Hunting & Fishing Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

[buckey]

I have heard that some changes have occureed with non-resident deer tags in Montana. I was to head out on a guided hunt in Montana in 2011 using a Outfitter tag, but if the price has gone through the roof, I am going to re-consider!!


Can someone explain what changes have been made for guranteed outfitter deer tags in Mt.


Thanks!!!

 

[elkkid3]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

http://fwp.mt.gov/hunting/licenses/

Looks like they did away with the outfitter sponsored tags and raised the prices over $200 for the tags. Just another case of hunting turning into a wealthy sport.

 

[buckey]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

That is really going to affect my plans for hunting in MT next year!!

I am very sorry to hear this - sucks!!

 

[Arnie]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

As a montana resident the people of the state voted to eliminate the guaranteed outfitter tags. Unfortunately it does raise the cost of non-resident tags but it does allow for more of an equal oppurtunity for everyone else to get a tag. I have put in for an elk tag every year since i was twelve i am no twenty three so eleven years i have not been able to draw a tag, But yet so many guides and outfitters are guarunteed them. To the residents of Montana i dont think it was fair that we could not draw tags because of someone who makes more money than we do to hunt our game with a guaranteed tag.

I have talked to alot of out of state hunters this season that are happy to come out and go on a do it yourself hunt. They all hunt public land and National forrest which is there right it is everyones land. I am personaly glad to see them come out and enjoy the state of montana and not have to pay a ridiculous amount to do so. Hunting was free to do for everyone for years and it should remain so for all of the future generations of hunters.

I feel it is when you have to hire a guide or outfitter to hunt is when it has become a "rich mans sport". So i am personally glad to see the guaranteed outfitter tags gone. No one should have to pay to someone to take you hunting not when there is so much avaliable public land to hunt in montana.

I really hope that the lack of outfitter guaranteed tags does not dicourage anyone from hunting here but rather incourages people to come and hunt Montana and enjoy want hunting should always be which is free and fair chase.

Just my 2 cents on the subject and how i feel about it so take it as you will

JD

 

[Carl_Ross]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

Buckey,

There may be no more guaranteed outfitter tag, but the draw odds on tags should be going up. If you really want to go deer hunting, put in for the elk/deer combo, it has traditionally had better draw odds than the deer combo (around 50% with no points). We'll see how everything shakes out, but I expect to see draw odds end up around 70%, maybe better. Even with the price increase, it will be cheaper than getting a guaranteed outfitter tag under the old system. Plus, if you wish to hunt by yourself, you can.

 

[buckey]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

What do you think draw odds for a non-resident deer tag will be in 2011??

 

[Carl_Ross]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

Deer only has been a lot lower than deer/elk. Shot in the dark that it might end up at 20 or 25%.

 

[vinnieb]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

I have hunted Montana for pheasant for about the last 10 years. The first time I went up there it was cheaper for me to buy an out-of-state turkey tag than a resident one here in Arizona. That was gone after a couple years. We drew deer tags last year and not this year in Montana but the part that sucks is we probably will not be able to afford to pay the extra money for the higher priced deer tags.

I agree that the residents should have the first crack at tags they want because I see it all the time here in Arizona and we have had lawsuits and all other kinds of BS because of the non-resident hunters and outfitter's and it was all generated because of GREED.

Sad to say, but I believe the average person will not be able to afford too hunt out of state in the future.

 

[buckey]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

Can I apply for "preference points" only for a year or two to have a better chance of drawing a deer license??

 

[Biscuit]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arnie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a montana resident the people of the state voted to eliminate the guaranteed outfitter tags. Unfortunately it does raise the cost of non-resident tags but it does allow for more of an equal oppurtunity for everyone else to get a tag. I have put in for an elk tag every year since i was twelve i am no twenty three so eleven years i have not been able to draw a tag, But yet so many guides and outfitters are guarunteed them. To the residents of Montana i dont think it was fair that we could not draw tags because of someone who makes more money than we do to hunt our game with a guaranteed tag.

I have talked to alot of out of state hunters this season that are happy to come out and go on a do it yourself hunt. They all hunt public land and National forrest which is there right it is everyones land. I am personaly glad to see them come out and enjoy the state of montana and not have to pay a ridiculous amount to do so. Hunting was free to do for everyone for years and it should remain so for all of the future generations of hunters.

I feel it is when you have to hire a guide or outfitter to hunt is when it has become a "rich mans sport". So i am personally glad to see the guaranteed outfitter tags gone. No one should have to pay to someone to take you hunting not when there is so much avaliable public land to hunt in montana.

I really hope that the lack of outfitter guaranteed tags does not dicourage anyone from hunting here but rather incourages people to come and hunt Montana and enjoy want hunting should always be which is free and fair chase.

Just my 2 cents on the subject and how i feel about it so take it as you will

JD </div></div>

I agree with all of the above. Mt blockmanagement system opens up millions of acres of great private land to hunters, for free.

 

[buckey]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

In my state, Pennsylvania, if a non-resident wants to hunt, they simply buy a non-resident hunting license & go hunting!!!

 

[spaniel]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Buckey</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Can I apply for "preference points" only for a year or two to have a better chance of drawing a deer license?? </div></div>
+1. Probably jinxing myself here, but I have drawn the non-resident combo three years in a row. I'm building points in elk/antelope draws, but got a nice 6X6 on public land (wilderness) the first year, nice deer the first and second year, and antelope the second and third years. No elk this year covering 80 miles on foot but had plenty of block mangement land to run for deer/antelope and wonderful experiences meeting the locals while hunting on their land.

No big loss on the outfitter tags. Leasing ruined my childhood deer hunting grounds.

 

[MontanaKid]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arnie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a montana resident the people of the state voted to eliminate the guaranteed outfitter tags. Unfortunately it does raise the cost of non-resident tags but it does allow for more of an equal oppurtunity for everyone else to get a tag. I have put in for an elk tag every year since i was twelve i am no twenty three so eleven years i have not been able to draw a tag, But yet so many guides and outfitters are guarunteed them. To the residents of Montana i dont think it was fair that we could not draw tags because of someone who makes more money than we do to hunt our game with a guaranteed tag.

I have talked to alot of out of state hunters this season that are happy to come out and go on a do it yourself hunt. They all hunt public land and National forrest which is there right it is everyones land. I am personaly glad to see them come out and enjoy the state of montana and not have to pay a ridiculous amount to do so. Hunting was free to do for everyone for years and it should remain so for all of the future generations of hunters.

I feel it is when you have to hire a guide or outfitter to hunt is when it has become a "rich mans sport". So i am personally glad to see the guaranteed outfitter tags gone. No one should have to pay to someone to take you hunting not when there is so much avaliable public land to hunt in montana.

I really hope that the lack of outfitter guaranteed tags does not dicourage anyone from hunting here but rather incourages people to come and hunt Montana and enjoy want hunting should always be which is free and fair chase.

Just my 2 cents on the subject and how i feel about it so take it as you will

JD </div></div>

Looks like I am kicking a dead thread here, anyway...
I agree with you on the points that you brought up. On the other hand, what about non residents who hunt with land owner sponsor deer tags. Why should they have to pay for a management system that doesn't support the land they hunt on. To me it seems like the political part of it painted the issue with a pretty big brush. It would be nice to see this issue be fixed, probably won't happen though.

 

[psinclair]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arnie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As a montana resident the people of the state voted to eliminate the guaranteed outfitter tags. Unfortunately it does raise the cost of non-resident tags but it does allow for more of an equal oppurtunity for everyone else to get a tag. I have put in for an elk tag every year since i was twelve i am no twenty three so eleven years i have not been able to draw a tag, But yet so many guides and outfitters are guarunteed them. To the residents of Montana i dont think it was fair that we could not draw tags because of someone who makes more money than we do to hunt our game with a guaranteed tag.

I have talked to alot of out of state hunters this season that are happy to come out and go on a do it yourself hunt. They all hunt public land and National forrest which is there right it is everyones land. I am personaly glad to see them come out and enjoy the state of montana and not have to pay a ridiculous amount to do so. Hunting was free to do for everyone for years and it should remain so for all of the future generations of hunters.

I feel it is when you have to hire a guide or outfitter to hunt is when it has become a "rich mans sport". So i am personally glad to see the guaranteed outfitter tags gone. No one should have to pay to someone to take you hunting not when there is so much avaliable public land to hunt in montana.

I really hope that the lack of outfitter guaranteed tags does not dicourage anyone from hunting here but rather incourages people to come and hunt Montana and enjoy want hunting should always be which is free and fair chase.

Just my 2 cents on the subject and how i feel about it so take it as you will

JD </div></div>

Thats not how it works.....residents can and always have been able to buy deer and elk licenses over the counter. You are talking about drawing a "special permit" for specified units....everyone has to draw those, including non residents(who are only allowed 10% of the entire permit quota)....FWIW, it took me 26 years to draw a special elk permit for the Missouri Breaks.

 

[hognuts]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

I grew up in Montana and have hunted there as a "non-resident" I have drawn 100% of the time the last five years as a non-resident as I now reside in Las Vegas Nevada. Another option is doing a "drop camp" We did that two years ago through Absaroka Beartooth Outfitters in Big Timber. (Great people to deal with) It was $500.00 each, I went with a buddy of mine who still lives up there, didn't break the bank and we got a ride in and out and they came in and picked up my bull for me as I shot my bull on opening day. We hunted in the Absaroka Beartooth Wilderness area which is open for the "early" rifle hunt, so you get to elk hunt while they are still in the rut. We spotted mine about 1200 yards out, my buddy bugled him in for me, took the shot at 300 yards and dropped him! You can hunt deer up there too, I had the deer/elk combo which is what I have put in for successfully every year for the last 5. Good luck up there. Here are a few pics from our last few years up there.

Beautiful Country!!!

My bull taken out of the Absaroka Beartooth Wilderness area early hunt on drop camp.

A little mulie taken by Dillon Montana with my Barrett model 99 the day before I had to come back to Vegas. Got him in the throat at 650 yards.

A few bulls taken by my cousins over by Dillon Montana.

Not from Montana, this was a mulie I got three years ago in Northern Nevada.

 

[MontanaKid]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

Does anybody know if Montana will go back to their normal prices anytime soon?

 

[Grimm]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

If you happen to be a MT native the Come Home to Hunt is a pretty reasonable option. Still not a drop in the bucket though

 

[spaniel]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

They couldn't get enough non-residents last year to fill all the tags. Given people have more time to react now, I'm sure the situation will be even worse. For one, my group of 3 is no longer applying....perhaps every 3rd year at these prices, Colorado here we come. They upped the prices to keep their revenue but in the end IMHO they are going to lose more. I love my time in Montana and have looked forward to it the last 4 years but it's not sustainable....especially with the effect the wolves have had where I hunted.

 

[MontanaKid]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ATH</div><div class="ubbcode-body">They couldn't get enough non-residents last year to fill all the tags. Given people have more time to react now, I'm sure the situation will be even worse. For one, my group of 3 is no longer applying....perhaps every 3rd year at these prices, Colorado here we come. They upped the prices to keep their revenue but in the end IMHO they are going to lose more. I love my time in Montana and have looked forward to it the last 4 years but it's not sustainable....especially with the effect the wolves have had where I hunted. </div></div>

I miss hunting in Montana so much. Google maps helps me cope with not actually being there, hehe. Not to be a dick, but I hope Montana feels the loss and returns the prices to normal.

 

[vinnieb]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

I also have not put in since the price increase. Just can't justify it anymore. I may go up for a visit and pheasant, but deer is not in my future. I would rather skip two years up there and get a reservation coues deer tag close to home.

 

[RemingtonSPS]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

The comments on the cost increase of tags has puzzled me since it happened. Im not happy that gas prices went up either but it doesn't stop me from hunting Montana. $200 is a drop in the bucket when you hunt out of state. You pay more than that for food, gas, coffee, etc. If i wanted to save money i would hunt Washington. I have successfully drawn tags the 2 times i have put in and came home with decent bucks both times. That to me is worth $500 when i could take time off work, hunt my state for 2 weeks, and come home empty handed instead.

I prefer public land, non guided hunts. If raising the tag cost $200 means i get to hunt public land i would rather pay that than a guide 3k.

 

[vinnieb]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

For me it isn't about trying to save money, but get the best hunt for my money. Since they increased the prices it got more in line with hunts I can get in Az. and I haven't found an animal I enjoy hunting more than coues deer.

 

[MontanaKid]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MuleHunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The comments on the cost increase of tags has puzzled me since it happened. Im not happy that gas prices went up either but it doesn't stop me from hunting Montana. $200 is a drop in the bucket when you hunt out of state. You pay more than that for food, gas, coffee, etc. If i wanted to save money i would hunt Washington. I have successfully drawn tags the 2 times i have put in and came home with decent bucks both times. That to me is worth $500 when i could take time off work, hunt my state for 2 weeks, and come home empty handed instead.

I prefer public land, non guided hunts. If raising the tag cost $200 means i get to hunt public land i would rather pay that than a guide 3k. </div></div>

It all adds up. I hunt on a friend's private land (na na na boo boo, lol), so why should I have to pay extra to benefit public land. I just think they painted it with too broad of a brush and need to fix some things.

 

[RemingtonSPS]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

I think it weeds out the people that aren't serious about going. The more land for me to hunt with less hunters the better

 

[spaniel]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MuleHunter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The comments on the cost increase of tags has puzzled me since it happened. Im not happy that gas prices went up either but it doesn't stop me from hunting Montana. $200 is a drop in the bucket when you hunt out of state. You pay more than that for food, gas, coffee, etc. If i wanted to save money i would hunt Washington. I have successfully drawn tags the 2 times i have put in and came home with decent bucks both times. That to me is worth $500 when i could take time off work, hunt my state for 2 weeks, and come home empty handed instead.

I prefer public land, non guided hunts. If raising the tag cost $200 means i get to hunt public land i would rather pay that than a guide 3k. </div></div>

When you are DIY, even coming from the Midwest, that tag now represents fully half the cost of the entire trip...more than half if you don't rent a 4X4 like we have to.

Here in the Midwest, leasing has ruined hunting for a lot of people. I can't blame the landowners (mostly farmers). But when I was a kid I could pretty much ask and hunt. Now, I know a lot of kids who don't hunt because well-off people from the city have all the land leased up and the local kids' parents can't afford to lease them land to hunt on.

I see it becoming more and more a rich man's sport to go out West too. I'm worried that by the time my kids are old enough to hunt I won't be able to afford to take them. There's a breaking point, and the Montana NR tags are now beyond reason for most joes.

It's also bad timing, in just the last few years many parts of the state have gotten much worse to hunt. We started in the NW part of the state, the first year we saw good elk and I got one. Then the wolves moved in and the elk moved out. 2010 was the last year we hunted there, we didn't see one and only one person we ran into on a 10 day hunt even saw one. $900 tag to walk around empty mountains?? I am there for the experience not just to kill something, but my buddy has now gone 3 years and never so much as had a chance to shoot one...it's getting hard to justify it as an elk hunt. Next time we're seriously considering focusing on antelope and deer and only spending 1-2 days on elk.

We then moved east to the Breaks last year. Still decent elk there, but we were running into a ton of residents telling us they were from the west part of the state and they were all hunting out east now due to the wolves taking the elk down to where they weren't worth hunting anymore.

If you want to justify $900 tags, you need to make sure there's something there to hunt.

I'll be back anyway, I love MT and the people I meet there. But every year is just out of the question anymore.

 

[RemingtonSPS]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ATH</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
If you want to justify $900 tags, you need to make sure there's something there to hunt.

I'll be back anyway, I love MT and the people I meet there. But every year is just out of the question anymore. </div></div>

Well said. I understand your point, and this last year there did seem to be less game. However hunting nowadays is not what it used to be. When my dad was hunting in his 20's he used to tell me of all the deer and elk that were out there. He has so many mounted animals from the 70's and 80's its rediculous. Times change. When i was growing up gas was .99 a gallon now it is $4 a gallon. To illustrate, gas has gone up 300% in 15 years. What would have cost me $100 in gas 15 years ago now costs $400, a difference of $300. Do i still hunt Montana? Yes. I still fail to see how it is a rich mans game. I took my wife and 3yr old son hunting with me for the first time in Montana. I wanted to treat them right for their first time so we stayed in hotels every night, ate at restauraunts 3x a day...the works to make them comfortable. That trip cost me under $2,000 for a week and a half hunt. That was 2011 with the raised tag costs. Now i could just go myself and skimp on the luxuries for ALOT cheaper than that. Still 2k for a family vacation is not bad (they had a blast by the way) especially when people spend many times more than that to go to Disney land or Hawaii. That is still alot cheaper than a guided hunt and we got to hunt public land as a family. We both filled our tags. How much does ammo cost or to rebarrel a rifle? to me an extra $200 is not that bad.

I would never pay for a guided hunt unless legally bound to do so (as in Dall sheep etc.). I will be going back to Montana with my family to hunt it again (if we don't end up moving there).

 

[MontanaKid]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

What ATH said. +1
My family hunts on a friend/farmer's land. He sees it as a favor because there is almost an over population of deer that run around his place.
It's kind of irritating when I hear about somebody and their awesome guided "hunting" trip that cost $2k +. It just doesn't seem very sporty to me. The guide finds the deer and the only thing the person has to do is pull the trigger.
PS. MuleHunter, I got my first deer in Montana, so I know what you're saying about being comfy/spoiled your first time.

Besides, F*** Hawaii. Too humid for me + nowhere to shoot.

 

[Graywolf.260]

Re: Montana non-resident deer tags- what changes???

I have a couple of buddies from out of state who were planning to come hunt elk with me and to make a long story short it fell through for one of them for financial reasons. Even changing to a deer hunt he didn't feel like he could swing it. The economy is still tough and uncertain for a lot of people.