My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

GlockandRoll

GlockandRoll

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 25, 2008
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Austin, TX
#1
<span style="font-size: 14pt"><span style="font-weight: bold">“Dangit… now I’ve got to add another cartridge to my ammunition stockpile!”</span>
</span>
<span style="font-weight: bold">My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel
By: GlockandRoll
</span>
DSC_4039.jpg


I didn’t know exactly what to expect with this cartridge, but hoped it would be a great alternative to the larger and heavier AR-10 platform; yet provide a more economical round with less recoil yet still formidable at long range.

As the range reports were so favorable from others testing the waters with this promising round, I decided it was best to contact JP rifles, who sent me a CTR-02™ upper with their cool howitzer themed JP Recoil Eliminator.

I am previously a JP customer due to their incredible workmanship and accuracy, not too mention I love their adjustable gas blocks and triggers and they have a reputation for unsurpased customer service and fast shipping.

So with the upper mounted on a completed lower assembly liberated from a match .223 upper with a JP trigger, and some purchased Hornady 123grn A-MAX rounds, I topped it off with a a spare scope (MIllet LRS-1) and headed out to Best of The West shooting sports in Liberty Hill, TX for a test drive.

I adjusted the gas system while zeroing it in just a few rounds and then the fun started. It was instantly obvious that the gun was accurate and flat shooting as head shots on the LaRue auto-reset targets at 250 yards were so close together that the paint splatter made it hard to see where the next round was going, so after 3 rounds I decided to move out to 500. Using the ballistics data I found online, I put 10MOA on the elevation knob, held center mass, and put one right on the LaRue’s forehead. A SWAG correction to 8.5MOA elevation put it dead center mass and then 3-4 follow up shots were in a small sub 3 inch group. On a good day I’m a .5MOA shooter on paper at 100 yards and I always giggle when I get lucky and pull something like this off.

What’s even more interesting is that it really smacks the crud out of the steel at 500 yards, I mean you FEEL it impact.. hard to believe from such a small cartridge. And just to give you an idea what I am talking about here, compared to the 175grn SMK’s I shoot in my custom .308 it’s going 200fps faster at 500 yards with 90% of the energy, yet 10-15% less wind drift and bullet drop.. but the best part is that its cheaper to shoot than the .308 and has nearly HALF the felt recoil. Oh, and it’s a higher BC bullet so it even becomes more interesting at longer ranges.
The next berm at BOTW is 750 yards. They have a hanging gong, 2 more LaRue reactive targets and a large steel plate that looks to be about the size of a bedroom door. Pardon this pic but it’s through the scope of my Mk4 LR/T using my BlackBerry. I put in 24 minutes and hit the berm on top of the target, windage was dead on. I put in 22 and still went high, so I put in 19.5moa and hit one of the LaRue’s smack dead center.

(Pause for more giggles.)

So before I swung the muzzle over to the 1000 yard berm I decided to play with the gas system a bit to see if I could squeeze any more FPS out of the JP upper so I loaded 1 round at a time into the mag and bled it off until it would just barely lock back on the empty mag and the brass was in a nice little pile just over my right shoulder.

The environmental conditions were perfect for shooting as it was 67 degrees with a winds gusting from 5-7 my from my 4 o-clock position.

Best of the West is a great place to practice 1000 yard shooting in the wind, becuase the berms are dry and there seems to be a near constant vortex and mirage is exaggerated there compared to other long-range targets I am used to. I was able to get dialed in with just around 33MOA elevation and engaged steel – a dream come true to me as I’ve always wanted a standard mag length cartridge that could do that from an existing stoner rifle… and now I’ve got it.

I will upgrade optics and swap out for a lighter trigger and test my skills again at 1000 yards with it and take some more pics and video of it next weekend hopefully.
Link to rifle manufacturer:
http://www.jprifles.com/1.2.1_CTR02.php


Originally posted on TGR:
http://tacticalgunreview.com/?p=9705
 
#3
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Yeah man, it's really something special IMHO.. it solves so many challenges for me. 1st, I've really always wanted a long-range AR15, now I haz one.

I'm also excited that Hornady is making the 123grn a-Max and Wolf is putting out some tolerable ammo also in their gold line.

It's almost too good to be true, you can have your cake and eat it to w/this round.
 
#5
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Thanks.. it's a 24" JP Supermatch™ cryo SS bbl I believe. But you can get them in different lengths. If it wasn't raining here I'd be shooting as I type.
 
#6
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Here's a fun comparison of the popular calibers in the AR platform. I really liked how it shines compared to the 6.8 SPC, which was a round I chose not to adopt.
arcaliberballistics.jpg
 
#7
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Have you chrono'ed the 123 A-max from your rifle? Just curious what actual velocity is from the JP 24" barrel.
 
#8
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Well, this review just about finishes my search for a long range round other than the .308 platform. Thanks for the write up. On a side note, has anyone tried the Wolf Gold offering in 6.5?
 
#9
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Love JP's rifles. Looks like a grade A long range stick. Have you weighed it yet?

Like the A2 stock, good for bench, not too big or bulky, like some aftermarket stocks meant for long range shooting.

Good for you.
 
#10
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GlockandRoll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here's a fun comparison of the popular calibers in the AR platform. I really liked how it shines compared to the 6.8 SPC, which was a round I chose not to adopt.
arcaliberballistics.jpg

</div></div>

I've been looking at this rifle for some time, but chose a GAP-10 over it. Once you strap that long barrel on a AR-15 the weight is no different than an "AR-10". The other thing is during my research I saw this chart posted, but could never find hard data to back up the 2750 MV from the 6.5G. Even the 6.8 MV is high (w/ one of the crappiest 6.8 bullets vs the best 6.5G bullet). I've also seen this chart and another one much like it shot full of holes on other forums. Not saying you made a bad choice (I really like JP and think the Grendel is a cool little cartridge) I would just chrono some of your loads before you head off to shoot a competition thinking those velocities are good to go.
 
#11
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I've been looking at this rifle for some time, but chose a GAP-10 over it. Once you strap that long barrel on a AR-15 the weight is no different than an "AR-10". The other thing is during my research I saw this chart posted, but could never find hard data to back up the 2750 MV from the 6.5G. Even the 6.8 MV is high (w/ one of the crappiest 6.8 bullets vs the best 6.5G bullet). I've also seen this chart and another one much like it shot full of holes on other forums. Not saying you made a bad choice (I really like JP and think the Grendel is a cool little cartridge) I would just chrono some of your loads before you head off to shoot a competition thinking those velocities are good to go.</div></div>


Thanks to everyone for the feedback. I have not chronod it but plan to at Long Range Ally thanksgiving week with friends. I'll be sure to post findings here.

I had a DPMS LR 308 for a while, and definitely like this better for long range.

I am waiting on some Wolf 6.5 ammo as well, hopefully I'll be able to chrono that to.
 
#12
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

I have to say something else here... the biggest thrill for me is that I can get out to long range with a standard mag length AR. If the wolf ammo is even moderately acceptable, it will still be formidable at farther distances than most people shoot at.

I actually wanted to find fault with the round, becuase of all the hype, but walked away from a day at the range shaking my head in disbelief. It's that good. I mean, 1st round engagements on steel at nearly half a mile once I dialed in the elevation.. rides the wind well. low recoil... how could you not love it?
 
#15
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Good write up and that is a nice looking rifle. I am very interested in this caliber as it seems to wring about all the performance possible out of the standard mag length AR-15.

I would like to see the load data that supports that chart though. Hottest load Hodgson's lists for the 123gr Sierra is 2500. Ramshot's is 2466 but in a 20" barrel; figure maybe 2600 in the 26" barrel that chart is supposedly based on. While on the other hand the 77gr OTM seems understated. Black Hill's load is listed at 2750 in a 16" barrel. I don't have real-world chronos, I'm just looking at the data that is published on the internet. That chart may be based on a real cartridge that was actually fired, but Alexander Arms doesn't provide data to support it and no loaded cartridge I can find claims it either.
 
#19
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

The wolf dosent shoot too bad for the price.
The brass is large primer pocket and super soft.
Also I have done some tinkering and can get Grendel to shoot out of a 30 rnd Pmag.I think I ended up getting 13rnds loaded in it.
 
#20
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GlockandRoll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From Hornady's website:
http://www.hornady.com/store/6.5-Grendel-123-gr-A-MAX/

Test Barrel (24") Velocity (fps) / Energy (ft-lbs)
MUZZLE 100 200 300 400 500
2620/1875 2435/1619 2257/1392 2087/1190 1925/1012 1770/856

Trajectory (inches)
MUZZLE 100 200 300 400 500
-1.50 2.20 0.00 -9.00 -26.00 -52.50</div></div>

This is not what the chart shows. It shows a 123 scenar pushed to 2750fps, which is very close to the factory loading of the 6.5-47Lapua (which has 27% more case capacity). The 123 Amax is nothing to shake a stick at, but it is not in the same league as the 123 Scenar, which the hottest Gendel load I've seen pushes to the mid 2500's. With the same barrel length a .308 shooting 155 scenars (at 2900fps) will outperform the 6.5g by a decent margin---just the way it is.

Again not saying the 6.5 sucks, because it's another excellent cartridge for the AR15 platform, I was just pointing out that the initial chart posted was misleading.
 
#21
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

I averaged 2610 fps at 10 ft. in my 24" heavy barrel and extreme spread was low. That's with factory 123 Hornady A-Max tested with my Oehler 35P. About 85 degrees temperature.
 
#22
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

This is not what the chart shows. It shows a 123 scenar pushed to 2750fps, which is very close to the factory loading of the 6.5-47Lapua (which has 27% more case capacity). The 123 Amax is nothing to shake a stick at, but it is not in the same league as the 123 Scenar, which the hottest Gendel load I've seen pushes to the mid 2500's. With the same barrel length a .308 shooting 155 scenars (at 2900fps) will outperform the 6.5g by a decent margin---just the way it is.

Again not saying the 6.5 sucks, because it's another excellent cartridge for the AR15 platform, I was just pointing out that the initial chart posted was misleading.</div></div>

I get what you are saying, and I agree however I believe Alexander Arms did this with a 26" BBL, unsure of twist.

I'll chrono mine, but I dont expect it to be much different than the Hornady specs out of my JP loaner.
 
#23
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rg1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I averaged 2610 fps at 10 ft. in my 24" heavy barrel and extreme spread was low. That's with factory 123 Hornady A-Max tested with my Oehler 35P. About 85 degrees temperature. </div></div>


I have a 24" aa barrel and was getting 2620fps on a 60 degree day here in ohio. Just to back up your info.
 
#24
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Glockandroll,

Nice rifle, and i'm happy for you that you've found a new long range cartridge. I have to however, take issue with your comparison and some comments you made.

Firstly, the 6.5 grendel is not and never will be cheaper to shoot than the .308 winchester, barring its adoption by any large military organization. 308 rifles and reloading components are far more plentiful and cheaper than the 6.5G, and this cartridge has a ways to go before it becomes "cheap to shoot".

Secondly, as already pointed out by others, the figures in your table are a little optimistic for the 6.5G. Additionaly, you are comparing a relatively new bullet (123AMAX) with ancient 308 loads (175SMK) going a 100fps or more slower than most ppl here push those same loads in 24" or longer tubes.

You should revise your chart to show the 308 cartridge with more modern 308 bullets such as Hornady's 208AMAX (.648 BC), and 208 HPBT (.620), the 178HPBT (.530 BC), and the 225 HPBT (.670 BC) offering just to name a few.

I believe you'll find that that these newer bullets breathe new life into the 308 cartridge and will extend its persistence in long range shooting.

I do agree with your areguments about the favorable comparison of recoil and weight semi-auto AR style rifles chambered in 6.5G vs 308 Win. However, rifles such as the FN SCAR (8.0lbs), DPMS Hunter style 308 rifles (7.9lbs) are closing the weight gap. It will only be a matter of time before manf turn their attention to making lighter, tactical 308 semi-auto rifles.

Once again, this post is not meant to bash you or your affinity for the 6.5G,just to provide a little more objectivity to your comparison of the two cartridges.

Regards,
 
#25
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tx_Flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Glockandroll,

Nice rifle, and i'm happy for you that you've found a new long range cartridge. I have to however, take issue with your comparison and some comments you made.

Firstly, the 6.5 grendel is not and never will be cheaper to shoot than the .308 winchester, barring its adoption by any large military organization. 308 rifles and reloading components are far more plentiful and cheaper than the 6.5G, and this cartridge has a ways to go before it becomes "cheap to shoot".

Secondly, as already pointed out by others, the figures in your table are a little optimistic for the 6.5G. Additionaly, you are comparing a relatively new bullet (123AMAX) with ancient 308 loads (175SMK) going a 100fps or more slower than most ppl here push those same loads in 24" or longer tubes.

You should revise your chart to show the 308 cartridge with more modern 308 bullets such as Hornady's 208AMAX (.648 BC), and 208 HPBT (.620), the 178HPBT (.530 BC), and the 225 HPBT (.670 BC) offering just to name a few.

I believe you'll find that that these newer bullets breathe new life into the 308 cartridge and will extend its persistence in long range shooting.

I do agree with your areguments about the favorable comparison of recoil and weight semi-auto AR style rifles chambered in 6.5G vs 308 Win. However, rifles such as the FN SCAR (8.0lbs), DPMS Hunter style 308 rifles (7.9lbs) are closing the weight gap. It will only be a matter of time before manf turn their attention to making lighter, tactical 308 semi-auto rifles.

Once again, this post is not meant to bash you or your affinity for the 6.5G,just to provide a little more objectivity to your comparison of the two cartridges.

Regards,
</div></div>

Thanks for the feedback.
However since you went there I am saying the 6.5 grendel is more affordable to shoot becuase it uses less powder and if you search around, most of the Hornady and Wolf 6.5 ammo is in the $17/box range whereas .308 ammo is upwards of $24/box.

I am very familiar with the 208 A-MAX and other heavier bullets... however my experience is that the 175grn SMK not unlike the M118/lr does well and I look forward to playing with the 155 lapua scenars but may go 6.5 creedmore in a new bolt gun instead and continue with the 175s in my .308. That being said the only people I know that shoot the 208 are in .300wm loads.

I dont have an affinity to any particular round, and dont want to use this as a forum to compare a 308 to a 6.5, however I think if you compared the accuracy and recoil of this JP rifle to your 8lb 7.62 gas rifles... you would appreciate how magnificent it is.

The main attraction of this round to me and many others is that we can use our standard length AR receivers. This is why I suspect the 6.8SPC took off originally, but becuase of the rounds poor long-range performance I never adopted it.
 
#26
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

Thanks for not teeing off glockandroll.

It nice to see that ppl can still take constructive criticism.

Your comparison of factory loads of 6.5G vs 308Win is also not quite objective. If you want to talk about affodability, 308 is far cheaper than 6.5G to shoot.

Got to cheaperthandirt.com, sportsmansguide.com et al. You will find 308 ammo by wolf, Tula, etc for about $6.50/box 20. You read that right, $6.50 for a box of 308 ammo. Can you even load 6.5G for that price? I'm guessing not.

If you look on gunbroker & other sites including those i mentioned above, you will find high quality 308 ammo (175SMK & other reloaded ammo) in the low to mid teens/box of 20.

Of course 6.5G or any other small cartridge uses less powder than 308...the case volumes are smaller. But that's the only "savings" one will realize for any smaller cartridge that is not 556.

And you will have to shoot maaaaany bullets before the difference in powder makes up for paying more for brass, projectiles, dies, etc.

The 6.5G is a lot of things, but "cheap to shoot", and a replacement for .308 (you dint make this assertion) aint one of them.

Regards,
 
#27
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tx_Flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thanks for not teeing off glockandroll.

It nice to see that ppl can still take constructive criticism.

Your comparison of factory loads of 6.5G vs 308Win is also not quite objective. If you want to talk about affodability, 308 is far cheaper than 6.5G to shoot.

Got to cheaperthandirt.com, sportsmansguide.com et al. You will find 308 ammo by wolf, Tula, etc for about $6.50/box 20. You read that right, $6.50 for a box of 308 ammo. Can you even load 6.5G for that price? I'm guessing not.

If you look on gunbroker & other sites including those i mentioned above, you will find high quality 308 ammo (175SMK & other reloaded ammo) in the low to mid teens/box of 20.

Of course 6.5G or any other small cartridge uses less powder than 308...the case volumes are smaller. But that's the only "savings" one will realize for any smaller cartridge that is not 556.

And you will have to shoot maaaaany bullets before the difference in powder makes up for paying more for brass, projectiles, dies, etc.

The 6.5G is a lot of things, but "cheap to shoot", and a replacement for .308 (you dint make this assertion) aint one of them.

Regards,</div></div>

And as explained, I'm not trying to compare the 6.5 to the .308, but if we want to compare apples to apples, compare the Hornady 6.5 123grn a-MAX to comparable .308, you will find it is less expensive. Additionally, converting an existing 5.56 stoner rifle over to 6.5 Grendel is MUCH less expensive than acquiring a new AR-10 or .308 bolt gun, it is an economical long range alternative to the .308 in that regard. End of discussion.

It recoils MUCH less than the .308, rides the wind better, and finally gives me a way to ring steel at over half a mile from a 5.56 receiver.. something I've dreamed of doing for some time.

I have not seen constructive criticism here.. just a holy war that I dont want any part of.
 
#28
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GlockandRoll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The main attraction of this round to me and many others is that we can use our standard length AR receivers. This is why I suspect the 6.8SPC took off originally, but becuase of the rounds poor long-range performance I never adopted it.

</div></div>

I think statements like this and that misleading chart are why you're getting so much push back on your review, which in-and-of-itself was pretty dang good.

When you compare the best bullets (flattest shooting; 6.5G-123Scenar, .308-155Scenar, and 6.8-110Vmax) and top end loads given equivalent barrel lengths between the 6.8, 6.5G, and .308 you will find that the .308 will smoke the the 6.8 and 6.5G and the 6.5G really starts to pull away from the 6.8 at 500. The 6.8 given the above conditions will not fall subsonic until ~950yds; my experience with a 16" barrel is the 6.8 is pretty damn accurate to 800yds (1.5MOA), but groups really open up at 1000 (2.5MOA). But then again I am not sure what you define as long range. It's funny because the 6.8 is as good or better than the 5.56 at distance with mag-length bullets. However to be fair, the 6.5G really shines relative to the 6.8 at longer ranges when the wind is blowing because of the high BC bullets. The problem with the Grendel is that it is lacking the case capacity to really take advantage of the 6.5 bullets.

Also you keep quoting velocities that were achieved with the 123Amax---your chart is for the 123 Scenar which has a significantly higher BC but is longer and cannot be driven as fast from the Grendel at least not with any hard (or even anecdotal) evidence I've seen.

Lastly, you mentioned 6.5G ammo being less expensive because of Wolf ammo or Hornady... Last I checked you can get MILSURP, Wolf, or other steel cased .308 ammo for under $10 a box if you just do a little looking, and can get FGMM 175gr at Cabelas for $18.99 per box. As for reloading, quality .308 brass and bullets are significantly cheaper than 6.5G brass and bullets which more than offsets any powder difference.

Plain and simple---you keep saying you're not committed to any one cartridge, but yet keep slighting other cartridges with vague unsupported statements and misleading tables. All of these cartridges have their own pluses and minuses, let's just be honest with what they are.

Basis of my argument above:
6.5G - Lapua 123 Scenar (G1 BC=.547) at 2560fps (fastest load I could find - 6.5G Forum)
6.8SPC - Hornady 110V-max (G1 BC=.377) at 2850fps (Fastest safe load I could find; 20"bbl not 24" - 6.8 Forum)
.308Win - Lapua 155gr Scenar (G1 BC=.510) at 2980fps (Fastest load I could find - 6mmbr)

All calculations run through Iphone App "Ballistic" with environmental settings from my last range session.
 
#29
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I think statements like this and that misleading chart are why you're getting so much push back on your review, which in-and-of-itself was pretty dang good.

When you compare the best bullets (flattest shooting; 6.5G-123Scenar, .308-155Scenar, and 6.8-110Vmax) and top end loads given equivalent barrel lengths between the 6.8, 6.5G, and .308 you will find that the .308 will smoke the the 6.8 and 6.5G and the 6.5G really starts to pull away from the 6.8 at 500. The 6.8 given the above conditions will not fall subsonic until ~950yds; my experience with a 16" barrel is the 6.8 is pretty damn accurate to 800yds (1.5MOA), but groups really open up at 1000 (2.5MOA). But then again I am not sure what you define as long range. It's funny because the 6.8 is as good or better than the 5.56 at distance with mag-length bullets. However to be fair, the 6.5G really shines relative to the 6.8 at longer ranges when the wind is blowing because of the high BC bullets. The problem with the Grendel is that it is lacking the case capacity to really take advantage of the 6.5 bullets.

Also you keep quoting velocities that were achieved with the 123Amax---your chart is for the 123 Scenar which has a significantly higher BC but is longer and cannot be driven as fast from the Grendel at least not with any hard (or even anecdotal) evidence I've seen.

Lastly, you mentioned 6.5G ammo being less expensive because of Wolf ammo or Hornady... Last I checked you can get MILSURP, Wolf, or other steel cased .308 ammo for under $10 a box if you just do a little looking, and can get FGMM 175gr at Cabelas for $18.99 per box. As for reloading, quality .308 brass and bullets are significantly cheaper than 6.5G brass and bullets which more than offsets any powder difference.

Plain and simple---you keep saying you're not committed to any one cartridge, but yet keep slighting other cartridges with vague unsupported statements and misleading tables. All of these cartridges have their own pluses and minuses, let's just be honest with what they are.

Basis of my argument above:
6.5G - Lapua 123 Scenar (G1 BC=.547) at 2560fps (fastest load I could find - 6.5G Forum)
6.8SPC - Hornady 110V-max (G1 BC=.377) at 2850fps (Fastest safe load I could find; 20"bbl not 24" - 6.8 Forum)
.308Win - Lapua 155gr Scenar (G1 BC=.510) at 2980fps (Fastest load I could find - 6mmbr)

All calculations run through Iphone App "Ballistic" with environmental settings from my last range session.
</div></div>

This wasn't a "why I dont like the 6.8/5.56/7.62" rant... it was just a review of a 6.5 Grendel, which I can assure anyone here they would get a kick out of if they shot it.

I found the chart online from Alexander Arms, and just used it as a comparison. I realize it's a Lapua bullet, it was before the 123a-max was avaible. I am not confused about that.

Furthermore, I am not comparing 2moa mil-surp 7.62x51 ammo to the Horny 123 Amax ,I'm comparing match ammo to match ammo, the cost of the host to shoot it in, etc.

I recognize the 6.8spc has good potential up-close, but find the 77grn 5.56 is better overall for my needs and have yet to see good performance from a 6.8SPC at distances over 400-500 yards.






 
#30
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GlockandRoll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

This wasn't a "why I dont like the 6.8/5.56/7.62" rant... it was just a review of a 6.5 Grendel, which I can assure anyone here they would get a kick out of if they shot it.

I found the chart online from Alexander Arms, and just used it as a comparison. I realize it's a Lapua bullet, it was before the 123a-max was avaible. I am not confused about that.

Furthermore, I am not comparing 2moa mil-surp 7.62x51 ammo to the Horny 123 Amax ,I'm comparing match ammo to match ammo, the cost of the host to shoot it in, etc. I will not participate in any discussion comparing the 6.8spc to the 6.5 grendel, as I do not see them as comparable rounds.

</div></div>

Agree 100% here. Use the search function if you want to see how many times the 6.5 Grendel vs. XZY argument has been hashed out.

IMHO the most compelling thing going on here is that the 6.5 Grendel uses the AR15 platform, so moving to the cartridge is as simple as pulling two pins and swapping uppers. Yes, you need new magazines, but they're relatively inexpensive and I have 20+ 25 rounders that all work -- meaning that reliable Grendel mags are out there for sure.
 
#31
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I've been looking at this rifle for some time, but chose a GAP-10 over it. Once you strap that long barrel on a AR-15 the weight is no different than an "AR-10". </div></div>

You are incorrect here. The 6.5 Grendel doesn't weigh any more than any other 24" 5.56 AR-15 w/comparable stocks, fore-ends, muzzle devices, etc. I took this to the range side-by-side with a DPMS 308 and found it much lighter and had much less recoil.
 
#32
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vmpgsc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Agree 100% here. Use the search function if you want to see how many times the 6.5 Grendel vs. XZY argument has been hashed out.

IMHO the most compelling thing going on here is that the 6.5 Grendel uses the AR15 platform, so moving to the cartridge is as simple as pulling two pins and swapping uppers. Yes, you need new magazines, but they're relatively inexpensive and I have 20+ 25 rounders that all work -- meaning that reliable Grendel mags are out there for sure.</div></div>

yeah, I dont want to engage in any religious wars.. I'm a prove it or STFU kind of guy. :p

New calibers always get feathers ruffled and I dont understand why people vest such an emotional stake it them.. I use what works. If I found the 6.0234 donkeypuncher SPC 11 mega ninja round worked for me.. I'd use it.
 
#34
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
So prove it---or pull the misleading info. </div></div>

Prove WHAT, exactly?
 
#35
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GlockandRoll</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
So prove it---or pull the misleading info. </div></div>

Prove WHAT, exactly?
</div></div>

You've proven that it's very easy to offend the ballistics police on this board. Heck, I say just pull the chart and let folks shoot the round. <sarcasm>After all, that chart is clear evidence that you have an agenda...</sarcasm>
 
#37
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

The Grendel is a very capable round. However it's wildcat sister the 6mm Turbo 40 Improved is proving to be one of the best long range performer out of the AR15 platform. It would be nice to see the T40i commercialized as it would end the 6.8 vs. 6.5G discussion for good.
 
#38
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sititunga1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Grendel is a very capable round. However it's wildcat sister the 6mm Turbo 40 Improved is proving to be the best long range performer out of the AR15 platform. It would be nice to see the T40i commercialized as it would end the 6.8 vs. 6.5G discussion for good.</div></div>

I am not familiar with it. We also have to give AAC credit for making the 300 AAC BLACKOUT an official SAAMI spec cartridge now!
That's next on my list to evaulate, supressed that is.
 
#40
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sititunga1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Grendel is a very capable round. However it's wildcat sister the 6mm Turbo 40 Improved is proving to be the best long range performer out of the AR15 platform. It would be nice to see the T40i commercialized as it would end the 6.8 vs. 6.5G discussion for good. </div></div>

I'm curious how does the 6mmT40i stack up aginst the 6mmSPC/WOA?

I'm not trying to start an argument I'm just curious what's the best offering available for the AR15 chassis in the 6mm department.

I've got a grendel on the way, I ordered it before I even heard of the former two but I'm still interested in which 6mm improved cartridge is the better?

Thanks
 
#42
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MrLebowski</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sititunga1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Grendel is a very capable round. However it's wildcat sister the 6mm Turbo 40 Improved is proving to be the best long range performer out of the AR15 platform. It would be nice to see the T40i commercialized as it would end the 6.8 vs. 6.5G discussion for good. </div></div>

I'm curious how does the 6mmT40i stack up aginst the 6mmSPC/WOA?

I'm not trying to start an argument I'm just curious what's the best offering available for the AR15 chassis in the 6mm department.

I've got a grendel on the way, I ordered it before I even heard of the former two but I'm still interested in which 6mm improved cartridge is the better?

Thanks </div></div>

I think the WOA and T40i are comparable. I'm not sure how many grains of water they both hold, but I think the T40i holds 2 - 3 grains more. As the T40i is based on a PPC style case the nod would have to go to the T40i as being the more accurate.
 
#43
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

I'll stay out of the caliber discussion but to the OP and everyone else if you like JP's gas guns check out their new Bolt Rifle JP MR-10 BOLT RIFLE or if you prefer a custom gun you can just get the JP AMCS Chassis System.

We have been using them for a while now and I cannot say enough good things about them. Look for a full review in the next few weeks.

2191dp3.jpg

Rem 700 243

accwi8.jpg

Rem 700 260
 
#45
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sititunga1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nice rigs but up at $4k + they're getting pretty close to an AI.</div></div>

Good point. I have shot both over the years and while I agree AIs are an excellent rifle, I would consider this system to be on the same level. There has been extreme attention given to detail and craftsmanship. It is a slightly different setup for someone looking for something a little different.
 
#48
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sititunga1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's a necked down Grendel with an increased case capacity. It drives a 6mm 108 gr bullet at 2850 - 2900 fps. </div></div>

Oh my!!

(<span style="font-style: italic">Wipes the drool away</span>).
smile.gif
 
#49
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

awesome! i have an AA 24" AWS that I was able to hit PD at 400yds with this summer.

About the wolf ammo, I don't know if you plan to reload, but their cases have about a 3-5 load life (depending on pressure) and they take large rifle primers vs the magnum small rifle / small rife the AA and Hornady brass has.

I contacted Bill Alexander for instructions on how to adjust the load data, and he told me to knock down the loads .2/.3gr to convert from Magnum Small Rifle to Large Rifle primers.

I bought 1k of the wolf MPT 123gr ammo and get about 1" at 100yds. not match ammo by any means, but I was much cheaper buying those loaded rounds vs buying the brass and loading my own.
 
#50
Re: My review of the JP 6.5 Grendel

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GlockandRoll</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lwrkeysfisher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
So prove it---or pull the misleading info. </div></div>

Prove WHAT, exactly?
</div></div>

Your mistake was to think that I care about a caliber discussion. Quite the contrary, I was pointing out that the data you based the premise of your arguments (the 6.5G is superior long range cartridge to the .308 and that the 6.8 suffers from "poor long range performance") is at best flawed. I have not found one load in which the 6.5G drives a 123gr Scenar to 2750fps---it just doesn't exist and saying it does is misleading. I know I would be disappointed if I bought a 6.5G because I though it could replicate 6.5X47 velocities, just to find out it falls well (~200fps) short. Second you said the 6.8 is a poor performer at "long range", despite the fact you never adopted the cartridge, and the fact that many people have driven it to 800+ yards with good success using 16-18" barrels (even though it's not what it was designed for). So what I see is that you've keyed in on data that is wrong and used it to prove a point; then when I pointed out your data was wrong and analysis flawed your rebuttal was to get upset and claim that I was starting a "caliber war"... The fact is I like the 6.5G for what it is and think it is a cool little AR15 cartridge, I just don't like it when people tout garbage data as fact. I'll let you have the final word as I'm done with this thread.
 
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