Dillon 650 Setup Confirmation/Advice

[MarinePMI]

What issues will I run into with mixed brass that I should be aware of ahead of time

Differences in primer pocket dimensions. Military brass is typically crimped, and the crimp can vary, even between years of LC brass. Then you have some brass that is once fired out of beltfeds, which can have pretty bloated case bodies, adding to even more variance in feel on a manual press (which is where rollsizing can be really helpful). Especially the lighter presses like the 650/750 and 550.

 

[RegionRat]

What issues will I run into with mixed brass that I should be aware of ahead of time

There is a pretty large difference when discussing bottleneck cartridges versus straight wall pistol rounds in terms of the resultant tolerance of the results.

For example, I agree that your experience with the press for pistol rounds is valuable and should shorten the learning curve since it is just a conversion to rifle. But, rifle brass prep is a little more demanding in terms of how your dies must be set.

You will need to give yourself a little stick time to get the hang of those combined stations where there is more than one demand, like the trim station for example. You will be both setting your case sizing as well as the trim length.

I would suggest you sort that first session by headstamp and then intentionally introduce different ones to see how they react. Sometimes one setting will work for all, and other times the results won't run. Brass differences can drive the die setting requirements in bottleneck rifle cartridges in ways that you might not detect in pistol brass.

You will be fine based on what you already know. No worries and have fun.

 

[Threadcutter308]

Norma and Gecco.

Thank you Sir ! I think I've only ever run across the Gecco. With as big as Norma is, I must have had some of their's too. Just don't recall it though.

 

[Threadcutter308]

What issues will I run into with mixed brass that I should be aware of ahead of time

Oh, and if'n yer gonna swage, get yourself a Primer pocket "Go/No Go" gauge set. I have the Swage-it setup and their dimensions are right in there, no issues. But it's nice to have the gauges so you can pull brass off the press and check it immediately after it's gone through the swaging station.

Some people would argue that the gauges aren't necessary. I probably wouldn't fight them a bunch on that, but they're nice to have and don't cost very much.

Small and Large Primer Pocket Swage Gage ® Set

Swage Gage Small Primer Pocket Gauge

ballistictools.com

 

[fedupflyer]

. Have you had any issue using a it on the 650?

Yes and no.
Using the swage-it has some feel to it. You figure it out as you go along.
I have had some case I thought were swaged but ended up flattening or squishing the primers.
If you feel too much resistance, stop priming that case and put it aside. Like I said, you will develop a feel for it.
Just don't force the swager or you may break the shell plate. I have not broken one but it seems like it may take a lot of force.
When I am reloading precision ammo, I keep the 650 set up with the swage-it and prime of the RCBS Rockchucker, the load on a Forster Co-Ax. One day I'll get a hand primer.
Not a fan of automating the 650 for loading because of the swageing issue.

If you haven't invested to deeply in the 650 I would suggest moving to the 1050 or Mark 7

 

[Threadcutter308]

Mighty Armory Decapping Pins

Toughest Decapping Pins in the Reloading Industry. Swiss machined rolled threads, high grade, heat treated tool steel. Shop Now.

www.mightyarmory.com

 

[Threadcutter308]

At least. (I keep at least 4-5 spare indexer rings for my 750 on hand. For what you pay in shipping, it makes no sense to order just one spare part).

But like Threadcutter, I run Autodrives. So when something goes out of whack, bad stuff happens, even when the machine is on it's slowest setting.

Under "certain conditions", it's amazing how fast the "slowest" setting is, isn't it ?

 

[Threadcutter308]

Yes and no.
Using the swage-it has some feel to it. You figure it out as you go along.
I have had some case I thought were swaged but ended up flattening or squishing the primers.
If you feel too much resistance, stop priming that case and put it aside. Like I said, you will develop a feel for it.
Just don't force the swager or you may break the shell plate. I have not broken one but it seems like it may take a lot of force.
When I am reloading precision ammo, I keep the 650 set up with the swage-it and prime of the RCBS Rockchucker, the load on a Forster Co-Ax. One day I'll get a hand primer.
Not a fan of automating the 650 for loading because of the swageing issue.

If you haven't invested to deeply in the 650 I would suggest moving to the 1050 or Mark 7

"Not a fan of automating the 650 for loading because of the swageing issue".

Yeah, I puckered up a little the first time I tried the Swage-it with the Auto Drive on my 650. I just lower the torque limiter until I get nuisance trips, then increase it back up one notch. Really haven't had any problems. Having said that, if I had it to do all over again, I would have bought a 1050 from the get go. IIRC, Autodrives for the 1050 are the same price as for the 650/750's.

As far as "loading", I have two 650's. One for 9mm, one for 45. Both have Auto Drives and loading works really well. But, it takes time to set up everything and get it dialed in properly.

Some people think that with Autodrives you can just "press the button and walk away". Not me. That's a real good way to either damage your machine or make a lot of bad ammo very quickly. The first limiting factor is re-charging the primers. You are limited to 100 per charge, which means that you pretty much have to sit with the machine while it's running.

 

[N_Turs]

Thanks for all the follow up advice everyone. I’ll probably grab a set of primer pocket gauges I like tools to rule out uncertainty.

I’m still waiting on a few parts. Dillon should be dropping the new decapping die this month. From what I understand that’s the fw design that everyone really likes that they don’t make now. I want to use that on my trim die set up.

I like the idea of sorting similar brass to start and mixing in some known randos and checking things as I go. That’s the advice I’m after forsure.

I’ll get the sage it and just be careful.

I could see automating the 650 for pistol but would probably get a new press if ever to that point in my rifle loading. I shoot pcc alot in pcsl matches so 9mm still my main jam for now. But have been shooting some long range more lately and have been disappointed in the velocity spreads I’m seeing.

 

[ubet]

What issues will I run into with mixed brass that I should be aware of ahead of time

I have not ran into any, for blasting ammo with 556.

Prep toolhead
Universal decap
Dillon trimmer/dillon die

Load toolhead
Mandrel/neck expander
powder drop
empty/verify powder/or powder check device
seat
crimp

 

[MarinePMI]

"Not a fan of automating the 650 for loading because of the swageing issue".

Yeah, I puckered up a little the first time I tried the Swage-it with the Auto Drive on my 650. I just lower the torque limiter until I get nuisance trips, then increase it back up one notch. Really haven't had any problems. Having said that, if I had it to do all over again, I would have bought a 1050 from the get go. IIRC, Autodrives for the 1050 are the same price as for the 650/750's.

As far as "loading", I have two 650's. One for 9mm, one for 45. Both have Auto Drives and loading works really well. But, it takes time to set up everything and get it dialed in properly.

Some people think that with Autodrives you can just "press the button and walk away". Not me. That's a real good way to either damage your machine or make a lot of bad ammo very quickly. The first limiting factor is re-charging the primers. You are limited to 100 per charge, which means that you pretty much have to sit with the machine while it's running.

"Not a fan of automating the 650 for loading because of the swageing issue".

Yeah, I puckered up a little the first time I tried the Swage-it with the Auto Drive on my 650. I just lower the torque limiter until I get nuisance trips, then increase it back up one notch. Really haven't had any problems. Having said that, if I had it to do all over again, I would have bought a 1050 from the get go. IIRC, Autodrives for the 1050 are the same price as for the 650/750's.

As far as "loading", I have two 650's. One for 9mm, one for 45. Both have Auto Drives and loading works really well. But, it takes time to set up everything and get it dialed in properly.

Some people think that with Autodrives you can just "press the button and walk away". Not me. That's a real good way to either damage your machine or make a lot of bad ammo very quickly. The first limiting factor is re-charging the primers. You are limited to 100 per charge, which means that you pretty much have to sit with the machine while it's running.

I'd add that if there was one thing that I wish was available, it would be a foot pedal (in lieu of the remote stop; ala the older automated shotgun reloaders). For precision rifle, it would make it easier to drop charges separately and then not have to reach up to the computer screen to advance it one stage; just stomp down on the pedal. I'm actually surprised no one offers one. If I knew crap about electrical, I'd try and wire something up myself. But at this point in my life, I've got other, higher, priorities to contend with.

 

[Threadcutter308]

I'd add that if there was one thing that I wish was available, it would be a foot pedal (in lieu of the remote stop; ala the older automated shotgun reloaders). For precision rifle, it would make it easier to drop charges separately and then not have to reach up to the computer screen to advance it one stage; just stomp down on the pedal. I'm actually surprised no one offers one. If I knew crap about electrical, I'd try and wire something up myself. But at this point in my life, I've got other, higher, priorities to contend with.

So, you want a "remote start" that advaces one cycle, right ?

I don't remember what I did it for, but I wired in a remote stop into one of the unused sensor input ports. IIRC, the input port wanted to see a N/C contact to continue running and would stop the machine if that contact opened. It was 2 wires and I think they were on pins 1 and 3 of the respective input port.

But, as far as I know, all the sensor ports stop the machine and none of them start it.

 

[sheepdog697]

watch our for extruded powder. they wont meter well out of the dillon powder measure.

 

[ZY100]

Just a consideration….I finally sent a few buckets of crimped mil brass out to be cleaned and swaged. It was not much but just made everything simpler…and while I have the swage it, took it off and just run the processed brass. (550 and 650).

Life is much better. Coin vs time/parts/frustration…your call.

All the rest of your plan sounds solid.

ZY