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KAC SR25 challenge!!!

Yeah like the mk12 quad rail that the entire world is after. People are scalping them for 1200$ or more on Arfcom.

I get that its a legacy product, and production is currently dedicated to current production items but there is no reason that they can't subcontract the work out to make a 20-year-old aluminum handguard.

Do all your current and next gen stuff in house, sub out all legacy support.

Its really not that hard.
 
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I bought a MK20 in 6.5 like a year ago when I gave up looking for the 6.5 upper.
Literally everything on the market is less costly than a lone KAC upper, it’s fairly ridiculous but you know…poors and stuff?
 
Literally everything on the market is less costly than a lone KAC upper, it’s fairly ridiculous but you know…poors and stuff?

Trust me I know and its a double edged sword. I have a KAC gun that there are only about 20 of.

It has a ROR on it that outperforms basically anything. Yet even I think the prices are insane.
 
What is your assessment of the MK20? pros /cons and would you make that purchase again today?
Thanks
I like it and it fills a good role between a MK12 and a bolt gun.

The Pros...

It's way lighter than it looks. It actually surprised me when I picked it up as to how light it was. This is due to the polymer lower as well as I'm not even entirely sure what the exact metal they use for the rail system is but its very lightweight. Compared to a SR25 or any other large frame, this thing is light with a ton of rail space and better balanced. The stock is designed around being a precision weapon; the adjustable buttpad, cheek piece and LOP reflect that; it doesn't have a wonky angled stock that wont allow for much rear bag bearing surface area. Again, all of this was very welcomed.

Once I got it to shoot (more on that below) the recoil impulse was less and felt like it was higher up (more forgiving to the rear bag) compared to a SR25; however, this was 140g vs 168g or 175g so keep that in mind. Charging handle(s) is ideal and fantastic for kneeling/prone/barricaded shooting. Overall gun functioned very smooth. Any lightweight or polymer parts didn't see to be an issue as far as with heat, being dragged around, etc. 1MOA gun and easily got hits with a NF 3.5-15 out to 1200 with it without much of an effort past zeroing, truing some temperature variances with the 140g Spark ammunition and getting used to what it likes as far as shoulder position, grip pull, etc

I was never a big SCAR guy, but you can tell this thing was built with a purpose in mind.

The Cons...

For a purpose built Geisselle trigger, its nowhere near as good as the other triggers they make which really surprised me. It has a bit of slack and breaks kind of weak instead of a solid break. After my 2nd outing with it I went home and googled triggers for it to replace what was in it. I was relieved when I saw Geisselle made one for it until....I opened the gun and realized it was already in there.

The gun didn't work after 10-15 rounds. It was sending out brass with heavily pierced primers. Initially I thought the Spark ammo was too hot or something and stopped shooting it. Then I came across posts and videos of exactly the problem I was having and it turned out that FN knew about this and redesigned a Gen2 bolt, firing pin and carrier. Gun went to FN and came back with the Gen2 stuff in it and worked without any issues. They also kept the mag I sent with it but sent me 3 when I called asking where it was.

Only other thing is that I wish the stock folded to the side, but whatever.
 
I bought a MK20 in 6.5 like a year ago when I gave up looking for the 6.5 upper.
Allegedly they're going to be dribbling out again before the end of the year. That way you don't have to buy one from Dumbbroker starting at a bid of $6k. Incidentally, I have no issue paying the market price. It is a very good upper. But what I do have an issue with is paying the marked up price so some dood can get his girlfriend a boob job. But that's just me.
 
Allegedly they're going to be dribbling out again before the end of the year. That way you don't have to buy one from Dumbbroker starting at a bid of $6k. Incidentally, I have no issue paying the market price. It is a very good upper. But what I do have an issue with is paying the marked up price so some dood can get his girlfriend a boob job. But that's just me.
The only thing dumber than buying a KAC at above MSRP is selling it so that some other guy can fondle your ex-GF's fake boobs.
 
I like it and it fills a good role between a MK12 and a bolt gun.

The Pros...

It's way lighter than it looks. It actually surprised me when I picked it up as to how light it was. This is due to the polymer lower as well as I'm not even entirely sure what the exact metal they use for the rail system is but its very lightweight. Compared to a SR25 or any other large frame, this thing is light with a ton of rail space and better balanced. The stock is designed around being a precision weapon; the adjustable buttpad, cheek piece and LOP reflect that; it doesn't have a wonky angled stock that wont allow for much rear bag bearing surface area. Again, all of this was very welcomed.

Once I got it to shoot (more on that below) the recoil impulse was less and felt like it was higher up (more forgiving to the rear bag) compared to a SR25; however, this was 140g vs 168g or 175g so keep that in mind. Charging handle(s) is ideal and fantastic for kneeling/prone/barricaded shooting. Overall gun functioned very smooth. Any lightweight or polymer parts didn't see to be an issue as far as with heat, being dragged around, etc. 1MOA gun and easily got hits with a NF 3.5-15 out to 1200 with it without much of an effort past zeroing, truing some temperature variances with the 140g Spark ammunition and getting used to what it likes as far as shoulder position, grip pull, etc

I was never a big SCAR guy, but you can tell this thing was built with a purpose in mind.

The Cons...

For a purpose built Geisselle trigger, its nowhere near as good as the other triggers they make which really surprised me. It has a bit of slack and breaks kind of weak instead of a solid break. After my 2nd outing with it I went home and googled triggers for it to replace what was in it. I was relieved when I saw Geisselle made one for it until....I opened the gun and realized it was already in there.

The gun didn't work after 10-15 rounds. It was sending out brass with heavily pierced primers. Initially I thought the Spark ammo was too hot or something and stopped shooting it. Then I came across posts and videos of exactly the problem I was having and it turned out that FN knew about this and redesigned a Gen2 bolt, firing pin and carrier. Gun went to FN and came back with the Gen2 stuff in it and worked without any issues. They also kept the mag I sent with it but sent me 3 when I called asking where it was.

Only other thing is that I wish the stock folded to the side, but whatever.
Thanks Baron for your thorough thoughts of this platform.
I was never a Scar guy myself until using one in an austere environment not to long ago and cant get over how light and how reliable the platform is.
As much as I like SR25s the scar17 and mk20 make a lot of sense design wise and low weight and reliability is undeniable. The accuracy seems good enough for what it was designed for.
There are a lot of detractors to this platfrom but your experience definitely adds some weight to the validity of this weapon.
 
This discussion is making me glad I never got into a KAC. The proprietary components are what originally put me off. Later, I "changed my mind" but it was already too late by then. But now I feel that my hesitation was the right call.

One thing that irks me to no end is poor customer support.

A lot of good points being made here.

Was thinking I might pick up a KS1 if those ever come out... but we'll see.
 
I intend to shoot this challenge with a CC/TA110/OSS combination when time allows. I'm unlikely to succeed but highly likely to deliver real-world results.
 
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I just got everything for the SR-25 in, and I'll take a crack at this challenge eventually. Since they don't send their own validation targets with the grouping measurements anymore, I wanted to do my own, anyways. I can't promise that I'm a good enough shooter, but I'll do my best and post the results for good or bad.
 




Vids for both LMT and KAC 14.5” 6.5 Creedmoor guns. I find it telling that he didn’t include an accuracy review on the KAC.
 
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I mean, different strokes for different folks and more power to anyone who wants one, but I don't understand a 14.5" creedmoor rifle.
 
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Vids for both LMT and KAC 14.5” 6.5 Creedmoor guns. I find it telling that he didn’t include an accuracy review on the KAC.


That's because if you look at his shooting position in the video, he has 3 different stock shoulder placements and his head is constantly in a different angle/plane in relation to his optic.
 
I dont know man.

I think we can all respect the engineering that has gone into KAC rifles and agree that they are some of the best running rifles on the planet, but I think there are a lot of really good guns out there these days.

At this point, I primary have stuff from Kac and LMT, I while i am willing to concede that my KAC is a little more refined than my LMT's, I am sort of over KAC at this point. Not because they aren't great rifles, or they are too expensive, but bc their parts availability is atrocious.

They have been talking about Short, 14.5 inch 6.5CM uppers for the last 4 years. Now they are talking about their new KS1 line up. I just can't take them serious anymore.

They have no availability, and this has been a problem for years. Ok their stuff is durable but if it takes 18 months to replace an extractor on a hard use rifle, it's really nothing more than a paperweight.

If KAC had a mechanism were KAC owners who blow $4,000 to $6.000 on one of their rifles, had the ability to log on and purchase spare parts and components for that rifle, to be filled as production allows, I would be all about KAC rifles.

But when you purchase one of their Gucci tier rifles made with Floridian space magic and ask them if you could order a new muzzle device and a silencer, no thanks, maybe give gunbroker a try, I just can't.

For every elite KAC shooter that spends 6 days a week, low crawling through the Florida everglades with a rifle that hasn't seen a drop of CLP in 20,000 rounds, there is some drunken slav, with no teeth running around in a muddy trench in Eastern Ukraine with a CZ Bren telling drunk Russians to suck his dick.

KAC, LMT, HK, CZ, FN, B&T, ect... It really doesn't matter; they all make good shit these days it really comes down to product support

Agreed
 
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Here’s my results. Kac apc with Nightforce atacr 4-16 and Kac crs suppressor. Federal golf medal match 175 grn ammo. Group 4 killed me. It was hot as balls and mirage was killer but no excuses. I’m happy with the results. Need to get some loads worked up for it.
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Here’s my results. Kac apc with Nightforce atacr 4-16 and Kac crs suppressor. Federal golf medal match 175 grn ammo. Group 4 killed me. It was hot as balls and mirage was killer but no excuses. I’m happy with the results. Need to get some loads worked up for it.
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Looks good, I'm sure with handloads those will tighten up.
 
But if someone actually films themselves shooting in real time a 1/2 MOA 6x5 with thier SR25 at 100 yards, id drop some cash again.
 
But if someone actually films themselves shooting in real time a 1/2 MOA 6x5 with thier SR25 at 100 yards, id drop some cash again.
A lot of it comes from the shooter honestly as I know you’re aware. Large frame gas gun is a lot more challenging than people think. If I took out groups 4 and the flyer on 5 I still wouldn’t be close to that .5 mark.
I have found that if I single feed this rifle it shoots about .1-.2 moa better though which is weird.
 
I have found that if I single feed this rifle it shoots about .1-.2 moa better though which is weird.
Nah, it’s a documented phenomenon. You’ve got two feed ramps feeding from two sides of the magazine, the geometry of the magazine plays a role in accuracy. Single feeding you’ve eliminated a variance by feeding only one ramp.
 
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Nah, it’s a documented phenomenon. You’ve got two feed ramps feeding from two sides of the magazine, the geometry of the magazine plays a role in accuracy. Single feeding you’ve eliminated a variance by feeding only one ramp.
That’s good to know I figured as much but never really seen it talked about.
 
A lot of it comes from the shooter honestly as I know you’re aware. Large frame gas gun is a lot more challenging than people think. If I took out groups 4 and the flyer on 5 I still wouldn’t be close to that .5 mark.
I have found that if I single feed this rifle it shoots about .1-.2 moa better though which is weird.
It's a very tedious exercise but you definitely learn a lot about yourself when shooting a 6x5. It teaches you to be fully aware of all your bad habits. But I promise you if you continue to shoot a couple 6x5 every month your long range game will improve.