Im thinking about a knight mk11 sound suppressor for a kinda mk11 clone im having built. Do they sell these to the public? and does anyone know how much they cost? Are they good suppressors?
Suppressors mk11 suppressor ?
- Thread starter clinto
- Start date
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
You can get them but they are not very good in terms of accuracy. Sound suppression wise they are just around average, not great, not completely awful. But the 2 point designs makes them less than accurate, especially as they get hot. I have also seen them leak alot, and have broken welds... again, design flaws.
But you can buy them, if you want to pay, nothing Knights is cheap.
You can get them but they are not very good in terms of accuracy. Sound suppression wise they are just around average, not great, not completely awful. But the 2 point designs makes them less than accurate, especially as they get hot. I have also seen them leak alot, and have broken welds... again, design flaws.
But you can buy them, if you want to pay, nothing Knights is cheap.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
..
Now that right there?
That makes this one hell of a short thread.
..
Now that right there?
That makes this one hell of a short thread.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
Thanks lowlight, Are there anyother's that go over the barrel and attach to a gas block rather than threading on the end? I just dont want the rifle to be too long with it on.
Thanks lowlight, Are there anyother's that go over the barrel and attach to a gas block rather than threading on the end? I just dont want the rifle to be too long with it on.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
Life is a trade off, if you want it physically correct you get the Knights, if you want it right you get a single point can that extends the length.
You can't have it both ways... enveloping 7" of barrel with a dis-similar metal is going to disrupt the harmonics and cause accuracy issues, as well the blow back is extreme which causes other issues.
Want to save length, use a shorter barrel with a single point can...
Life is a trade off, if you want it physically correct you get the Knights, if you want it right you get a single point can that extends the length.
You can't have it both ways... enveloping 7" of barrel with a dis-similar metal is going to disrupt the harmonics and cause accuracy issues, as well the blow back is extreme which causes other issues.
Want to save length, use a shorter barrel with a single point can...
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: clinto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks lowlight, Are there anyother's that go over the barrel and attach to a gas block rather than threading on the end? I just dont the rifel to be too long with it on. </div></div>
Planning to use as a hog gun or just general use?
-David
Edgewood, NM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: clinto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks lowlight, Are there anyother's that go over the barrel and attach to a gas block rather than threading on the end? I just dont the rifel to be too long with it on. </div></div>
Planning to use as a hog gun or just general use?
-David
Edgewood, NM
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
I plan on using this one mainly for coyotes/other varmints, hogs also if I ever find a place to shoot them.
I plan on using this one mainly for coyotes/other varmints, hogs also if I ever find a place to shoot them.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: clinto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks lowlight, Are there anyother's that go over the barrel and attach to a gas block rather than threading on the end? I just dont want the rifle to be too long with it on. </div></div>While it doesn't attach to the gas block, the Surefire 7.62ss does cover a good portion of the barrel. It only adds 5.5 inches to the overall length.
I have been doing a fair bit of reading on the Surefire can because I am considering one for myself. To summarize what I have read on it- accuracy is good, POI shift is minimal, sound suppression is OK but not superb, and the price is high for what you get ($1900 or so retail.)
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: clinto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks lowlight, Are there anyother's that go over the barrel and attach to a gas block rather than threading on the end? I just dont want the rifle to be too long with it on. </div></div>While it doesn't attach to the gas block, the Surefire 7.62ss does cover a good portion of the barrel. It only adds 5.5 inches to the overall length.
I have been doing a fair bit of reading on the Surefire can because I am considering one for myself. To summarize what I have read on it- accuracy is good, POI shift is minimal, sound suppression is OK but not superb, and the price is high for what you get ($1900 or so retail.)
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can get them but they are not very good in terms of accuracy. Sound suppression wise they are just around average, not great, not completely awful. But the 2 point designs makes them less than accurate, especially as they get hot. I have also seen them leak alot, and have broken welds... again, design flaws.
But you can buy them, if you want to pay, nothing Knights is cheap. </div></div>
Wow,
thats news to me. The two point mount seems to work just fine on the military rifles and I've seen some pretty impressive accuracy from other 2 point mounted cans out there. I don't think the 2 point mount has anything to do with accuracy as long as its done properly. My Mk11 Mod 0 was very accurate and putting the matching can on it very consistantly changed the point of impact by about a quarter inch right at 100yds and the group was always as good or better than without the can. All the other factory Mk11 Mod 0's I've seen have been the same. All of them were half to three quarter inch groups with good ammo.
The cans are durable though not intended for rapid fire use. The cans are pretty damn quiet when you consider the size of the actual suppressor. Its short and small diameter compared to most of the others out there. I've never seen any broken welds though I can see where it would be possible on well used cans. I have seen problems with carbon build up making it hard to either install or remove them. I've also seen one that had the latch get loose when firing. It never came off though. As far as getting them from Knights its hit or miss. I've heard of them being transferred and other times the buyers never managed to get the transfer done. When we talked to Knights at SHOT last year they said they'd sell them to class 2 or 3 dealers.
Good luck and go for it.
Frank
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can get them but they are not very good in terms of accuracy. Sound suppression wise they are just around average, not great, not completely awful. But the 2 point designs makes them less than accurate, especially as they get hot. I have also seen them leak alot, and have broken welds... again, design flaws.
But you can buy them, if you want to pay, nothing Knights is cheap. </div></div>
Wow,
thats news to me. The two point mount seems to work just fine on the military rifles and I've seen some pretty impressive accuracy from other 2 point mounted cans out there. I don't think the 2 point mount has anything to do with accuracy as long as its done properly. My Mk11 Mod 0 was very accurate and putting the matching can on it very consistantly changed the point of impact by about a quarter inch right at 100yds and the group was always as good or better than without the can. All the other factory Mk11 Mod 0's I've seen have been the same. All of them were half to three quarter inch groups with good ammo.
The cans are durable though not intended for rapid fire use. The cans are pretty damn quiet when you consider the size of the actual suppressor. Its short and small diameter compared to most of the others out there. I've never seen any broken welds though I can see where it would be possible on well used cans. I have seen problems with carbon build up making it hard to either install or remove them. I've also seen one that had the latch get loose when firing. It never came off though. As far as getting them from Knights its hit or miss. I've heard of them being transferred and other times the buyers never managed to get the transfer done. When we talked to Knights at SHOT last year they said they'd sell them to class 2 or 3 dealers.
Good luck and go for it.
Frank
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
The MK11 can is short and small compared to what other brand??? Someone is possibly in need of glasses!
The MK11 can is short and small compared to what other brand??? Someone is possibly in need of glasses!
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: biffj</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can get them but they are not very good in terms of accuracy. Sound suppression wise they are just around average, not great, not completely awful. But the 2 point designs makes them less than accurate, especially as they get hot. I have also seen them leak alot, and have broken welds... again, design flaws.
But you can buy them, if you want to pay, nothing Knights is cheap. </div></div>
Wow,
thats news to me. The two point mount seems to work just fine on the military rifles and I've seen some pretty impressive accuracy from other 2 point mounted cans out there. I don't think the 2 point mount has anything to do with accuracy as long as its done properly. My Mk11 Mod 0 was very accurate and putting the matching can on it very consistantly changed the point of impact by about a quarter inch right at 100yds and the group was always as good or better than without the can. All the other factory Mk11 Mod 0's I've seen have been the same. All of them were half to three quarter inch groups with good ammo.
The cans are durable though not intended for rapid fire use. The cans are pretty damn quiet when you consider the size of the actual suppressor. Its short and small diameter compared to most of the others out there. I've never seen any broken welds though I can see where it would be possible on well used cans. I have seen problems with carbon build up making it hard to either install or remove them. I've also seen one that had the latch get loose when firing. It never came off though. As far as getting them from Knights its hit or miss. I've heard of them being transferred and other times the buyers never managed to get the transfer done. When we talked to Knights at SHOT last year they said they'd sell them to class 2 or 3 dealers.
Good luck and go for it.
Frank</div></div>
HAHAHAHAHAHA.... 1/2 to 3/4 minute guns with the cans.... now that made me laugh and I have seen hundreds of Mk11s.... 100s. In fact I saw a bunch this week.
From where I stand, I think, what you have <span style="font-style: italic">"seen"</span> is something through some very rosy glasses... <span style="text-decoration: underline">because I haven't seen any of this</span>. It's why we have <span style="font-style: italic">"government dots'</span> so we can accommodate the Mk11s. They are 1.25" instead of the usual 1/2" we use with other systems.
Accuracy standard with the Mk11 is only like 1.5MOA and that is from the worked over guns from Crane. So where you are seeing 1/2 Minute accuracy I have no idea. In fact they accuracy standard is better without the Can... if that tells you anything.
<span style="text-decoration: underline">I have actually seen,</span> the horse clip lifted and guys shoot the can off, so sure they loosen, and when they move they can pop up and then when fired the can goes flying, it's quite a sight.
You're post is how bad internet myths and rumors start.
Funny thing is, I like the Mk11, I like much of Knights stuff, still, there is the truth and then again there is the TRUTH.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: biffj</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can get them but they are not very good in terms of accuracy. Sound suppression wise they are just around average, not great, not completely awful. But the 2 point designs makes them less than accurate, especially as they get hot. I have also seen them leak alot, and have broken welds... again, design flaws.
But you can buy them, if you want to pay, nothing Knights is cheap. </div></div>
Wow,
thats news to me. The two point mount seems to work just fine on the military rifles and I've seen some pretty impressive accuracy from other 2 point mounted cans out there. I don't think the 2 point mount has anything to do with accuracy as long as its done properly. My Mk11 Mod 0 was very accurate and putting the matching can on it very consistantly changed the point of impact by about a quarter inch right at 100yds and the group was always as good or better than without the can. All the other factory Mk11 Mod 0's I've seen have been the same. All of them were half to three quarter inch groups with good ammo.
The cans are durable though not intended for rapid fire use. The cans are pretty damn quiet when you consider the size of the actual suppressor. Its short and small diameter compared to most of the others out there. I've never seen any broken welds though I can see where it would be possible on well used cans. I have seen problems with carbon build up making it hard to either install or remove them. I've also seen one that had the latch get loose when firing. It never came off though. As far as getting them from Knights its hit or miss. I've heard of them being transferred and other times the buyers never managed to get the transfer done. When we talked to Knights at SHOT last year they said they'd sell them to class 2 or 3 dealers.
Good luck and go for it.
Frank</div></div>
HAHAHAHAHAHA.... 1/2 to 3/4 minute guns with the cans.... now that made me laugh and I have seen hundreds of Mk11s.... 100s. In fact I saw a bunch this week.
From where I stand, I think, what you have <span style="font-style: italic">"seen"</span> is something through some very rosy glasses... <span style="text-decoration: underline">because I haven't seen any of this</span>. It's why we have <span style="font-style: italic">"government dots'</span> so we can accommodate the Mk11s. They are 1.25" instead of the usual 1/2" we use with other systems.
Accuracy standard with the Mk11 is only like 1.5MOA and that is from the worked over guns from Crane. So where you are seeing 1/2 Minute accuracy I have no idea. In fact they accuracy standard is better without the Can... if that tells you anything.
<span style="text-decoration: underline">I have actually seen,</span> the horse clip lifted and guys shoot the can off, so sure they loosen, and when they move they can pop up and then when fired the can goes flying, it's quite a sight.
You're post is how bad internet myths and rumors start.
Funny thing is, I like the Mk11, I like much of Knights stuff, still, there is the truth and then again there is the TRUTH.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
the MK11 is NOT a 1/2 MOA gun, not even close. i've seen some shoot better then standard but calling that system a 1/2 MOA system is COMPLETELY flawed. most hang right at or around 1MOA from what i've seen. I don't like the system, we've had endless problems with it ie; triggers, barrels goin out at 1500 rounds, just don't like it. the mod1 was a turn in the right direction but a little too late.
the MK11 is NOT a 1/2 MOA gun, not even close. i've seen some shoot better then standard but calling that system a 1/2 MOA system is COMPLETELY flawed. most hang right at or around 1MOA from what i've seen. I don't like the system, we've had endless problems with it ie; triggers, barrels goin out at 1500 rounds, just don't like it. the mod1 was a turn in the right direction but a little too late.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
I've got to admit that I'm no AR fan and the only one I owned was an SP1 I got so I had an example to fiddle with. I do a lot of repair work and needed one to see how they worked...don't really like them though.
I ended up buying a Mk11 Mod 0 that was one of the trade in guns Knights got back when the M118's came out. I wasn't expecting much but have been pleasantly surprised. If I can shoot sub 1" groups at 100yds than the gun must be capable of better. Since I got this rifle I've learned of others out there and most shoot better than mine. You can believe what you want and call me names all you want but I've seen it in real life...no internet crap.
As for MY comment on the can being small I am referring to the size of the actual suppressor, not the tube that supports and attaches it to the gun. The rear 6 inches or so of the suppressor don't do anything but help keep the front end on the gun. The part with the baffles is actually pretty damned small compared to most .308 sized suppressors. I'd be happy to get some actual measurements for you if you want them.
As for the sound suppression I can't give any numbers but we shoot with no earplugs and its not uncomfortable. Its not as quiet as a good Gemtech or OPS Inc can but it wasn't intended to be. Its no where near as large or heavy either.
Flame away, I've got my nomex on and I stand by all I've stated.
Frank
I've got to admit that I'm no AR fan and the only one I owned was an SP1 I got so I had an example to fiddle with. I do a lot of repair work and needed one to see how they worked...don't really like them though.
I ended up buying a Mk11 Mod 0 that was one of the trade in guns Knights got back when the M118's came out. I wasn't expecting much but have been pleasantly surprised. If I can shoot sub 1" groups at 100yds than the gun must be capable of better. Since I got this rifle I've learned of others out there and most shoot better than mine. You can believe what you want and call me names all you want but I've seen it in real life...no internet crap.
As for MY comment on the can being small I am referring to the size of the actual suppressor, not the tube that supports and attaches it to the gun. The rear 6 inches or so of the suppressor don't do anything but help keep the front end on the gun. The part with the baffles is actually pretty damned small compared to most .308 sized suppressors. I'd be happy to get some actual measurements for you if you want them.
As for the sound suppression I can't give any numbers but we shoot with no earplugs and its not uncomfortable. Its not as quiet as a good Gemtech or OPS Inc can but it wasn't intended to be. Its no where near as large or heavy either.
Flame away, I've got my nomex on and I stand by all I've stated.
Frank
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
OP, if you are interested in a MK 11 can, I can get you one from KAC without a problem. I have them through here all the time.
As to the discussion regarding accuracy of the Knights SR-25 series with the suppressor, I have had alot of SR-25 EMC's, EMR's, Mk 11 Mod 0's, Mk 11 Mod 1's through here and all have been MOA guns or less. In fact, I've had one that was a sub-half MOA gun with the can on.
Never had any problems with the can's leaking or welds breaking or anything like that.
In terms of suppression, they are a good performing can. Are there cans out there that suppress 7.62 better? Sure there are. The Knight's can does, however, hold it's own.
OP, if you are interested in a MK 11 can, I can get you one from KAC without a problem. I have them through here all the time.
As to the discussion regarding accuracy of the Knights SR-25 series with the suppressor, I have had alot of SR-25 EMC's, EMR's, Mk 11 Mod 0's, Mk 11 Mod 1's through here and all have been MOA guns or less. In fact, I've had one that was a sub-half MOA gun with the can on.
Never had any problems with the can's leaking or welds breaking or anything like that.
In terms of suppression, they are a good performing can. Are there cans out there that suppress 7.62 better? Sure there are. The Knight's can does, however, hold it's own.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
Okay, you talked to someone who said that they know of someone who shot a 1/2 consistently with the Mk11, cause your Mk11, which is really an SR25 version, and not the true Mk 11 is a 1/2 with factory ammo. Okay, pictures of the rifle, no 5 shot 1/2 groups to back it up.
Well a bunch of Mk11s were here last week, no 1/2 shooters in the bunch, and 18 more just arrived this morning, I am happy to bet, no 1/2 minute shooter in the bunch.
Talking to someone who thinks they are shooting a 1/2, or might be saying 3 of the 20 rounds goes in a 1/2 is different than multiple first hand experiences with Mk11s used by both .gov and .mil , I would be happy to see more than 1 in a row shoot a real 1/2 5 shot group, and not from a test target that nobody saw shot.
3/4 minute rifles without the can I have seen, better, maybe on a fluke once or twice, but put 20 rounds through the rifle with the can on then transition to your group shot and see what happens. The 2 point system goes against any known theory to accuracy, let alone practice. Most know when things happen better shoot the far targets first, because accuracy is gonna head south when things get hot.
Okay, you talked to someone who said that they know of someone who shot a 1/2 consistently with the Mk11, cause your Mk11, which is really an SR25 version, and not the true Mk 11 is a 1/2 with factory ammo. Okay, pictures of the rifle, no 5 shot 1/2 groups to back it up.
Well a bunch of Mk11s were here last week, no 1/2 shooters in the bunch, and 18 more just arrived this morning, I am happy to bet, no 1/2 minute shooter in the bunch.
Talking to someone who thinks they are shooting a 1/2, or might be saying 3 of the 20 rounds goes in a 1/2 is different than multiple first hand experiences with Mk11s used by both .gov and .mil , I would be happy to see more than 1 in a row shoot a real 1/2 5 shot group, and not from a test target that nobody saw shot.
3/4 minute rifles without the can I have seen, better, maybe on a fluke once or twice, but put 20 rounds through the rifle with the can on then transition to your group shot and see what happens. The 2 point system goes against any known theory to accuracy, let alone practice. Most know when things happen better shoot the far targets first, because accuracy is gonna head south when things get hot.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay, you talked to someone who said that they know of someone who shot a 1/2 consistently with the Mk11, cause your Mk11, which is really an SR25 version, and not the true Mk 11 is a 1/2 with factory ammo. Okay, pictures of the rifle, no 5 shot 1/2 groups to back it up.
Well a bunch of Mk11s were here last week, no 1/2 shooters in the bunch, and 18 more just arrived this morning, I am happy to bet, no 1/2 minute shooter in the bunch.
Talking to someone who thinks they are shooting a 1/2, or might be saying 3 of the 20 rounds goes in a 1/2 is different than multiple first hand experiences with Mk11s used by both .gov and .mil , I would be happy to see more than 1 in a row shoot a real 1/2 5 shot group, and not from a test target that nobody saw shot.
3/4 minute rifles without the can I have seen, better, maybe on a fluke once or twice, but put 20 rounds through the rifle with the can on then transition to your group shot and see what happens. The 2 point system goes against any known theory to accuracy, let alone practice. Most know when things happen better shoot the far targets first, because accuracy is gonna head south when things get hot. </div></div>
Since the original poster asked about a knights can for his "Mk11 clone" maybe we should keep the post directed that way. I gave an answer. If you want to argue with me send a pm and we can argue where its not taking away from the original question or we can start our own thread. Ford Vs Chevy! Everyone knows that chevy's can't go nearly as fast as fords right? Sub MOA from a Knights? Impossible? I don't think so. . .
Frank
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay, you talked to someone who said that they know of someone who shot a 1/2 consistently with the Mk11, cause your Mk11, which is really an SR25 version, and not the true Mk 11 is a 1/2 with factory ammo. Okay, pictures of the rifle, no 5 shot 1/2 groups to back it up.
Well a bunch of Mk11s were here last week, no 1/2 shooters in the bunch, and 18 more just arrived this morning, I am happy to bet, no 1/2 minute shooter in the bunch.
Talking to someone who thinks they are shooting a 1/2, or might be saying 3 of the 20 rounds goes in a 1/2 is different than multiple first hand experiences with Mk11s used by both .gov and .mil , I would be happy to see more than 1 in a row shoot a real 1/2 5 shot group, and not from a test target that nobody saw shot.
3/4 minute rifles without the can I have seen, better, maybe on a fluke once or twice, but put 20 rounds through the rifle with the can on then transition to your group shot and see what happens. The 2 point system goes against any known theory to accuracy, let alone practice. Most know when things happen better shoot the far targets first, because accuracy is gonna head south when things get hot. </div></div>
Since the original poster asked about a knights can for his "Mk11 clone" maybe we should keep the post directed that way. I gave an answer. If you want to argue with me send a pm and we can argue where its not taking away from the original question or we can start our own thread. Ford Vs Chevy! Everyone knows that chevy's can't go nearly as fast as fords right? Sub MOA from a Knights? Impossible? I don't think so. . .
Frank
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: biffj</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay, you talked to someone who said that they know of someone who shot a 1/2 consistently with the Mk11, cause your Mk11, which is really an SR25 version, and not the true Mk 11 is a 1/2 with factory ammo. Okay, pictures of the rifle, no 5 shot 1/2 groups to back it up.
Well a bunch of Mk11s were here last week, no 1/2 shooters in the bunch, and 18 more just arrived this morning, I am happy to bet, no 1/2 minute shooter in the bunch.
Talking to someone who thinks they are shooting a 1/2, or might be saying 3 of the 20 rounds goes in a 1/2 is different than multiple first hand experiences with Mk11s used by both .gov and .mil , I would be happy to see more than 1 in a row shoot a real 1/2 5 shot group, and not from a test target that nobody saw shot.
3/4 minute rifles without the can I have seen, better, maybe on a fluke once or twice, but put 20 rounds through the rifle with the can on then transition to your group shot and see what happens. The 2 point system goes against any known theory to accuracy, let alone practice. Most know when things happen better shoot the far targets first, because accuracy is gonna head south when things get hot. </div></div>
Since the original poster asked about a knights can for his "Mk11 clone" maybe we should keep the post directed that way. I gave an answer. If you want to argue with me send a pm and we can argue where its not taking away from the original question or we can start our own thread. Ford Vs Chevy! Everyone knows that chevy's can't go nearly as fast as fords right? Sub MOA from a Knights? Impossible? I don't think so. . .
Frank</div></div>
Seeing how I own the site I think I can take the conversation in any direction I want, you can change the subject if you like, but I am happy to back up my experience with the system versus yours any day. As I said they unpacked 18 Mk11s yesterday and are there shooting them now, I can tell you there is not a 1/2 minute gun in the bunch.
Simple question how many 1/2 MOA Mk11s have you personally shot, you can include yours.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: biffj</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay, you talked to someone who said that they know of someone who shot a 1/2 consistently with the Mk11, cause your Mk11, which is really an SR25 version, and not the true Mk 11 is a 1/2 with factory ammo. Okay, pictures of the rifle, no 5 shot 1/2 groups to back it up.
Well a bunch of Mk11s were here last week, no 1/2 shooters in the bunch, and 18 more just arrived this morning, I am happy to bet, no 1/2 minute shooter in the bunch.
Talking to someone who thinks they are shooting a 1/2, or might be saying 3 of the 20 rounds goes in a 1/2 is different than multiple first hand experiences with Mk11s used by both .gov and .mil , I would be happy to see more than 1 in a row shoot a real 1/2 5 shot group, and not from a test target that nobody saw shot.
3/4 minute rifles without the can I have seen, better, maybe on a fluke once or twice, but put 20 rounds through the rifle with the can on then transition to your group shot and see what happens. The 2 point system goes against any known theory to accuracy, let alone practice. Most know when things happen better shoot the far targets first, because accuracy is gonna head south when things get hot. </div></div>
Since the original poster asked about a knights can for his "Mk11 clone" maybe we should keep the post directed that way. I gave an answer. If you want to argue with me send a pm and we can argue where its not taking away from the original question or we can start our own thread. Ford Vs Chevy! Everyone knows that chevy's can't go nearly as fast as fords right? Sub MOA from a Knights? Impossible? I don't think so. . .
Frank</div></div>
Seeing how I own the site I think I can take the conversation in any direction I want, you can change the subject if you like, but I am happy to back up my experience with the system versus yours any day. As I said they unpacked 18 Mk11s yesterday and are there shooting them now, I can tell you there is not a 1/2 minute gun in the bunch.
Simple question how many 1/2 MOA Mk11s have you personally shot, you can include yours.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
For the OP check out OPS Inc it would probably serve you better.
For the OP check out OPS Inc it would probably serve you better.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
Hi Lowlight,
Not to change the subject, but I would really appreciate your opinion on the accuracy/reliability of the older Knight's SR25 Match rifles with 24" barrels (circa 1994)?
Within the next month or so, I plan on starting to shoot one that has been sitting in the safe unused (purchased new) for the last 16 years or so...
Thanks.
Regards,
Mark
Hi Lowlight,
Not to change the subject, but I would really appreciate your opinion on the accuracy/reliability of the older Knight's SR25 Match rifles with 24" barrels (circa 1994)?
Within the next month or so, I plan on starting to shoot one that has been sitting in the safe unused (purchased new) for the last 16 years or so...
Thanks.
Regards,
Mark
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
Thanks for the good info ans suggestions guys
Thanks for the good info ans suggestions guys
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Marker</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi Lowlight,
Not to change the subject, but I would really appreciate your opinion on the accuracy/reliability of the older Knight's SR25 Match rifles with 24" barrels (circa 1994)?
Within the next month or so, I plan on starting to shoot one that has been sitting in the safe unused (purchased new) for the last 16 years or so...
Thanks.
Regards,
Mark
</div></div>
The SR25 is very good especially the older ones. You should see decent accuracy with it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Marker</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi Lowlight,
Not to change the subject, but I would really appreciate your opinion on the accuracy/reliability of the older Knight's SR25 Match rifles with 24" barrels (circa 1994)?
Within the next month or so, I plan on starting to shoot one that has been sitting in the safe unused (purchased new) for the last 16 years or so...
Thanks.
Regards,
Mark
</div></div>
The SR25 is very good especially the older ones. You should see decent accuracy with it.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
SR-25s run the gamut from great to horrible.
I believe I signed the military's first Quality Deficiency Report on the SR-25. These usually result in a stop deliveries -stop payment - show cause question from Uncle Sam as to why a piece of equipment does not work and what is the manufacturer going to do to fix it.
I had two dozen SR-25s that had wandering zeroes and would shoot tighter with M80 machingun ball than with two or three different military match and three or four different brands of commercial match ammo. Those guns disappeared from system for nearly two years with no back-fill. I understand Boots Obermyer's cut-rifled barrels saved that contract from going under.
There is no perfect gun, especially when they're made in commercial numbers without a MILSPEC (or incentive to maintain ANY specification).
SR-25s run the gamut from great to horrible.
I believe I signed the military's first Quality Deficiency Report on the SR-25. These usually result in a stop deliveries -stop payment - show cause question from Uncle Sam as to why a piece of equipment does not work and what is the manufacturer going to do to fix it.
I had two dozen SR-25s that had wandering zeroes and would shoot tighter with M80 machingun ball than with two or three different military match and three or four different brands of commercial match ammo. Those guns disappeared from system for nearly two years with no back-fill. I understand Boots Obermyer's cut-rifled barrels saved that contract from going under.
There is no perfect gun, especially when they're made in commercial numbers without a MILSPEC (or incentive to maintain ANY specification).
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
There is a reason Surefire uses a single piece mount in their reflex suppressors. And it's not because they haven't realized making it in two separate pieces like OPSINC or KAC is cheaper.
I've said it before and had people argue and argue with me about it. Reflex suppressors that feature two point mounts have wandering POI unless they are one piece like the Surefire. The trapped gasses heat that section of barrel disproportionately. It in turns torques the two piece mount sections independently. From a design standpoint it sucks. But it is cheaper to make. Like monocore baffle stacks....
I've seen quite a few SR-25 MK-11 problems fixed by shelving the KAC suppressor, threading the barrel, and just running a muzzle can. The downside is added expense for the department, but better accuracy, and repeatable POI shift. Seems departments and Mil get the bad ones. Because I haven't met a civilian yet who has been willing to see those improvements at the cost of a mismatched gun.
There is a reason Surefire uses a single piece mount in their reflex suppressors. And it's not because they haven't realized making it in two separate pieces like OPSINC or KAC is cheaper.
I've said it before and had people argue and argue with me about it. Reflex suppressors that feature two point mounts have wandering POI unless they are one piece like the Surefire. The trapped gasses heat that section of barrel disproportionately. It in turns torques the two piece mount sections independently. From a design standpoint it sucks. But it is cheaper to make. Like monocore baffle stacks....
I've seen quite a few SR-25 MK-11 problems fixed by shelving the KAC suppressor, threading the barrel, and just running a muzzle can. The downside is added expense for the department, but better accuracy, and repeatable POI shift. Seems departments and Mil get the bad ones. Because I haven't met a civilian yet who has been willing to see those improvements at the cost of a mismatched gun.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
@ Arron funny I have seen more baffle strikes on Surefire cans than any other(but this is due more to bad smithing than design) , I have never had a baffle strike, nor a wandering zero with my OPS inc 7.62 or 5.56 I have been shooting both for years.
KAC and OPS are two very different designs from a engineering stand point, rear attach loose front end makes no sense to me, but front thread and rear tension makes more sense to me, there is tension at both contact points.
I too have seen most of the MK11 issues go away by putting the suppressor in the ruck.
@ Arron funny I have seen more baffle strikes on Surefire cans than any other(but this is due more to bad smithing than design) , I have never had a baffle strike, nor a wandering zero with my OPS inc 7.62 or 5.56 I have been shooting both for years.
KAC and OPS are two very different designs from a engineering stand point, rear attach loose front end makes no sense to me, but front thread and rear tension makes more sense to me, there is tension at both contact points.
I too have seen most of the MK11 issues go away by putting the suppressor in the ruck.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
Regarding the Ops Inc suppressors, my experience is similar to that of zink14. I own more than a couple Ops Inc products and have never experienced baffle strikes, wandering POI or any other problems like that. I have one 16th Model I've ran for years on several guns including select-fire M4s. I've let a LOT of guys shoot one of those M4s at various MG shoots and events. Never any problems with it.
My experiences with the Ops products on precision guns is limited to the 12th and 3rd Models on 7.62 caliber rifles and the 16th and 12th Models on 5.56 caliber hosts. Samples I've personally shot are no more than a couple dozen suppressors on at least that many hosts.
As to the KAC hosts, I've had my hands personally on a lot fewer than Frank but I very much agree with his assessments.
Regarding the Ops Inc suppressors, my experience is similar to that of zink14. I own more than a couple Ops Inc products and have never experienced baffle strikes, wandering POI or any other problems like that. I have one 16th Model I've ran for years on several guns including select-fire M4s. I've let a LOT of guys shoot one of those M4s at various MG shoots and events. Never any problems with it.
My experiences with the Ops products on precision guns is limited to the 12th and 3rd Models on 7.62 caliber rifles and the 16th and 12th Models on 5.56 caliber hosts. Samples I've personally shot are no more than a couple dozen suppressors on at least that many hosts.
As to the KAC hosts, I've had my hands personally on a lot fewer than Frank but I very much agree with his assessments.
Re: mk11 suppressor ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Seeing how I own the site I think I can take the conversation in any direction I want, you can change the subject if you like, but I am happy to back up my experience with the system versus yours any day. As I said they unpacked 18 Mk11s yesterday and are there shooting them now, I can tell you there is not a 1/2 minute gun in the bunch.
Simple question how many 1/2 MOA Mk11s have you personally shot, you can include yours. </div></div>
Like I said in my earlier post. I'm not an AR guy and I won't defend or degrade them...not enough experience. As for my own personal experience I can say that my rifle has fired groups consistantly under 1" with me shooting and with the suppressor installed. I've not fired 1000rds through this gun so I can't give you a long term history either. It is used and if anything should be shooting less accurately now than it did before. I watched personally 5 others shoot similar or better groups. All of these guns were trade ins that came from knights and all were part of the test program. Is there a chance that all of these went through Crane at some point? I'd say its possible knowing where they came from and what they were doing. Are they special guns and not normal for the group? Hell, I don't know. Its hard enough to get any info on the guns from Knight and he probably doesn't know the history anyway. In any case, I never expected this rifle to shoot like a bolt gun and I'm sure its not that good but sub moa? Yes I think its that. 1/2 MOA...I don't think I said that though there were a few groups that small. Miracle? maybe, especially with me on the trigger.....I'm not that good. Its still pretty impressive.
Frank
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Seeing how I own the site I think I can take the conversation in any direction I want, you can change the subject if you like, but I am happy to back up my experience with the system versus yours any day. As I said they unpacked 18 Mk11s yesterday and are there shooting them now, I can tell you there is not a 1/2 minute gun in the bunch.
Simple question how many 1/2 MOA Mk11s have you personally shot, you can include yours. </div></div>
Like I said in my earlier post. I'm not an AR guy and I won't defend or degrade them...not enough experience. As for my own personal experience I can say that my rifle has fired groups consistantly under 1" with me shooting and with the suppressor installed. I've not fired 1000rds through this gun so I can't give you a long term history either. It is used and if anything should be shooting less accurately now than it did before. I watched personally 5 others shoot similar or better groups. All of these guns were trade ins that came from knights and all were part of the test program. Is there a chance that all of these went through Crane at some point? I'd say its possible knowing where they came from and what they were doing. Are they special guns and not normal for the group? Hell, I don't know. Its hard enough to get any info on the guns from Knight and he probably doesn't know the history anyway. In any case, I never expected this rifle to shoot like a bolt gun and I'm sure its not that good but sub moa? Yes I think its that. 1/2 MOA...I don't think I said that though there were a few groups that small. Miracle? maybe, especially with me on the trigger.....I'm not that good. Its still pretty impressive.
Frank
