First off i apologize if this has been covered before. I shoot prs and my 9 year old wants to start shooting with me. He already shoot to distance with his howa 223. That gun is too big for him and the twist is 1:12 so for playing at club shoots its really a no go. He shoots my M&P sport well since the LOP can be shortened to him. Also he got to shoot a top end AR type rifle at the last shoot he went to that the gentleman was fire forming the brass. He did quite well shooting that platform. I know a lot about bolt guns but really am way way behind the curve on gas guns. I have a budget of about $1200 for the rifle only, i already have quality glass. What would be a good way to go so that once he gets a little bigger i can get him a good custom bolt gun and i would be left with a good gas gun? Thanks in advance.
Help a newbie spec out a rifle
- Thread starter Mancill
- Start date
As you can imagine, that is a very open-ended broad question.
It would appear that accuracy is at the top of your list, and not durability and kid-proofing (throwing in the mud), I would pay attention to the same things that you would with a bolt gun: #1, pick a great barrel, #2, pick a solid receiver set platform, and #3, pick a good trigger.
All things being equal, based upon your (lack of) familiary with gas guns, I would not recommend you build it, but buy a complete firearm, either factory or custom shop.
At your budget level, there are some manufacturers that come to mind, but they usually are not focused on the barrel quality. Just about anything that I can think of will be at 1.0 to 1.25 MOA. Is that good enough? You mentioned something he can grow with. Replacing a barrel is always an basic upgrade to a solid platform, as AR's do not need to be headspaced to a bolt (generally).
My "go-to" gas gun for someone getting into ARs that wants to be able to grow is Colt. You can also look at Rock Rive, Stag, PSA, in that price range. If you want to start with more accuracy and a better barrel, you can try LaRue, JP, Seekins, Noveske, Barret, but you will be beyond your budget.
It would appear that accuracy is at the top of your list, and not durability and kid-proofing (throwing in the mud), I would pay attention to the same things that you would with a bolt gun: #1, pick a great barrel, #2, pick a solid receiver set platform, and #3, pick a good trigger.
All things being equal, based upon your (lack of) familiary with gas guns, I would not recommend you build it, but buy a complete firearm, either factory or custom shop.
At your budget level, there are some manufacturers that come to mind, but they usually are not focused on the barrel quality. Just about anything that I can think of will be at 1.0 to 1.25 MOA. Is that good enough? You mentioned something he can grow with. Replacing a barrel is always an basic upgrade to a solid platform, as AR's do not need to be headspaced to a bolt (generally).
My "go-to" gas gun for someone getting into ARs that wants to be able to grow is Colt. You can also look at Rock Rive, Stag, PSA, in that price range. If you want to start with more accuracy and a better barrel, you can try LaRue, JP, Seekins, Noveske, Barret, but you will be beyond your budget.
If he is going to be shooting PRS type matches, I would recommend looking at a .224 valkyrie.
The additional velocity with heavier bullets would be a welcome improvement when trying to hit those distant targets.
I have no experience with the Savage, but here is one:
https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog...d/411558316/Savage+MSR15+18+224+Valkyrie+25+1
The additional velocity with heavier bullets would be a welcome improvement when trying to hit those distant targets.
I have no experience with the Savage, but here is one:
https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog...d/411558316/Savage+MSR15+18+224+Valkyrie+25+1
Post in the px what you are looking for and your budget. And look every morning for new listings. ARs have a very soft market right now. I’ve seen 2500$ rifles go in the 1700$, 1800$ range.
Rock river arms predator pursuit upper and a adjustable lower would work good. If you are just after the length of pull adjustment I built off of a mdt lss chassis. Gets you down to 12” or less and works with a rem 700 bolt gun. Or you could get him a Ruger Precision Rifle right now for $799 at grabagun. It would have the 12” length of pull. The rpr is a little bit heavy for a kid though. This would also work https://www.whiteoakarmament.com/sh...stock-uppers/predator-upper-1-8-twist-18.html And then this http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...ul-acs-l-edition-black-no-magazine-39607.html and upgrade the trigger
For accuracy you want to avoid most chrome lined barrels.
If you're not going to be shooting much more than 7-800 yards, you might be able to get away with a 1 in 9" twist and 50-65 grain bullets. If you're reloading, the 50 grain can be a lot cheaper than the 70+ grain bullets people need to make it to 1,000 yards accurately (with a fast twist barrel).
I'm hoping to prove myself right with an 18" upper I'm building with a Remington R15 blem barrel I got from JSE for $75 around Black Friday (no longer available).
I'm going to be using a nitride coated Toolcraft BCG which I paid $80 for. You can get Nickel Boron for a few dollars more and it might be worth it but nitride works fine and I like it better than parkerized. I think I buy them from WC Armory, their prices are great. My last order was two backordered BCGs but their web site mentioned the backorder status and had an accurate delivery date. I like them a lot.
I'm building it on an Aero Precision upper with a slightly incompatible free float rail I got on clearance because I like a project.
If I had to do it over with less project, I like the Aero Precision enhanced upper receiver with matching free float rail. I have that setup on a 6.5 Creedmoor AR and I like it very much, I'm sure it would be great on an AR15.
A lower is a lower for the most part.
I think Optics Planet has 14% off triggers tonight which is a pretty good discount. I got a Rise Armament RA140 (I think) from them. It was the cheapest drop in I could find and should be a great entry level "match" trigger.
I've used mostly DPMS LPKs because I'm cheap but I just bought some spares that are "AR Stoner" for about $25 each with no trigger, hammer or pistol grip. I like to chuck up the detents in a dremmel to round the tips and give them a polish so they don't have to break in so much. I also soak everything in some light oil over night to dissolve any grease or wax that the manufacturer adds to prevent rusting in the package. I wipe it pretty dry before installing and if I find any burrs or rough spots I'll try to clean them up before installing. If you build, that extra 5-10 minutes of inspection and prep will result in a lower that has nicely functioning takedown pins and a selector lever that is easy to manipulate. Skipping prep can make a gun feel rough.
Two more tips if you want to build: installing a trigger guard is a pain in the ass, a lower with integrated trigger guard is nice unless you are shooting in the Arctic and I like to use the hollow tip of a T25 security Torx bit to start the bolt hold open roll pin which I think is the second most likely place to scratch up an AR15 lower build.
A lot of advice about ARs is kind of old and some things have changed.
Colt was the go-to when they had all the police contracts and they had made the M16, M16A2 and M4.
Back then "Mil spec" was king and people would expect a BCG to break if it didn't have chrome lining, high pressure test proof marks and a bolt made with Carpenter steel.
Today there are lots of things made better than "Mil spec", lots of things made more than good enough and "Mil spec" probably isn't any better than my $80 Toolcraft BCG.
Any way, if you think you are up to it, consider a build. It could be a good bonding activity and will give you a familiarity with the platform that you'll never lose. If you are handy at all, you can pull it off.
Try to spend money where it counts and round it off with some nice ergonomics. If you choose well you can wind up with a very nice AR for not too much money. On the flip side, choose poorly and you can wind up with an AR that fails to be good at the things you want it to do.
If you're not going to be shooting much more than 7-800 yards, you might be able to get away with a 1 in 9" twist and 50-65 grain bullets. If you're reloading, the 50 grain can be a lot cheaper than the 70+ grain bullets people need to make it to 1,000 yards accurately (with a fast twist barrel).
I'm hoping to prove myself right with an 18" upper I'm building with a Remington R15 blem barrel I got from JSE for $75 around Black Friday (no longer available).
I'm going to be using a nitride coated Toolcraft BCG which I paid $80 for. You can get Nickel Boron for a few dollars more and it might be worth it but nitride works fine and I like it better than parkerized. I think I buy them from WC Armory, their prices are great. My last order was two backordered BCGs but their web site mentioned the backorder status and had an accurate delivery date. I like them a lot.
I'm building it on an Aero Precision upper with a slightly incompatible free float rail I got on clearance because I like a project.
If I had to do it over with less project, I like the Aero Precision enhanced upper receiver with matching free float rail. I have that setup on a 6.5 Creedmoor AR and I like it very much, I'm sure it would be great on an AR15.
A lower is a lower for the most part.
I think Optics Planet has 14% off triggers tonight which is a pretty good discount. I got a Rise Armament RA140 (I think) from them. It was the cheapest drop in I could find and should be a great entry level "match" trigger.
I've used mostly DPMS LPKs because I'm cheap but I just bought some spares that are "AR Stoner" for about $25 each with no trigger, hammer or pistol grip. I like to chuck up the detents in a dremmel to round the tips and give them a polish so they don't have to break in so much. I also soak everything in some light oil over night to dissolve any grease or wax that the manufacturer adds to prevent rusting in the package. I wipe it pretty dry before installing and if I find any burrs or rough spots I'll try to clean them up before installing. If you build, that extra 5-10 minutes of inspection and prep will result in a lower that has nicely functioning takedown pins and a selector lever that is easy to manipulate. Skipping prep can make a gun feel rough.
Two more tips if you want to build: installing a trigger guard is a pain in the ass, a lower with integrated trigger guard is nice unless you are shooting in the Arctic and I like to use the hollow tip of a T25 security Torx bit to start the bolt hold open roll pin which I think is the second most likely place to scratch up an AR15 lower build.
A lot of advice about ARs is kind of old and some things have changed.
Colt was the go-to when they had all the police contracts and they had made the M16, M16A2 and M4.
Back then "Mil spec" was king and people would expect a BCG to break if it didn't have chrome lining, high pressure test proof marks and a bolt made with Carpenter steel.
Today there are lots of things made better than "Mil spec", lots of things made more than good enough and "Mil spec" probably isn't any better than my $80 Toolcraft BCG.
Any way, if you think you are up to it, consider a build. It could be a good bonding activity and will give you a familiarity with the platform that you'll never lose. If you are handy at all, you can pull it off.
Try to spend money where it counts and round it off with some nice ergonomics. If you choose well you can wind up with a very nice AR for not too much money. On the flip side, choose poorly and you can wind up with an AR that fails to be good at the things you want it to do.
