Rifle Scopes Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

[henschman]

Hi fellas. Here's the deal -- I have a TA-55A ACOG that I love as a battle rifle optic. However, my current battle rifle is an M1A. Even with the lowest scope mount available, the ACOG sits very high on that rifle, as it is intended to mount on a flat-top AR. I have an adjustable cheek rest, but shooting with it adjusted all the way up is just not very comfortable. Also, the ACOG mounts just a hair too far forward for optimal eye relief.

What I am looking for is a scope that has the same type of reticle as the ACOG, only in a tube-body optic that can be mounted in traditional rings. That way I could get it a lot lower, and could get the proper eye relief with no trouble.

And what I mean by "ACOG-type reticle" is a BDC reticle, designed for 7.62x51, that gives an aiming point for each distance that is the width of a man-sized target at that distance. I also like the large illuminated center aiming point that can be used with both eyes open at close range. Fixed or variable power doesn't really concern me, as long as the reticle is useable at a nice low power like 4-6x or somewhere in there. Being able to go higher power for spotting would just be a bonus. High-quality and durable optics would be preferred.

For reference, here is a pic of what my current ACOG's reticle looks like:

And lets not make this a debate over the merits of the ACOG-type reticle, like my last thread turned into. Let's just assume that I have experience with this reticle and like it; and let's assume that I have talked to lots of other guys who have used them in combat out to 600m plus who like them too.

 

[Jester308]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

Best bet could be the nightforce velocity reticle, isn't exactly the same as the ACOG but has a number of similarities.

JJ

 

[henschman]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

The Nightforce Velocity reticle doesn't have any markings to range a man-sized target at each hold-over point, which is the main feature of the ACOG that I want. I don't want to have to measure targets with the MOA lines and then do mental math. I have a feeling all that would go out the window in a high stress situation like a 2-way range. I like the ACOG type reticle because it is super quick and thought-free... which is just what you want for a battle rifle IMO.

I do like how the Velocity reticle has hold-over points for wind at each distance, though. If they would just add a ranging bracket on each stadia line that represents a 20" wide target at that distance, I would be all over it. And maybe a fatter and more eye-catching aiming point for 300m and under, which could be used with both eyes open for close quarters, like the ACOG's chevron.

 

[Postal0311]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

Perhaps check out IOR's reticles.

 

[longshotbml]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

I've been looking at theis same issue for my SOCOM 16. I don't like the scout scope concept. Here are two scopes you may like:
Burris 1.5-6 XTR
IOR Valdada 1.5-8

 

[henschman]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

Well I've looked at the Burris XTR before, but didn't like it because the stadia lines are not scaled to range targets like the ACOG. It does have the illuminated short-range aiming point though.

Now Valdada's CQB-BDC reticle looks interesting... it is pretty much the same as Triji's horseshoe ACOG reticle. The only problem is that it is set for 5.56 62 grain, whereas I will be shooting almost exclusively 7.62 147 grain. On their website it says it will work for 7.62 and 6.8 as well, but I'm sure it won't be as accurate as my ACOG that is designed specifically for a 7.62, especially at the longer ranges where the .22 pill drops off a lot faster than the thurty cal. I do like the idea of that reticle in their 1.1-4x26. That would make a killer AR optic... I might have to pick one up when I finish my AR build.

I appreciate the input, gents. Please keep it coming!

 

[Grump]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: henschman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well I've looked at the Burris XTR before, but didn't like it because the stadia lines are not scaled to range targets like the ACOG. It does have the illuminated short-range aiming point though.

Now Valdada's CQB-BDC reticle looks interesting... it is pretty much the same as Triji's horseshoe ACOG reticle. The only problem is that it is set for 5.56 62 grain, whereas I will be shooting almost exclusively 7.62 147 grain. On their website it says it will work for 7.62 and 6.8 as well, but I'm sure it won't be as accurate as my ACOG that is designed specifically for a 7.62, especially at the longer ranges where the .22 pill drops off a lot faster than the thurty cal. I do like the idea of that reticle in their 1.1-4x26. That would make a killer AR optic... I might have to pick one up when I finish my AR build.

I appreciate the input, gents. Please keep it coming!
</div></div>

Your concerns are why in the early 1980s my dream scope would have had a way to separately "elevate" several holdover hashmarks going down the reticle. Just zero each for your desired ranges.

I even wondered if a "common trajectory" reticle could be etched on glass and tilted inside the scope to "compress" it for flatter-shooting loads.

But an optics designer I'm not. So I've learned to dial. Would still love to have an ART-MPC type with SFP ranging brackets and mil-hash marks on a superimposed FFP reticle.

And I agree with you on the holdover hashes subtending to a known target size. In my perfect world, the resulting crosshairs would be interrupted, with maybe 5 inches subtension "open" so I never have a crosshair cover my target. Loved my smallbore rifle's aperture front sight.

 

[henschman]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

Yeah Grump, I have also thought how great it would be to be to have an adjustable reticle where you could precisely zero each stadia line at the corresponding distance. Hmm, an etched reticle that can be angled inside the tube is a very interesting idea. If I ever wind up owning an optics factory, I might have to have some engineers draw it up!

The closest thing to a one size fits all BDC scope I have seen is the NEW Leatherwood ART Camputer. Unlike the ones from the 70s, the newer models (M-1000 and M-1200) have an adjustable cam. It has a lobe that gets thicker at an increasing rate, and you set it to use whichever section of the cam corresponds best to your trajectory. However I don't want that type of setup for this rifle... I don't want to be fiddling with the power ring to range a target. I want it all to be done in the reticle just like with the ACOG.

 

[BCP]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: henschman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">range a man-sized target at each hold-over point</div></div>

That's not really practical and may not be very rewarding for most of the shooting you'll do, ie plinking at the range.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: henschman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The only problem is that it is set for 5.56 62 grain, whereas I will be shooting almost exclusively 7.62 147 grain.
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Trajectory for them is very similar inside 600M.

IOR scope is definitely an option 1.5-8 good glass drop reticule and a 308 BDC knob on newer models. A good 1-4 scope might make you happy too.

Best option is a FFP scope with a milling or moa reticule. While there are scopes out there with "funnel" reticules and drop points they are difficult to find and of limited manufacture. I think IOR makes one with that reticule as I saw a 2.5-10 at a gun show a long time ago. Can't seem to find them online though.

 

[BCP]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: henschman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The closest thing to a one size fits all BDC scope I have seen is the NEW Leatherwood ART Camputer.
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That thing looks like a nightmare to me.

 

[henschman]

Re: Looking for ACOG-type reticle in a tube-body scope

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: henschman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">range a man-sized target at each hold-over point</div></div>

That's not really practical and may not be very rewarding for most of the shooting you'll do, ie plinking at the range.
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This isn't for a plinking rifle, it's for a battle rifle... and most of my range practice is on man- or head-sized targets anyway.

I wouldn't want that IOR 1.5-8x because it is a SFP reticle that is only accurate at 8x. It is nice to have that kind of mag for spotting, but I like to shoot at a much lower setting on a battle rifle. Now what would be about perfect would be something like a 2.5-10x with that kind of reticle in FFP. I'd be all over something like that.