CETME as a sniper rifle
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Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
best thing i could do with mine was sell it. i think at its best its still not gonna be better than a dpms 308. i bought mine before the 308 ar craze or before they were as common. its been years. didnt have a front sight adjuster so i bough a scope. you gotta get a stock extender or a short scope. even a cheap 3-9x40 is too long. i found a no name 6x32 that was a nice fit. if you use a regular scope it will be too far back to you to shoulder the stock and get behind. at least thats my experience. look where the irons are, thats where your eye is designed to sight on that rifle. thats about where your scope needs to end. short eye relief is good, but dont let it bite you under recoil. also, true claw mounts dont all fit. H&K claw with a 4x32 or whatever heinsholdt they used would not fit my cetme, but my copy claw works flawlessly. but that took a little tweaking. get a mount that moves your scope forward, use a short scope, its never gonna be a psg-1 or close to what a good dpms would be. mine is a fun beast to shoot. i cant imagine it on full auto. i wonder how those skinny soldiers hold it when i see them in photos from africa.
not to discourage you, i looked and looked for stuff for mine. after finding a cheap FM scope that fit, i never took it back to see if it was a decent shooter. since i want to reload, even just for plinking probably, its just too hard on brass, and not something that has the customization options and accuracy potential of a good AR based 308 so i decided not to chase down that road. if i can help, just pm.
and ill sell you a back up gun cheap, lol
best thing i could do with mine was sell it. i think at its best its still not gonna be better than a dpms 308. i bought mine before the 308 ar craze or before they were as common. its been years. didnt have a front sight adjuster so i bough a scope. you gotta get a stock extender or a short scope. even a cheap 3-9x40 is too long. i found a no name 6x32 that was a nice fit. if you use a regular scope it will be too far back to you to shoulder the stock and get behind. at least thats my experience. look where the irons are, thats where your eye is designed to sight on that rifle. thats about where your scope needs to end. short eye relief is good, but dont let it bite you under recoil. also, true claw mounts dont all fit. H&K claw with a 4x32 or whatever heinsholdt they used would not fit my cetme, but my copy claw works flawlessly. but that took a little tweaking. get a mount that moves your scope forward, use a short scope, its never gonna be a psg-1 or close to what a good dpms would be. mine is a fun beast to shoot. i cant imagine it on full auto. i wonder how those skinny soldiers hold it when i see them in photos from africa.
not to discourage you, i looked and looked for stuff for mine. after finding a cheap FM scope that fit, i never took it back to see if it was a decent shooter. since i want to reload, even just for plinking probably, its just too hard on brass, and not something that has the customization options and accuracy potential of a good AR based 308 so i decided not to chase down that road. if i can help, just pm.
and ill sell you a back up gun cheap, lol
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
The words "CETME" and "PRECISION RIFLE" should never be used in the same sentence unless it is to say something akin to: "The CETME is anything BUT a Precision Rifle." OR "If you want a Precision Rifle, for God's sake don't buy a CETME!"
They are decent enough battle rifles, capable of 3MOA accuracy (give or take) with iron sights. Most of the CETME rifles I have seen lately have been pretty poorly built with some seriously bad welds, chewed up barrels and very poor fit/finish...none of which helps the rifle in terms of accuracy. The Century CETMEs are just pure garbage so don't even think about trying to "improve" one of their rifles if that is what you have. Regardless...you aren't going to get one close to a precision rifle no matter what scope you mount, modifications you make, etc.
If you must try, the first and best thing you can do is get Bill Springfield or Denny Williams to work over your trigger to get the creep out and the pull reduced to 4-5lbs instead of the factory 10-12lb pull that feels like dragging a block down a gravel road. Scoping your rifle may help you versus the irons...just depends on you. Using decent ammo (not foreign mil surplus crap), and assuming you can shoot...all this and you might get your groups shrunk down to 2MOA or so.
The words "CETME" and "PRECISION RIFLE" should never be used in the same sentence unless it is to say something akin to: "The CETME is anything BUT a Precision Rifle." OR "If you want a Precision Rifle, for God's sake don't buy a CETME!"
They are decent enough battle rifles, capable of 3MOA accuracy (give or take) with iron sights. Most of the CETME rifles I have seen lately have been pretty poorly built with some seriously bad welds, chewed up barrels and very poor fit/finish...none of which helps the rifle in terms of accuracy. The Century CETMEs are just pure garbage so don't even think about trying to "improve" one of their rifles if that is what you have. Regardless...you aren't going to get one close to a precision rifle no matter what scope you mount, modifications you make, etc.
If you must try, the first and best thing you can do is get Bill Springfield or Denny Williams to work over your trigger to get the creep out and the pull reduced to 4-5lbs instead of the factory 10-12lb pull that feels like dragging a block down a gravel road. Scoping your rifle may help you versus the irons...just depends on you. Using decent ammo (not foreign mil surplus crap), and assuming you can shoot...all this and you might get your groups shrunk down to 2MOA or so.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
I've run 2 of my buddy's , one scope one not, both shot great for the cost. They do a number on the brass but they were 1.5moa rifles & and they will eat any ammo - spit out the shell.
The triggers just suck but there are a couple places that will tune them down for you.
I've run 2 of my buddy's , one scope one not, both shot great for the cost. They do a number on the brass but they were 1.5moa rifles & and they will eat any ammo - spit out the shell.
The triggers just suck but there are a couple places that will tune them down for you.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
I have the HK91 and after trying several mounts I like the one shown here http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-Low-Profile-Scope-Mount-For-All-HK-Rifles-Pistols-MFI-5p762.htm
HK Parts is a good company and you can order with confidence.
I would suggest you try the rifle scoped and see what you can do. However, a "Sniper Rifle" it is not. If you truly want a percision rifle your time and money would be better spent on a different platform. A DM rifle maybe. I can smack steel targets at 500 yards with mine but on paper targets it is a sub two MOA rifle at best.
I have the HK91 and after trying several mounts I like the one shown here http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-Low-Profile-Scope-Mount-For-All-HK-Rifles-Pistols-MFI-5p762.htm
HK Parts is a good company and you can order with confidence.
I would suggest you try the rifle scoped and see what you can do. However, a "Sniper Rifle" it is not. If you truly want a percision rifle your time and money would be better spent on a different platform. A DM rifle maybe. I can smack steel targets at 500 yards with mine but on paper targets it is a sub two MOA rifle at best.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
does anyone know of anyone that fixes or has a wealth of knowlege about these? mine jammed a few times but 3 times out of 60 the one time i had it out. shells didnt clear. may have to go out and shoot it again and see what that scope will do. i still never got the sight tool.
does anyone know of anyone that fixes or has a wealth of knowlege about these? mine jammed a few times but 3 times out of 60 the one time i had it out. shells didnt clear. may have to go out and shoot it again and see what that scope will do. i still never got the sight tool.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AXEMAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know of anyone that fixes or has a wealth of knowlege about these? mine jammed a few times but 3 times out of 60 the one time i had it out. shells didnt clear. may have to go out and shoot it again and see what that scope will do. i still never got the sight tool. </div></div>
There is a huge amount of information on the CETME rifles and clones/builds on HKPro. You might start there. As for gunsmiths, any certified HK Armorer should be able to look at it for you, but be careful about taking it to just anyone. I have seen some mangled CETME rifles leave gunsmith shops with improper headspacing/bolt gap, broken trigger groups, etc.
Jamming only 3 out of 60 rounds sounds like it might be more of an ammo problem than a rifle problem, but without more info it is hard to tell. What type of ammo? Were you running different mags during that time? First/Last round jams? If not an ammo problem, it could be your ejector sitting too low in the bolt head. This is a pretty common CETME issue, but one that usually results in significantly more FTE problems than 3 out of 60. If that is it, you can solve the problem by shimming the front of the trigger pack so that the extractor rides higher and contacts with more of the rim of the spend case.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AXEMAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know of anyone that fixes or has a wealth of knowlege about these? mine jammed a few times but 3 times out of 60 the one time i had it out. shells didnt clear. may have to go out and shoot it again and see what that scope will do. i still never got the sight tool. </div></div>
There is a huge amount of information on the CETME rifles and clones/builds on HKPro. You might start there. As for gunsmiths, any certified HK Armorer should be able to look at it for you, but be careful about taking it to just anyone. I have seen some mangled CETME rifles leave gunsmith shops with improper headspacing/bolt gap, broken trigger groups, etc.
Jamming only 3 out of 60 rounds sounds like it might be more of an ammo problem than a rifle problem, but without more info it is hard to tell. What type of ammo? Were you running different mags during that time? First/Last round jams? If not an ammo problem, it could be your ejector sitting too low in the bolt head. This is a pretty common CETME issue, but one that usually results in significantly more FTE problems than 3 out of 60. If that is it, you can solve the problem by shimming the front of the trigger pack so that the extractor rides higher and contacts with more of the rim of the spend case.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
Big50 and Mark Graham in arizona are great HK plumbers and alot of knowledge, Bill springfield is the best triggerman for them.
Big50 and Mark Graham in arizona are great HK plumbers and alot of knowledge, Bill springfield is the best triggerman for them.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prairie Dog Dundee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have the HK91 and after trying several mounts I like the one shown here http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-Low-Profile-Scope-Mount-For-All-HK-Rifles-Pistols-MFI-5p762.htm
HK Parts is a good company and you can order with confidence.
I would suggest you try the rifle scoped and see what you can do. However, a "Sniper Rifle" it is not. If you truly want a percision rifle your time and money would be better spent on a different platform. A DM rifle maybe. I can smack steel targets at 500 yards with mine but on paper targets it is a sub two MOA rifle at best. </div></div>
The B-Square mount is also a good solid mount as well.
http://secure.armorholdings.com/b-square/hk.html
I agree with Dundee though. The 91 is fun to shoot but it's definitely not in the same class as a bolt gun in terms of accuracy.
+1 on the Williams trigger job. That's the best $65 you can spend on it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prairie Dog Dundee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have the HK91 and after trying several mounts I like the one shown here http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/HK-Low-Profile-Scope-Mount-For-All-HK-Rifles-Pistols-MFI-5p762.htm
HK Parts is a good company and you can order with confidence.
I would suggest you try the rifle scoped and see what you can do. However, a "Sniper Rifle" it is not. If you truly want a percision rifle your time and money would be better spent on a different platform. A DM rifle maybe. I can smack steel targets at 500 yards with mine but on paper targets it is a sub two MOA rifle at best. </div></div>
The B-Square mount is also a good solid mount as well.
http://secure.armorholdings.com/b-square/hk.html
I agree with Dundee though. The 91 is fun to shoot but it's definitely not in the same class as a bolt gun in terms of accuracy.
+1 on the Williams trigger job. That's the best $65 you can spend on it.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
Have the Williams set trigger on my HK-91 and it has turned the cargo ratchet trigger into a very nice smooth pull. Don't know about $65 though. I paid about $150 back in the 80's for mine. Bought the gun brand new in the box in the early 80's for around $300. This was when you could buy the Russian make AK's for about $60-$70 all day long.
From what I have seen and heard the HK's don't even need an extractor to get the case out of the chamber (youtube has a video of someone removing the extractor completely to show it can extract) I think extraction issues are pure ammo and fluting not being cut right in CETME's as I have never had a failure of any kind in any way with mine ever.
You can pick up sight tools for $10 on egay.
I like mine but have never considered it a precision weapon. Just a battle rifle that I would trust my life on to shoot every single time I pull the trigger.
Have the Williams set trigger on my HK-91 and it has turned the cargo ratchet trigger into a very nice smooth pull. Don't know about $65 though. I paid about $150 back in the 80's for mine. Bought the gun brand new in the box in the early 80's for around $300. This was when you could buy the Russian make AK's for about $60-$70 all day long.
From what I have seen and heard the HK's don't even need an extractor to get the case out of the chamber (youtube has a video of someone removing the extractor completely to show it can extract) I think extraction issues are pure ammo and fluting not being cut right in CETME's as I have never had a failure of any kind in any way with mine ever.
You can pick up sight tools for $10 on egay.
I like mine but have never considered it a precision weapon. Just a battle rifle that I would trust my life on to shoot every single time I pull the trigger.
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
I have 2 century's and other than a broken shell with steel case ammo, They function fine and fit and finish are good
I have 2 century's and other than a broken shell with steel case ammo, They function fine and fit and finish are good
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't know about $65 though. I paid about $150 back in the 80's for mine. </div></div>
$65 for a standard job, $125 for contoured plus shipping. Standard job was fine for mine.
http://www.williamstriggers.com/page3.html
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't know about $65 though. I paid about $150 back in the 80's for mine. </div></div>
$65 for a standard job, $125 for contoured plus shipping. Standard job was fine for mine.
http://www.williamstriggers.com/page3.html
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DirtyRod</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't know about $65 though. I paid about $150 back in the 80's for mine. </div></div>
$65 for a standard job, $125 for contoured plus shipping. Standard job was fine for mine.
http://www.williamstriggers.com/page3.html
</div></div>
Oh I see. They now do a trigger job. Mine is the set trigger. Like it a lot and is pretty much the reason I went with the Kepplinger on my Windrunner
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DirtyRod</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Mechanic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't know about $65 though. I paid about $150 back in the 80's for mine. </div></div>
$65 for a standard job, $125 for contoured plus shipping. Standard job was fine for mine.
http://www.williamstriggers.com/page3.html
</div></div>
Oh I see. They now do a trigger job. Mine is the set trigger. Like it a lot and is pretty much the reason I went with the Kepplinger on my Windrunner
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
its decent and clean and the welds on the sights are good beads and not popcorn welds on the corners. i like it, i just figured i could part with it to build the dpms 308 and not hurt over it too much. anyway, ill keep these guys in mind. i would like to get it back out and shoot it a bunch, test the scope, see how it really shoots. we will see. but as much as i like it, i never once thought about accuracy of anything but minute of man and better after use in service somewhere. its a good "here man, take this and shoot that way" gun to have on hand it something ever happens is my feelings about keeping it, lol
i did see a guy with a rifle of this style, cant say what it was, wasnt HK, or spanish cetme. but he had a match barrel turned to fit and some other stuff. wanted $2k way back what a century was $400-$600. but no man, its never gonna be a psg
its decent and clean and the welds on the sights are good beads and not popcorn welds on the corners. i like it, i just figured i could part with it to build the dpms 308 and not hurt over it too much. anyway, ill keep these guys in mind. i would like to get it back out and shoot it a bunch, test the scope, see how it really shoots. we will see. but as much as i like it, i never once thought about accuracy of anything but minute of man and better after use in service somewhere. its a good "here man, take this and shoot that way" gun to have on hand it something ever happens is my feelings about keeping it, lol
i did see a guy with a rifle of this style, cant say what it was, wasnt HK, or spanish cetme. but he had a match barrel turned to fit and some other stuff. wanted $2k way back what a century was $400-$600. but no man, its never gonna be a psg
Re: CETME as a sniper rifle
Had one a few years back, I put a MSG 90 style buttstock on it, and a wide forearm on it. I reloaded RE-7 in it not very fast, with a IOR Super M2, and out to 300yds in was MOA all day. never really shot it past 300yds. Rifle never missed a beat functioned everytime I pulled the trigger. Wish I never got rid of. Mine had a great trigger never had to send it off
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pat M</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've run 2 of my buddy's , one scope one not, both shot great for the cost. They do a number on the brass but they were 1.5moa rifles & and they will eat any ammo - spit out the shell.
The triggers just suck but there are a couple places that will tune them down for you. </div></div>
Had one a few years back, I put a MSG 90 style buttstock on it, and a wide forearm on it. I reloaded RE-7 in it not very fast, with a IOR Super M2, and out to 300yds in was MOA all day. never really shot it past 300yds. Rifle never missed a beat functioned everytime I pulled the trigger. Wish I never got rid of. Mine had a great trigger never had to send it off
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pat M</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I've run 2 of my buddy's , one scope one not, both shot great for the cost. They do a number on the brass but they were 1.5moa rifles & and they will eat any ammo - spit out the shell.
The triggers just suck but there are a couple places that will tune them down for you. </div></div>
I sent my Cetme parts kit off to Bill Springfield to build. PTR receiver and eighteen inch heavy barrel. Had him perform his trigger job and install his buffer. Went with a m-lok handguard and a magpul prs stock. Also he welded on a picatinny scope rail on the receive. The only scope that would clear the charging handle and had twelve power was a Athlon 2-12X40 Helos BTR rifle scope. It is short. The way it’s built. It’s shorter in the front. I also used Vortex Pro series high scope rings. They have a cut out. So you can use the iron sights. For the rear sight I went with the H&K barrel style. With my reloads. It shoots 1-1.25 MOA at one hundred yards. Have $1800 into it not including the scope. The scope was $550 and the rings $65.
CETME rifles are a very good value for a full size battle rifle... If you buy a kit & build it yourself. Just a year or two ago, a guy could still get a kit for $129 ($99 on sale) and a flat from RTG or HKParts was about $80 plus shipping, and a new $160 barrel from whoever was making them, us a weldment kit... A whole mbr for about $450 or less. Surplus Spanish 20rd magazines are widely available and still fairly cheap. I got 38 ea for about $4.65 delivered...
Some things to think about:
These rifles were eventually designed/built for 7.62NATO and can be hard exfractors/ejectors. The fluted chambers mark the brass and these guns fling empties into the next time zone. They also dent the cases in 2 places. None of this really matters. I have reloaded spent mil cases 5 or 6 times with no ill effects. Civilian brass being thinner, can rip in half, so use milsurp brass.
IMO, the best way to mount a scope is to find a steel picatinny rail & weld it to the top of the receiver, like PTR does.
These guns can be fairly accurate. The Germans have a variant they used as a designated marksman rifle/sniper version.
2nd the suggestion for a Bill Springfield trigger job.
Weapons Guild has a BUNCH of threads/specific info for those who want to build one. Its a very inexpensive/VERY fun gun to shoot. Recoil is low.
Some things to think about:
These rifles were eventually designed/built for 7.62NATO and can be hard exfractors/ejectors. The fluted chambers mark the brass and these guns fling empties into the next time zone. They also dent the cases in 2 places. None of this really matters. I have reloaded spent mil cases 5 or 6 times with no ill effects. Civilian brass being thinner, can rip in half, so use milsurp brass.
IMO, the best way to mount a scope is to find a steel picatinny rail & weld it to the top of the receiver, like PTR does.
These guns can be fairly accurate. The Germans have a variant they used as a designated marksman rifle/sniper version.
2nd the suggestion for a Bill Springfield trigger job.
Weapons Guild has a BUNCH of threads/specific info for those who want to build one. Its a very inexpensive/VERY fun gun to shoot. Recoil is low.
