Bulk Rifle Brass Processing Neck Expansion

[iflyskyhigh]

The Dillon trim/size die obviously WAY under sizes the neck.

When I was doing it on the 650 I was just using a Lyman M die for 223 and 300 BO after the size and trim.

Going to upgrade to an Apex 10, RL1100, or CP2000. Figured this was a good time to see if there was any better options?

Looked like FW Arms was going to come out with one, but seems like his business is in limbo.

Besides Might Amory, what expanders are you all running when processing rifle brass, specifically .223?

 

[MO Fugga]

Big fan of Forster Ultra.

 

[45-90]

When the case overall length needs to be trimmed, sometimes alot, in case forming, say a half inch off the parent case, and in a hurry with 1000 cases to be made...I prefer 3 phase power in a Bridgeport mill with a lever closing collet fixture...it just works, and in about a second is all it takes in cutting time to remove all that excess.

 

[Hoser]

I am using a Dillon 1100 with their trimmer.

This way I deprime, remove primer crimp, trim and then M Die for the neck.

For the 300 Whisper/Blackout, same deal other than a Bosch router for the trimming.

All that hooked up to a Mk7 autodrive.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

When the case overall length needs to be trimmed, sometimes alot, in case forming, say a half inch off the parent case, and in a hurry with 1000 cases to be made...I prefer 3 phase power in a Bridgeport mill with a lever closing collet fixture...it just works, and in about a second is all it takes in cutting time to remove all that excess.

Sorry. I didn’t specify.

I’m using an RT1500 with the Dillon Trim Die. Which of course doesn’t have an expander.

I was specifically asking about expanders.

 

[rjacobs]

This:

Expander Die Body

Expander Die Body Introducing the much anticipated Generation X Expander Die Body with viewing window! Set up of an expander die has not been easier! The viewing window allows the user to set the die to allow for optimal mandrel use without “bottoming out”. Machined out of 7075 Aluminum and...

21stcenturyinnovation.com

Plus whatever mandrel you need... in .0005 increments...


I process on a Dillon with their trim die and use this afterwords to set the neck. Dillon trim dies are cut with the same cutter as their sizing dies...which have a neck expanding ball in them, which obviously the trim die does not.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

I am using a Dillon 1100 with their trimmer.

This way I deprime, remove primer crimp, trim and then M Die for the neck.

For the 300 Whisper/Blackout, same deal other than a Bosch router for the trimming.

All that hooked up to a Mk7 autodrive.

M Die is what I’m currently using as well.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

This:

Expander Die Body

Expander Die Body Introducing the much anticipated Generation X Expander Die Body with viewing window! Set up of an expander die has not been easier! The viewing window allows the user to set the die to allow for optimal mandrel use without “bottoming out”. Machined out of 7075 Aluminum and...

21stcenturyinnovation.com

Plus whatever mandrel you need... in .0005 increments...


I process on a Dillon with their trim die and use this afterwords to set the neck. Dillon trim dies are cut with the same cutter as their sizing dies...which have a neck expanding ball in them, which obviously the trim die does not.

I’d looked at the 21st Century stuff for some precision rifle projects but ended up just getting the SAC die for the project.

I was wondering if something like the 21st or Whidden is worth the extra money over the Lyman M Die which I already own?

What size mandrel are you using on the 21st Century?

 

[rjacobs]

The M-die doesnt have any options for size IIRC... i.e. you order a .223, 308, etc... and you get what you get...

With the 21st century you can measure what you need for your neck tension and order that mandrel.

I have an m-die for 300blk loading since I load a lot of cast projectiles that need a case mouth flare.

ETA: I have no clue what size I am using. Its whatever I needed for neck tension after measuring fired brass from my gun. I only have one 6.5 and one .223 precision gun, so im not loading for multiple different types.

 

[99mpower]

Sorry. I didn’t specify.

I’m using an RT1500 with the Dillon Trim Die. Which of course doesn’t have an expander.

I was specifically asking about expanders.

as someone who processes metric tons of 223.. haha

Lyman M die in station 1 during loading.. easy button

 

[99mpower]

if you are loading more precision.. than buying proper mandrel is next best option

 

[iflyskyhigh]

The M-die doesnt have any options for size IIRC... i.e. you order a .223, 308, etc... and you get what you get...

With the 21st century you can measure what you need for your neck tension and order that mandrel.

I have an m-die for 300blk loading since I load a lot of cast projectiles that need a case mouth flare.

ETA: I have no clue what size I am using. Its whatever I needed for neck tension after measuring fired brass from my gun. I only have one 6.5 and one .223 precision gun, so im not loading for multiple different types.

Understood.

Thats why I originally got the Lyman M dies. Was to add a tiny bit of bell for loading .223/300BO on a the 650 with bullet feeder. I wasn’t actually using it when I was processing. I guess at the end of the day it doesn’t really matter at what point I use it.

My issue with the Lyman die was as you said, I still had more neck tension than I wanted. Hence the need for as you said, a specifically sized mandrel.

I’m going to add a mandrel style to the processing. And then if those cases end up on the 650 for bulk loading, I’ll still use the Lyman M dies for adding just a hint of flair for bullet seating.

Wish FW would have released his .223 expander. Not sure if he was planning on offering it in specific sizes but it looked like that would have been a good option.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

if you are loading more precision.. than buying proper mandrel is next best option

No sir. This is just bulk stuff. But I guess I am in essence still looking for specifically sized mandrel dies to give the neck tension I’m looking for. After the Dillon trim die, the Lyman M die just doesn’t open the neck back up enough.

 

[99mpower]

No sir. This is just bulk stuff. But I guess I am in essence still looking for specifically sized mandrel dies to give the neck tension I’m looking for. After the Dillon trim die, the Lyman M die just doesn’t open the neck back up enough.

not sure why you would say that... I run an M die during loading, and opens it plenty to actually hold 55/62gn FMJBT bullets, while loading on an automated machine, so its definitely opening the neck enough..

 

[Herb Stoner]

Here's what I use on my DIllon...

https://portersprecisionproducts.com/mandrel-dies/

 

[RegionRat]

If you prefer precise control over the ID after the trim die, then either of the 21Century or the Porter's is easy enough.

I also put a slight flare on the case mouth since the RT1500 is a straight cut.

You can flare just about any caliber with a Lee Universal Flare die.

This completely eliminates jacket scrapes without the need to chamfer. YMMV

 

[iflyskyhigh]

not sure why you would say that... I run an M die during loading, and opens it plenty to actually hold 55/62gn FMJBT bullets, while loading on an automated machine, so its definitely opening the neck enough..

I sent you a PM. It’s not inadequate tension. It works. Just still more neck tension than I find optimal for what I’m doing.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

Here's what I use on my DIllon...

https://portersprecisionproducts.com/mandrel-dies/

Not familiar with the Porter. I’ll look at it. Thank you.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

If you prefer precise control over the ID after the trim die, then either of the 21Century or the Porter's is easy enough.

I also put a slight flare on the case mouth since the RT1500 is a straight cut.

You can flare just about any caliber with a Lee Universal Flare die.

This completely eliminates jacket scrapes without the need to chamfer. YMMV

I wet tumble in stainless after sizing. Knocks the burrs off. Then I use the Lyman M die to flair a little for bullet seating with the Mr Bullet bullet feeder. Knocks any remaining burs off.

If the brass is going to be used for anything other than that run it through the Henderson Trimmer which makes a perfect chamfer and debur.

 

[iflyskyhigh]

I’ll look at the Porter,
Whidden and 21st Century. Thank you.