Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

[Matthais_31]

Hi all,

I am hoping to write a paper for the UK Defence Forum on the UK's recent fulfillment of an Urgent Operational Requirement for Designated Marksmen rifles (L129A1 aka an LEI LM7). It will only be a short piece, but I was hoping to get some input from US Service personnel who have had experience of using DMR's in Iraq or Afghanistan to provide some background as to their utility etc. The paper will address why it has taken the UK so long to procure these rifles.

Its only in the planning stages at the minute, as I need to see what input I can get from various officials etc.

However, back on topic: does anyone know of any Designated Marksmen who frequent this forum?

Any input would be much appreciated,

Matthais_31

 

[Lindy]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am hoping to write a paper for the UK Defence Forum on the UK's recent fulfillment of an Urgent Operational Requirement for Designated Marksmen rifles (L129A1 aka an LEI LM7).</div></div>

Why? What qualifications do you have to be writting such a paper?

 

[Matthais_31]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

I do not have a history of military service. I do however have a post-graduate degree, if that is what you mean.

Your post comes across as somewhat aggressive; I didnt mean to offend anyone. Its just a topic of interest to me that would fall within the remit of the UK Defence Forum. I have talked about the topic with the Director, and he thought it could make for an interesting read.

If it is going to cause offense, then I will ask the mods to delete my post and we can forget all about it

Matthais_31

 

[Mike]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

I am not speaking for Lindy however I don't believe he meant it in an aggressive manner.

I believe he is asking what your experience with said rifles is and what is the premise behind your paper? In other words, the ability to write is irrelevant to writing intelligently on the subject.

You are more than welcome to inquire but be prepared for a little skepticism as we see hundreds of "authors" blow through here constantly.

 

[Lindy]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

I have a post-graduate degree, too, but that mere fact does not inspire me to write papers about fields in which I have neither expertise nor experience. If anything, I am therefore inclined in the other direction, having read absolute balderdash in my field(s) written by people with both.

I am not offended, merely curious. Please do carry on.

 

[Matthais_31]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

Thats understandable. Whilst not comparable to active service, my degrees are in military history and strategic studies, and I have spent a lot of time studying counter-insurgency operations.

Skepticism is understandable; for some reason it didn't occur to me that you would get these kind of requests all the time. Here is a previous piece I have written for the forum, although I guess you have no way of verifying that it is me :s : http://ukdf.blogspot.com/2010/04/war-clouds-over-gaza-again.html

The paper would not look at the weapon system itself, but rather the requirement for the system and what benefits it brings. If these benefits are substantial, why has it taken so long for the UK to acquire these weapons? The paper focuses on policy as opposed to the specifics of the system itself. I had hoped to talk to service personnel about their experiences with these systems, in order to provide some background and ascertain what advantages they felt the system provided.

That is about as well thought out as it gets currently! This was an initial feeler-post to see if anyone would be willing to talk to me. It is not certain yet that it will be written, just making the first inquiries at the moment.

Matthais_31

 

[Graham]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

From a policy perspective there is plenty of open information available on the topic.
What information do you have so far?

 

[kraigWY]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

A long time ago, someone wrote a book and the reasoning for Designated Marksman. I beleive if you could get WhoEver, to read it, it would convince them.

I believe the Author's name was McBride, the book: A RIFLEMAN GOES TO WAR

Anyway, if one want TODAYS prospective on the sucject, shoot a letter to Army Marksmanship Unit, Benning School for Boys. You wont find any more knowleable people on the subject.

 

[shark0311]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matthais31</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The paper would not look at the weapon system itself, but rather the requirement for the system and what benefits it brings. If these benefits are substantial, why has it taken so long for the UK to acquire these weapons?

Matthais_31</div></div>

The procurement system seems to be the largest stopping block in the U.S. for testing and acquiring new gear. What I believe you should do is contact someone from Marine Corps Systems Command as they have the most experience in this area at least for the Marines.

 

[ArcticLight]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

Sure would be easy for an english speaking terrorist to come here and ask that same information.

 

[ranger1183]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

writing about a subject which you have no experience and know nothing about?

Chandler, is that you?

 

[Lindy]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

Now, that's <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">funny</span></span>...

 

[splean]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kraigWY</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A long time ago, someone wrote a book and the reasoning for Designated Marksman. I beleive if you could get WhoEver, to read it, it would convince them.

I believe the Author's name was McBride, the book: A RIFLEMAN GOES TO WAR

Anyway, if one want TODAYS prospective on the sucject, shoot a letter to Army Marksmanship Unit, Benning School for Boys. You wont find any more knowleable people on the subject.</div></div>

That is a great book!

 

[eddieo]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

Matthew,

british soldiers "In country" have a long list of compliants about sub standard gear.

BOOTS: SHIT
UNDERWEAR: SHIT
CLEANING GEAR FOR WEAPONS : SHIT
BODY ARMOUR: SHIT: AND COULDNT STOP A BEE STING
LOW BANDWIDTH RF JAMMERS: ALMOST NON EXISTENT
RATIONS: ALMOST STARVATION RATES.

May I suggest that you direct your comments to an area such as this. Your current topic on weapons systems will in my humble optnion make a lot of people unwilling to talk to you. many here are former and serving operators who have been in country several times and would be very much aware that as has already been pointed out, there are many english speaking terrorists, ie, Richard Reed, the Shoe Bomber....

Ed

 

[eddieo]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

Matthew

You should also present your request to ;

http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/ContactUs/

They will require copies of your past articles, membership of the NUJ if you have it, and a copy of your passport and last utility bill to verify you.

Such a specific question I doubt will be entertained here. Think about it, nobody knows you or where you come from... Would you answer such a query from someone asking that type of question if you didnt know them.

 

[aqualung]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am not speaking for Lindy however I don't believe he meant it in an aggressive manner.

</div></div>

Certainly read that way to me, and I wasn't on the recieving end!

N

 

[Matthais_31]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

Hi all,

I certainly do understand the skepticism, and I have done my best to address these concerns with the individuals who have PM'ed me.

Just to reiterate however, my idea for the paper was to examine the operational requirement for the introduction of Designated Marksmen within squads, not the weapon system itself. From my limited understanding, DM fill a vital niche that had not been addressed previously by the UK armed forces. Individuals were previously supplied with SA80A2 LSW, or hand-me-down L96's, neither of which really allow them to fulfill the DM role.

Since US servicemen have been using DM for decades now, I thought it would be prudent to ask for your opinion on the role these individuals play, and how useful they are in the type of counter-insurgency operation the US and the UK find themselves in today. If they are as useful as I suspect them to be, I would then look at why it has taken the UK so long to follow suit. Chances are its simply budgetary limitations, but it could be more complicated than that - something I hope to find out.

This is an area in which I have no previous experience. The conclusion of the paper will not be earth shattering. Chances are it will never get read by anyone of any importance. Its just an opportunity for me to research an area of interest.

Thank you all for your input (both positive and negative), alternative viewpoints are always appreciated.

Matthais_31

 

[eddieo]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Matthais31</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi all,

I certainly do understand the skepticism, and I have done my best to address these concerns with the individuals who have PM'ed me.

Just to reiterate however, my idea for the paper was to examine the operational requirement for the introduction of Designated Marksmen within squads, not the weapon system itself. From my limited understanding, DM fill a vital niche that had not been addressed previously by the UK armed forces. Individuals were previously supplied with SA80A2 LSW, or hand-me-down L96's, neither of which really allow them to fulfill the DM role.

Since US servicemen have been using DM for decades now, I thought it would be prudent to ask for your opinion on the role these individuals play, and how useful they are in the type of counter-insurgency operation the US and the UK find themselves in today. If they are as useful as I suspect them to be, I would then look at why it has taken the UK so long to follow suit. Chances are its simply budgetary limitations, but it could be more complicated than that - something I hope to find out.

This is an area in which I have no previous experience. The conclusion of the paper will not be earth shattering. Chances are it will never get read by anyone of any importance. Its just an opportunity for me to research an area of interest.

Thank you all for your input (both positive and negative), alternative viewpoints are always appreciated.

Matthais_31 </div></div>

Matthew, I know of at least 3 batt's in the british army that already fill the DM role. irish army units have that specific role for the last 20+years..

Foreign legion have used the DM since Dien Bien phu.

Operational requirements of the DM role is to kill bad guys and cover the good guys. Matthew I would think that somebody with a degree of experience as you say you have would already know the operational reasons for the deployment of the DM in country.

ed

 

[Matthais_31]

Re: Does anyone know any Designated Marksmen?

You are clearly better informed than I sir. I garnered that information from the few individuals I talked to within the forces...

Ed; I said I had no previous experience in this area. I understand the "kill bad guys" requirement; im pretty sure any combat role can be reduced down to this. I wanted to look at why now; if the specific requirement for designated marksmen is there, why has it taken so long to introduce it. However this is where I seem to have gone wrong. My understanding was that the UK did not have an established Designated Marksman role - clearly this was wrong.

Ah well, cant blame a guy for trying. Thanks again everyone - Mods if you would be so kind as to delete this topic.

Cheers,

Matthais_31