First Long Range Rifle

[Specs]

Howdy,

Just recently I began withdrawing from the AR platform to getting the urge for a nice long range rifle. I've mainly been invested in the tactical/training side, with IR night shooting in the mix. Though it is very enjoyable, at my last class the instructor and I did some long range shooting afterwards. There's a satisfaction I get from hitting a steel plate at 600 yards that repeatedly ringing steel plates at 10-100 yards with an AR does not provide. I highly respected his rifle and the time he put into it to perform so accurately, and it ultimately lead me here.

Last week I picked up a 20" Remington 700 Tactical AAC-SD. My goal here is for a nice, all-around rifle capable of 1,000 yards max. I've never built a rifle capable of this, but as someone who really enjoys building and tweaking firearms, I'm really looking forward to it. I will be taking advantage of this site and the information on it, as well as advice on this thread.

What I'm looking at doing thus far is the following:

- Surefire Warcomp, possibly with SOCOM 762.

- Stock possibilities: Hunter, Bell and Carlson target/varmint with adjustable cheek well, McMillan M40A3. Opinions welcome, and stock will require detachable magazine capability.

- See how I like the trigger and explore other options if I'm not satisfied.

- Optics:
- With my goal of 1,000 yards and under, would a 3-15x do the trick, or would the better option be a 5-25x range?
- Brands I've looked at range from Steiner, who I highly trust in since my IR laser has been through hell without a hiccup, to Vortex, Trijicon, Nightforce, SWFA, etc.
- I want nice turrets with excellent glass. My eyes are good enough to notice glass clarity between different red-dot brands, so I'd assume I can tell the same on magnified scopes.

- NV: My current setup is a TNVC White Phosphor Sentinel, spare TNVC PVS-14 and a Steiner A3. I'm pretty sure shooting long range under tubes is not a viable option, can anyone here comment on clip-on optics for use in front of a scope? May be a stretch but has anyone used an IR laser on a long range rifle?

- Bipod: Undecided, never used one, taking opinions.

Am I missing anything?

 

[pmclaine]

You need to decide what your goals are. Hunting, comps, just enjoyment

You have the distance goal at 1000.

Now pick a caliber. Think cost, compatibility with other rifles, recoil, barrel life if that matters. At 1000 yards you have lots of choices.

Satisfy your need for aesthetics - you should "want" the rifle because its what you want. I have an interest in history and a bunch of my rifles are not what "I" want but are what was historically accurate.

Over the last year I did a custom and built what I wanted. This was my odyssey....

https://www.m40rifle.com/forum/gener...m40a1ish-build

Its my most loved rifle amongst a bunch of rifles I love. Only change I can think of making would be 1:10 twist instead of the 1:11.25 I went with, otherwise perfect.

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5 shot groups....


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[pmclaine]

To your specifics....

Stock - your preference. Everyone will recommend what they bought.

Scope - a 10X will work for 1000 yards but more is a nice luxury to have. My pictured rifle is 3-15X. 15X is plenty for steel torsos at 1000 yards. For 1K I wouldn't go beyond 25X. S&B seems to be having some good sales these days so your timing is good. Check out Killshots scope tracking thread. Its a sticky in the optics section. You will get good info in there on what you may be considering. Killshot comments on glass quality as well as turret feel. Its a great thread.

Bipod - I shoot my historical guns off bags. A bipod was one of the primary wants on my new gun. You will appreciate it. Choose your poison and when you order your stock include the appropriate attachment means.

Night vision - For me that means someone stands behind me with a flashlight. Figure this out when considering your stock order in case you are embedding a rail or other method to attach your device.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

If you want to spend money, that's easy to do. But it's not strictly necessary.

I favor Savage rifles because they are affordable, easy to upgrade by yourself, and are designed to be cheap to construct. Yet those construction friendly factors, like the barrel nut and floating bolt head, also contribute to innate accuracy and ease of upgrade.

I have been working for a couple of years on a very simple and basic concept rifle, in the tradition of the Original SH Ghost Dancer project rifles. The Ghost Dancers were based on the 2001 Savage 10FP .260. My more current ones are based on the Savage 11VT, which is essentially a descendant of the 10FP, but with many of the upgrades already added which we incorporated into the original Ghost Dancer. Available as a distributor exclusive model from Dick's Sporting Goods, the 11VT is an ideal and admirably affordable starter rifle specifically configured to favor basic accuracy shooting at extended distances..

It has a scope already mounted (which can be salvaged and used for a hunter, where it is more appropriate considering your extended range goals), I replace mine with the Mueller 8-32x44, an affordable scope with few pretenses and performance like others costing several times its price. While 32x may seem like overkill at 1000yd (and it is....); I find that accurate rifles are at least as accurate at distances shorter than 1000yd as well, and it is at those shorter distances that the higher magnifications really shine. I have used mine to do my spotting for 22 caliber bullet holes at 250yd, which is pretty easy with this scope. I own two, have had both for several years, and will buy more.

The Savage Stock, although adequate, is not 'Tactical", and I'm evaluating a replacement with this Choate Tactical Rifle Stock, which is a five minute replacement with a perfect fit for my 11VT .308. This stock is robust, incorporates an aluminum bedding block, and fits my 6" 5 1/2" frame with excellent proportions.

For bipods, I use something affordable from the the ubiquitous and highly adequate pack of Harris-Style clones. Unless you are mounting them on a Pic rail, stick with the ones made to mount directly to a sling stud.

The 11VT comes in an assortment of chamberings, I have both the .308 and the .223. I shot the 11VT .223 at 600yd in F T/R MR this past February in the Berger SW LR Nationals at Ben Avery Range just outside Phoenix, AZ.

The .308 is my test mule for .308 with the Hornady 178 Grain ELD-X, and either it, or an additional 11VT .308 will serve as the donor for a barrel replacement in .260 rem, which I have been shooting in the Ghost Dancer since 2001. The .223 serves equally well as both a trainer and as a (Medium Range) entry level F T/R competitive rifle.

Piece of advice... Start with simple, common equipment. It's lack of inherent quirks makes marksmanship/accuracy diagnostics a whole lot less complex and ambiguous.

Easily a 1000yd rifle with the .260 barrel I linked, it can do a lot of the things you mention with a bit of good handloading and some respectable wind skills. What it won't do is serve well as a carry rifle for walkabout hunting. It's a rifle best suited to a stationary firing mode.

For hunting, I gladly recommend the Savage 10 Predator Hunter Max I .260. I just passed my own on down to my Daughter. This rifle will hunt to 1000yd with several of these commercially available loads

Reaching those distances and achieving ethical kills is not a simple equation, so use significant judgement when harvesting substantial animals beyond 250yd.

By the way, a very decent .223/5.56 MR capable Upper is also available, which my Granddaughter shot alongside me in Phoenix this year. Although currently out of stock right now, that occurs from time to time on an annual basis. They are also heavily committed to their recent .308 chambering release. The Model 6 has a 1/2MOA (commercial match ammo) accuracy guarantee. A good friend just finished a build using this barrel to imitate my Upper, with very decent results

I make these very same recommendations here several times a week to folks seeking answers to questions very much like your own. They are the results of several years worth of patient and diligent experimentation on my own. At 70, I am retired for the past 13 years; and here in Arizona, my primary exercise is in having fun with rifles at as much distance as I can find to safely shoot. At out 4800ft local altitude, that can reach a loooong way off. The thing about the 6.5's is that you can do that rather effortlessly (and painlessly).

Greg

 

[Wyzrd]

I would say to figure a certain budget first, cause long range/precision shooting and everything that goes into it gets expensive as fuck and really quick!!! For me, I would start with a factory rifle (Tikka, Rem, Savage, Bergara, etc...) And invest most of the budget in good solid scope base, rings, and good repeatable glass. After a while and if needed, throw in an aftermarket trigger, bedding job, muzzle brake/can, truing, spin up another barrel, start handloading.... There's a lot that adds up and adds up and never fucking stops! This truly is a sickness, but a damn fun one! OR, you can always go the custom route (GAP, Area 419, LRI, etc) or high end production route (AI, Barrett, Sako, etc).... Just have fun with it, shoot a bunch, and let us know what you go with.

 

[FatBoy]

A buddy of mine went down the same road last summer. He bought a used 20" 700 that already had a 20 MOA rail and Timney in it for like $500. Put it in a KRG stock, borrowed a cheap Vortex from me and bought a hundred rounds of 175 match ammo so he could both get zeros and stock up brass for me to load for him.. By shot 30 he was hitting IPSC full sized at 1k. With handmade 175 SMK'S, a 10" plate at 750 gets boring if the wind is steady.

The biggest asset you have is access to someone you trust who's BTDT. If you can bounce ideas off someone who is an expierence long range shooter, you're way ahead of the game. Not saying follow their advice implicitly, as you want to make this your own rifle and "journey". Experimentation and the occasional non-life threatening mistakes are part of the fun.

 

[moosemeat]

Budget?
Since you already got a SPS Tactical I assume your in 308. That means your going to want a scope with some good adjustment range. I would be looking at the Vortex Razor 3-18, the Bushnell LRSI 3-18 and the NightForce SHV. That's just me and my budget.
Stock- what ever feels best. Really. The stock and trigger are the interface between you and the rifle. It needs to align your eye to the scope, you hand to the trigger and give you repeatability. I like the McMillan A3. It is what I shoot. I wish mine was adjustable thou, but with Loggerhead fittings.
NV- Surefire Dominator? Seriously I have zero experience with NV.

 

[BCP]

I love the look of the mcmillan HTG camo stocks but the vertical grip stocks with adjustable cheek pieces are easier to set up.

Since it's a remington 700 you can buy all sorts of different stocks and chassis from B&C to grayboe to mcmillan to manners and everything in between.

Scope wise I really like 3-15s so SWFA, Nightforce, Vortex, Leupold has a couple. If you start a thread in the optics section you will get a ton of ideas.

FWIW I am using a Tikka 20" 308 in a KRG chassis with Ruger branded 10rd mags and it runs great.

 

[Specs]

Thanks for the responses everyone,

Right now I'm focusing on getting nice glass, rings, and scope base. I will bed the base and true the rings if needed. Right now I'm heavily leaning for the NF NXS 5.5-22, but not sure as to how much I will like SFP. A S&B would be great, but unless I can get a killer deal on one, it's a little out of my price range. With some nice glass I can get to know the gun, which will tell me what I'd like to change to take the next steps.

 

[NT93]

I just snagged a Steiner 3x15x50 TX5i off the hide with seekin rings for $1200 for my 6.5 x 284 custom build. I will be shooting 700yds today and 15x is plenty magnification. I was set on getting a NF scope originally but they didn't offer exactly what I wanted for the price I was willing to pay. I would recommend leaning towards the FFP, I've never heard anyone say they wished they had stuck with SFP. I do agree past 1k you'll want more magnification for certain things, but I'm not sold on the idea that it's necessary. Good luck!

Sent from my SM-G930R4 using Tapatalk

 

[FatBoy]

I would recommend leaning towards the FFP, I've never heard anyone say they wished they had stuck with SFP.

The other perspective on this. KD shooting, or Bullseye shooting (highpower/F class) SFP is the only way to go. Much more precise hold points and you don't obscure the target with a fat ass reticle or lose the reticle because its tiny when you have to dial back due to horrid mirage.

both systems have their place. Picking the one that is right for YOUR situation/shooting style is going to be the key to happiness. I shoot both to 1250y. I get more hits with my SFP 5.5-22 than my 15x F1 but in fairness a 230 OTM at 2800 bucks the wind better than a 142 at 2800. Cheating? Maybe

 

[Specs]

Howdy,

I've got a PST Gen II 5-25x on the way, deciding on base and rings, most likely going with NF 20MOA but undecided on the height of the rings.

As as for stock, I will most likely see how the rifle does as is and then explore options. Been looking at Manners T2-A, but also tossing around the idea of a modular chassis such as Cadex, but not sure if I'd like the weight of them.

 

[Specs]

Howdy,

I've got a PST Gen II 5-25x on the way, deciding on base and rings, most likely going with NF 20MOA but undecided on the height of the rings.

As as for stock, I will most likely see how the rifle does as is and then explore options. Been looking at Manners T2-A, but also tossing around the idea of a modular chassis such as Cadex, but not sure if I'd like the weight of them.

 

[Mossyoak44]

I just got done building my first presicion rifle a couple months ago. The two things I can suggest from my experience from your questions is on the stock I got a krg x-ray and love it! Easy to install and every feature you can want (especially for a beginner like me) at a great price. I got and highly recommend a Jewell trigger. Its super light, crisp and installs easy. Good luck and get what makes you happy. I put a Steiner T5xi 5-25 and love it.

 

[Ron Warren]

It all depends on what you want to shoot? Hunting, Bench Rest or PRS Tactical. Second, it depends on your budget, especially when it comes to glass. If you can afford it, get the Nightforce, SFP is preferred for benchrest F-class shooters. For PRS get a FFP scope. 1x15 power is fine for PRS, but more is better. Benchrest shooters like high magnification, like a Sightron siii 10x50. I prefer Athon scopes which give me the best value with the new Cronos BTR, or Ares BTR, but these are for PRS. For the stock, some prefer traditional stocks like Manners or McMillan. Some like a chassis system, so you don't have to bed the stock to the receiver. I prefer a chassis system, and the KRG, XLR, MDT and Masterpiece BA all good choices. The KRG Xray is a polymer stock, so it's advatage is it's light weight and your hands will not freeze up holding an aluminium chassis. But for benchrest shooting you want a heavy rifle for less recoil. For PRS, and hunting, weight is more of a factor. When you shoot the barrel out or if you want a to move up to a 6.5 or 6 creedmoor, you can Remage the barrel yourself or take it to a gunsmith for a fee.

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

 

[Specs]

I'll be looking at precision rifle competitions if there are some in my area.

The rifle came in but the face of the bolt is rested to hell. A fellow member here is guiding me into the direction of a PTG bolt and I will probably end up going that route, but I am in contact with Remington now to see what they will do about this issue.

5-25x PST Gen II came in a few days ago. Looks magnificent, and I've never seen clearer glass in a scope that I've personally looked through. Turrets are nice and sturdy with audible clicks that you can feel. I cannot feel any slop in the whatsoever either. Feels built like a tank. Looks like it will be a great optic. Now that I have an optic in-and I've chosen a Badger Ordnance base along with their rings, but will have to do the math to see what height to go with.

Will be putting an order in for a T4-A in the next few days, CF with mini chassis, EFR inlet, etc. This should turn out to be a very nice rifle. Thanks every one for the help. There are several stand-up members here that have gone out of their way to message me and answer all of my stupid questions.

 

[domdoc]

5-25 power or thereabouts for the scope. You can shoot 1,000 yards with a Vortex, Weaver, Simmons, Leupold, or Bushnell. You'll need a 20 MOA picatinny rail, and a 6-24 Bushnell will get you out there. You would do well to find a gunsmith in your area, and discuss the rest of the options with him, regarding stock (Bell & Carlson Tactical Medalist is excellent value for what it offers), trigger (probably better to get a Jewell or a Timney Elite than to work over the factory Remington 700 trigger). As for caliber, I like the .308 Win, since I shoot milsurp Lake City cases. However, for optimal distance performance, while retaining minimal recoil and the ability to form from.308 cases (so you don't have to buy $1 brass unless you want to) I like the .260 Remington. I'm basically on board with Greg Langelius in all of this. If money is no object, get a Desert Tech, Accuracy International, GAP, or Modern Outfitters MR-1. I still like to work with a local gunsmith, since you do not want to be obligated to ship your firearm every time you want something done. Savage is excellent, and Greg covered that, but you said you already have a Remmy. Minimum 24" barrel, but better with 26" or longer; whatever you like. Probably the cheapest way to do this is to keep your Remington, and buy one of the Savages that you like. The Savage trigger and factory barrels are just fine as they are. Whatever stock makes you happy, but that can be done later. Factory Savage with minimum 24" barrel in 8 twist for a 6.5, or 10 twist for a .308, 20 MOA rail, any optic at least 15 power, and go shoot it. The 10 FCP H-S Precision is just fine, out of the box. No muzzle brake, if you are going to compete, but your gunsmith can thread for one later.

 

[mrbig]

I started with a 700 PSS 308 and 4.5-14 LRT M1 ,,I sold the HS stock and moved the PSS into an AICS 1.5 Chassis,,got a Jewell trigger,,switched to an 8-32 Sightron 2 MOA reticle scope in the Barrett EX 15-40 MOA taper rings,,then sold the PSS bbl/action and got a Stiller Tac 30 action and a Krieger 8 twist HV bbl chambered in 243 Win throated for the 105 VLDH bullets,,then I took the Harris bipod off and installed the spigot mount Atlas bipod,,

the 243 bbl has been really great,,shooting the 105 VLDH bullets at 3200 fps ++ into 1/4 MOA groups it really makes head shots at 1,000 yards pretty easy,,its a lazer,,the throat is getting long and the next bbl will be a medium palma as an 18 pound rifle is a bit much to handle in the field,,I may also switch to the 6 Creedmoor but this 243 bbl has 2,000+ rounds and still shooting lights out but throat is getting long and losing some speed,,

great thing about the 700 platform is you can upgrade as you want to or can afford to and parts are easy to sell,,

 

[Specs]

Still dealing with Remington to see what they will do about this bolt that is rusted to hell, but, Manners stock is now on order as of 20170609.

T4A:
- Elite tactical
- Gen 1 mini chassis
- Factory Varmint/Sendero contour
- Adjustable spacer system with Pachmayer decel pad
- Atlas rail
- Badger EFR
- Sting studs 1x front 2x rear
- Flush cups front and rear on both sides
- Desert sage camo

And the waiting game begins!

 

[Specs]

I got word from Remington today that they are doing a warranty claim on my rifle, which will be sent in and hopefully they will at least replace the bolt if not the whole rifle itself. We'll see exactly what they do at a later date.

In other news, I've got a Badger rail and rings on the way as well as a Surefire brake for later plans of suppressor to match.

 

[2c1fr]

Op that's good to know sounds like your off to a great start!

 

[Specs]

Hey thanks.

Got an e-mail from Remington on Friday saying they had received my rifle, but also saw they have an estimated wait time of 12 months for "voluntary R700 recall". I doubt this is my case since I've never seen a bolt rusted out like that, but I hope it doesn't reflect general wait times.