Full length Sizing Required after One Firing?

[Limedust]

Recently bought a Remington 700 AAC-SD in .308. I took it out to sight it in and found that my hand loads wouldn't chamber properly. Required excessive force to try to close the bolt, so I backed off; had to hammer fist the bolt open. Tried with ADI, Remington, Lake City and Hornady brass . . . all had been trimmed and neck sized and all checked out in case gauge after firing through my Tikka T3.

I chalked this up to differences in actions/chambers. Bought a few rounds of Federal XM80 to run through and then reload. The factory ammo chambered fine, bolt went to battery no problems (though the Remington isn't quite as smooth as the Tikka) and everything worked okay. Alas, upon arriving home and hand-loading a few of the newly once-fired-in-my Remington-cases, I find that those won't chamber either. Same problems with closing/opening bolt and excessive brass left on bolt face, paricularly near the extractor.

Now, I neck size because that is all I can do; I use the Lee Loader (of the collet and mallet variety) and it has worked fine up until this point. After that long explanation I guess my questions are these:

1: Is something wrong with the rifle's chamber?
2: Is something wrong with the extractor?
3: Are some Remington's so tightly chambered that I have to full-length size after every firing?

It seems pretty odd to me that the brass would flow so much after one firing that they'd be unusable without bumping back the shoulder, but that seems to be the case as far as I can tell.

 

[bigedp51]

Question.

Where is the case rubbing in the chamber as you close the bolt? If you can't tell then take a black felt tip marker and color the entire case and then chamber the round.

I'm going to take a wild ass guess and say its rubbing at the juncture of the shoulder and the case body. This is because you have a round faced hammer and are pounding the case to far into the die and flaring the shoulder area of the case.

Don't ask me how I know all this but it was 1968 I was 18 and the wrong hammer might have been involved with my Lee Loader.

 

[Limedust]

Hmmm. I did not think of that. Tried to make sure case is flush and no more, but I've screwed things up before without realizing. Will test a new method and see what happens. Thanks for the help.

 

[Brux]

If all these cases were once fired out of another gun you have to FL size them and then fire form them to your chamber.

 

[bigedp51]

You are going to need to break down and buy a reloading press because your cases will need full length resizing sooner or later.

I have many Lee loaders for loading at the range but a press will serve your new rifle much better. I was having an argument in another forum and the person just couldn't understand "a cartridge should fit the chamber like a rat turd in a violin case".

Partial Neck Sizing
by Germán A. Salazar

"a full-length sized case in which the neck is also fully sized. There is clearance at the neck and in the body of the case, the closest fit anywhere is the bullet in the throat. If the neck to bullet concentricity is good (although it needn't be perfect), then the bullet will find good alignment in the throat and the case body and neck will have minimal influence. Let's not forget that the base of the case is supported by the bolt face or the extractor to a certain degree as well; this is yet another influence on alignment. As you can see, there are several points from base to bullet that can have an effect. My procedure is to minimize the influence of those that I can control, namely the case body and neck, and let the alignment be dictated by the fit of the bullet in the throat and to some extent by the bolt's support of the base. Barring a seriously out of square case head, I don't think the bolt can have a negative effect on alignment, only a slightly positive effect from minimizing "case droop" in the chamber. Given that a resized case will usually have a maximum of 0.001" diametrical clearance at the web, this isn't much of a factor anyway.

In conclusion, I believe that allowing the bullet to find a relatively stress-free alignment in the throat by full length sizing (including the neck) and turning necks to enhance concentricity gives the bullet the best probability of a well-aligned start into the rifling"

The Rifleman's Journal: Reloading: Partial Neck Sizing

 

[Limedust]

I do know that full length sizing is ideal, but I think there is an issue here above and beyond that one. Perhaps the chamber is just very tight and I'll have to learn to live that . . .

 

[Mad_Charlie]

My 700 requires the shoulder to be bumped back to 1.627 (.308) or it is hard to close.

 

[MitchAlsup]

I do know that full length sizing is ideal, but I think there is an issue here above and beyond that one.

And yet, the symptom you describe is exactly that of the case not being correctly sized.

But you can tell for sure:: size a case your way, then chanber the unprimed, unpowdered, bullet free case and see if the bolt closes freely or not. Only if the case chambers freely at this stage can you proceede to change the empty case into a cartrige.

 

[Limedust]

Full length Sizing Required after One Firing?

Misunderstood above post; replied erroneously.

I have done what you suggested, and the case doesn't fit. You're definitely right about the sizing device-and/or my use of it-being a problem. However, once fired cases that haven't been sized are problematic too; they don't chamber easily at all, and in fact require more than typical force for any bolt manipulation. The whole rat turd in the violin case is only a fantasy of mine at this point.

It's clear that I need to work my way toward buying a press. Thanks for the help.

 

[gstaylorg]

Brass is malleable and cases expand when fired, no way around it. In some instances it can be quite a bit. The .308 cases fired from my GAP bolt guns will almost never allow the bolt to be closed after a single firing, so I FL resize before each reload. I recently noticed with a batch of reloads during an F-TR match that I had very hard bolt lifts on some of the rounds. A couple of the other competitors (very experienced reloaders/shooters) asked specifically where during the bolt lift did I encounter resistance. It seems as though this can be a very good clue as to where on the case the sizing issue is likely to be, which I had not been aware of. For me, the resistance was at the very top of the lift. Apparently, this can indicate an issue with the cases not being fully re-sized in the area of the webbing, as opposed to elsewhere. In any event, purchasing a press is a good idea and something you probably would have wanted to do at some point, anyhow. Good luck with it.