I have a Bushmaster Car-15 and want to replace the collapsible stock that came with it. What is the difference in commercial or Mil-spec when looking at new ones?
- Thread starter MWilliams96
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Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
Quick way to tell. Pull the stock off and look at the end of the tube, is it straight ot slanted? Slanted will be a commercial tube, staight is a Mil Spec.
Quick way to tell. Pull the stock off and look at the end of the tube, is it straight ot slanted? Slanted will be a commercial tube, staight is a Mil Spec.
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
thanks, im at work now and cant get to any website that has to do with weapons except snipershide and bravocompanyusa for some reason. ill pull it off tonight and check any recommendations on a buttstock?
thanks, im at work now and cant get to any website that has to do with weapons except snipershide and bravocompanyusa for some reason. ill pull it off tonight and check any recommendations on a buttstock?
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
With your AR being a Bushy you most likely will have the Commercial spec buffer tube. My Rock Rivers I've boughten and the Deployment Commerative DPMS I bought all have commercial tubes.
Stock choice is plentiful; Magpul, Vltor, and LMT are all excellent choices. I personally would suggest getting a new tube in Mil Spec if you're looking at getting a new buttstock. The reason being is typically the metal used on Mil Spec is stronger and you'll have more options for stocks with Mil Spec. Do a google search and you'll be able to find different threads on the net of the differences.
I got a Mil Spec tube, buffer and Spring and a Magpul CTR package from Palmetto state when I was building my SBR about a year ago-great deal for the whole package. My SBR is the only AR of mine that uses a collapsible, my 6.8 and 308 both have UBR stocks on them. My wife's and kids's have commercials on them and unless they decide to upgrade stocks I'll leave them as is.
YMMV
With your AR being a Bushy you most likely will have the Commercial spec buffer tube. My Rock Rivers I've boughten and the Deployment Commerative DPMS I bought all have commercial tubes.
Stock choice is plentiful; Magpul, Vltor, and LMT are all excellent choices. I personally would suggest getting a new tube in Mil Spec if you're looking at getting a new buttstock. The reason being is typically the metal used on Mil Spec is stronger and you'll have more options for stocks with Mil Spec. Do a google search and you'll be able to find different threads on the net of the differences.
I got a Mil Spec tube, buffer and Spring and a Magpul CTR package from Palmetto state when I was building my SBR about a year ago-great deal for the whole package. My SBR is the only AR of mine that uses a collapsible, my 6.8 and 308 both have UBR stocks on them. My wife's and kids's have commercials on them and unless they decide to upgrade stocks I'll leave them as is.
YMMV
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
I think tube choice is just personal preference and intended stocks foreseen to be used on the rifle.
I think tube choice is just personal preference and intended stocks foreseen to be used on the rifle.
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matt2143</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think tube choice is just personal preference and intended stocks foreseen to be used on the rifle. </div></div>
No, it's not just personal preference from commercial to milspec tube. Commercial is extrude which is cheaper and not as strong as the forged milspec. If you have one or the other already your only option is to choose that type of stock for it unless you want to change out your parts but to most it's not worth it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matt2143</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think tube choice is just personal preference and intended stocks foreseen to be used on the rifle. </div></div>
No, it's not just personal preference from commercial to milspec tube. Commercial is extrude which is cheaper and not as strong as the forged milspec. If you have one or the other already your only option is to choose that type of stock for it unless you want to change out your parts but to most it's not worth it.
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
So lets pretend Im a novice when it comes to building AR's, because I am. I would need a mil-spec extension tube, buffer, spring, and the stock. Correct? And are all buffers and springs the same or is heavier a better way to go?
So lets pretend Im a novice when it comes to building AR's, because I am. I would need a mil-spec extension tube, buffer, spring, and the stock. Correct? And are all buffers and springs the same or is heavier a better way to go?
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
Having a standard, heavy or the other layers of heavy buffers depends on the weapon and the user. Having one of the heavy buffers can work to help slow down the cyclic rate, smooth out perceived recoil, and help reliability with larger calibers or shorter barrels.
I run a heavy with my SBR, a standard (for the time being) on my 6.8, and a Slash heavy CAR 10 on my Mega. If your current buffer and spring works then no you most likely don't need a different one.
Jer pointed out the structural difference between commercial and mil spec. In reality a commercial tube will work if you aren't but stroking doors/people or falling on your rifle on a regular basis to break your fall going to prone. I like to think of having a mil spec tube as having a little extra insurance. If you can manage to bend your tube your rifle is down.
Hope this helps you out a little further.
Having a standard, heavy or the other layers of heavy buffers depends on the weapon and the user. Having one of the heavy buffers can work to help slow down the cyclic rate, smooth out perceived recoil, and help reliability with larger calibers or shorter barrels.
I run a heavy with my SBR, a standard (for the time being) on my 6.8, and a Slash heavy CAR 10 on my Mega. If your current buffer and spring works then no you most likely don't need a different one.
Jer pointed out the structural difference between commercial and mil spec. In reality a commercial tube will work if you aren't but stroking doors/people or falling on your rifle on a regular basis to break your fall going to prone. I like to think of having a mil spec tube as having a little extra insurance. If you can manage to bend your tube your rifle is down.
Hope this helps you out a little further.
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
gotcha, i mainly use the rifle for targets and occasion whitetail hunting, SE oklahoma .223 is plenty big. so i think i will stay with commercial, since im not abusing the crap out of it but thanks for all the info... has anyone used the Magpul BAD the bolt release and catch extension? if so, thoughts?
gotcha, i mainly use the rifle for targets and occasion whitetail hunting, SE oklahoma .223 is plenty big. so i think i will stay with commercial, since im not abusing the crap out of it but thanks for all the info... has anyone used the Magpul BAD the bolt release and catch extension? if so, thoughts?
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jer</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matt2143</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think tube choice is just personal preference and intended stocks foreseen to be used on the rifle. </div></div>
No, it's not just personal preference from commercial to milspec tube. Commercial is extrude which is cheaper and not as strong as the forged milspec. If you have one or the other already your only option is to choose that type of stock for it unless you want to change out your parts but to most it's not worth it. </div></div>
First time I have heard extrusions are weaker than forgings. Extrutions are used
because they are stronger for the same thickness of material. I don't know which tubes are forged or extruded in this case. But the commercial, if extruded, should be much stronger if it's .02 thicker as well.
As a side note I think the bushy upper is extruded as well.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jer</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matt2143</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think tube choice is just personal preference and intended stocks foreseen to be used on the rifle. </div></div>
No, it's not just personal preference from commercial to milspec tube. Commercial is extrude which is cheaper and not as strong as the forged milspec. If you have one or the other already your only option is to choose that type of stock for it unless you want to change out your parts but to most it's not worth it. </div></div>
First time I have heard extrusions are weaker than forgings. Extrutions are used
because they are stronger for the same thickness of material. I don't know which tubes are forged or extruded in this case. But the commercial, if extruded, should be much stronger if it's .02 thicker as well.
As a side note I think the bushy upper is extruded as well.
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
I've got the BAD on my two AR15s and the Phase Five latch on my Mega 308. Fantastic gear. I won't have a personal weapon of mine without one.
I've got the BAD on my two AR15s and the Phase Five latch on my Mega 308. Fantastic gear. I won't have a personal weapon of mine without one.
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
awesome, thanks for all the info. I just wish it were a little warmer so I could go to the range
awesome, thanks for all the info. I just wish it were a little warmer so I could go to the range
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
Looking at the drawings I wonder if a comm. tube and milspec tube will tread into any lower??? The diameters are vastly different, am I missing something?
Thanks<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A quick Google search returned:
</div></div>
Looking at the drawings I wonder if a comm. tube and milspec tube will tread into any lower??? The diameters are vastly different, am I missing something?
Thanks<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A quick Google search returned:
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
So I ordered the commercial stock, Magpul CTS, a Magpul MOE + grip and the MOE foregrip with the attachable rail, and the B.A.D. I like the way the rifle feels now, and looks ways better over the stock Bushy.
So I ordered the commercial stock, Magpul CTS, a Magpul MOE + grip and the MOE foregrip with the attachable rail, and the B.A.D. I like the way the rifle feels now, and looks ways better over the stock Bushy.
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
Extruding is a form of cold-working, just as forging is.
They both promote the development of a crystalline grain adding hardness to the metal.
If it's extruded it'll likely be annealed 6061-0, tempered to T-6 hardness after extrusion.
If its forged it'll likely be 7075-0, tempered to T-6 after forging.
The cheapest forged tube I've ever seen (They seem rare to me) was $75.
7075T6 is stronger for the same cross-section.
6061T6 is tougher (and there will be more cross-sectional area and a higher "I" value in the commercial tube).
Forging generally adds a more distinct grain that can flow with the changing shape of the part (like a tree's grain flows along branches and curves).
Extruding needs additional steps to match a forging's grain development, and it'll only be unidirectional.
I can hot-link some mechanical specs for the engineering inclined.
Any-who..............
The moral of the story is:
It really doesn't matter at all.
The only way you could mess this up is if you were to buy some Chinese crap.
Just pick one, and stay with it so when it comes time to buy another, you can swap stocks between them.
Also:
Very important!!!
I'm practicing my writing for the day, and you all are suckers for reading this.
HaHaHa
Extruding is a form of cold-working, just as forging is.
They both promote the development of a crystalline grain adding hardness to the metal.
If it's extruded it'll likely be annealed 6061-0, tempered to T-6 hardness after extrusion.
If its forged it'll likely be 7075-0, tempered to T-6 after forging.
The cheapest forged tube I've ever seen (They seem rare to me) was $75.
7075T6 is stronger for the same cross-section.
6061T6 is tougher (and there will be more cross-sectional area and a higher "I" value in the commercial tube).
Forging generally adds a more distinct grain that can flow with the changing shape of the part (like a tree's grain flows along branches and curves).
Extruding needs additional steps to match a forging's grain development, and it'll only be unidirectional.
I can hot-link some mechanical specs for the engineering inclined.
Any-who..............
The moral of the story is:
It really doesn't matter at all.
The only way you could mess this up is if you were to buy some Chinese crap.
Just pick one, and stay with it so when it comes time to buy another, you can swap stocks between them.
Also:
Very important!!!
I'm practicing my writing for the day, and you all are suckers for reading this.
HaHaHa
Re: Commercial or Mil-Spec Diameter Buttstock?
Thanks for the information on the differences in commercial vs mil-spec. I guess I am still wondering why there needed to be two versions for what appears to be a fairly straight forward component.
Thanks for the information on the differences in commercial vs mil-spec. I guess I am still wondering why there needed to be two versions for what appears to be a fairly straight forward component.
