- Thread starter thefitter
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Re: Giraud trimmer?
I wondered the same about the Wilson, I like the attachmens available, can get a meplat trimmer as well as a drill attachment.
I wondered the same about the Wilson, I like the attachmens available, can get a meplat trimmer as well as a drill attachment.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
No the Wilson is a micro lathe, it will cut every case to the exact length, the Giraud indexes off the shoulder so if the shoulders are all different after FL your trim length will be all different, since I got my Giraud my Wilson is gathering dust, and so far all my cases are the same using the Giraud, even if they were all +/- .0015 what difference would it make down range
No the Wilson is a micro lathe, it will cut every case to the exact length, the Giraud indexes off the shoulder so if the shoulders are all different after FL your trim length will be all different, since I got my Giraud my Wilson is gathering dust, and so far all my cases are the same using the Giraud, even if they were all +/- .0015 what difference would it make down range
Re: Giraud trimmer?
I have a Wilson too, but I only know its out in the garage under a pile of dust and only dug out when I have to trim an oddball cartridge that I dont have a Giraud collet for...and thats going to be an oddball cartridge cause I can only handle trimming about 20 cases by hand before I give up and get a collet for the Giraud! Doug just makes it too damn easy to get addicted to that machine.
John
I have a Wilson too, but I only know its out in the garage under a pile of dust and only dug out when I have to trim an oddball cartridge that I dont have a Giraud collet for...and thats going to be an oddball cartridge cause I can only handle trimming about 20 cases by hand before I give up and get a collet for the Giraud! Doug just makes it too damn easy to get addicted to that machine.
John
Re: Giraud trimmer?
I need to study the fundamentals more. I don't know enough to make a good decision on this one.
This was posted on another forum:
"...Anyway, there are basically three ways to index brass for sizing and everyone has their own opinion to which is best. The three index points are the shoulder (Gracey, Giraud, PH, etc), The inside of the case head (K&M and I think Lee are two examples) and the case head (most lathe type trimmers). I along with many other shooters have used all three methods. If you are sizing your brass consistently and separate your brass by head stamps, all three ways are capable of producing brass which is +/- .001". One thing to remember is that with a flat cutter, you will have to debur. This can create a lot of variance in you case length if you get to aggressive with your deburing. Also, deburing by hand will lead to a bit of inconsistancies no matter what you do."
I need to study the fundamentals more. I don't know enough to make a good decision on this one.
This was posted on another forum:
"...Anyway, there are basically three ways to index brass for sizing and everyone has their own opinion to which is best. The three index points are the shoulder (Gracey, Giraud, PH, etc), The inside of the case head (K&M and I think Lee are two examples) and the case head (most lathe type trimmers). I along with many other shooters have used all three methods. If you are sizing your brass consistently and separate your brass by head stamps, all three ways are capable of producing brass which is +/- .001". One thing to remember is that with a flat cutter, you will have to debur. This can create a lot of variance in you case length if you get to aggressive with your deburing. Also, deburing by hand will lead to a bit of inconsistancies no matter what you do."
Re: Giraud trimmer?
All I can say is I can make production "match" brass with mine. One of a few tool that were well worth the money.
All I can say is I can make production "match" brass with mine. One of a few tool that were well worth the money.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
The Giraud may not be quite as accurate, but it is as accurate as is necessary to load just as good of ammo in my experience. In fact, as long as they chamfered well and not too long, trim length does not seem to make any difference at all. I'd rather be practicing than trimming too.
The Giraud may not be quite as accurate, but it is as accurate as is necessary to load just as good of ammo in my experience. In fact, as long as they chamfered well and not too long, trim length does not seem to make any difference at all. I'd rather be practicing than trimming too.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
I agree. More time shooting than trimming. The Giraud works great.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wade</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Giraud may not be quite as accurate, but it is as accurate as is necessary to load just as good of ammo in my experience. In fact, as long as they chamfered well and not too long, trim length does not seem to make any difference at all. I'd rather be practicing than trimming too. </div></div>
I agree. More time shooting than trimming. The Giraud works great.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Wade</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Giraud may not be quite as accurate, but it is as accurate as is necessary to load just as good of ammo in my experience. In fact, as long as they chamfered well and not too long, trim length does not seem to make any difference at all. I'd rather be practicing than trimming too. </div></div>
Re: Giraud trimmer?
It's one of those tools that you look at and wonder about the price. Then after you take the giant step and buy one, you ask-why didn't i get this years ago. I love mine. The Giraud makes trimming brass fun. It even lured my wife into the reloading room.
It's one of those tools that you look at and wonder about the price. Then after you take the giant step and buy one, you ask-why didn't i get this years ago. I love mine. The Giraud makes trimming brass fun. It even lured my wife into the reloading room.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
If trimming on a Giraud is not accurate enough, I need to find another game to play! There is no way that a thousandth of an inch is making a difference for us...and thats the accuracy of the Giraud. You have a bigger variance probably due to your sizing, cause the trim is based off the shoulder.
As a Giraud owner, I can only stand back and think "why would some idiot trim on a hand cranked trimmer?" Sorry, but thats how great of a tool this trimmer is.....once you have one, you can only wonder why others dont.
John
If trimming on a Giraud is not accurate enough, I need to find another game to play! There is no way that a thousandth of an inch is making a difference for us...and thats the accuracy of the Giraud. You have a bigger variance probably due to your sizing, cause the trim is based off the shoulder.
As a Giraud owner, I can only stand back and think "why would some idiot trim on a hand cranked trimmer?" Sorry, but thats how great of a tool this trimmer is.....once you have one, you can only wonder why others dont.
John
Re: Giraud trimmer?
I use both: Giraud for volume/ease of use and Sinclair-Wilson for 20 or so match cases.
I use both: Giraud for volume/ease of use and Sinclair-Wilson for 20 or so match cases.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BAT_Boy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I use both: Giraud for volume/ease of use and Sinclair-Wilson for 20 or so match cases. </div></div>
Please give a detailed description what you do special or get specifically different from the Wilson over the Giraud. Thanks
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BAT_Boy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I use both: Giraud for volume/ease of use and Sinclair-Wilson for 20 or so match cases. </div></div>
Please give a detailed description what you do special or get specifically different from the Wilson over the Giraud. Thanks
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Please give a detailed description what you do special or get specifically different from the Wilson over the Giraud. Thanks</div></div>
I'm looking at buying a trimmer too. The difference as I understand it from tutorials on the hide, is that the caseneck should be trimmed to the headspace measurement, rather than indexed off the shoulder.
I'm just trying to learn, because I want to start reloading myself. Do I run any risks, safety or accuracy-wise in indexing off the shoulder? It seems like the Giraud would save me alot of time, rather than custom trimming-to-length every case. I'll definiteley be going Giraud if there will be no measured difference down-range for hunting purposes etc.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Please give a detailed description what you do special or get specifically different from the Wilson over the Giraud. Thanks</div></div>
I'm looking at buying a trimmer too. The difference as I understand it from tutorials on the hide, is that the caseneck should be trimmed to the headspace measurement, rather than indexed off the shoulder.
I'm just trying to learn, because I want to start reloading myself. Do I run any risks, safety or accuracy-wise in indexing off the shoulder? It seems like the Giraud would save me alot of time, rather than custom trimming-to-length every case. I'll definiteley be going Giraud if there will be no measured difference down-range for hunting purposes etc.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
After you have properly setup your FL die pacificnw, you FL resize your cases, the Giraud indexes off the shoulder, trim length on the Giraud is actually from the shoulder to the neck, not from the base of the case to the neck.
After you have properly setup your FL die pacificnw, you FL resize your cases, the Giraud indexes off the shoulder, trim length on the Giraud is actually from the shoulder to the neck, not from the base of the case to the neck.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the Giraud indexes off the shoulder, trim length on the Giraud is actually from the shoulder to the neck, not from the base of the case to the neck.</div></div>
427Cobra -
I've read alot of your posts and they've been helpful. That is what I was trying to say. As I understand it, the benefit that the Wilson has over the Giraud is that its more accurate. Being that you could get the actual headspace measurement and trim to length on the Wilson, rather than indexing off the shoulder on the Giraud.
That said. If there is no safety or accuracy I am risking, then I see no problem with a trimmer that indexes off the shoulder. I'm looking to buy a trimmer and get into reloading, and hope to understand before I end up damaging my rifle or worse.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the Giraud indexes off the shoulder, trim length on the Giraud is actually from the shoulder to the neck, not from the base of the case to the neck.</div></div>
427Cobra -
I've read alot of your posts and they've been helpful. That is what I was trying to say. As I understand it, the benefit that the Wilson has over the Giraud is that its more accurate. Being that you could get the actual headspace measurement and trim to length on the Wilson, rather than indexing off the shoulder on the Giraud.
That said. If there is no safety or accuracy I am risking, then I see no problem with a trimmer that indexes off the shoulder. I'm looking to buy a trimmer and get into reloading, and hope to understand before I end up damaging my rifle or worse.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
New reloaders trying to learn from new reloaders.....
Listen new guys, we have ability here on the Hide to search previous threads. Learn to search, it will bring you great wisdom.
There has been much said here, even in the last 2 weeks about the Giraud trimmer, by very experienced reloaders. Search and learn.
New reloaders trying to learn from new reloaders.....
Listen new guys, we have ability here on the Hide to search previous threads. Learn to search, it will bring you great wisdom.
There has been much said here, even in the last 2 weeks about the Giraud trimmer, by very experienced reloaders. Search and learn.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rookie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">New reloaders trying to learn from new reloaders.....
Listen new guys, we have ability here on the Hide to search previous threads. Learn to search, it will bring you great wisdom.
There has been much said here, even in the last 2 weeks about the Giraud trimmer, by very experienced reloaders. Search and learn. </div></div>
Yes there are many posts about the Giraud. All of which say how great it is and how fast it is and how well made it is. And I believe them. And I'm buying one. But I have yet to find a post that specifically answered the specific question posed by pacificnw.
That said I have concluded for myself from reading that if I head stamp sort all the brass I've saved and FL re-size them all at once before I trim them I will be fine.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Rookie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">New reloaders trying to learn from new reloaders.....
Listen new guys, we have ability here on the Hide to search previous threads. Learn to search, it will bring you great wisdom.
There has been much said here, even in the last 2 weeks about the Giraud trimmer, by very experienced reloaders. Search and learn. </div></div>
Yes there are many posts about the Giraud. All of which say how great it is and how fast it is and how well made it is. And I believe them. And I'm buying one. But I have yet to find a post that specifically answered the specific question posed by pacificnw.
That said I have concluded for myself from reading that if I head stamp sort all the brass I've saved and FL re-size them all at once before I trim them I will be fine.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pacificnw</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the Giraud indexes off the shoulder, trim length on the Giraud is actually from the shoulder to the neck, not from the base of the case to the neck.</div></div>
427Cobra -
I've read alot of your posts and they've been helpful. That is what I was trying to say. As I understand it, the benefit that the Wilson has over the Giraud is that its more accurate. Being that you could get the actual headspace measurement and trim to length on the Wilson, rather than indexing off the shoulder on the Giraud.
That said. If there is no safety or accuracy I am risking, then I see no problem with a trimmer that indexes off the shoulder. I'm looking to buy a trimmer and get into reloading, and hope to understand before I end up damaging my rifle or worse.
</div></div>
Save yourself a ton of money, buy the Wilson trimmer, stand, micrometer if you want and definitely buy the drill bit adapter for the lathe end. It is almost as quick as a Giraud once you get a routine down and extremely precise.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pacificnw</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the Giraud indexes off the shoulder, trim length on the Giraud is actually from the shoulder to the neck, not from the base of the case to the neck.</div></div>
427Cobra -
I've read alot of your posts and they've been helpful. That is what I was trying to say. As I understand it, the benefit that the Wilson has over the Giraud is that its more accurate. Being that you could get the actual headspace measurement and trim to length on the Wilson, rather than indexing off the shoulder on the Giraud.
That said. If there is no safety or accuracy I am risking, then I see no problem with a trimmer that indexes off the shoulder. I'm looking to buy a trimmer and get into reloading, and hope to understand before I end up damaging my rifle or worse.
</div></div>
Save yourself a ton of money, buy the Wilson trimmer, stand, micrometer if you want and definitely buy the drill bit adapter for the lathe end. It is almost as quick as a Giraud once you get a routine down and extremely precise.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: thefitter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Is it as accurate as a WILSON Stainless Trimmer with Micrometer? I know it will be faster. </div></div>
I have both. The Giraud is more "accurate" in one measurement, and the Wilson is in another. The Giraud die measures from the shoulder to the cutting blade, so the neck length is what is measured. The Wilson measures case overall length to the cutting blade, so it is a different measurement.
For this purpose, consistency in the length of the neck is the more "accurate" measurement and thus the Giraud is more "accurate."
As mentioned, I have both and I have not used the Wilson even one time since buying the Giraud.
If you want a Wilson I would be happy to make you a good deal on mine.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: thefitter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Is it as accurate as a WILSON Stainless Trimmer with Micrometer? I know it will be faster. </div></div>
I have both. The Giraud is more "accurate" in one measurement, and the Wilson is in another. The Giraud die measures from the shoulder to the cutting blade, so the neck length is what is measured. The Wilson measures case overall length to the cutting blade, so it is a different measurement.
For this purpose, consistency in the length of the neck is the more "accurate" measurement and thus the Giraud is more "accurate."
As mentioned, I have both and I have not used the Wilson even one time since buying the Giraud.
If you want a Wilson I would be happy to make you a good deal on mine.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Swan, Do you own a Giraud? I am curious how you arrive at the conclusion that the Wilson can be almost as fast as a Giraud? Does the Wilson now have the ability to chamfer and de-bur the case? I own a wilson and a Giraud and I can't operate the Wilson anywhere near as fast. Jeff
Swan, Do you own a Giraud? I am curious how you arrive at the conclusion that the Wilson can be almost as fast as a Giraud? Does the Wilson now have the ability to chamfer and de-bur the case? I own a wilson and a Giraud and I can't operate the Wilson anywhere near as fast. Jeff
Re: Giraud trimmer?
I own both the Wilson and the Giraud and there is NO way possible that the Wilson can be made or adapted that will make it anywhere near as fast as the Giraud...just cant be done.
I own both the Wilson and the Giraud and there is NO way possible that the Wilson can be made or adapted that will make it anywhere near as fast as the Giraud...just cant be done.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
There's no question as to which is faster. I may be new to reloading, but I've read/searched and understand this topic. The OP said he would take 10 minutes per case to get the proper accuracy. My situation is more concerned with safety, as long as the accuracy is negligable. Here is the question from a noobie, that has read, and searched etc.
Is it safe when trimming, to index off the shoulder, rather than measure headspace and trim OAL?
Another question that I think is valid, is from the OP and that is which is more accurate, and whether there is a measurable difference downrange.
There's no question as to which is faster. I may be new to reloading, but I've read/searched and understand this topic. The OP said he would take 10 minutes per case to get the proper accuracy. My situation is more concerned with safety, as long as the accuracy is negligable. Here is the question from a noobie, that has read, and searched etc.
Is it safe when trimming, to index off the shoulder, rather than measure headspace and trim OAL?
Another question that I think is valid, is from the OP and that is which is more accurate, and whether there is a measurable difference downrange.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: oregonshooter#2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Swan, Do you own a Giraud? I am curious how you arrive at the conclusion that the Wilson can be almost as fast as a Giraud? Does the Wilson now have the ability to chamfer and de-bur the case? I own a wilson and a Giraud and I can't operate the Wilson anywhere near as fast. Jeff </div></div>
You are right, my bad. Totally forgot the Giraud chamfers and deburs as well. Disregard my blabbering.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: oregonshooter#2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Swan, Do you own a Giraud? I am curious how you arrive at the conclusion that the Wilson can be almost as fast as a Giraud? Does the Wilson now have the ability to chamfer and de-bur the case? I own a wilson and a Giraud and I can't operate the Wilson anywhere near as fast. Jeff </div></div>
You are right, my bad. Totally forgot the Giraud chamfers and deburs as well. Disregard my blabbering.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pacificnw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Is it safe when trimming, to index off the shoulder, rather than measure headspace and trim OAL?
Another question that I think is valid, is from the OP and that is which is more accurate, and whether there is a measurable difference downrange.
</div></div>
Its completely safe no question about it!
I don't shoot benchrest, but I do belong to a club that alot of BR matches are held at, and I have never seen one guy trim as they load in the pits, that may be due to the extremely tight chambers in there rifles, all I can say is I don't beleave exact trim length makes a difference in our shootings, my goal is 1/2 moa to 1K, because all the targets are 1 moa or bigger.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: pacificnw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Is it safe when trimming, to index off the shoulder, rather than measure headspace and trim OAL?
Another question that I think is valid, is from the OP and that is which is more accurate, and whether there is a measurable difference downrange.
</div></div>
Its completely safe no question about it!
I don't shoot benchrest, but I do belong to a club that alot of BR matches are held at, and I have never seen one guy trim as they load in the pits, that may be due to the extremely tight chambers in there rifles, all I can say is I don't beleave exact trim length makes a difference in our shootings, my goal is 1/2 moa to 1K, because all the targets are 1 moa or bigger.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Thanks 427 - If its safe I guess I'll have to get both and compare myself. From those that already have both, I don't see how it makes any sense to say its more accurate to index off the shoulder and trim neck length, than it is to measure headspace and trim OAL. Rather than measure and trim accordingly, do you trim first, and then measure to see where it took you? That might be AS accurate, but to say MORE accurate, I guess I'm missing something.
For those that own both and concur that while not AS accurate, its SAFE, and accurate enough to have NEGLIGABLE difference downrange. That is something I can get behind, and be happy with. I would rather get behind the trigger than the trimmer, so either way I expect to be happy based on your experiences. I may end up with a hand trimmer and a powered trimmer, but that's ok too. I know I can trim meplat with the Wilson.
Oh well...sometimes you just have to find things out for yourself. I'll post my results. Hopefully I can contribute a comprehensive comparison with photos and measurements etc. I'm just getting started and the trimmer is only one of many questions I have, so being a newbie I may stumble and encourage criticism when I do. These forums have been valuable to me, so as I learn more I hope to contribute, even as an example of what not to do =) haha. seriously thanks to frank and everyone who makes this place possible.
Thanks 427 - If its safe I guess I'll have to get both and compare myself. From those that already have both, I don't see how it makes any sense to say its more accurate to index off the shoulder and trim neck length, than it is to measure headspace and trim OAL. Rather than measure and trim accordingly, do you trim first, and then measure to see where it took you? That might be AS accurate, but to say MORE accurate, I guess I'm missing something.
For those that own both and concur that while not AS accurate, its SAFE, and accurate enough to have NEGLIGABLE difference downrange. That is something I can get behind, and be happy with. I would rather get behind the trigger than the trimmer, so either way I expect to be happy based on your experiences. I may end up with a hand trimmer and a powered trimmer, but that's ok too. I know I can trim meplat with the Wilson.
Oh well...sometimes you just have to find things out for yourself. I'll post my results. Hopefully I can contribute a comprehensive comparison with photos and measurements etc. I'm just getting started and the trimmer is only one of many questions I have, so being a newbie I may stumble and encourage criticism when I do. These forums have been valuable to me, so as I learn more I hope to contribute, even as an example of what not to do =) haha. seriously thanks to frank and everyone who makes this place possible.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Giraud Trimmers, Prometheus Scales and other high dollar reloading items are not required to produce safe accurrite ammo, they are time savers pure and simple, get a Forster trimmer to start off with, Forster also has a 3way blade setup for there trimmers, later as time goes by you can upgrade to a Giraud if you want\need to.
Giraud Trimmers, Prometheus Scales and other high dollar reloading items are not required to produce safe accurrite ammo, they are time savers pure and simple, get a Forster trimmer to start off with, Forster also has a 3way blade setup for there trimmers, later as time goes by you can upgrade to a Giraud if you want\need to.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Yeah. I saw the 3way Forster. If it can do meplat too, that would be the goods. I'll check it out. Thanks again 427. I still may end up with a Giraud to grind out some 5.56 and get a comparison going. I want to challenge myself on the ability to chase the rifling etc. and post my results in the differences of indexing off the shoulder vs COAL. Anyways...Much respect 427. Good times.
Yeah. I saw the 3way Forster. If it can do meplat too, that would be the goods. I'll check it out. Thanks again 427. I still may end up with a Giraud to grind out some 5.56 and get a comparison going. I want to challenge myself on the ability to chase the rifling etc. and post my results in the differences of indexing off the shoulder vs COAL. Anyways...Much respect 427. Good times.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Just got the Giraud. What an awesome piece of equipment. My only regret is not buying the additional blades and holders for different calibers. My first call on Monday.
Just got the Giraud. What an awesome piece of equipment. My only regret is not buying the additional blades and holders for different calibers. My first call on Monday.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: triplecelectric</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just got the Giraud. What an awesome piece of equipment. My only regret is not buying the additional blades and holders for different calibers. My first call on Monday. </div></div>
Agreed. I liked mine so much I bought another one!!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: triplecelectric</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just got the Giraud. What an awesome piece of equipment. My only regret is not buying the additional blades and holders for different calibers. My first call on Monday. </div></div>
Agreed. I liked mine so much I bought another one!!
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Happy Giraud owner here too.
But one thing that isn't stated by the guys asking the questions. Are you talking about a bolt or gas gun?
My application:
Have one collet/blade set up for .223 fired through an AR. Every reloaded case gets trimmed through my Giraud (after FL sizing & depriming). Why? Because the brass is being stretched under heat/pressure when extracted.
I've never seen a safety issue result from my trimming & chamfering process across 50,000 or so .223 reloads.
Bolt guns (.308 and .260):
Have a collet/blade that I have used for both (adjust blade for different neck diameter -- pretty easy).
After initial fire forming, I check OAL and neck length, usually trim on the Giraud once after FF is all. My brass isn't being stretched through the bolt guns. I usually spot check before every reloading but haven't seen it yet.
I just chamfer after that. I've found that the hand chamfer tools are fine but increase the speed by using a cordless screwdriver. Pretty quick.
I have a AR-10 in .260 coming so my expectation is I'll be FL resizing/depriming and using the Giraurd after every firing with it.
Meplant trimming: I've read plenty about it. May be critical for BR, not sure what gains for tac LR comps. A buddy bought the Giraud Meplant trimmer collet, tried it, and doesn't use it. So he's going to give it to me to play with. I'll try the Whidden bullet pointing die & Giraud meplant trimmer just out of curiosity.
Happy Giraud owner here too.
But one thing that isn't stated by the guys asking the questions. Are you talking about a bolt or gas gun?
My application:
Have one collet/blade set up for .223 fired through an AR. Every reloaded case gets trimmed through my Giraud (after FL sizing & depriming). Why? Because the brass is being stretched under heat/pressure when extracted.
I've never seen a safety issue result from my trimming & chamfering process across 50,000 or so .223 reloads.
Bolt guns (.308 and .260):
Have a collet/blade that I have used for both (adjust blade for different neck diameter -- pretty easy).
After initial fire forming, I check OAL and neck length, usually trim on the Giraud once after FF is all. My brass isn't being stretched through the bolt guns. I usually spot check before every reloading but haven't seen it yet.
I just chamfer after that. I've found that the hand chamfer tools are fine but increase the speed by using a cordless screwdriver. Pretty quick.
I have a AR-10 in .260 coming so my expectation is I'll be FL resizing/depriming and using the Giraurd after every firing with it.
Meplant trimming: I've read plenty about it. May be critical for BR, not sure what gains for tac LR comps. A buddy bought the Giraud Meplant trimmer collet, tried it, and doesn't use it. So he's going to give it to me to play with. I'll try the Whidden bullet pointing die & Giraud meplant trimmer just out of curiosity.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Have my Giraud for 2 years now. It's fast, it's easy, only problem is it does not produce accuracy like the above poster said. My friend was only able to get 0.1" groups @100 yards with a 4 shot group with LC brass that were trimmed from my Giraud
Then again, I am thinking it might not have been the Giraud fault on why his groups were horrible. The problems could have been any of the following:
- Lee Dies
- LC Surplus Brass that were shot from a Machine Gun
- Wolf Primers
- Giraud Trimmer (as was already mentioned)
- Using an inferior mount (EGW)
- Using inferior Rings (Burris Extreme)
- Stock Remington 700 with stock trigger
- Stock Remington 700 with no Bolt Face work done
- AICS stock was not bedded
Have my Giraud for 2 years now. It's fast, it's easy, only problem is it does not produce accuracy like the above poster said. My friend was only able to get 0.1" groups @100 yards with a 4 shot group with LC brass that were trimmed from my Giraud
Then again, I am thinking it might not have been the Giraud fault on why his groups were horrible. The problems could have been any of the following:
- Lee Dies
- LC Surplus Brass that were shot from a Machine Gun
- Wolf Primers
- Giraud Trimmer (as was already mentioned)
- Using an inferior mount (EGW)
- Using inferior Rings (Burris Extreme)
- Stock Remington 700 with stock trigger
- Stock Remington 700 with no Bolt Face work done
- AICS stock was not bedded
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fx77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I missing something from the above post?
? Unhappy with 0.1" groups
That is Benchrest Level Quality Groups
Why not be happy with that? </div></div>
We are happy with these groups.
I am just trying to share with you what I have learned from all the juice drinkers and ghost hunters on the things you can do to make a gun more accurate.
Today I learned that the Giraud is another one of those things that produces "inaccurate results"
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fx77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I missing something from the above post?
? Unhappy with 0.1" groups
That is Benchrest Level Quality Groups
Why not be happy with that? </div></div>
We are happy with these groups.
I am just trying to share with you what I have learned from all the juice drinkers and ghost hunters on the things you can do to make a gun more accurate.
Today I learned that the Giraud is another one of those things that produces "inaccurate results"
Re: Giraud trimmer?
Its tough to beat the wilson for the price. Extremely precise cuts and quicker than most other trimmers who don't cut as well.
Its tough to beat the wilson for the price. Extremely precise cuts and quicker than most other trimmers who don't cut as well.
Re: Giraud trimmer?
If you are worried about the brass fitting our chamber perfectly then..... adjust the giraud with your resized brass and there shouldn't be any variation between the accuracy you can achieve. Chill out. The bigger issue is whether or not its worth 450. AND as a previous poster mentioned chamfer and deburring by hand can cause huge variations.
If you are worried about the brass fitting our chamber perfectly then..... adjust the giraud with your resized brass and there shouldn't be any variation between the accuracy you can achieve. Chill out. The bigger issue is whether or not its worth 450. AND as a previous poster mentioned chamfer and deburring by hand can cause huge variations.
B
bubbapug1
Guest
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricCartmann</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fx77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I missing something from the above post?
? Unhappy with 0.1" groups
That is Benchrest Level Quality Groups
Why not be happy with that? </div></div>
We are happy with these groups.
I am just trying to share with you what I have learned from all the juice drinkers and ghost hunters on the things you can do to make a gun more accurate.
Today I learned that the Giraud is another one of those things that produces "inaccurate results"</div></div>
I love your humor!!!
It's amazing how unsubstantiated procedures can become dogmas passed on for decades
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EricCartmann</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fx77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I missing something from the above post?
? Unhappy with 0.1" groups
That is Benchrest Level Quality Groups
Why not be happy with that? </div></div>
We are happy with these groups.
I am just trying to share with you what I have learned from all the juice drinkers and ghost hunters on the things you can do to make a gun more accurate.
Today I learned that the Giraud is another one of those things that produces "inaccurate results"</div></div>
I love your humor!!!
It's amazing how unsubstantiated procedures can become dogmas passed on for decades
Re: Giraud trimmer?
BUMP
BUMP
Re: Giraud trimmer?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fx77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I missing something from the above post?
? Unhappy with 0.1" groups
That is Benchrest Level Quality Groups
Why not be happy with that?
</div></div>
I would be totally unhappy with that group. He completely missed the target!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fx77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I missing something from the above post?
? Unhappy with 0.1" groups
That is Benchrest Level Quality Groups
Why not be happy with that?
</div></div>
I would be totally unhappy with that group. He completely missed the target!
