Rifle Scopes Measuring deer and elk?

[Steve1]

In ranging a deer or elk, I was wondering what measurements you use. For years I've been told that a deer is about 18 inches from the top of the back to the bottom of the chest. I'd bet mule deer would be closer to twenty inches. That would make the math simpler too.

I've never taken a tape measure and actually measured.....I need to do that.

I'm wondering what measurement to use for elk. If I remember right, somebody said thirty inches. Thanks......

 

[roggom]

I use 14" for antelope, 18" for deer and 36" for Elk. The only caveat is if I will be taking shots past MPBR, then I use a range finder to verify. In the Colorado Mountains, most shots are within 100Y, unless you see one cross canyon. So MPBR set appropriately for the chambering ~250 for a 30-06 and I am comfortable with most sub 300Y shots.

On the prairie, I use an LRF, as shots can be well past 500Y. Since most manufactures only warranty their LRF's for 2 years, I purchase one pre season, then sell it post.

 

[Steve1]

Thanks Roggom! I need to buy a rangefinder too. I'm learning a lot. I've always tried to stay below what I know is too far to shoot. With my new scope and 300 Winchester I hope to extend my effective range. I'm learning a lot from you guys. This is a great web site to learn new info.....

 

[sscoyote]

I've reticle-ranged a bunch of antelope and some mule deer on the ranches I hunt and find that antelope vary little in their b-b dimensions as long as you can guess the ~age of the animal (adult vs. yearling). Deer are a different story though, and elk are even worse, which is why after a bunch of data I limit deer reticle ranging to about 400-500 yds., and antelope to a solid 500. Winter coyotes are actually easily reticle-ranged from the limited data I have on them (I use 11" b-b). Have r-r'd them to about 500 close enough to ensure a kill 1st shot from the loads I use. There are some variables though that aren't thought of much making r-r'ing not the most practical system.

 

[ZiaHunter]

I have ranged elk using the reticle but never felt comfortable enough to take a shot based on that estimate. I just use a LRF.

 

[Steve1]

I've used 3x9 Leupold scopes, for years. I had a system that worked well out to about 500 yards, using a duplex recticle and 9 power. To tell you the truth I rarely took a 500 yard shot, but did shoot a couple antelope and one deer at that range with one shot kills. I need to buy a range finder, but have been holding off because I've heard the cheaper ones aren't that accurate.

Lieca 1600 is the one I hope to buy soon.

 

[D.ID]

For big game hunting I have two numbers that work really well.
#1 close range, often referred to as max point blank.
#2 what the Laser tells me the distance is..
I have sean a 4" difference between a nice 4x4 mule dear and a big 4x4 mule dear (and an even bigger 3x3 mule dear), never measured any of our elk but there is clearly to much standard deviation to trust a "known size" method such as reticle ranging.

 

[kraigWY]

I use mil dot scopes in hunting.

Antelope 14.5 vital 8.5
Deer (only mule deer here ) 17-18, vital 10-11
Elk 24-26 vital 15 inches

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Why vitals? I use the MPBR ( Max point blank range) where I can hit the vitals of the above critters without hold over/under.

For my 270 Win. that would be:

Antelope 1.25 mils
Deer 1.25 mils
Elk 2 mils.

Meaning if the respective critter fits in the mill range, I can aim at the center of the vitals and not be too high or too low.

I have a Lup. 1200 LRF. It works great in the mountains, I have ranged 900+ yards. It sucks on the prairie where I seen to cant get beyond 300 yards.

Year before last I saw a nice antelope but couldn't range it with the LRF, I use the mil dot based on the size listed above and ranged it at 600 yards. I adjusted (as it was beyond my MPBR), using a 600 yard setting and hit the critter turning both lungs into what appeared to be wet coffee grounds. Using a map, and confirming with a GPS, the antelope was 586 yards.

This last Oct I didn't get my choice elk area so I had to buy a left over cow/calf tag and got this. It was a large calf but didn't fit my elk numbers so I used the LRF instead of the scope for ranging. I came up with 334 yards, and after the shot, I used the GPS and came up with 332.

In short, some times Mil Dots work, sometimes they don't. Mil Dots are one means of ranging, LRFs are another and a map and compass is another. They all work. In both cases listed above, I set in an area I knew the respective animals would appear. While waiting, it was relatively easy to plot the area on a map, (much like a range card) and could easily check the range to what ever spot the animal appeared. If you don't have the luxury of that time, then using the Mil Dots paired with MPBR will get you by.

 

[sscoyote]

I created this range sticker for a 1/2 mil system based on an 11" back to brisket coyote. I stuck it in a Butler Creek Blizzard scope cap cover so it was always there easily referenced by just glancing up to it, but coyotes only occasionally give you enough time to RR them effectively--



The "mil-ranging formula" in it's most basic form defines all of this stuff really--even downrange zeroing. Here is a youtube I did on it several years ago--

Pt. 1) Reticle-Rangefinding Math - YouTube

Interestingly there are bunch of youtubes on the mil-dots application for reticle-rangefinding, but nothing on it's adaptation for any subtension--which is a concept that's way bigger than the mil-dot itself. I've even used it with archery sight pins with a pretty good degree of accuracy.

If you look at the sticker above you can also get a good idea of the accuracy level one can expect from any particular unit of subtension relative to target size. After 470 or 500 yds each .1 level of interpolation yields 30-40 yds. on an 11" target relative to a subtension of 1/2 mil (1.8 IPHY), which is the limit of it's effectiveness really.

 

[Steve1]

Ranging has come a long ways over the years. I used to do some reading about early sniper operations in Vietnam. For a time many snipers were being issued Remington 700's in 30/06. The 308 came later. A 3x9 Redfield scope was mounted on top. It had a recticle in it that would range an 18 inch (deer sized) target and tell you how far it was. Snipers would measure an enemy soldier from the top of the shoulders to the crotch. The average VC or NVA soldier was thought to be 18 inches on that measurement.

I've never been through sniper school, but I think they still use various measurements to varify ranges. I imagine a good range finder would simplify all of this, if it is working properly....