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Internet/wifi experts, I need help

Sixfivesavage

Sixfivesavage

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Mar 30, 2013
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Maryland
I'm sure there's plenty of people on here that can help me out with this. I know virtually nothing about internet and communications technology. I'm a real lineman by trade, I work on electric, not phone stuff, so I have never messed with this kind of thing. I recently got fiber optic internet into my farm and everything associated with it is in the vacant house on the property. I have a specific need for the internet at the farm, and beings the house is vacant untill it is rehabbed there will be no other traffic on the service. Everything is working as it should with the hardwired stuff that I have it there for.

When I'm outside, the only time my phone will connect to the wifi network is when I'm very close to the house. This isn't an issue to me but I assume it's pertinent information for what I'm about to ask.

I would like to get the internet to a pole building that is my shop on the farm about 200 yards away to connect a NVR system for remote access. I would assume that I can run an eathernet cable there and connect it to the NVR but is there anyway I can use a directional amplifier at the house and antenna at the shop or something like that to do it wireless. I'd like to be able to put off installing duct or running cables overhead if I can help it but it might still be the most cost effective thing to do. The only other internet traffic that would potentially be added would be some kind of smart ear tag system for beef cattle like the cowsense system from Allflex.
 
Unifi setup would be the way to go.

Unifi gateway where the internet comes in. Along with a Unifi switch to handle what's plugged into the switch.

Then internet access points plugged into the switch inside and outside the house.

To get a wireless bridge to the barn would be 2 Unifi nano beams. One at the house and one at the barn, assuming you have line of sight to the barn. then put one of the Unifi mini switches at the barn, with a couple of the outdoor access points depending on how much you want to cover.

Put the NVR at the house it will be able to go through the network even with the cameras in the barn.

I have a setup somewhat similar to this as there is network with WiFi and cameras at the house, shop, barn, and gate coverage. I'll draw you up a schematic and parts


I have been installing with HIK vision cameras, but with this year and them being owned by the Chinese government I am having significant issues with this now.
 
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Hit Costco.com

look at the mesh systems for 7,000+ sq ft homes.

you will get 3 or more devices. Your phone willhand off between them seamlessly

I agree with your thoughts of wiring the barn and adding an access point out there.

you can add a device outside under an Eve in a waterproof box to help send signal across the yard.

my suggestion is that one of the devices absolutely needs plugs/ Ethernet ports so you can hardwire a TV/ computer and run a cable to a barn.


You get one IP address per internet account. If the mesh does not cover the barn, you can run a cat 6E or faster to the barn and set up a range extender.
 
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It should be noted....I have absolutely zero idea of what you guys are even talking about. I'll have to search everything you say on the internet.

Also, I have two NVRs. One system on the house and one on the barns.
 
Sixfivesavage said:
It should be noted....I have absolutely zero idea of what you guys are even talking about. I'll have to search everything you say on the internet.

Also, I have two NVRs. One system on the house and one on the barns.
Click to expand...
I'll write up a diagram and some links. You could still have both NVR's at the house with this system. NVR's like being in a climate controlled enclosure. I do have access to some rugged NVR's that are rated for pretty much any temp but there kinda pricey.
 
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missed said:
I'll write up a diagram and some links. You could still have both NVR's at the house with this system. NVR's like being in a climate controlled enclosure. I do have access to some rugged NVR's that are rated for pretty much any temp but there kinda pricey.
Click to expand...
The shop is going to be more climate controlled than the house, though neither is actually climate controlled. The vacant house isn't heated since it doesn't have electric in it with the exception of running the well, a heat lamp and the NVR and internet. The one in the shop is at least inside a metal cabinet so it retains some of the heat from the NVR. They're Lorex systems.
 
You should very seriously consider whatever @missed sends you. There is no regular WiFi access point system that is going to give you reliable connectivity for that far even with 3 meshed units. An ethernet cable’s signal needs to be repeated every 100 yards so you’d have to put some type of signal repeater halfway between the buildings. Something similar to this would probably be an ideal setup:

UniFi Air Fiber 60

You would get one of these for the house and one for the shop, pointed at each other. This will wirelessly beam your house network to the shop. You would also need access points in the shop because this just bridges the connectivity to the shop—it isn’t something phones or computers or cameras would connect into directly. These are way more reliable than WiFi across distances longer than 75 feet.

Good luck!
 
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Mesh is nice for great coverage over shorter distances, as in 100' radius, but most won't do the 200y (Missed likely nailed that situation - follow his advice).

I use google wifi's mesh (8 of them) which cover house, barn, patio areas etc extremely well. Some devices require an ethernet-cabled connection to the internet (like a Reolink NVR), here you can plug that device into a wireless mesh "access point" ethernet port, and let the mesh's access points work together seamlessly.
 
Nano beams would be more than enough to make the bridge. 450mbs, less than $100 for each of them. Airfiber equipment is great. I have some nano beams scattered across a neighborhood for a camera system, I have 2 locations that are over 6 miles
 
You need two of these.

5C844362-9ED4-490C-A5F2-623EC498AE8F.png


TP-link CPE-210 transmitter/ receiver.

I shoot wifi about 200 yards to one building and about 100 yards to another. Works great! Was a little difficult to program as these are designed for people who are in the business, but with utube I was able to get them going.
 
200 yards sounds damn far unless you have a clean line of sight. You could rent a trencher, get some underground tubing, get it in place then run physical cables. The ethernet cable is going to be under $200. 1000' Shielded underground direct burial cable is like $250-450.

So maybe map out a physical path, see what the footage ends up being. Compare costs. Not to mention if you plan correctly you can include more cables/wires inside the conduit you bury if that's the route you take for getting it to the building.
 
UniFi / Ubiquiti is the way to go. This isn’t cheap but will work

store.ui.com

WiFi BaseStation XG - Ubiquiti Store

Tri-radio WiFi 5 AP with 12 spatial streams and a selectable beamforming antenna, designed for high-density applications at large venues.
store.ui.com store.ui.com

Set this up for someone in a similar situation. House has internet, but they wanted WiFi in the barn
 
LuvDog said:
UniFi / Ubiquiti is the way to go. This isn’t cheap but will work

store.ui.com

WiFi BaseStation XG - Ubiquiti Store

Tri-radio WiFi 5 AP with 12 spatial streams and a selectable beamforming antenna, designed for high-density applications at large venues.
store.ui.com store.ui.com

Set this up for someone in a similar situation. House has internet, but they wanted WiFi in the barn
Click to expand...
Base XG is way over kill, 10g bandwidth is not going to be needed in any residential application. Even many commercial applications. We rent Base XG setups for temporary venues.

Simple nano beam at up to 450mb/s would be plenty of bandwidth.

www.ui.com

airMAX NanoBeam 5AC - Ubiquiti Store

Compact, UISP-ready, 5 GHz WiFi bridge with enhanced surge protection and an optimized radio and antenna.
www.ui.com www.ui.com
 
missed said:
I'll write up a diagram and some links. You could still have both NVR's at the house with this system. NVR's like being in a climate controlled enclosure. I do have access to some rugged NVR's that are rated for pretty much any temp but there kinda pricey.
Click to expand...

Would also like to see something like that. Don't have NVRs (had to look that up) but like OP trying to get wifi from house into metal shop building about 75yds away w/o running wire. Started looking into this a few months ago but lost interest because I couldn't figure out what to buy/how to hook up each end.
 
Waorani said:
Would also like to see something like that. Don't have NVRs (had to look that up) but like OP trying to get wifi from house into metal shop building about 75yds away w/o running wire. Started looking into this a few months ago but lost interest because I couldn't figure out what to buy/how to hook up each end.
Click to expand...

225' clear line of sight, nanobeams would be one option. May be able to use 2 of the outdoor access points, which would get you outdoor WiFi. The extended mesh network would provide an access point right at the metal building along with another indoor access point inside the building. You might be able to get away with just the two exterior AP's.

If you want an Ethernet connection the nano beam bridge is a better solution. I have been able to provide an Ethernet on the tail end of the extended mesh system, but I haven't been as happy going that route to just save a couple pieces of gear.
 
missed said:
Base XG is way over kill, 10g bandwidth is not going to be needed in any residential application. Even many commercial applications. We rent Base XG setups for temporary venues.

Simple nano beam at up to 450mb/s would be plenty of bandwidth.

www.ui.com

airMAX NanoBeam 5AC - Ubiquiti Store

Compact, UISP-ready, 5 GHz WiFi bridge with enhanced surge protection and an optimized radio and antenna.
www.ui.com www.ui.com
Click to expand...
Got your email. Thanks a lot for that. I still have about zero understanding of what all this crap is and what I would need but I am starting to think it would definitely be easier and less hassle to set up to just trench it and be done with it.
 
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Many of the above systems can be tricky to setup if you don't understand the terminologies and technologies. There are now companies that offer pre-configured wireless bridges that work wonderfully.

Like this

Amazon.com: Ubiquiti LocoM2 2-PACK PRE-CONFIGURED Nanostation Loco M2 AirMax CPE 2.4GHz: Home Audio & Theater

Buy Ubiquiti LocoM2 2-PACK PRE-CONFIGURED Nanostation Loco M2 AirMax CPE 2.4GHz: Wireless Access Points - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
www.amazon.com
 
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Am I wrong to think the simplest, most direct way to get internet to the shop to connect a NVR would be to trench duct and pull an ethernet cable and plug the damn thing in direct to the router in the house?
 
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Sixfivesavage said:
Am I wrong to think the simplest, most direct way to get internet to the shop to connect a NVR would be to trench duct and pull an ethernet cable and plug the damn thing in direct to the router in the house?
Click to expand...
No, that is the simplest way to do it. Just takes a different approach. Like someone else above said, Ethernet over 100m can run into trouble. We go to fiber optics over 100m. One of the best ways to run over 100m is coax and line extenders at both ends. If the fiber term tools are not available. Do you have any line buddies on the comm side? I actually hate having copper in the ground here for communication, the lightning just beats our ass.

The couple nano beams, flex switches, some other hardware including surge supressors, would more than likely be less expensive.
 
VA-Varminter said:
Many of the above systems can be tricky to setup if you don't understand the terminologies and technologies. There are now companies that offer pre-configured wireless bridges that work wonderfully.

Like this

Amazon.com: Ubiquiti LocoM2 2-PACK PRE-CONFIGURED Nanostation Loco M2 AirMax CPE 2.4GHz: Home Audio & Theater

Buy Ubiquiti LocoM2 2-PACK PRE-CONFIGURED Nanostation Loco M2 AirMax CPE 2.4GHz: Wireless Access Points - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
www.amazon.com
Click to expand...

If I understand these correctly, they basically get you a wireless ethernet signal to a remote location - not your actual existing wifi signal? So,

- on the broadcast end - ethernet cable from existing wireless router (in house) into power adapter and another ethernet cable to antenna

- on receiving end (this is where I get confused) - ethernet cable from antenna to a second wireless router? or access point? or switch (in shop)? I believe a switch would just be something to plug a computer directly into? but don't understand difference between the wifi router and access point other than having read not to have multiple routers on same network. Does an "access point" solve that and have the same password, etc as the in house wifi?
 
1) I'd say you are correct.
2) No. Your device finds the signal for access.

Seems like some of what was posted above are just transmission antennas that take the ethernet "internet" access point off your router and transmits that signal. Then there is an access security that is part of that transmitted signal.

So your device on the other end will receive the signal from the antenna that provides the access to your network router. It seems possible that you could configure a switch in the barn to allow multiple hardwire connections to the broadcast signal.

I think you may be confusing some terms interchangeably. WiFi is it's own thing. A router is it's own thing. There are routers that provide a WiFi signal. The router does have protocol that helps with user access and security.

Access point from the web:
An access point is a device that creates a wireless local area network, or WLAN, usually in an office or large building. An access point connects to a wired router, switch, or hub via an Ethernet cable, and projects a Wi-Fi signal to a designated area. For example, if you want to enable Wi-Fi access in your company's reception area but don’t have a router within range, you can install an access point near the front desk and run an Ethernet cable through the ceiling back to the server room.
 
What is being mentioned above (the Ubiquiti solution) is just using two radios to replace the ethernet cable. All other equipment required would remain the same. The radios are cheap and reliable. As long as you have power on both ends you are good to go.
 
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Waorani said:
If I understand these correctly, they basically get you a wireless ethernet signal to a remote location - not your actual existing wifi signal? So,

- on the broadcast end - ethernet cable from existing wireless router (in house) into power adapter and another ethernet cable to antenna

- on receiving end (this is where I get confused) - ethernet cable from antenna to a second wireless router? or access point? or switch (in shop)? I believe a switch would just be something to plug a computer directly into? but don't understand difference between the wifi router and access point other than having read not to have multiple routers on same network. Does an "access point" solve that and have the same password, etc as the in house wifi?
Click to expand...

Each unit comes with two ethernet ports, so you can plug a single device into the far end. If you need just a cabled connection at the far end then you're done. If you want more that one cabled connection at the far end, then you can add a switch.
If you want wireless at the far end then you MAY have to add an access point at that end of the bridge.

An access point does no routing. it simply provides a wireless connection back to your existing router, which most people already have.
You would not need any more than a simple access point for wireless at the far end of this bridge setup.
They are much easier and simpler setup than routers. About $25
 
Thanks all. Don't really need cabled connection in shop, just WiFi. So I'd just need to run an ethernet cable from the bridge to an access point? That's it? Not sure what "MAY have to add access point" means. There's got to be something in the shop to serve as a "wifi antenna," for lack of a better description, doesn't there?

I've had every generation of PC from the first one w/ two 5 1/4 floppys, 286s, 386s, 486s, Pentiums, and on and on but have never gotten the networking part.
 
Waorani said:
Thanks all. Don't really need cabled connection in shop, just WiFi. So I'd just need to run an ethernet cable from the bridge to an access point? That's it?
Click to expand...


That's it. I said "MAY" before because I don't think these units have dual radios. One with dual radios would allow for a wifi network at the remote end without the need for another access point.
 
VA-Varminter said:
That's it. I said "MAY" before because I don't think these units have dual radios. One with dual radios would allow for a wifi network at the remote end without the need for another access point.
Click to expand...

Got it, thanks!

And sorry OP for stepping into your thread but hopefully this will help others too.
 
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MTN said:
I didnt read all the replies.

But if the shed is on the same breaker panel as the house I'd look into power line adapters to extend ethernet to the out building.
Click to expand...

Thought about that after seeing some of the options while researching but shop is on it's own meter.
 
If you can deploy Fiber, digging your ducts, it might not be the cheapest or simplest solution, but it will be certainly the most future proof. point to point dark Fiber with Ethernet switches at both ends should work even if you do not have any clue about internet/ip internet working whatsoever. And your grandsons will still be using it unless rats find them palatable, that unfortunately happens quite often.
 
I know you said digging was not the preferred option.
But if wifi does not work out, consider fiber-optic cable.
Depending on where you live, if there is substantial Summer lightning, avoid any low-voltage metal cable between buildings (Ethernet).
I live in Florida. Lightning capitol of North America.
Screen Shot 2020-12-28 at 16.11.44.png

Could not put any low-voltage cable (Ethernet) between the house and workshop, 200ft away, as it would be zapped.
Found an ebay seller of fiber optic patch cables, kids helped dig the trench & install conduit.
Used a shop-vac to vacuum the pull string through the conduit.
Pulled in the fiber, connected to small Ethernet switches on each end that had a fiber interface (a pair of used ethernet switches from ebay ).
20 years on, zillions of lightning strikes, all still working!
 
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The Link CPE 210 are $80 for the pair. Then you need a router at the other end. Probably the cheapest option but is a bit of a pain to program. Utube videos are required.

CD2DD7B0-6D5E-42A1-BCCF-8066D9470501.png
 
Waorani said:
Would also like to see something like that. Don't have NVRs (had to look that up) but like OP trying to get wifi from house into metal shop building about 75yds away w/o running wire. Started looking into this a few months ago but lost interest because I couldn't figure out what to buy/how to hook up each end.
Click to expand...
My situation is similar to yours. My shop is block and 50 yards from the house (where the wifi is). I don't want to trench or vibe plow because I have trees I want to keep alive. i'm looking for something to get a signal to the shop without going into the ground.
 
LuvDog said:
You really only want to run Ethernet 100 meters
Click to expand...

Doing Optical Fibre based Ethernet is really simple actually.
Go on eBay, get a couple $100 to $200 switches that have 2x 10gbe Fibre SFP+ ports and then a bunch of Gigabit ethernet RJ45 ports
Decide how many meters total you want to run and get the GBICs to match.
Grab 2 pre-made cables rated for the specific type of GBICs, of the length you want + extra and then have at it, pretty much no more difficulty than it would be to run any other wire the same distance and not that much more cost either.
 
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Ok. So I hit the house with the rangefinder from the door to the shop last night. 95 yards line of sight. I have maybe 10 yards inside the house, line of sight to get to the internet. I could move it closer to that wall if it makes a difference. Can I make this work with a POE switch and ethernet cable?
 
Ubiquiti is the way to go. Very easy to setup. It is line of sight. Put one on your house and one on the shop wired to a Router set up as an access point.
 
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Maybe the problem is with your WiFi. Sometimes the wires of Wifi from the new generation can't be processed by old devices. For example, I have a 5G router at home, and I am using an Ipad mini for it and Laptop. I have noticed that the Internet on these devices is running considerably slower than on my mobile phone. I downloaded iWifi for Mac to check the Internet speed on my iPhone and MacBook, and the difference was big. This is all because my MacBook is old, and it can't work using 5G Internet speed.
__________________

iWifi for Mac - SpeedTest & Signal Test - Free Mac Wi-Fi speedtest and network analyzer - Oka Apps

iWifi for Mac - SpeedTest & Signal Test - iWifi for Mac - speedtest for the Wi-Fi and wired network. One-click to do the speedtest on Mac. Show download/upload speed on Mac status bar real-time. View all detailed information if your Mac network.
okaapps.com okaapps.com
 
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Can someone confirm, in order to get internet with available ports to a barn from the main router at a house, I would need two of these...

store.ui.com

airMAX NanoBeam 5AC - Ubiquiti Store

Compact, UISP-ready, 5 GHz WiFi bridge with enhanced surge protection and an optimized radio and antenna.
store.ui.com store.ui.com

And one of these...

store.ui.com

Switch Flex Mini - Ubiquiti Store

A compact, 5-port, Layer 2 switch that can be powered with PoE or a 5V USB-C adapter.
store.ui.com store.ui.com

And some cat6 cable obviously. I'm not sure I'm reading it right but it seems like the nanobeam has a POE injector included in the specs.
 
All you can do is read what the page states is included
Seems more clear many of the rambling posts on the hide ;)

1635556390867.png
 
Quick start guide suggests you buy the Sure Protectors separately (not included)

1635556610642.png
 
Highly recommend the surge protection if your in an area that gets lightning. I'm in Texas, every device that is outside of a building here gets surge protection.

Yes the nano beams come with POE adapters. Got a pile of them in the shop right now....
 
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Ubiquiti LocoM2 recommended above worked for me. Both ends have POE adapters so internet connection in at house and internet out to wireless access point in shop. Assume Nanobeam would be the same and instead of access point just a switch would work as well for hard wired. Only issue was I wasn't able to get the preconfigured units to work so returned, ordered unconfigured and had to wade through the setup.
 
I know virtually nothing about this kind of stuff so I wasn't sure if there was a difference between what's included and a POE injector. I was gonna have Padom set it all up but I can't get a hold of him since September.


He is busier than a puppy with two peters....

Setup on the link between the two is not to bad the user interface makes it pretty easy. I can help you with setup.
 
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