- Thread starter pmclaine
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One of those sold for something north of $10k a few months ago on gunbroker.....appear to be a better "investment" than the SSA Remington issue...but the MaWhinney M40 editions were actually test fired by the man himself.
These two statements add some provenience, my guess is it will sell because of it.
" Commemorative data book with the first page filled out by Mawhinney .
Rifle is placed on consignment by an associate of Mawhinney."
The thing is it doesn't need to sell. Sort of like the rising tide raising all boats, internet auctions tend to drive up prices no matter what. Even if it doesn't sell, it's making the rest of them more valuable.
How? If I list my house at 5 million and it doesn’t sell, my neighboring properties don’t automatically go up…
This listing will sell eventually...... collectable value far exceeds value as a shooter. There is a lot of cash "out there" right now, and lots of cash flowing into collectibles of any flavor, and precious metals, certain real estate, and sock drawers now...
i would disagree with this statement. People are being a lot more choosy on what they are spending their discretionary money on.
i think anyone who is going to buy this gun as a collector, will have to be VERY well off and i still think the price is 4k too high.
as we enter a lot of economic uncertainty, most people want to put their money into something they could liquidate quickly and get their exact investment from, if they need to. That gun will not sell quick at $15k. it might sell very quick at $9k.
People who don't know better see that auction at 15k and think that the next one listed at 12k is a bargain.
Ppl dropping that much coin on a rifle should be knowledgeable about the overall price/investment, and know that if the 15k didn’t sell, it was over priced. One at 12k may also be overpriced (I would think so).
But, if you’re paying 12k for nothing more than nostalgia, you probably aren’t worried about spending thousands of dollars. You may be at the point to where only 50k+ purchases even cross your mind of considering if you should spend that much for a hobby.
I’d be bidding on the CMP one if I had that money.
I love my MaWhinney over run and at $2k or whatever we paid perhaps second only to my USMC M45A1 return.
I love my MaWhinney over run and at $2k or whatever we paid perhaps second only to my USMC M45A1 return.
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Person A lists his Winhouser 1896 on Gunnerbroker for $800. Nobody buys it, it's too much. It re-lists again and again. Person B goes to list his 1896 Winhouser, sees person A's and thinks "Mine's in better shape than that one!" So he lists his for $950. It cycles on. Person C wants to sell his 1896, he knows his is worth more because... it's his! Lists it for $1200. Person D goes by these prices, lists his for $1k.
Someone's looking for one checks current auctions and closed auctions... "Well there was just one on here that didn't sell for $1200". Person A's gun has become much more appealing , looks like a good deal and it sells.
I've seen this on two different model rifles and one model pistol that I used to track. Watched the prices climb steadily higher, even though most weren't selling. With the one model there were three guns that were originally listed for more that twice what they were worth when they first listed them, eventually they sold, rough as they were, because they'd become "bargains".
Cool story but they were worth exactly what they sold for.
What I have seen dozens of times is what I call “old guy syndrome” it’s easily diagnosed by the first sentence which always begins “those used to sell for…”
Past prices, asking prices and all others are irrelevant. The value is exactly what the item sold for today.
Another fallacy I see is buyers being concerned with what the seller paid for an item. It has exactly zero bearing on value. If the seller paid a nickel for a million dollar gun it’s still a million dollar gun. Oddly, no one ever wants to pay the seller more for an item because the seller paid too much for it. It’s only used as an attempt to downgrade the price.
Not to derail the thread, but I'm fortunate to live a few miles from the museum and spoke to one of the curators ref the Mawhinney M40. IIRC, someone in PWS found the receiver and tracked the SN back to Chuck (maybe there was a log book with the receiver, not sure). PWS then rebuilt the receiver to a M40 rifle and it was transferred to the museum.
So if it sells high, that's what it's worth. But if it sells low, that's not what it's worth?
Nope, it’s always worth exactly what it sells for when properly marketed to a buying audience. Changes day to day and with each sale.
It’s just the nickel dicks whining about “what it used to sell for” who think it’s too high.
I would think that would be clear as I stated it 3 times in my post.
I have also seen a few sellers of items do the same thing on items which have declined in price. Opposite side of same coin.
That is Jackson Armory in Dallas. If you look at their other auctions and their closed auctions, they almost never receive bids. They just seem to use Gunbroker as advertising and picture hosting for the guns they are selling.
I believe there were just records, either with Chuck or USMC, of what his rifle SN was. It was in service out on the west coast and yes, PWS did the restore work to original M40 form.
Joseph Ward listed the SN in his book which is how MaWhinney was “discovered”. The rifle was passed directly to Ward from MaWhinney according to the book.
It’s been 23 years since I turned my ‘40 in to the armory for the last time, but I do remember the SNs of both the guns I carried. That shit was as important as my social.
For those curious about how much a documented M40 has sold for, check out this 2018 Rock Island auction:
www.rockislandauction.com
And the realized price was sans the 25% buyers premium.
Rare and Highly Desirable Documented U.S.M.C. Vietnam Remington
Rare and Highly Desirable Documented U.S.M.C. Vietnam Remington Model 700 (M40) Bolt Action Sniper RifleRare, original, Remington Model 700 sniper rifle with Redfield 3-9x telescopic sight manufactured in 1966 as part of the original U.S.M.C contract for 700 rifles to replace the M1C, M1D and...
www.rockislandauction.com
And the realized price was sans the 25% buyers premium.
For those curious about how much a documented M40 has sold for, check out this 2018 Rock Island auction:
Rare and Highly Desirable Documented U.S.M.C. Vietnam Remington
Rare and Highly Desirable Documented U.S.M.C. Vietnam Remington Model 700 (M40) Bolt Action Sniper RifleRare, original, Remington Model 700 sniper rifle with Redfield 3-9x telescopic sight manufactured in 1966 as part of the original U.S.M.C contract for 700 rifles to replace the M1C, M1D and...
And the realized price was sans the 25% buyers premium.
Last year I sold one of my original USMC M40's for even more than that auction rifle with the added buyers premium. One of my other USMC M40's is probably worth double the price of that auction rifle. Real, verified USMC 6 digit M40's are extremely rare and they sell for a lot of money, and they've DRASTICALLY increased in price in the past decade. It's always good to keep up with current prices, and I always discuss price trends with my fellow collectors. Sometimes the discussion goes from current prices to "how the hell is everything M40 related so expensive right now?!" From what I've seen, there's the usual stuff that causes price increases (more people collecting = more demand, original sniper rifles are ALWAYS a sellers market, inflation, etc., etc.), but there's also a much more important and deeper factor to the price increases in the past decade.
Original M40 rifles and take-off parts have skyrocketed in price, mainly due to what we have done within our own collecting community, and it all boils down to 1 single word - information. This information educates collectors and drastically increases their level of knowledge about M40's, which in turn has led to a massive increase in confidence buyers have after verifying the original rifles/parts that come up for sale. High definition color photos, detailed descriptions of every known M40 part, comparisons between parts, detailed clone threads, etc. have all helped the collector community in recent years, and this massive increase in information is directly related to very well educated potential buyers being confident in potential purchases. Essentially, the more you know, the more you're willing to spend. And right now there's a lot of people with a lot of information who are actively trying to spend a lot of money acquiring original M40 rifles and take-off parts.
Before these detailed threads with beautiful photos of original rifles and parts existed, all we had were a few old reference books (amazing books and I still recommend that people buy copies of them) that only had grainy black and white photos and missing a great deal of research that we know have. Now it's extremely easy to pull up a reference thread, and check the photos/information against an item that pops up for sale. It's also very easy to shoot someone a message on a forum and ask them about the authenticity of an M40 rifle or part. I'm currently at 18 pages of messages (20 conversations per page) on just this forum alone! The vast majority of the conversations on these 18 pages are forum members who reach out to me with questions and need help. But I'm not alone, there are many, many, MANY forum members here who are willing to help others, and they get private messages as well. There's a ton of information posted, and if anyone needs further assistance, there's tons of people they can immediately contact. So, legitimate M40 information is extremely easy to come by these days, and there's not that much left in question (and we're currently discovering the missing answers to those few remaining questions).
This M40 community has come a long way since those well known books were published throughout the 1990's and early 2000's! All of these amazing photographs, detailed descriptions of parts, and new research have rapidly changed the entire field of M40 collecting. It wasn't anything like this 10 years ago, and it's 100% because we've spent a ton of time in this community discussing these historic rifles and educating each other. We did this together, and look at how much information we now have! Look at how much discussion takes place and how much people are willing to help out their fellow community members! So, I blame all of you guys for everything that's happened with M40 collecting, lol.
Also, this isn't the only field of firearm study/collecting that has exploded like this, just look at the entire Mk13 market as an example. Mk13 collecting didn't even exist in any relevant manner prior to 2016, only a few random Mk13 Mod 5 clones existed and that was essentially it, nothing more. Now Mk13 collecting rivals M40 collecting, and this relatively new area of sniper rifle collecting might even surpass the M40 series in collector interest and demand! As with the M40 market, information is one of the main driving forces for what we're currently seeking with this market (the availability of original Mk13 take-off parts is another massive driving force).
After seeing @RTESantaFe's post, I just wanted to help explain the changes that long-term M40 collectors have seen in the past decade. And it gave me a chance to write another one of my usual rambling posts, lol.
