Anybody having issues getting their B14 Trainer with Carbon barrel to group with a suppressor? Recently just picked up a Bergara B14 on a sale. Had it out yesterday for the first time and noticed very large POI shifts while running the can and poor accuracy (2-3 MOA). Unsuppressed the rifle shot great. Issues were present across the three types of ammo I tried (CCI SV, Eley, SK) the POI shift was high which I thought was a bit strange. I only had one can with me (Silencerco Switchback) but I run it on all my other rimfires so I doubt its an issue with the can. I'm assuming the problem is with the Carbon Tension barrel. Just wondering if this is a common known problem with them or did I just win the unlucky lottery? I did run across an old post from ORKAN (primal rights) where he mentioned similiar issues with the carbon barrel.
- Thread starter Millron
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Buddy has the same issue. Gun shoots like a shotgun with a can, groups perfect without it. Hes got the carbon barrel as well
Every can will do different things with every barrel.
I have thin barrels that move up and down, I have heavy barrels that move up and down. Only ever had 1 that didn't move and I think it was a freak chance of everything meshing, not necessarily repeatable.
Try a different can. It's a .22, so it's going to do what it does and there's little you can do but keep testing. The most fun and frustrating part is not being able to just develop a load and reload what works.
I have thin barrels that move up and down, I have heavy barrels that move up and down. Only ever had 1 that didn't move and I think it was a freak chance of everything meshing, not necessarily repeatable.
Try a different can. It's a .22, so it's going to do what it does and there's little you can do but keep testing. The most fun and frustrating part is not being able to just develop a load and reload what works.
Agreed, I own and shoot lots of different 22s, suppressed and unsuppressed but this one takes the cake. Its obviously something is happening outside just normal "harmonics issues". The lower group is unsuppressed, the five founds running vertical are with the can "on".
Good to know, sounds like maybe not a unique issue.
My CZ457 did this also with the Odin Works .22 can. I had the threaded end tested to make sure it was concentric with the bore and the gunsmith put another can on it. With a different can it shot great and the threads were great.
Once the can was finally out of jail, I was able to do some testing. I removed all the baffle extensions except 1 so I would still have an end cap. It shot great with 1, then added 2nd, shot great. But once I put on the 4th a dramatic shift happened. By the time I added the 6th baffle, it was off paper at 25 yards. Crazy how much barrel harmonics can affect the flight path.
Once the can was finally out of jail, I was able to do some testing. I removed all the baffle extensions except 1 so I would still have an end cap. It shot great with 1, then added 2nd, shot great. But once I put on the 4th a dramatic shift happened. By the time I added the 6th baffle, it was off paper at 25 yards. Crazy how much barrel harmonics can affect the flight path.
Question.... Is the carbon barrel a pencil barrel with a fairly lose carbon tube around it? I would have thought that a carbon barrel
would be much stiffer than 4140 steel if it was actually boded to the steel since carbon fiber is much stronger in terms of modulus of elasticity and tensile strength.
Of course, if it's simply a slip over a CF sleeve I'm thinking it would be near useless except for looks and weigh savings. It's difficult to imagine Bergara would do that sort of thing.
I guess I should read up on CF barrels and their construction.
would be much stiffer than 4140 steel if it was actually boded to the steel since carbon fiber is much stronger in terms of modulus of elasticity and tensile strength.
Of course, if it's simply a slip over a CF sleeve I'm thinking it would be near useless except for looks and weigh savings. It's difficult to imagine Bergara would do that sort of thing.
I guess I should read up on CF barrels and their construction.
It's the same as every other cheap carbon barrel. Sleeve over a pencil barrel.
I'm guessing that since a proof blank is $700, they're not going to figure out how to put a real carbon barrel on until you get to the $2k price point.
For your reading pleasure
PSA berg 14r carbon barrel.
First in my quest to figure out why the cold bore shot was so far off and as the day got hotter the groups were opening up to look like a shotgun blast. Tried all types of ammo and some helped but still had problems. So in getting the barrel ready for a suppressor i started checking runout and...
www.snipershide.com 
Ive got a 7 or 8 mil shift low and like 5 mil right at 50yds from unsuppressed.
That's with my can. I put my buddy's can on and its tight shooting and only off by a few tenths low.
I don't know what to say to you. I've seen cans shift POI and group size with lots of guns....not just Bergara Carbon's.
I could cry about it. But it shot good enough to be a top competitor in the region in Open NRL22 last year. The gun has walked on plenty of higher dollar rigs at times.
This thread comes off sounding like they are junk barrels when I've seen no reason to believe they are not in any way equally as good on paper as the steel versions. If you say yours dissappoints....it doesn't mean that they all do or others haven't had good use with them.
That's with my can. I put my buddy's can on and its tight shooting and only off by a few tenths low.
I don't know what to say to you. I've seen cans shift POI and group size with lots of guns....not just Bergara Carbon's.
I could cry about it. But it shot good enough to be a top competitor in the region in Open NRL22 last year. The gun has walked on plenty of higher dollar rigs at times.
This thread comes off sounding like they are junk barrels when I've seen no reason to believe they are not in any way equally as good on paper as the steel versions. If you say yours dissappoints....it doesn't mean that they all do or others haven't had good use with them.
I have a B14 and it shoots great without the can. I only used my can at first for the cool factor. Then realized I was getting to many flyers. Since I’ve removed the can my groups are way better and consistent. I have a cheap Hunter Town can so maybe that’s it.
And I was hoping to finally have a use for my can. Oh well. Not worth the hassle when competing. And honestly, I like the shorter overall length when competing.
And I was hoping to finally have a use for my can. Oh well. Not worth the hassle when competing. And honestly, I like the shorter overall length when competing.
They are not junk barrels. These guns shoot lights out. We have 6 guys at our club that shoot both the steel and carbon B14 and are right up there in the pack with the vudoo. The only thing that separates the top shooters is the fact that they just shoot faster. Shoot, one of top shooters shoots a CZ. That’s half my problem. I just need to compete more and learn to get more proficient. Learn what works best for me. Get better at working on my holds. Watch what the good shooters are doing during the stage. But having my dope correct allows me to work on the other stuff.
Where did I say they are junk barrels? Maybe you should re read the post. It's an honest question if it's a known issue with tension barrels and cans? Thru some additional research it doesn't look like my issue is all that unique. Luck of the draw I guess. I have lots of cans and lots of rimfires, this one is the worst that I've tried with a can by far. Without a can it shoots very well. I've tried two different cans on it, same result. POI SHIFT isn't a big deal if repeatable, but the horrible groups are. Mostly vertical dispersion, not a random "splatter" type group.
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I run a Volquartsen carbon barrel (which is also a carbon sleeved pencil barrel) on my 10/22 TD. I get about a 3/4 MOA shift in POI when I run a Dead Air Mask on it, but there is no discernable change in accuracy. I just finished wrenching on my BIL's Bergara BXR with a carbon barrel, I may take it out today and see how it handles having a can on it.
After moving away from the can on my B14 I ended up installing a Hellfire Brake mostly for the added weight. But it hasn’t affected accuracy at all. And honestly it appears to have helped my grouping. I just feel more confident with it on. Also the added weight of the MPA chassis. Making the overall gun heavier has helped my holds leading to better more accurate shooting. Never thought it would help as much as it does. Definitely minimizes scope movement. Yes it could be overkill but it does help.
Light weight will amplify everything you do incorrectly. Heavy weight will help you develop poor habits.
Possibly. Not sure what bad habits I have. Until someone points them out, I won’t know for sure. For me, it’s trying to get faster and better at target acquisition and the having a steady hold with little movement as possible. I just need to shoot and practice more to find what works best for me to achieve this. Watching other shooters helps with movement and stance.
