M1A/M14 Powder

[Pinecone]

I am confused (not abnormal ).

I read this - http://www.zediker.com/downloads/14_loading.pdf

According to it and other sources, one should not use powders slower than IMR 4064 for the M1A/M14 due to concerns about gas port pressure. OK, that is easy.

But, I thought that BL(C)2 and WW748 were canister versions of the powder used for military ammunition. But, according to this - Burn Rate IMR 4064 is #93 on the list. And BL(C)2 and WW748 are #102 and #101 respectively.

I also looked up info on WC-846 surplus power from 7.62 and found comments about the burn rate being similar to WW748/BL(C)2 (#101/#102) and H335 (#81). That seems to be saying the burn rate is between pistol and 50 BMG powder.

So am I missing something? Is BL(C)2 and WW748 usable for an M1A/M14? What is WC-846 similar to?

 

[Foul Mike]

I really don't have an answer for you.
I shot Service Match for a long time years ago.
I had 2 M14 rifles. One was good with 4895 and the other used 3031. My son used one rifle and I used the other.
It was a pain in the ass to keep everything straight, but scores dropped off when the right powder wasn't used.
I would much rather have been able to use one powder than two.
My Garand likes 4895 and it is also compatible with other calibers I reload for now, especially my AR 15.
You might try some of that and see if it will work for you too. My son is still shooting 3031 in his rifle. Regards, FM

 

[leid]

OP,
The early XM118 MATCH cartridge used WC 846 in '63. The later M118 MATCH cartridge was loaded with IMR 4895. Late '70s thru the early '80s, the group I shot with all used Sierra 168gr. INTL over WW748 in the NM M14/M1A rifles. Others used IMR 4895. I used H335 in AR15/M16 heavy loads with very good success.

 

[FLIGHT762]

BLC-2 and W 748 are good to go powders for the M-1A. There's quite a few of medium burning powders that are suitable. In the IMR powder line, IMR 4320 is about the slowest you want to go. BLC-2 is the commercial version of WC846 which has been used for many years in loading US Military 7.62 NATO ammo.

Zediker felt that Varget was a little too slow when he tested it in his M1-A, but others will disagree. Here's another burn chat that I like a little better since it show a side by side comparison. I feel it's a bit more accurate than the Hodgdon chart by listing in numerical order.

http://www.ramshot.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/burn_rates.pdf

I've owned and reloaded for an M1-A since 1974.

 

[Serpent408]

Pinecone,
I would recommend staying with IMR 4895 as your reference powder. Varget is the most commonly used powder by several of my HP Shooting team members. VV N550 did not appear to give me any clear advantage over the 4895.
You did not specify what projectile you intended to use. I am using SMK 168's with 4985 for my NM M1A with chrono's running consistent @ 2775+/- 25 fps. For the M1 Garand I'm using IMR 4320 topped with the 168 SMK. Both give me excellent groupings out to 600yrds. with iron sites.
Serpent

 

[Pinecone]

BLC-2 and W 748 are good to go powders for the M-1A. There's quite a few of medium burning powders that are suitable. In the IMR powder line, IMR 4320 is about the slowest you want to go. BLC-2 is the commercial version of WC846 which has been used for many years in loading US Military 7.62 NATO ammo.

Zediker felt that Varget was a little too slow when he tested it in his M1-A, but others will disagree. Here's another burn chat that I like a little better since it show a side by side comparison. I feel it's a bit more accurate than the Hodgdon chart by listing in numerical order.

http://www.ramshot.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/burn_rates.pdf

I've owned and reloaded for an M1-A since 1974.

WOW, that chart puts 748 and BL(C)2 as FASTER than H4895/IMR 4895. Versus Hodgdon putting is a good bit slower.

With those numbers, 748 is fine. Varget is close, but a tiny bit slower.

But interesting, the chart shows 760 and H414 as having different burn rates, but aren't they the same powder? Like HP38/WW231.

 

[Pinecone]

Pinecone,
I would recommend staying with IMR 4895 as your reference powder. Varget is the most commonly used powder by several of my HP Shooting team members. VV N550 did not appear to give me any clear advantage over the 4895.
You did not specify what projectile you intended to use. I am using SMK 168's with 4985 for my NM M1A with chrono's running consistent @ 2775+/- 25 fps. For the M1 Garand I'm using IMR 4320 topped with the 168 SMK. Both give me excellent groupings out to 600yrds. with iron sites.
Serpent

I have loaded a good bit of plinking ammo for another .308 gas gun with 748 and 147/150 gr FMJ bullets. I was wondering about the same load in the M1A based on the Hodgdon burn rate charts. 748/BL(C)2 meters MUCH better for making a lot of ammo for fun.

My accuracy load for the M1A is 41.5 gr of H4895, 168 SMK, LC LR brass.

 

[FLIGHT762]

But interesting, the chart shows 760 and H414 as having different burn rates, but aren't they the same powder? Like HP38/WW231.

The Ramshot chart also shows IMR 4831 and Hodgdon 4831 in the same line, but we all know H-4831 is a bit slower than IMR 4831. Charts are what they are, they show relative rates. At least the Ramshot chart shows rates at or near the same levels for the different manufacturers. A chart like Hodgdon lists the rates by number, which can be misleading if you have 6-7 powders all in a very similar burning rate.

 

[Pinecone]

Here is another chart, that puts also Varget faster than 4064, and 748/BL(C)2 faster than 4895.

Powder Burn Rates