Need some basic education - light, short, 1000 yrds plus other Qs

[Knight6]

So a few questions:

What is the reason for long action and short action?

How do barrel length and twist rate relate to each other?

If you shorten a barrel is there an equation for change in twist rate?

If you shorten a barrel I hear you should use ammo with a higher muzzle velocity. is the to increase spin due to shorter barrel or simple reduce the flight time and thus effects of less stable flight?

How short can you go and still be MOA/sub MOA at 1000yrds?

Can anyone list some of the best
skeleton stock makers for me. Looking to create a very light but still 1000yrd precision rifle:


What caliber would you use in a light, short Precision rifle.

Any other tips?

 

[SnakeDoctor27]

If u uses search feature there is a thread to answer every one of your questions..

 

[Randoman5]

So a few questions:

What is the reason for long action and short action?

How do barrel length and twist rate relate to each other?

If you shorten a barrel is there an equation for change in twist rate?

If you shorten a barrel I hear you should use ammo with a higher muzzle velocity. is the to increase spin due to shorter barrel or simple reduce the flight time and thus effects of less stable flight?

How short can you go and still be MOA/sub MOA at 1000yrds?

Can anyone list some of the best
skeleton stock makers for me. Looking to create a very light but still 1000yrd precision rifle:


What caliber would you use in a light, short Precision rifle.

Any other tips?

If you spend some time just reading threads that sound interesting you'll learn much more than just asking random questions.

The reason for short and long action is to fit different length cartridges. Shorter cartridges don't need as long of a bolt throw, and make it easier and faster to load the next round.

The twist rate is the number of turns per foot of barrel. A 24 inch barrel with a 1:10 twist makes 20 rotations before it leaves the barrel. The rate doesn't change depending on the length of the barrel. If that same barrel were cut to 18 inches it would still be 1:10 it would just make 5 fewer rotations.

Generally and up to a certain length muzzle velocity will increase with barrel length as there is more chance for the expanding gases of the burned powder to push the round. There are different powders that burn at faster rates and with a shorter barrel you would generally want a faster burning powder so that it expends more of its energy before the projectile leaves the barrel. While in general the faster a bullet is moving the more stable it is. I'm not sure how to answer the rest of that question.

There's only one way to find out.

I don't know what a skeleton stock is.

I would probably use a 6.5 Creedmoor or .260 Remington but opinions on that may vary.

My only other tip would be to read as many threads as possible on this site and maybe try some articles on this site too. http://8541tactical.com/ He also has a youtube channel which answers a lot of questions people unfamiliar with long range shooting would have.

 

[jwp6114]

Good luck in your adventure. After you build it and achieve your goal, post up rifle and target pics,

 

[BoilerUP]

Looking to create a very light but still 1000yrd precision rifle

What's the budget?

A 20", 1:8 twist, light varmint contour (or fluted Rem Varmint contour) 260 Remington would allow you get ~2700fps with 140gr handloads, and a Manners carbon fill stock will minimize weight. You probably won't win any tactical competitions with such a rifle, but for hunting and banging steel and paper, it'd suit your stated use just fine.

For comparison's sake, 1000yd ballistics assuming 500' ASL, 59F, 29.92Hg

140gr A-Max @ 2700fps: 9.3mil drop, 2.1mil drift
140gr Hybrid @ 2700fps: 9.0mil drop, 1.9mil drift (69.9")
130gr VLD @ 2800fps: 8.9mil drop, 2.2mil drift
123gr SMK @ 2900fps: 8.6mil drop, 2.3mil drift (82.0")

308/175smk @ 2600fps: 11.8mil drop, 3.0mil drift
308/168 Hybrid @ 2700fps: 10.1mil drop, 2.5mil drift

 

[Knight6]

Budget under 3K. I will use the search and find out more, your right I should have done more of this. Randoman5 thank you. Jwp6114 will do. BoilerUP thank you. I would like to see how short and how light I can take a rifle and still have a precision piece out to 1000, even for competition, if only with myself.

 

[BoilerUP]

Do a forum search for "short is smart".

Short barrels aren't winning many competitions, but that doesn't mean they aren't accurate.

 

[oliver166]

You can still push a .308155 lapua round at 2800fps out of 20" bbl with 1/12 twist maintaining 3/8th moa. Granted that's with a compressed load. I'd prefer a faster twist with 20" bbl for next build.

 

[jordan0317]

If you spend some time just reading threads that sound interesting you'll learn much more than just asking random questions.

The twist rate is the number of turns per foot of barrel. A 24 inch barrel with a 1:10 twist makes 20 rotations before it leaves the barrel. The rate doesn't change depending on the length of the barrel. If that same barrel were cut to 18 inches it would still be 1:10 it would just make 5 fewer rotations.

Maybe you should take the time to read more yourself friend because the twist rate explanation you gave is wrong. A 1:10 twist means that for every ten inches the projectile makes one full rotation so almost 2.5 rotations out of a 24 inch barrel not fucking twenty.

 

[JB02]

If you want light and short you are compromising on long range capability, especially at the range you are asking. BTW, do you even have access to 1000 yd range?

If you're looking for something that is light and short and shoots great inside 500 yds, VJJ and others have shorty rifles they have posted up. If you're looking for something light an long, take a look at GAP's non typical rifle and make a build similar to that. If you want something best suited for long range, take a look at something like GAP's Rock rifle, except chambered with a 6mm or 6.5mm round and a 1/8 twist barrel.k

What is a skeleton stock?

 

[Knight6]

Thanks folks for the info. When I spoke of a skeleton stock I meant a minimilist stock like an XLR, to reduce weight. With regard to range, my nearest decent range, non competition is 885 yrds but I have access to ranges to and above 1000yrds for competition, and non populated areas where you can set up any distance you want. With regard to barrel twist, I did not mean cutting down the length you get a different rate of twist, but wanted to know if you needed to change twist rate for a shorter barrell, maybe increase twist to try and impart more spin to stabalize bullet flight as well as increase MV based on load. I was interested in caliber as I know the 7mm and 6.5s tend to have a flatter trajectory, but I do not have any experience with these calibers. So I am starting to think of something like a 16-18 inch barrell, 6mm or 6.5 cred, maybe a 1:8 twist, lightweight stock. How does this sound? Not expecting to win competitions but would like to be able to get out to 1000yrds and be around MOA. BoilerUP thanks am looking up "short is smart". Thanks to all!

 

[Tango down]

Originally Posted by Randoman5
If you spend some time just reading threads that sound interesting you'll learn much more than just asking random questions.

The twist rate is the number of turns per foot of barrel. A 24 inch barrel with a 1:10 twist makes 20 rotations before it leaves the barrel. The rate doesn't change depending on the length of the barrel. If that same barrel were cut to 18 inches it would still be 1:10 it would just make 5 fewer rotations.




Maybe you should take the time to read more yourself friend because the twist rate explanation you gave is wrong. A 1:10 twist means that for every ten inches the projectile makes one full rotation so almost 2.5 rotations out of a 24 inch barrel not fucking twenty.

jordan0317
Thanks for a good laugh early morning; this is the kind of diplomatic wordage our Drill Sergeant would use when we were fucking up.
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