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Gunsmithing I've had it with Tactical Rifles.

I

IH8DavidRooney

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Jul 22, 2014
21
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I ordered an SPG from those clowns TWO years ago. I understand others here have had similar issues. I wish I had known about it at the time.

I've payed them 4 grand for this rifle, without so much as an update. I have emailed them with no response. I have made multiple phone calls, and most go unanswered. In the fortunate event someone actually picks up the phone, I'm told the same crap. "It should be ready next month." I even called Rooney direct, and he blew me off. I feel like I am out 4k and will never have a rifle to show for it. Even if I do eventually get it, will it be worth owning?

I'm about to call again, for whatever that's worth.

Had anyone attempted to do anything about this guy? I understand he's lawyered up pretty good, so will going through a lawyer do any good? Has anyone attempted to put a group together for a class action suit or something similar? I want this guy finished. I want my money back. I don't even want the rifle anymore, although that would be better than what I've got out of the deal, so far. I want something. What are my options, here?
 
They actually answered this time. They told me they are waiting for the barrel. They've been getting the run around from the barrel company since November, according to the lady I spoke to. Funny, I've been waiting since August of 2012. I asked if getting my money back was an option (knowing it wasn't), and of course, she said it wasn't. I told her that I, along with many others, were fed up with Rooney's scams, so I would be putting a group together to file a suit against him. I fully intend to do just that, if it is in any way a viable option. Anyone else interested? How would I go about that?
 
Oh boy...

What barrel are they waiting for? It would be fairly easy to find a quality barrel, even if you need to change brands. I would see what they say if you do a little foot work and locate a barrel, see what happens if you offer to purchase a barrel and send it to them, if that is all they are waiting on.

Kirk Roberts
 
You can't file a class action, customers of TR is not a class as I am to understand it.

I would recommend getting a lawyer and documenting your troubles, their suit is specifically about removing any negative reviews or instances with their customers from our website. Basically they want the Internet free of Negative Comments which is why you didn't see any. They use their lawyer to threaten sites to remove this stuff. Also contact the BBB in FLA and file a complaint that helps document the issues too.

I would call back and ask them who the barrel company is they are using. We have contacts in the shooting world and can find out the truth. I can tell you, I was at Bartlein Barrels last week and they told me about their Dealings with TR.... I won't repeat it, but the barrels ordered were finished, it was the TR side that fell down.

If you have any email exchanges with them, it is always helpful to post them, as they claim we are creating fake accounts from fake disgruntled customers as part of their lawsuit against us. In other words, you are not who you say you are, and are simply making stuff up. Anonymous people on the internet attacking them at our urging is what they tell others. I would list an order number at least...
 
Thanks. I'll check out those threads.

I just had it out with David. He called me a few minutes after I talked to his office. He started off by yelling and cussing at me, calling me a smart ass and everything else. It pretty much went downhill from there. Mostly insults and placing the blame on Krieger barrels. They gave me two different dates that they had been waiting since, which doesn't even matter, since both were over a year later after I ordered the rifle. He also dared me to drive to Florida and tell him these things to his face. I wasn't exactly cordial with the guy, but I have never in my life seen that level of rudeness from a business to a customer.

He gave me his word that he would call me when the barrel comes in. Is his word supposed to mean something to me at this point?
 
He is jack ass

Go with gap. My last 5 have been awesome and I got the ones they built for me from the ground up pretty quick.
 
One would think a half-ass competent gunsmith would offer a Rock Creek or Bartlein alternative - after all, Bugholes has both (and even Krieger) in stock...
 
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Rooney from my life long experiance, "telephone tough guys", are simply just that. Big mouth on the phone, cowards in person. They pretty much stole your money, and push you back and back to keep you on the ropes. As lowlight said, document and get lawyer up. If it were my $4,000, I dont care who or what tough guy is yelling on the phone, I would make a person trip there.
 
Showing up on his steps would delight me. But I'm trying to be smart about this. He deserves more than a black eye, and I deserve my money back.
 
BoilerUP said:
One would think a half-ass competent gunsmith would offer a Rock Creek or Bartlein alternative - after all, Bugholes has both (and even Krieger) in stock...
Click to expand...

I asked him why that wasn't an option. He said they are all on back order. 2 years? I ordered a Lilja, and it came in 4 months. He said they don't prefer Lilja. Really? This is about what YOU prefer?
 
I'd call him up and tell him to go to Bugholes.com and order an in-stock fucking barrel right now.
 
Lowlight said:
I would consider calling Krieger now and tell them you have a rifle on order with TR and that it is going on 2 years because of them and see what they say.
Click to expand...

I think I'll do that. I've been wanting to call them. I just didn't know how to approach it. Thanks.

Obviously, talking to David gets me nowhere. I'll give this a shot.
 
albeit i do my own work but ive never waited more then a couple weeks for a barrel and i'm a nobody. you'd think bad ass's like TR would get them just as quickly. he's a fuckin liar if you ask me.
 
He is a liar. That's a fact.

I talked to Krieger. They laughed when I told them what he said. The wait time for that barrel is about 6 months, and that's from the time the barrels are ordered and payed for. He said he gets calls like this from time to time, and it's always about companies that drag their feet on building guns.

Now, this is just their word, but I've had enough dealings with David to know who to trust, here.
 
Your on the right track. I would find a barrel in stock and call TR with the info, let them know you are part of the solution if they are truely intending to make it right. Better yet, tell them you will purchase it yourslef and have it sent to them.

I have a feeling TR feels like they are in the middle of a hornets nest and there #1 goal right now is damage control, although it sounds like they didn't go out of their way to put you at ease when you called. I hope that this legal mess will work out and customers will get the rifles and gear they payed for.
 
I feel like anymore dealings with this guy is a complete waste of time. I can either wait it out and hope for the best, or get a lawyer involved. I think the latter option is the only one that will give him any incentive. I could send him a barrel, but that obviously isn't the problem. He could have had one by now if he wanted to. Then I would have wasted money on that, too.

Does anyone know of any successful legal action being taken against the turd?
 
What's so hard about turning the lights on and getting the machines going to build rifles? They are, afterall, (self) touted to be superior in all ways? The challenge is that with these claims come proof, and everything so far has been counter to that. Success is bred by success and obviously something is amiss here, especially when their *excuse* is the 'barrel company' which has stated what you can reasonably expect. I waited just shy of 6 months to the day for the last Krieger I ordered. As promised.
2 years....a bit of a stretch. I communicate with customers and send them texts with pics of stuff I am doing, keeping them involved goes a long way and doesn't add a great deal of time.
Sad state of affairs.
 
Early Cuyler said:
Sadly, I don't believe the outfit at TR is capable of MAKING the quality rifles they paid for.
Click to expand...

That's another conclusion I've arrived at. I don't even want the gun, now. I want my money back. I'll never be able to trust the gun, and it will be a constant reminder of the goofy talking bastard. This was supposed to be my all around, do all, down and dirty, deer and pig gun. And I'm supposed to count on it in any situation after knowing all of this? And suppose it works fine, and I try to sell it? I would take a huge hit due to the reputation of his work. I'm in a no win situation without getting a full refund.
 
jasonk said:
IH8, where are you located?
Click to expand...

West Texas.

BRB, I'm going to take a quick drive down the road to Florida and chat with him in person, like he suggested.

He's got some gall. I feel like he was baiting me into flying down there. We were both yelling at the time, but I'm pretty sure he offered to pay for half of the airfare to do it. He probably had his lawyer next to him getting ready to file charges for assault. I just know more than one person has threatened him by now, so he expects it. I'm not falling for stupid crap like that.
 
As Lowlight said, document everything. Dates of payments, promises, phone calls, etc. If you haven't written down the notes from today's conversation then do so. Start a binder and keep track of stuff. The courts believe facts, if you ho hum in testimony that I called somewhere around a certain date then they assume you're not really sure. If you say on the 22nd at 1pm I called and we spoke for 12 minutes and he threatened me, promised me, etc then then they know your facts are facts.

Make the calls on your cell phone? Those records are likely searchable and you can find out dates that you called the TR office, get that info back as far as you can.

If you can find my comments in the other thread about filing in small claims it's very inexpensive, you can have a service file the paperwork for you and likely you can handle everything up to the court date from Texas. Then go to court, state your case, win. If he no shows you get a judgement by default. Also, if you haven't requested a refund in writing then do so immediately. Send it by email, regular mail and return receipt mail. Ask him for a refund or the rifle within say 60 days, plenty of time for him to complete or refund money, small claims will likely take longer than that for a court date so you'll have had tried to make an honest attempt at resolving it without the courts.

I'm no legal beagle, but I've done small claims a handful of times to collect from non paying customers.
 
Your best bet is to call your local small claims court clerk and ask for information on how to prepare a filing, and whether you can file there. They will be in the best position to describe the rules regarding whether/how you can sue someone out-of-state by filing a lawsuit in Texas (e.g., establishing jurisdiction by them electing to do business with a customer in Texas), and how to complete the filing correctly.

I think small claims courts are called justice courts in Texas, but a little poking around online should reveal plenty of information and contacts relevant to your county.
 
I certainly no lawyer, but I do know they don't work for free, and are very expensive. You can sue them, and win. Some judge will order them to reimburse your deposit after a good long fight which they will drag on. It really sucks, but the law protects bad businesses like this. I don't care for them nor their rifles, especially at their crazy prices. A very long time ago when they first started, and I didn't know a precision rifle from a shotgun, I bought one of their rifles. The wait was so long, that it prompted me to start building my own shit. By the time I got my rifle from them I had already bought equipment, learned to use it, and had two rifles that surpassed theirs in quality, and that's me, a no body.

I'm not suggesting you do the same as me, because I'm fucked up. I would however, order a Precison rifle from one of the vendors on this site, and you'll have it before they fill their order. Then, just wait for them to deliver, and sell those rifles on Gunbroker to someone whom doesn't know them. I know that's not what anyone should have to do, but you will come out ahead money wise, and trouble free. Meanwhile, keep being a pain in their ass with daily phone or weekly phone calls with out spending your hard earned cash on a lawyer who gets his wether you win or not.

Punching a dirt bag like that in the face, or better yet slapping him around like a little bitch with an open hand would only feel good for little while, and then you'll spend a very long time paying for it because you know pussys always run to the cops to tell them that someone gave them a well deserved ass whooping.

Believe me, I know how it feels to get ripped off by some low life.
 
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Have him send you everything but the barrel. If all he is waiting on is that, you would have all the other pieces to send to a smith that might not have as heavy a work load as them. At least you would get something back.
 
Yeah, it sucks that I would have to chase bad money with good. At this point, it's more about the principle.

I may call him and see if he'll send me the parts. I bet he won't. I bet he doesn't even have them.
 
I think you should call him and let him in on the conversation you had with krieger. Tell him you dont know who to believe and ask him to mail you copies of the orders he has placed with them. Or show up at his shop with a krieger barrel in hand and tell him to refund that portion of your bill and install what you hand him.

I hate seeing guys treat customers like this.
 
What a nightmare. Suing is only going to get the lawyers a pay day. Because if you win in court it doesn't actually mean your going to be able to collect. Like what was already suggested, Have Rooney stop all work and ship everything he has to a local FFL dealer and the barrel to your home when it comes in. Try to settle cause they have all the cards.
 
Whatever you do DO NOT send him a barrel. Then he'll have your rifle, your new barrel, AND your money. Don't give him any thing else. Its time to take take take.
 
remind him he said he was just waiting on a barrel. Take take take and run. Don't give another dime. You have spent enough. Spending money on a lawyer I agree seems like a good idea but that is more money out of pocket and still no rifle. Get the parts what you can of them and go somewhere that will at least not yell at you on the phone. For the $4000.00 you have spent maybe you have to stop by his shop and help him find the parts for your rifle. Cut the loss and move on. I would be just as pissed off as you.
 
IH8DavidRooney said:
Yeah, it sucks that I would have to chase bad money with good. At this point, it's more about the principle.

I may call him and see if he'll send me the parts. I bet he won't. I bet he doesn't even have them.
Click to expand...

We all understand principal, but throwing more money into the fire doesn't help you. Asking for the parts from this clown won't work any better than asking for a completed rifle. Try it, but I'm with you in that he's not going to send you anything until he doesn't feel like it. Sending you your parts would mean that he's reasonable, and we all already know he's not. BTW, I'm almost certain he's reading everything you/we post, and he will now make your life even more difficult with this issue. Be smart, and analyze all you possible legal options carefully before deciding which way you're going to run with this, and why. I'm sure he does, which is why he has yours, and many other people's money that we don't know about, and has you all hanging. Clear heads win wars.
 
He already knows how I feel about him and his business. He can read all he wants. He knows he's screwing people over. He just won't admit it to anyone else. If nothing else, I have a 4 thousand dollar lesson. Do better research on companies to expose the low lifes and don't pay the full fee up front. I'll have to do my best to forget about this whole deal and get a quality rifle elsewhere. It's obvious that this will never work out. All I can do is make sure others are aware so they can avoid the POS.
 
STR said:
Clear heads win wars.
Click to expand...

Yes indeed. This is also why he will never reply to emails or posts here (or other sites) due to the fact that would leave a trail of legal bread crumbs. You can say a lot on a phone call and the only record is that there was a call, not what is said. Texts, forums, emails, that is your best recourse. By all means, if you can document phone call times and frequency, that is very good.
 
I would recommend posting your order number, otherwise this will be used against our suit as evidence.

With a valid order, that will say a lot more than you might realize as this is part of his defense.
 
Yeah, they won't respond to emails.

You got it, man. I'll have to dig through my emails from TWO YEARS ago, but that is not a problem.
 
Here is what I was sent for my first payment. I made several more to equal an amount just shy of $4,000.00. In fact, they actually overcharged me, and I had to call to get them to fix it. Does this provide the necessary info?

 
Also I would download a call recording app and put their number it in. It will record all phone calls from them which you might need as further evidence.
 
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