Interested in making an action. What does it take?

[Tomekeuro85]

Pretty much what the title says.

Looking to make one for myself or just for experimentation I guess.

I dont have an edm for the bolt raceways so I'd have to send it out.

I also probably cant make a bolt because of all the moving parts so I'd probably end up buying one...

Aside from that, what does it take to make the body of the action? It would be a very close tolerance benchrest style action, no mag feed.

Anyone have experience?

 

[Massoud]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

There's a lot that goes into building an action, are you thinking of building a Rem clone or something unique. If you can't build a bolt, you're pretty much limited to copies of other actions. That would then dictate your trigger and layout as far as length. Essentially you might as well buy one. Unless you just want to do it for fun.

 

[Tomekeuro85]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lxxsumi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">DON'T QUOTE SPAMMERS PLEASE! </div></div>

Oh perfect thanks! No more answers needed.. I got my nfl jersey. hahaha.

 

[Badshot308]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

That person's a spammer, hopefully to be banned ASAP.

 

[sr15match]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

A buddy of mine has made a couple for himself for testing. One was a .50BMG project and the other a .22lr benchrest rifle.

It is cool to see but he has a lot of time into both.

 

[6.81star]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

If you don't have an EDM just take into consideration the amount that will cost plus the machine work you will do yourself, the time and research it work take to get it to function properly and safely , and all the headsches you will have. You will probably have the cost of a custom action wrapped up in getting yours functional good luck.

 

[bohem]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.81star</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you don't have an EDM just take into consideration the amount that will cost plus the machine work you will do yourself, the time and research it work take to get it to function properly and safely , and all the headsches you will have. You will probably have the cost of a custom action wrapped up in getting yours functional good luck. </div></div>

With careful work and design the EDM is not necessary. It's a nicety, but it can be done without and still hold exceptional precision.

The time and engineering work involved is almost not worth it unless you want bragging rights or you're going to sell them. Take a guess how I know that one.

If I spend 160 hours of work with design, calculations and stiffness checks, then another 100 hours getting setup and making all the tooling in the shop I've literally spent 6 months of my free time to get 1 receiver out.

Now, had I simply spent that 260 hours with a little OT at work I could have purchased a dozen Surgeon, Defiance, Pierce, etc receivers.

 

[Tomekeuro85]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bohem</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 6.81star</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you don't have an EDM just take into consideration the amount that will cost plus the machine work you will do yourself, the time and research it work take to get it to function properly and safely , and all the headsches you will have. You will probably have the cost of a custom action wrapped up in getting yours functional good luck. </div></div>

With careful work and design the EDM is not necessary. It's a nicety, but it can be done without and still hold exceptional precision.

The time and engineering work involved is almost not worth it unless you want bragging rights or you're going to sell them. Take a guess how I know that one.

If I spend 160 hours of work with design, calculations and stiffness checks, then another 100 hours getting setup and making all the tooling in the shop I've literally spent 6 months of my free time to get 1 receiver out.

Now, had I simply spent that 260 hours with a little OT at work I could have purchased a dozen Surgeon, Defiance, Pierce, etc receivers. </div></div>

Very Very true. Ive taken that approach to a lot of things. I used to make a lot of little stuff for myself.. then i realized the time I was spending designing, revising, and machining was "costing" me more than If i just spent that time doing overtime and buying whatever i was making.

This is just something I'm interested in doing to improve my skill and maybe get a working aciton out of it.

But heres what i was wondering, tell me what you think:

My idea to make an ultra stiff action, use slightly oversize material compared to the normal diameter actions and instead of having a port for side loading, to load all rounds through the back end where the bolt enters, and just have no ejection port or bolt lock so you can just pull the bolt all the way out easily. Obviously a single shot.

How do you think something like this would work?

 

[Massoud]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

Sounds interesting but a hassle. If you look at a loading port design like the TRG or the Barnard, you're really not losing very much action stiffness. If you go with an oversize action diameter, that would make it moot, no need for rear loading. What is your reasoning behind the desired stiffness? Do you have a super heavy barrel you want to hang off something?

There's a .50 cal action that is made this way (rear feed) if I remember. It doesn't even have a moving extractor, you just slide the cartridge up into the bolt face that has a built in rim. Very positive extraction!

If it's just for learning and fun, go with it!

 

[Tomekeuro85]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

Well I dont know much about rifle building... at all..


I just figured with that stiff of an action, a little oversize, as well as an oversize barrel... accuracy probably wouldnt be too bad. Just an idea.. I literally dont have any idea about what has been done in the past like this so I may be wrong...

 

[Massoud]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

Well I encourage you to go for it. Rifles really are simple, a bolt gun hasn't really changed in over a hundred years. Just make sure you have enough contact between the bolt lugs and the lug abutments in the receiver. This is called bearing area. Also make sure the lugs on the bolt are sturdy, i.e. have a good footprint on the bolt, the shear area.

You want to get around or over 40HRC on your action/bolt hardness to eliminate setback (also caused by too little bearing area).

For your first one you can just skip the primary extraction camming mechanism that often dictates a 4th axis type op.

I suggest reading "The Bolt Action Rifle" by Stuart Otteson. Then look at Dan Lilja's articles. Then go from there,
Justin

 

[Tomekeuro85]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

Thanks Justin,

I'll have to start there. Because almost nothing you said made any sense to me. haha. Which I honestly think is kindof sad considering the kind and complexity of machining work I do on a day to day basis.

The only experience I have with bolt actions is operating them.... thats about it.

 

[Massoud]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

No problem and if you have any specific questions feel free to ask. I think we need to promote a resurgence in "grassroots" innovation and production in small arms. This will eventually pay off in new technologies, more efficient designs, and more developed/more knowledgeable industrial base. As cnc equipment becomes more accessible, more guys with ingenious inventions can enter into the idea marketplace (and commercial marketplace)and really elevate our field.
Justin

 

[Tomekeuro85]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

haha yea I have lots of specific questions... I'll do the required reading first. And yea, having all this CNC stuff is a huge blessing for me. My dad owns the machine shop where I work so i have 10 real CNC mills (not a manual rigged with servos haha), a CMM, and a lot of other stuff to use that most people will never get a chance to even touch.

 

[bohem]

Re: Interested in making an action. What does it take?

Before you get ready to pull the trigger on it send me the CAD of the tenon area and the bolt head.

You can defeature the parts for little things like extractor grooves and firing pin hole. I'm concerned mainly with the lockup area. Let me know what materials that you'd like to use and I'll give you a conservative check on safety.

I'd hate to see something bad happen out of inexperience. I don't mind doing a little checking to make sure that the parts are going to at least show good margins.