Sako mount and get a Spuhr 34mm mount for the TRG-22. Better mount and it has a built in level.</div></div>
That's Not a bad idea. When I get 100 posts I may just offer the sako mount in the for sale section.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Bazgab</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ThrottleJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What level options are there for a trg22 using s&b 5-25 on 34mm sako optic mount? </div></div>
Sell the Sako mount and get a Spuhr 34mm mount for the TRG-22. Better mount and it has a built in level.</div></div>
That's Not a bad idea. When I get 100 posts I may just offer the sako mount in the for sale section.
Re: Bubble Level?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lexington</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just bought the newly engineered USO swivel bubble level. It's nice but I've had to mount it as far forward on the scope base as possible...because at my age I can't focus my vision very closely. Even with it on the front of the base I am having trouble seeing it clearly. Does Brownells sell new eyes? </div></div>
LOL- Don't feel bad. I have a USO level mounted nearly all the way forward on an AR-15 handguard because my eyes can focus on it better. It's probably 18"+ away from my head in the shooting position.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lexington</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just bought the newly engineered USO swivel bubble level. It's nice but I've had to mount it as far forward on the scope base as possible...because at my age I can't focus my vision very closely. Even with it on the front of the base I am having trouble seeing it clearly. Does Brownells sell new eyes? </div></div>
LOL- Don't feel bad. I have a USO level mounted nearly all the way forward on an AR-15 handguard because my eyes can focus on it better. It's probably 18"+ away from my head in the shooting position.
