First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

[Shadow_Warrior]

Well as luck would have it... I decided to anneal my 6.5 CM brass after its fourth firing from my bolt gun and to run it in my GAP10 gas gun.
Now after annealing I am seeing donuts on the neck shoulder junction that measure roughly .003-.005".
I am using Redding S bushing seizer followed by a FL body die.
I have used Unique case lube with no real effect
I have removed the expander ball with no real effect.
Is it possible that I got the brass to soft and now its forming the dreaded donut?

 

[doubled]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

are your dies set up properly?

can you do replicate it with a piece of brass you did not anneal?

it sounds like your dies might be off a bit.

 

[buffybuster]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

The annealing is not causing the donut. The donut is most likely coming from your sizing die situation.

You are using a neck bushing FL sizing die. There exists a slight unsupported joint between the bushing and the die body at the base of the neck. When you're sizing a case, the body of the die is resizing and supporting the case body, the bushing is sizing and supporting the caseneck. The junction of the neck and shoulder is unsupported so brass is going to move there, forming a donut. Annealing makes the brass softer and easier to displace.

 

[korykhunter]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

Try running the brass through the body die first. No guarantee but it helped on my 22-6mmImp.

 

[deadnbrkn84]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

Redding type s dies leave a "doughnut" at the shoulder/neck joint. The doughnut is outwards though not inwards so it doesn't effect anything. It's caused by the busing because it actually has a chamfer at the bottom to ease the brass going into it. It's totally normal

 

[milo 2.0]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

Whatever Buffy and Dead said is correct, it's the die. I have the same thing going on some 6.5x47 brass. MIne is coupled by my neck being slighty over reamed. I don't think it is bad enough to cause feeding problems yet.
I'm going to buy a standard FL die to see if I can't get rid of it.

 

[former naval person]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

A Wilson inside neck reamer will cut the donut out of fired cases and solve the problem easily.

 

[milo 2.0]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: former naval person</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A Wilson inside neck reamer will cut the donut out of fired cases and solve the problem easily. </div></div>
I think it's on the outside of the neck.

 

[former naval person]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

After firing the donut is on the inside.

 

[Niles Coyote]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

Do you have a micrometer to measure and verify there is a donut? I use Redding bushings as well and deadnbrkn84 is right.

 

[ChrisGarrett]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

I have a bunch of S bushing neck and FL sizer dies.

Here's what I'm guessing is happening.

Depending on the die in question, it's quite possible that your bushing, which generally gets free floated an eigth of a turn 'backed out' via the stem, isn't actually sizing down precisely to the neck/shoulder joint.

Some of my dies go down 95%, for example. When you don't go all the way down on the case, that little itty bitty section, doesn't get squeezed back down. Upon firing, your sized necks expand and then contract, but that itty bitty part doesn't expand and contract at the same rate, to the same dimension as the sized portion.

You're essentially seeing a 'false shoulder' like you would see if you were of the mind to only size your necks say 50%, like I did on my 338LM early on in my career, with that cartridge.

I would argue that it's only a cosmetic issue and not something that will bind up upon chambering in your weapon.

Just a guess, mind you.

Chris

 

[Boogaloo]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

I get the doughnut on my .308 brass using the S type neck sizing die. It is annoying... not sure how to fix it though.

 

[milo 2.0]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: former naval person</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After firing the donut is on the inside. </div></div>

That's funny!

 

[korykhunter]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: milo-2</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: former naval person</div><div class="ubbcode-body">After firing the donut is on the inside. </div></div>

That's funny! </div></div> Not funny if you seat your bullet into the donut causing pressure problems.

 

[milo 2.0]

Re: First time annealing and now getting dreaded donut

I'm sure not. Not what I was getting at.