MRAD or... Ballista or....

[alwaywatchyoursix]

Also chiming in from the Ballista crowd.

Let's see...I got mine right around the end of 2016. For people keeping score on price, I paid $5545 for mine. I've got a little less than 50 rounds through mine.

I think it's an amazing rifle. Having said that, it's also the first rifle I'd sell if I needed money.

It's a cool system but a lot of its value is basically wasted on most of us and how we shoot. Most people don't need to quickly change calibers when they are out at the range. And caliber conversion kits, last I checked, were over two grand for the full barrel, a replacement bolt head, and 1 magazine.

You're basically paying for something that can do something you probably never will, and even then only if you throw even more money into it. And a really nice Pelican Storm 3300 case with custom-cut foam that can hold the rifle plus conversion kits. Oh, and all the product pictures I've ever seen of it show it with accessories mounted, including an Atlas bipod and an optic in an FN mount. And while everyone's going to be all "Well of course that's just for show, of course it won't come with a scope and bipod included" all the pictures also show it with basically several hundred in Ballista-specific accessories that don't actually come with it and are somewhat hard to find.

So, the good: The Unique Alpine brake works really well, the grip safety is easy to remove and the rifle will accept most AR-style grips, it has a rail on top with a 20 MOA cant built into it, the folding stock is really solid, it comes with a really nice hard case, and it's definitely rather unique.

Now, the bad: It's overpriced if you just want a bolt-action rifle in 338LM, it comes with a grip safety, the full-length rail up top means you have to run taller mounts, support will probably be non-existent if you ever need it, and it's marketed somewhat deceptively.

Make of that what you will.

I can't really speak to the MRAD as it's been about 15 years since I shot a Barrett and TBH I don't think the MRAD even existed at the time.

 

[ralfabco]

Also chiming in from the Ballista crowd.

Let's see...I got mine right around the end of 2016. For people keeping score on price, I paid $5545 for mine. I've got a little less than 50 rounds through mine.

I think it's an amazing rifle. Having said that, it's also the first rifle I'd sell if I needed money.

It's a cool system but a lot of its value is basically wasted on most of us and how we shoot. Most people don't need to quickly change calibers when they are out at the range. And caliber conversion kits, last I checked, were over two grand for the full barrel, a replacement bolt head, and 1 magazine.

You're basically paying for something that can do something you probably never will, and even then only if you throw even more money into it. And a really nice Pelican Storm 3300 case with custom-cut foam that can hold the rifle plus conversion kits. Oh, and all the product pictures I've ever seen of it show it with accessories mounted, including an Atlas bipod and an optic in an FN mount. And while everyone's going to be all "Well of course that's just for show, of course it won't come with a scope and bipod included" all the pictures also show it with basically several hundred in Ballista-specific accessories that don't actually come with it and are somewhat hard to find.

So, the good: The Unique Alpine brake works really well, the grip safety is easy to remove and the rifle will accept most AR-style grips, it has a rail on top with a 20 MOA cant built into it, the folding stock is really solid, it comes with a really nice hard case, and it's definitely rather unique.

Now, the bad: It's overpriced if you just want a bolt-action rifle in 338LM, it comes with a grip safety, the full-length rail up top means you have to run taller mounts, support will probably be non-existent if you ever need it, and it's marketed somewhat deceptively.

Make of that what you will.

I can't really speak to the MRAD as it's been about 15 years since I shot a Barrett and TBH I don't think the MRAD even existed at the time.

I am not sure it is overpriced. I think it is reasonable when you also compare it with similar eurotrash contemporaries.

FN also markets the item with the Peli case.
FN should also offer the 300 NM and 6.5 creed barrels. In Europe you can buy just the barrel - assuming you already have the .308 bolt head. FN is not bringing in these barrels and UA has it’s hands tied with the market share agreement and lack of insurance liability. The barrels by themselves are reasonable and include a muzzle brake. FN completely screwed up when the rifle took years to arrive inside of the CONUS. Don’t promise a shiny new toy that will take years to arrive.

o/t

In addition German gun laws are absolutely crazy. Germany/EU requires a buyer to fill out the EUC document, to purchase and export a precision rifle out of DE/eu. End user certificate. It’s approximately 7 pages and full of declarations and questions. Let me give you one requirement.

The doc requires you to contact the local German authorities and give them ample time for the gov’t representatives to witness the destruction of the rifle, if that is your choice for final disposition. You are not permitted to just export the item to another buyer in a foreign country. Essentially they do not want these rifles to end up in some African street. The gov’t is reluctant to grant export approval. The documents are reviewed by a team and are then submitted to the German ATF (I forgot the name ) for final approval. They do not seem happy to permit you to buy this crap.

I can go on and give more examples of the agreements the document demands the buyer adheres to and the signature, printed name, date, and stamp. My guess it is only a matter of time before the eu slams the door on exports of weapons to all civilians - including domestic sales.

FYI SigSauer GMbH is closing it’s doors. Sig Sauer claims draconian gun restrictions is one of the main reasons it is shutting it’s doors. Sig Sauer just released a statement on this matter. It’s already floating around the internet.

 

[alwaywatchyoursix]

I am not sure it is overpriced. I think it is reasonable when you also compare it with similar eurotrash contemporaries.

FN also markets the item with the Peli case.
FN should also offer the 300 NM and 6.5 creed barrels. In Europe you can buy just the barrel - assuming you already have the .308 bolt head. FN is not bringing in these barrels and UA has it’s hands tied with the market share agreement and lack of insurance liability. The barrels by themselves are reasonable and include a muzzle brake. FN completely screwed up when the rifle took years to arrive inside of the CONUS. Don’t promise a shiny new toy that will take years to arrive.

o/t

In addition German gun laws are absolutely crazy. Germany/EU requires a buyer to fill out the EUC document, to purchase and export a precision rifle out of DE/eu. End user certificate. It’s approximately 7 pages and full of declarations and questions. Let me give you one requirement.

The doc requires you to contact the local German authorities and give them ample time for the gov’t representatives to witness the destruction of the rifle, if that is your choice for final disposition. You are not permitted to just export the item to another buyer in a foreign country. Essentially they do not want these rifles to end up in some African street. The gov’t is reluctant to grant export approval. The documents are reviewed by a team and are then submitted to the German ATF (I forgot the name ) for final approval. They do not seem happy to permit you to buy this crap.

I can go on and give more examples of the agreements the document demands the buyer adheres to and the signature, printed name, date, and stamp. My guess it is only a matter of time before the eu slams the door on exports of weapons to all civilians - including domestic sales.

FYI SigSauer GMbH is closing it’s doors. Sig Sauer claims draconian gun restrictions is one of the main reasons it is shutting it’s doors. Sig Sauer just released a statement on this matter. It’s already floating around the internet.

I don't think it's overpriced for what it is. I did say it's overpriced if you're just looking for a rifle in 338LM. As in, you could probably pick up a factory 338LM rifle in a traditional style (no multi-caliber quick-change capability) complete with high-end optic for what I paid for my Ballista.

Maybe the Pelican case bit is my bad. I remember researching the hell out of the rifle before I bought it, and being completely surprised when it showed up in that giant FN box with the Pelican case inside of it. It's been a few years now though so I guess I could be misremembering things.

As for the rest of your post, that doesn't surprise me at all. But you raise a good point in that I wasn't really thinking of import/export hassles and the effect they have on pricing and availability.

 

[6brshooter]

Don't buy a .338LM if you're just starting out. Theis is right.

Yep, exactly this.....you should get 375 cheytac, lol. In all honesty, unless you have 1800+ yd to shoot, stick to creedmoor to learn and 300nm/prc for elr.

 

[LilGucci]

I don't know much about guns, so forgive the noob question...

But why has nobody brought up the Desert Tech SRS A2? It shoots 300 WM/Norma/Rum, 338 LM / Norma mag, 308 and 6.5 Creedmoor.

Does the community not look highly on Desert Tech products? I like the AXMC, and I saw that get brought up.

 

[_Windrider_]

I don't know much about guns, so forgive the noob question...

But why has nobody brought up the Desert Tech SRS A2? It shoots 300 WM/Norma/Rum, 338 LM / Norma mag, 308 and 6.5 Creedmoor.

Does the community not look highly on Desert Tech products? I like the AXMC, and I saw that get brought up.

I think it’s more the fact that bull pups aren’t for everyone. Desert tech makes a good rifle.

 

[mgrs]

I don't know much about guns, so forgive the noob question...

But why has nobody brought up the Desert Tech SRS A2? It shoots 300 WM/Norma/Rum, 338 LM / Norma mag, 308 and 6.5 Creedmoor.

Does the community not look highly on Desert Tech products? I like the AXMC, and I saw that get brought up.

It is a nice, usable rifle that shoots every bit as well as anything out there, but just is not in the same league as the initial three this thread is about in terms of quality, 'feel', usability, etc. (speculating on the ballista, as I have never owned one) Again, it DTA is a really good rifle that does something nothing else does, but shoot it seriously side by side with an MRAD or AI for a while, and you start to see the daylight between them.

 

[Mark Coffey]

Customer service isn’t great at DT...
-Barrett’s CS is very good!

I have have owned enough firearms to have sent more then a few back to the manufacture and CS is now very important to me.

 

[rustyinbend]

I realize that this conversation as turned away from choosing between a MRAD or Ballista.

I do agree with learning on a small caliber.

I stretched my .223 out to 1000 yards for my first year or two. Admittedly, this was not by design. It was just the way things worked out. I couldn’t wait to get a “big gun”.

if you want to learn to read wind, try shooting a 69 grain 223 at 1k! I learned wind...
-Like wind at 12:00 effects POI long before I saw a chart that showed it.

I have spent some time spotting 6.5CM out to 2,000 too. Not easy past 1,000 yards. Depending on conditions.

But, the draw back to small caliber long range is spotting your misses! Hell, it’s hard to call your hits... Sometimes, the strike indicator (if you are lucky enough to have them or a camera) doesn’t activate with light impacts.
-You can’t make a correction, if you can’t see your miss!

Very frustrating

My point is, it is a balance!
-Especially, for someone working on their basics.

Great advice in this post. I have a MRAD with four barrels. I use the .308 for practice. The 6.5 Creedmoor out to 1,300-ish, although it's tough to spot misses and hear hits. I go for my 1-mile+ shots with the .300 WinMag barrel. (All three barrels shooting suppressed.) And the .338 Lapua ... well ... I'm waiting for the suppressor I have ordered for that. Shot it a few times with an APA Fat Bastard muzzle brake for recoil reduction. It still beat the crap out of my shoulder, and blew everything off the adjacent benches at my range. The concussion on the sides is impressively annoying. I need to learn to love the .338 Lapua, but I'm not there yet.