For the neck turners...

[TommyD11730]

Hey guys hope your week is going well as we approach the holidays.
So I'm pretty sure I'm going to purchase the 21st century neck turning tool.
My question is about its use and where in your reloading step do you employ it.
My biggest concern is overworking brass. I don't for example want to full length size my brass, then use their mandrel so size the case mouth, only to have to resize it back down again to set neck tension.
Not sure if I'm explaining my question correctly so bare with me.
Right now I full length size without and expander. Then I set neck tension with a gauge pin. My hope was I could turn in between those 2 steps.

Any input always welcome.

Thanks!!

 

[Dogtown]

I won't bare with you, but...

When I neck turn, I just do it on brand new brass, then be done with it. So I open a new box, expand the necks to fit the turner, turn them, clean them up, then neck size them back to what I want. You could anneal them afterward, but I don't think that's necessary.

I do operations on the neck during my regular reloading process, but as for turning, that only happens when it's virgin brass.

 

[Evintos]

First firing (or fire forming), clean, anneal (but I anneal after every firing), full length size, trim (if necessary), expander mandrel, neck turn (either skim turn or full cut - if skim turning, you'll have to do this more than once, full cut is one and done), chamfer & debur.

 

[Threadcutter308]

I won't bare with you, but...

When I neck turn, I just do it on brand new brass, then be done with it. So I open a new box, expand the necks to fit the turner, turn them, clean them up, then neck size them back to what I want. You could anneal them afterward, but I don't think that's necessary.

I do operations on the neck during my regular reloading process, but as for turning, that only happens when it's virgin brass.

This. You pretty much neck turn only once (when it’s new) over the life of the brass.

 

[waveslayer]

As part of this thread I noticed, for the first time, I had to turn my necks on my 6.5 SAUM brass I made after 8 firings, noticed they grew. Common?

 

[OREGUN]

I do as @Dogtown does (except I don’t neck size back down, I’ve always found the neck tension to be just about right straight off the expander mandrel) and the best benchrest shooter I personally know does it as @Evintos has described….so, how’s that for helpful?

 

[rustyinbend]

I had this question too (K&M Neck Turner on the way) ... just to be clear ...

1. Decap
2. Clean
3. Size
4. Trim
5. Mandrel
6. Neck-Turn
7. Chamfer/Debur

Correct?

At this point, I'd be tempted to run through the Mandrel one more time, but that's just my OCD.

I have a really good Concentricity Gauge (Sinclair) so irrespective of new or old ... I'll turn when it needs it to keep variance under 2/1000's.

 

[TommyD11730]

So by the looks of things in some cases the arbur (or whatever you want to call it) that your brass rides on is close to/smaller then what you normally expand your necks to??

 

[Dogtown]

The arbor I got for neck sizing (K&M) all came with the full bullet dimension. The result is that once I'm done turning the necks, if I were to try to seat the bullet it would nearly fall through the neck. That's why I neck size them back down to my load setting.

 

[OREGUN]

“Skim turning” takes variation out of your necks by trimming off high spots and supposedly increases the consistency of the position of the bullet in the throat, making it more concentric. “Full cut” reduces outside diameter to provide the needed clearance in a tight necked chamber. Either way, it’s usually only done once in the life of the brass.

Depending on your needs, regarding accuracy, it may or may not be worth the time spent if you don’t have a tight necked chamber.

There’s not much work hardening going on. With new brass, going over the expander mandrel to uniform the i.d. is the only work process. I’ve always found new brass to have excessively small necks so once it comes off the expander mandrel and is turned, the neck tension, with spring back, is just about right and you can go straight to loading. With fired brass, it would have to be sized down and then expanded back up…the fired brass will have a neck diameter too big to ride on the turning mandrel as the cutter works. From there, with spring back, you are back to likely having at least acceptable neck tension without an additional sizing process.

So by the looks of things in some cases the arbur (or whatever you want to call it) that your brass rides on is close to/smaller then what you normally expand your necks to??

Yes, the expander mandrel gets you uniformed and is usually a thou under bullet diameter and then the turning arbor/mandrel is 2 thou smaller than bullet diameter so the brass is aligned but free to turn as it is cut.

 

[Steel head]

I once fire my new brass with a known mild load then trim to equal lengths if needed.
Then I resize and neck turn, usually a 70-80% skim cut on really good brass or a 100% on so so brass back when I messed with so so brass.

 

[OREGUN]

The arbor I got for neck sizing (K&M) all came with the full bullet dimension. The result is that once I'm done turning the necks, if I were to try to seat the bullet it would nearly fall through the neck. That's why I neck size them back down to my load setting.

I guess I should add that I have a Sinclair setup that came with two mandrels; one labeled T and one labeled E. The e is .242 and the t is .241. So, for me, after the Expander mandrel, I end up with almost .002” of “neck tension” on annealed brass that springs back a good bit. My bullets are definitely tighter than a slip fit at that point.